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Thread: Capture One catalog

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    Member bcf's Avatar
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    Capture One catalog

    Try as I might, I cannot wrap my head around the session concept

    But I have read rather unenthusiastic reports about the catalog functionality of Capture One Pro 7. How has it evolved since version 7.0? Is it now fully usable? C1 users, what is your experience?
    -- Bernard

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    Administrator Bob's Avatar
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    Re: Capture One catalog

    Sessions are great and isolate everything concerning a shoot in a single place.
    Catalogues are a mis-feature and so far are not stable enough to use.
    Lightroom has a catalogue sort of thing as well, but it is better in a few regards but worse in others.
    Sessions are a good balance.
    -bob

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    Re: Capture One catalog

    if only i had a secretary to help me organize my shooting, i'd have her/him start a file for each job that had subfolders for the incoming shots, processed shots, favorites, temporary trash, etc. and then automatically fill them up

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    Re: Capture One catalog

    Quote Originally Posted by jlm View Post
    if only i had a secretary to help me organize my shooting, i'd have her/him start a file for each job that had subfolders for the incoming shots, processed shots, favorites, temporary trash, etc. and then automatically fill them up
    That sounds an awful lot like just creating a new session.
    -bob

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    Re: Capture One catalog


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    Member padams's Avatar
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    Re: Capture One catalog

    I use both Sessions and Catalogs. 7.0's catalogs area good start. The big benefit over sessions is that they allow for search/filtering across many different shoots.

    The way I organize within my catalog is to:

    1. Do an import
    2. Create a new Project
    3. Create a new Album within that project that hold all new images
    4. Drag all new imported images into that new album
    5. Create a Smart Album within the project for 5 star images (selects).

    I use a Project as my outer container for the Albums as it constrains the Smart Album filters to just images inside the Project (unlike the Groups).

    One thing that is sorely missing from the Catalog functionality in 7.x is the ability to transfer folders of images to another hard drive from within Capture One. You can move images but if what you want is to essentially move a folder full of images then you need to first create an identical folder on the target hard drive and drag the files over to it.

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    Administrator Bob's Avatar
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    Re: Capture One catalog

    Quote Originally Posted by padams View Post
    I use both Sessions and Catalogs. 7.0's catalogs area good start. The big benefit over sessions is that they allow for search/filtering across many different shoots.

    The way I organize within my catalog is to:

    1. Do an import
    2. Create a new Project
    3. Create a new Album within that project that hold all new images
    4. Drag all new imported images into that new album
    5. Create a Smart Album within the project for 5 star images (selects).

    I use a Project as my outer container for the Albums as it constrains the Smart Album filters to just images inside the Project (unlike the Groups).

    One thing that is sorely missing from the Catalog functionality in 7.x is the ability to transfer folders of images to another hard drive from within Capture One. You can move images but if what you want is to essentially move a folder full of images then you need to first create an identical folder on the target hard drive and drag the files over to it.

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    --> Check out my new eBook: Wordpress For Photographers - The Guide To WordPress For Photographers | WP PHOTOG
    Nope, has have worked for me.
    Every time I try to load it up with 50-60k images it just lies down and dies, also I have more image kinds that c1 cannot deal with such as pdfs, film scans, pads etc.
    I find the best is still Media one for that sort of thing although it is cumbersome.
    When C1 stops going totally dead when I invest time in creating a catalog and when it starts rendering the file types I need, then it might be useful.
    I use xmp side-cars so that I can use either media one or bridge or something else. Small-scale DAM is not here for those not willing to spend a bunch of bucks.
    Since I organize my sessions by yyyy-mm-dd keyword, most are fairly easy to find without the overhead and confusion that results in lightroom, or catalogs.

    the best feature about sessions is that an entire session can be transferred from one computer to another without doing an export, just move or copy the entire directory
    -bob

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    Member bcf's Avatar
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    Re: Capture One catalog

    Bob and Peter, thanks for your replies.

    The search/filtering functionality across the whole catalog is what I am interested in in the catalog. Using sessions, say you want to find all photos made with a given lens, or all photos from a given location: is there a way to do that, other than searching sessions one by one?

    Peter, you say that you use both Sessions and Catalogs. May I ask how you combine the two, or organize your work with both? In your experience, what size catalog is manageable with C1?
    -- Bernard

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    Re: Capture One catalog

    The problem with using both sessions and catalogs is that editing changes made in the catalog are not reflected in the session and vice-versa.

    What I do, and I am not saying it is the best alternative, just one that works for me without paying a lot of money, is to use sessions with xmp side-car files in conjunction with Media Pro.
    metadata changes made in sessions or in media pro may be reflected back to the other with just a little annoyance, and that annoyance is that when a session is opened, Capture One will synchronize metadata found in the xmp files. There is a Capture One bug, which I have reported several times, that a change in metadata which might be visible in the C1 metadata panel are not shown in the session filters until the session is closed and then re-opened.
    With Media Pro, you may be frustrated looking for images made with a particular lens unless you add the lens as a keyword. I found that a lot of files did not contain lens data, from Leica files to negative scans. Media Pro does not provide a way to search by lens (that I have found) even if it is present.
    If Lightroom were not so annoying to work with tethered or in a multiple-computer and client environment it might be my choice if I could stand the way that it processes files and presents adjustments.

    Some folks will take their Capture One session and process all of their "selects" into preview-sized tiffs or jpegs and then catalog those with Aperture.

    There do exist professional digital asset management tools that are oriented for organizations such as publishers, but they are expensive. If a better solution for the individual photographer were offered I would jump on it. Unfortunately the market seems too small to support such an effort as most of the better single-photographer tools have been discontinued.

    Sadly I think that most photographers are happy with Lightroom or Aperture and work within the scope of their limitations. If I didn't like Capture One as much as I do, I would probably be amongst them.
    -bob

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    Re: Capture One catalog

    Thanks Bob, very informative.

    I do not have Media Pro, and I am rather reluctant to start using it, because of the uncertainty of its future. Phase One will probably place all their efforts into C1, and I'm afraid Media Pro will some day be discontinued. On the other hand, perhaps when this happens, the catalog functionality of C1 will have matured enough to replace Media Pro.

    The solution consisting of cataloguing tiff or jpg files with LR or Aperture is interesting.

    I like the idea of having a good folder structure, independent of any tool. The sessions as you use them could be this structure. Then C1 would be used most of the time, but other tools such as Iridient or Photo Ninja could be as well. And the catalog would be Media Pro... Mmm... Food for thought.

    I'm interested in other experiences...?
    -- Bernard

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    Senior Member Ario Arioldi's Avatar
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    Re: Capture One catalog

    I maintain since more than ten years a folder based structure for all my raw files which is totally independent from any other editing/cataloging tool I use.
    I make reference to that structure with Lightroom, with Aperture (referenced library) and more recently with Capture One (referenced catalog).
    All my files go into Lightroom and selected files only go to Capture One and/or Aperture. Other Raw Converters are also in use (Iridient, AccuRaw and Photo Nijia mainly in conjunction with Lightroom).

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    Member bcf's Avatar
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    Re: Capture One catalog

    Thanks Ario.

    So currently LR is your main catalog tool (and perhaps for processing as well?), and you use the others for certain types of photos?

    May I ask the size of your C1 catalog?
    -- Bernard

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    Senior Member Ario Arioldi's Avatar
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    Re: Capture One catalog

    Yes Bernard, LR is my main tool for cataloging and editing since it was launched (I got the first licence for free from Adobe as a replacement of RawShooter).
    I am also a long term user of Capture One (from version 3.x) as raw converter/editor but I have started adopting the new cataloging feature rather recently and at present my CO parallel catalog has just about two thousands pics.

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    Re: Capture One catalog

    Well, I am testing the C1 database, and the handling of location metadata seems to be haphazard... Sometimes it works, sometimes I cannot make a location "stick" to a picture. And when I apply location to a series of pictures, the number of pictures for a given location is not reflected in the "Place" filter (Library tab) until I quit C1 and relaunch it...

    Maybe not ready for prime time... A bit discouraging. Back to LR or Aperture, at least for the catalog?
    -- Bernard

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    Re: Capture One catalog

    I also could never get my head around "sessions", and I just found it it to be a major impediment to my use of C1. I have my own file structure, and I do not want my raw converter forcing me to use ITS file organization system. The dilemma is that C1 does do a great job at raw conversions. Depending upon the camera model, I can often produce a better conversion with C1, though LR is sometimes better. (IMO, the Highlights and Shadows controls in LR are much more effective, and you can use them locally.)
    So, what to do. Well, my solution is that I use LR as my "real" catalog for all of my digital images. When and if I have a file that I think I want to work on and possibly print, I will go over to C1 and import the Folder containing the image into my C17 catalog. When I am done working on the file in C17, I will export it as a TIFF to the same Folder and import that TIFF into my LR catalog. This has worked well for me, but I work on a relatively small number of images per year.

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    Member bcf's Avatar
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    Re: Capture One catalog

    Thanks Howard.

    I think I will adopt a similar workflow: use LR as the "backbone", cataloguing everything. If I want to use C1, send the raw to C1 (either to a session using the "Open directly" plugin, or imported in a C1 catalog, I am not sure yet), then import a TIFF (or a maximum quality JPEG?) into LR.
    -- Bernard

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    Re: Capture One catalog

    Bernard,
    I have about 35000 images in a structured folder system on my Mac HD so I can use any catalogue as referenced.
    After using the LR catalogus succesfully for years with no problems and "Open Directly" to Capture One session, I tried both Media Pro and Capture One Pro 7 catalogs and had only trouble (crashes, extremely long wait times and freezing) and after frequent contact with the very helpful and patient Phase One support went back to the LR catalog combined with C1 session and everything works smoothly again.
    maurice da silva solis

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    Member bcf's Avatar
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    Re: Capture One catalog

    Thanks Maurice. That's the route I'm embarking on as well...
    -- Bernard

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