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Thread: RAW Converters for Leica M8 DNG Files, C1 vs. LR or ?

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    Member beamon's Avatar
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    RAW Converters for Leica M8 DNG Files, C1 vs. LR or ?

    Yeah, I know, d/l LR and try it. Can and probably will, but to those with experience with both, what are your findings? I'm not even too proud to use a freebie/cheapie like RawTherapee and will appreciate any experiences.

    C1 is fine, but I'm not learning it very fast . Photography is an avocation and I have no heavy DAM requirements.

    TIA.
    Roger
    Leica M6, M8.2 & assorted Leica glass

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    Re: RAW Converters for Leica M8 DNG Files, C1 vs. LR or ?

    Quote Originally Posted by beamon View Post
    Yeah, I know, d/l LR and try it. Can and probably will, but to those with experience with both, what are your findings? I'm not even too proud to use a freebie/cheapie like RawTherapee and will appreciate any experiences.

    C1 is fine, but I'm not learning it very fast . Photography is an avocation and I have no heavy DAM requirements.

    TIA.
    Maybe you'd benefit from a class on Capture One from the comfort of your own home.

    You log on to the meeting and see my screen (via Screen Sharing technology) and then join a conference call to participate in the training and ask questions.

    Doug Peterson (e-mail Me)
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    Re: RAW Converters for Leica M8 DNG Files, C1 vs. LR or ?

    Quote Originally Posted by dougpetersonci View Post
    Maybe you'd benefit from a class on Capture One from the comfort of your own home.

    You log on to the meeting and see my screen (via Screen Sharing technology) and then join a conference call to participate in the training and ask questions.

    Doug Peterson (e-mail Me)
    I'd be cool with a go at that Doug. Do I get there from the PO site?

    Thanks,
    Roger
    Leica M6, M8.2 & assorted Leica glass

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    Re: RAW Converters for Leica M8 DNG Files, C1 vs. LR or ?

    Can the M8's use Flex Color? I loved that for the DMR, but it took me quite a while to really get fast with it. Not a lot in the way of documentation. It wasn't until my last shoot with the DMR that I finally became proficient enough with it to quickly process an entire shoot.

    Which makes me think, some of these companies need to hire a tech writer to put together a real manual and workflow. The increase in sales would probably be instant. Just because it makes sense to the developer doesn't mean it makes sense to anyone else, and any developer or company who honestly believes people will play with their app until they get it and realize its superiority is only fooling them self. Lightroom and Capture One are not necessarily the best, but they are popular because it is relatively easy to get tutorials and instruction on how to use them. That instruction/conveyed knowledge result in people being able to make superior images.

    <end rant>
    Last edited by Bill_Green; 6th August 2009 at 16:29.

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    Re: RAW Converters for Leica M8 DNG Files, C1 vs. LR or ?

    Quote Originally Posted by beamon View Post
    I'd be cool with a go at that Doug. Do I get there from the PO site?

    Thanks,
    http://www.captureintegration.com/20...e-web-seminar/

    Doug Peterson (e-mail Me)
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    Re: RAW Converters for Leica M8 DNG Files, C1 vs. LR or ?

    Quote Originally Posted by dougpetersonci View Post

    Ok, I see, Doug, thanks.

    Two things mitigate against the class. The charge and the fact that it is taylored for C1 Pro. I only have the standard version of 4.8.2 upgraded from the version that came with the M8.2

    Considering my non professional requirements, and acknowledging that C1 may well be the best processor for the DNG files, my inclination is to process in C1. I suspect that LR will do whatever further PP is necessary. And, I can always hope that LR will, in the future, be as effective a processor for DNG files as C1.

    Anyone else doing it this way with their DNG files?
    Roger
    Leica M6, M8.2 & assorted Leica glass

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    Re: RAW Converters for Leica M8 DNG Files, C1 vs. LR or ?

    Quote Originally Posted by beamon View Post
    Ok, I see, Doug, thanks.

    Two things mitigate against the class. The charge and the fact that it is taylored for C1 Pro. I only have the standard version of 4.8.2 upgraded from the version that came with the M8.2

    Considering my non professional requirements, and acknowledging that C1 may well be the best processor for the DNG files, my inclination is to process in C1. I suspect that LR will do whatever further PP is necessary. And, I can always hope that LR will, in the future, be as effective a processor for DNG files as C1.
    http://www.captureintegration.com/20...pture-one-pro/

    I don't presume to tell you how to spend your money, nor to know whether it would be worth it for you but I thought you'd like to know the differences between C1 and C1 Pro (listed in the above link) and that the upgrade from the Leica to Pro version is $300.

    For your purposes the customizations allowed in the pro version, clarity, and the Color Editor are very powerful additions to the program.

    As to the cost of the class: it's our hope (and broad experience) that the class would save you nearly uncountable hours of trudging through the program as well as improve the quality of your output; not a bad deal for $99 (basic) or $199 (advanced), but... of course I would say that: I teach the class! [obvious bias].

    Doug Peterson (e-mail Me)
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    Re: RAW Converters for Leica M8 DNG Files, C1 vs. LR or ?

    I've been reading the Capture Integration site, Doug, and appreciate the features that the Pro version has. It makes the choice between it and LR all the more difficut.

    I have a reservation re: C1 Pro in that the recent divorce twixt PO and Leica could lead to less, rather than more, support for Leica RAW formats. I guess that only time will tell. The upside to C1 Pro is that the online tutorials would likely be enough to get me into the flow of things. Meanwhile, I'm able to use the standard version well enough to nearly satisfy my needs. I'm paying the price for being late to the digital party.
    Roger
    Leica M6, M8.2 & assorted Leica glass

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    Re: RAW Converters for Leica M8 DNG Files, C1 vs. LR or ?

    I too, wanted to try C1 but no luck. I previously had C1 from the Sandisk deal, but the license code rejects to deactivate. I cannot input a new code (the one provided with my M8.2 purchase) to activate it. What a bummer and I am now stuck at version 4.13 or something!

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    Re: RAW Converters for Leica M8 DNG Files, C1 vs. LR or ?

    Quote Originally Posted by francishmt View Post
    I too, wanted to try C1 but no luck. I previously had C1 from the Sandisk deal, but the license code rejects to deactivate. I cannot input a new code (the one provided with my M8.2 purchase) to activate it. What a bummer and I am now stuck at version 4.13 or something!
    No guarantee, Francis, but try d/l the trial version from the Phase One site (it will probably be the version 4.8.2 latest). Then apply your code from the disc that you received with your M8.2. I'll bet that will do it for you. If not, ask PO what to do.
    Roger
    Leica M6, M8.2 & assorted Leica glass

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    Re: RAW Converters for Leica M8 DNG Files, C1 vs. LR or ?

    Quote Originally Posted by francishmt View Post
    I too, wanted to try C1 but no luck. I previously had C1 from the Sandisk deal, but the license code rejects to deactivate. I cannot input a new code (the one provided with my M8.2 purchase) to activate it. What a bummer and I am now stuck at version 4.13 or something!
    4.1.3 was before version 4 went "pro" and had no dSLR (or rangefinder) support. So it wouldn't accept activation by a C1 M8 license.

    Uninstall 4.1.x. Download and install 4.8.2. Activate using your M8 key. Enjoy.

    Doug Peterson (e-mail Me)
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    Re: RAW Converters for Leica M8 DNG Files, C1 vs. LR or ?

    Uninstall didn't work. I uninstalled it through the program menu, but when I reinstalled it, the same license code still exist and won't allow me to input a new key.

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    Re: RAW Converters for Leica M8 DNG Files, C1 vs. LR or ?

    Quote Originally Posted by francishmt View Post
    Uninstall didn't work. I uninstalled it through the program menu, but when I reinstalled it, the same license code still exist and won't allow me to input a new key.
    Call me on my cell tomorrow and I'll help you figure it out.

    Normally we'd reserve such support for our customers, but I'm not inclined to let you hit your head against a wall

    Doug Peterson (e-mail Me)
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    Re: RAW Converters for Leica M8 DNG Files, C1 vs. LR or ?

    Thank you Doug for getting me through this. I came out with more knowledge on C1 than before. Much appreciated.

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    Re: RAW Converters for Leica M8 DNG Files, C1 vs. LR or ?

    Quote Originally Posted by beamon View Post
    I've been reading the Capture Integration site, Doug, and appreciate the features that the Pro version has. It makes the choice between it and LR all the more difficut.

    I have a reservation re: C1 Pro in that the recent divorce twixt PO and Leica could lead to less, rather than more, support for Leica RAW formats. I guess that only time will tell. The upside to C1 Pro is that the online tutorials would likely be enough to get me into the flow of things. Meanwhile, I'm able to use the standard version well enough to nearly satisfy my needs. I'm paying the price for being late to the digital party.
    Roger

    I have tried them all including Lightzone, Raw Developer, ACR, Lightroom, and concluded that C1 Pro is simply the best. I do have needs for DAM however so I use Lightroom for file storage and retrieval.

    I was able to get a couple of hours with Doug Peterson at the recent workshop in Northern Arizona with Guy. Doug is an immense talent with a real flair for teaching. I was already reasonably accomplished with C1 Pro but realized after the class how far I had yet to go (and still do so I may consider the advanced version of Doug's class in the near future)

    Anyway, just my humble opinion and insights gained from a few years of evaluating images from a number of raw converters. Hopefully you may have gained an insight or two from this post

    Regards

    Woody

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    Re: RAW Converters for Leica M8 DNG Files, C1 vs. LR or ?

    Many thanks for the comments, Woody. That seems to be the consensus opinion from the majority of M8 users.

    Since I have it, I'll stick with C1 for the foreseeable future and if DAM becomes an item for me (I suspect that it will as my experience with the M8 indicates that many more images will be shot), I'll cross that bridge when necessary.
    Roger
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    Re: RAW Converters for Leica M8 DNG Files, C1 vs. LR or ?

    Hi Roger,

    At the first workshop Guy and Jack arranged in Yosemite, Guy took the same RAW files from an M8 and put them into 3 processors, including ACR and C1. I felt C1 was superior and I have used it since then. We looked at portrait and landscape files; C1 looked much better on the portraits, in particular (in my very humble opinion!).

    Doug has been of great help in teaching me the more intermediate and advanced aspects of C1 (while at the Moab workshop number 2). I hope Capture Integration can come to the upcoming workshop on the Oregon coast so I can spend more time on C1 with them.

    Maybe Doug or someone else can address learning about C1 via Capture U?

    Thanks, steve

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    Re: RAW Converters for Leica M8 DNG Files, C1 vs. LR or ?

    The folks from Capture Integration will be in Oregon. We will be doing C1 again for sure. We have a conference room just for this stuff plus CS4 and Pano work. We are loaded for bear on this one. LOL

    Roger you should really consider going. We also will have Leica there as well and plenty of demo gear to try out.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

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    Re: RAW Converters for Leica M8 DNG Files, C1 vs. LR or ?

    Hi Roger,

    I thought of one more reason I use C1. On the M8, I frequently shoot in IR. If I use ACR, the WB is limited to 2000 K and sometimes that is not low enough. C1 allows temps to 800 K.

    Thanks, steve

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    Re: RAW Converters for Leica M8 DNG Files, C1 vs. LR or ?

    Quote Originally Posted by scatesmd View Post
    Hi Roger,

    At the first workshop Guy and Jack arranged in Yosemite, Guy took the same RAW files from an M8 and put them into 3 processors, including ACR and C1. I felt C1 was superior and I have used it since then. We looked at portrait and landscape files; C1 looked much better on the portraits, in particular (in my very humble opinion!).

    Doug has been of great help in teaching me the more intermediate and advanced aspects of C1 (while at the Moab workshop number 2). I hope Capture Integration can come to the upcoming workshop on the Oregon coast so I can spend more time on C1 with them.

    Maybe Doug or someone else can address learning about C1 via Capture U?

    Thanks, steve
    Great stuff, Steve. Good A/B comparisons like that are the most convincing ammunition available. One sees the results in real time and makes up his mind.

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Mancuso View Post
    The folks from Capture Integration will be in Oregon. We will be doing C1 again for sure. We have a conference room just for this stuff plus CS4 and Pano work. We are loaded for bear on this one. LOL

    Roger you should really consider going. We also will have Leica there as well and plenty of demo gear to try out.
    I'd love to, Guy, but have what looks to be a direct conflict at that time. It's a command performance at our daughter and son-in law's place. The irony of it is that they live in The Sea Ranch, CA right down the road from where you guys will be in OR. The possibility of breaking away to get to your workshop is, unfortunately, only a very, very remote possibility. You've got my attention for the future, though.

    Quote Originally Posted by scatesmd View Post
    Hi Roger,

    I thought of one more reason I use C1. On the M8, I frequently shoot in IR. If I use ACR, the WB is limited to 2000 K and sometimes that is not low enough. C1 allows temps to 800 K.

    Thanks, steve
    An impressive body of evidence is being assembled, Steve. In the well ordered life that I lead at my age, I tend to do too much thinking about the future. I should just act on what is here and now and let the future take care of itself re: future support of Leica by PO. My ideal of one piece of s/w to cover RAW conversions and futher PP is likely not realistic, and I suspect that the future may see me into several more before my time is up!
    Roger
    Leica M6, M8.2 & assorted Leica glass

  21. #21
    Johannes01
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    Re: RAW Converters for Leica M8 DNG Files, C1 vs. LR or ?

    I came across this same problem,now thanks for your advice.

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