The GetDPI Photography Forum

Great to see you here. Join our insightful photographic forum today and start tapping into a huge wealth of photographic knowledge. Completing our simple registration process will allow you to gain access to exclusive content, add your own topics and posts, share your work and connect with other members through your own private inbox! And don’t forget to say hi!

Cyclorama/infinity wall

M

mjr

Guest
Evening!

I've just bought a building to house a new studio as I've outgrown my current space, it's not huge as it is an old shop with a nice apartment above it but at 6m x 12m, it's big enough for me at the moment. I'm wondering if anyone has built a cyclorama before? As it's a blank space I'm considering putting one in, does anyone have any feedback on whether they are worth the effort? The room is not very tall unfortunately at only 2.7m so looking to make the most of the space in any way I can.

Any feedback would be appreciated!

Mat
 

Shashin

Well-known member
I guess my first reaction would be what does that give you that a seamless background does not? The very few studios I have seen with these walls, the walls are usually dirty, damaged, and unused. They also make your space smaller. Are you doing the kind of work and the volume that makes sense for making one of these?
 
M

mjr

Guest
Hi Will

Thanks for replying, these are all questions I have asked myself many times, plus a load more! It doesn't give anything over a normal seamless background, it's just a permanent version, there's no advantage really but also very little disadvantage, I think because I am taking a blank canvas and building the whole studio myself, it seemed little real effort to do it as I'm raising the floor anyway and have had to redo all the walls. I have also seen studios where they are neglected, I'm a little anal though with my work space so feel I am likely to take better care of it but you are entirely right, it's only worth doing if the work warrants it, I am definitely in 2 minds at the moment!

Thanks again for taking the time to reply!

Mat
 

docmoore

Subscriber and Workshop Member
Hi Mat,

Don't know but it seems that this is a far step from you core strength ... natural light ... good use of strobes.

I assume that if you put the effort into fixed but replaceable space and maximize the available light and space ...
you will be well served. And it will be something that going forward you can leverage in a new space ...new studio.

Hard to improve on your portraits of the seniors in my opinion.

Duplicating north light in the winter may be a challenge but will open up a number of months to you.

My biggest concern is whether the Cyclorama / Infinity wall will build the trust and relationship that you
are so adept at depicting with your clients. If not ... wasted effort ...

When you finish the studio it would be great to see a behind the scene behind the shot thread on what you have accomplished.

Bob
 
M

mjr

Guest
Hi Bob

Many thanks for the kind words and the thoughts!

I am with you on whether the space will allow me to interact as well with the clients, my current space is small and whilst that's a negative as far as what I can shoot, there isn't the space to back up and use longer lenses, having a 12m x 6m studio suddenly opens up lots of options but it's a large and impersonal space, even the echo makes it feel less intimate. I am leaning towards not bothering as I can always add it later if I feel the need. Luckily there are 2 very large windows, each are over 2m square and North facing which add a lot of lovely natural light to the room in summer but as you say, in the winter they won't help much, we are in 24hr daylight at the moment which means amazing light all day as it's reflected from the forest opposite and looks amazing, can't wait to shoot in it. I have a big set of Hensel strobes so hopefully the extra space will allow me to recreate some of that in the winter.

I will do a build thread if there's interest, I have done a huge amount in the last week but as it's just me doing the work it's not as quick as it could be, hopefully in a couple of weeks it will be open and ready for work. It's an amazing building with a beautiful big log cabin in the garden which is absolutely stunning, will be running workshops with accommodation soon! Amazing landscapes here and the bonus of a full studio and print setup should be good.

Have a good day

Mat
 

fotografz

Well-known member
Hi Mat, congratulations on your new space! A studio makes a lot of sense given where you live : -)

Personally, I'm for anything that expands the possibilities. I've had a studio space for many years, but they were always in my home. When I recently downsized I lost the nice sized one I used for 20 years. I now have a decent sized one in our winter home in Florida. However, being in home, both precluded a cyclorama .... something I dearly wished for many, many times.

IMO, backdrops are 1) a PITA to deal with, 2) not wide enough, and 3) expensive over time ... especially wide ones. I don't know about where you are, but 12' backdrops are as wide as commercially available here. Not to mention that a Cyclorama has a second wall that forms a seamless corner which you can't do with a backdrop.

A 20' wide cyclorama (or whatever width you select including the second wall) would be a dream come true. Even when dealing with one or two subjects, it allows you to move more freely on angles to the subject without running out of background ... especially when shooting full length figures with normal focal lengths or using a slightly wider lens with a group. The extra depth you have is another reason to have as wide a background as possible ... it allows you to move the subject forward away from the background to control light spill and/or to add light fall-off behind the subject ... again as the subject moves away from it, the background gets narrower ... this is something I am often fighting with normal backdrops.

Maintaining them is no different than any wall ...

Were I you, I'd built it now because you are redoing the floor anyway. It'll allow you to seamlessly make the cyc. Adding it later presents more issues ... plus, adding anything later usually ends up not happening.

If a Cyc is too much, then consider just a cove ... it'd still be 8' wider than a backdrop

A few more suggestions. Due to the 9' height I'd consider adding some top to the cove ... a simple drywall ceiling that can effectively increase the visual height when lit correctly... or can be used as bounce (thus making the lower height a positive rather than a negative).

Also, consider adding track on the sides of the cove nearer the background so you can light it without stands eating up space.

Here's a yummy example:

http://www.cycwallusa.com/?gclid=CN6Tz_eCuNQCFYOBaQodOo4FLA

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VKVY6f1YF9k

I say ... GO FOR IT!

- Marc
 
M

mjr

Guest
Hey Marc

Thanks for an opposing view! The video and studio space look excellent and very close to what I can make with my space, now I'm swaying back again!

I have one end of the space 6m wide, the left wall then goes 3m until it meets the window, the right hand side goes 4m until it meets a stairwell going down to the basement, if I do it I will take the cyc around both corners and down each wall as far as I can. The 2 big windows let in amazing light, they were the reason I thought about the cyc wall at all, I wanted to shoot natural light at times but as the subject would be 4m or more from the back wall, the floor/wall join would be visible, hence wanting to make it disappear and add the illusion of more depth.

The floor is concrete which wouldn't be an issue in most places but here, when it's -30 in the winter it will just be a pain, I am considering adding 50mm of hard insulation and then a floor on top so it is indeed the right time to do it and as it's just a bit of effort rather than a large expense, you may be right and I should just make it.

Maybe it's time for a couple of pics just to set the scene a little..

I got the keys last week, it was a real mess, great potential but had been closed as a shop for years and just used as a dumping ground for the guys family, day I got in..



In the last week I have gutted the place, back to bare wood, fixed a few problem areas and then started with the new plasterboard/drywall before tackling the floor. This is how it looked after 5 long days of work..





Excuse the iphone pics, the room goes back 12m, the other end has a smaller window and is going to be the work/print space, that has today been taken back to bare wood as well and I will start on replacing all the walls this afternoon. Interesting you say about the ceiling, I was tempted just to paint the wood black/dark grey in order to tame stray light but it may be worth adding the cyc wall up around to the roof too, it's worth considering anyway.

Thanks again.

Mat
 

fotografz

Well-known member
Very nice!

I'd advocate doing the ceiling even if it is just a ways out from the wall. It allows further back shots, or lower angle shots of subject without the hair falling within the ceiling wood ... which is impossible to retouch.

I don't have that issue in my Florida space because the cathedral ceilings angle up from 10' to 14' high ... and are 14' high for 15' wide.

I'd say that height is your biggest challenge ... In my previous studio with lower ceilings, I used shoot-into modifiers so I could get the softbox right up against the ceiling ... or boom arms on rolling stands.

Keep posting as you make decisions and make progress.

- Marc
 

Shashin

Well-known member
Mat:

Congrats on the new space.

I agree with Marc that the ceiling height is going to be your biggest challenge. It might be good to also to extend the wall to the ceiling. The infinity wall might actually help as most seamless setups are going to take away usable height.

Just keep clients from trying to skateboard on the walls, as tempting as that looks...
 
M

mjr

Guest
Thanks for the comments guys, much appreciated.

I have drawn out a plan, costed the materials and weighed up the pro's and cons and I'm going to do it.

I will probably turn this in to a bit of a build thread and update it at key points, if I can find the energy, a lot to do!

Have a nice evening.

Mat
 

fotografz

Well-known member
I'm actually excited for you Mat :thumbs:. I just love stuff like this rather than the constant gear discussions. A space like this and new lighting opportunities can really make more of a difference than a new lens or accessory. Lots of creative ways to use light.

I'm generally down in Florida during the winter and the natural light is amazing ... but it gets dark by 4:30 or 5:00 PM which is when many people can come to the studio to shoot portraits ... plus I do some commercial product stuff for the money and those have a deadline that requires shooting when you get the items.

Please, do keep us updated!

- Marc
 
M

mjr

Guest
Thanks Marc, I'm pretty excited too!

Some additional info if this is going to proceed as the build comes along. I'm not a big studio photographer, mainly because I haven't had the space, 95% of my work is on site and I don't really think it will drop much although I'm hoping I can produce some studio work and get some new clients as time goes on. The reason for buying this place is the never ending quest for improved income and better opportunities for whatever contracts come up here, it's a very small market so I need to be able to do anything and everything.

This place was built as a shop with apartment above, has been on the market for a number of years but as these rural communities are migrating to the bigger towns, nobody wanted it. I made a seriously low cash offer and to my surprise he took it! As this is Swedish Lapland, the landscapes are pretty amazing all year round, I'm 5 mins walk from a national park and a huge set of waterfalls, there are half a million tourists each year passing right by, I will see if I can tap in to that market with print sales, theres enough space for a small gallery.

The next big thing is the log cabin in the garden, it's really beautiful and there is a big market for holiday lets here, I have also had a lot of success with photography workshops in Iceland over the last few years so will be using the cabin as accommodation for small group photography workshops in the future, running them out of the studio with hundreds of great locations right on the doorstep could be good.

Anyway, here's a couple of pics of the place, the house is huge!



The cabin..



Inside is lovely too..





All this for an extremely low price, a lot of work is needed on the house but the studio will be ready within a few weeks I hope.

Cheers!

Mat
 
M

mjr

Guest
Morning!

Time for a build update, this is the second week of work on the studio, a long 5 days has seen some decent progress.

The shop had been converted to have a small store room at one end with a wall built, as I want my office and print space to be a part of the main room, the wall needed to go. I started on Monday with this..



Took it down..



Stripped all the walls and ceiling back to bare wood..



Started with new plasterboard after making a few repairs..



Built a false floor with 70mm insulation..



And last night managed to get a coat of dark grey on the ceiling in order to deal with some of the reflections as there isn't much height, plus some white on the walls..



Thats it for this week, pretty tired as having to do this all on my own, I don't lack motivation but my back, knees, elbows and most of the rest of me is hurting! Next week it's time for the trim to go around the ceiling and floor, fit the new floor to the main room and studio space and start on the cyclorama.

Have a nice weekend all!

Mat
 
M

mjr

Guest
Morning!

A midweek update as I'm running out of stuff to do until the flooring arrives, on Monday I started on the cyc wall with a plan to do the ceiling cove before the floor comes to make it easier to do. It took a little head scratching with the first piece, they are big sheets and a pain to get up on your own, I came up with the solution of screwing a piece of wood along the bottom edge at the right height and level and then a piece on to the ceiling around 5mm away from where the wood should end up, easy then to push the sheet in to place and let the tension hold it in position whilst I then manoeuvred it, works quite well. Only took a few hours to cut all the curves, fit them and put up the easy sheets. After that came the corner, I decided it would be easier to reduce the radius of the frame at he corners so I could fit strips under the board and screw through the outer sheet, strip and in to the frame, making it easy to plaster to level. I have put a rough coat of jointing plaster on last night so will sand it down this morning and then go for the top coat to get a smooth shape.

Quick shot of the corner..



I would class this as tricky rather than difficult, up to now it's gone pretty easy. I know I can use light to hide any imperfections but my ocd means I want it to look perfect whether lit or not, the joints from board to walls will look perfect when done. As it stands now, the main back wall cove extends 90cm in to the ceiling, that may be enough to give me the extra appearance of space but without causing issues with light bouncing around too much, I can extend it if needs be.

Mat
 
M

mjr

Guest
Morning

Another quick update, went and picked up the floor on Thursday, started to get it down in the afternoon but changed my mind on how it would be and so ran out of wood just over half way through so can't finish it now until next week. Got the wall which will double as a portrait area and a small gallery space finished, this wall will have a roll system mounted to the ceiling with some painted backdrops I can bring down as an alternative for headshots, it's big enough for 10 or so framed prints should I get any passing trade!



The cyc wall took a back seat as I started on the floor but as I now have most of the floor down in that area I shall continue with it today, probably 2/3rds completed now. Doesn't look like it but the joins are pretty much spot on now with the top half, looking forward to getting some paint on by the end of the week.



Have a nice weekend all!

Mat
 

fotografz

Well-known member
Hi mat, lookin' good! What a wonderfully creative environment you are building.

Even unfinished, you can tell how much "apparent height" the upper cove has added :thumbs:

The visually increased background height is really helpful when moving the subject forward away from the back wall and/or shooting subjects from a lower perspective. I've always been intrigued by the over-all difference in perspective between classic photos shot with waist-level finders (most MF SLRs and TLRs), and more eye level photos shot later on with regular finders.

Working with lighting will still be a challenge from time to time ... but when I had my previous studio with a lower ceiling, I tended to favor "shoot-into" larger modifiers as opposed to rear mount mods. It allowed me to place the mod right up against the ceiling for max height.

You are very handy ... so here's another suggestion you may already be doing or considering ...

Build a mobile bounce wall that could snug up against the wall in your first photo ... same height and width. I've seen a couple of studios that had this "false wall" and it was incredibly versatile. Just a thought, not that you need more work ... :ROTFL:

Keep the pics coming.

Thanks,

- Marc
 
M

mjr

Guest
Thanks Marc!

Hopefully in a couple of weeks I can start to play around with the light I have and look at new modifiers to make the most of the space, I am tempted with a couple of XL umbrellas, especially for lighting from above, up against the ceiling as you suggest and fire up in to them, will see once I can use it properly.

Still hoping to be able to work in a couple of weeks although there is still a lot to do, there's a huge amount going on behind the scenes which slows down progress a little, heating, water and electrical stuff have all needed work to get the building as a whole up and running, getting there though!

Interesting idea about the movable bounce wall, I have plenty of big polystyrene boards to use but hadn't thought about a large wall, once I'm working I will definitely look at options, too tired now though! A very nice ceiling track came up for sale here recently at a great price but really think it would hamper more than it helps as I'm down to 2.65m height now with the floor in place, would have been nice not to need stands at all though!

Anyway, back to it! Hopefully the boards will be in place for the bottom of the cyc wall by the end of today, then filing, sanding and getting ready for paint, it's quite satisfying!

Thanks again, have a good Sunday

Mat
 

fotografz

Well-known member
Hope the mods don't trash this thread. It is a really instructional post for anyone considering a smaller studio space even without the cyclorama part.

Westcott makes 7" parabolic umbrella and a diffuser for it that I've used on location and in the studio ... both cost $125 total. :thumbup:

- Marc
 
M

mjr

Guest
Evening

Quick update, a good couple of days has seen the floor finished and the structure of the cyc wall is complete, now on with finishing up the sanding and filling jobs and with some luck, painting it all and starting to equip it by the end of the week, feels good!

 
M

mjr

Guest
Afternoon!

Another quick update, the cyclorama is almost done, a coat of paint to use as a guide coat to highlight any issues has been applied and it looks pretty good. I wouldn't go as far as to say it was perfect but it's not far off.

Here's a quick, impatient shot to test the available shooting area for full length stuff, shot with the 63mm on the GFX, my normal choice for group or full length, taken from about 8m back from focus point, no cropping and only the available light through the big windows at ISO 640, no sign of the edges of the cyc wall and still plenty of room either side, only using about half the space here. I think once a couple more layers of paint have been added and the strobes are in, it will work perfectly.



Excuse the state of me, I've looked like this for the last 2.5 weeks!

Will do a final post when everything is in and working.

Have a nice weekend all.

Mat
 
Top