The GetDPI Photography Forum
Great to see you here. Join our insightful photographic forum today and start tapping into a huge wealth of photographic knowledge. Completing our simple registration process will allow you to gain access to exclusive content, add your own topics and posts, share your work and connect with other members through your own private inbox! And don’t forget to say hi!
Comparing the Leica S 007 to other MF alternatives
- Thread starter glenerrolrd
- Start date
erick.boileau
Member
I sent my M to repair twice and got it back 4 or 5 days later
The M9 MM, which is the CCD version. High ISO is fine.
Seascape
New member
Love my Monochrom V1, I was recently offered a mint 246 at a very attractive price as a trade up.
I said to the salesman (that I bought the mint V1 from just a year ago at a clear out price) "why would I do that, the V1 is the closest thing to my M4 (bought in 1970) and Plus X"…..it's perfect just the way it is for my type of shooting :thumbs:
Last edited:
doug
Well-known member
I sent my R 280/4 APO for repair almost four months ago and have not yet received an estimate for the repair cost. Today I spoke with Kevin at Leica USA and he acknowledged receiving the lens and told me it had to be sent to Germany for repair. And I thought four months' turnaround (for the lens' initial service some years ago) was slow. I expect that after I approve the estimate the lens will return six months later (like the most recent "service") and that I'll either have to re-connect the aperture linkage myself or complain of missing caps. Leica's service is terrible.
M
mjr
Guest
Morning
I'm not sure if being in the EU helps but I had my fair share of issues with S kit and found the service to be excellent. Even though I live in the middle of nowhere by the Arctic circle, every time I had a problem I got a loan body sent to me within 48 hours for the duration of repairs, I had a problem with a 24mm I bought with poor performance, they sent me a new body, lens and also sent me loaners of all my other lenses so they could check whether it was my camera or the lens and check all the others too. Sure, it shouldn't be necessary for kit that costs as much as it does but I can't complain. The guy in charge of my area was rubbish and he even had the nerve to tell me that I shouldn't check up on my kit because the guys at HQ where doing more than could reasonably be expected, I pointed out that I don't expect anything beyond paying for a piece of equipment and it working, anything they had to do beyond that was their issue not mine, he apologised.
Having a good dealer really helps, I also found that marking the box of kit I was sending in with a big red "P" for professional meant that it got dealt with quicker. It's a shame to read about such poor service, not on at all.
Mat
I'm not sure if being in the EU helps but I had my fair share of issues with S kit and found the service to be excellent. Even though I live in the middle of nowhere by the Arctic circle, every time I had a problem I got a loan body sent to me within 48 hours for the duration of repairs, I had a problem with a 24mm I bought with poor performance, they sent me a new body, lens and also sent me loaners of all my other lenses so they could check whether it was my camera or the lens and check all the others too. Sure, it shouldn't be necessary for kit that costs as much as it does but I can't complain. The guy in charge of my area was rubbish and he even had the nerve to tell me that I shouldn't check up on my kit because the guys at HQ where doing more than could reasonably be expected, I pointed out that I don't expect anything beyond paying for a piece of equipment and it working, anything they had to do beyond that was their issue not mine, he apologised.
Having a good dealer really helps, I also found that marking the box of kit I was sending in with a big red "P" for professional meant that it got dealt with quicker. It's a shame to read about such poor service, not on at all.
Mat
Apparently Leica service is extremely inconsistent. I've had issues with my S2P, and subsequently almost all of my CS lenses. A failure rate that caused trepidation every time I went to use the S on a job.
Other than travel distance, it should not make any difference where you are located.
I just received an e-mail blast titled ... "Leica SL and S: The Perfect Professional Tools" ... So, Leica is touting some of its products as professional choices, but seem unable to grasp what that means for professional after purchase service.
In the USA Kelsey Haines used to be the S specialist, now John Kreidler is her replacement ... sort of ... it isn't clear if he works for Leica or is a sub-contracted ombudsman. Both Kelsey and John have been very helpful, but it has proven to be of no avail when it comes to getting defective products fixed in a reasonably timely manner.
In past, I availed myself of Leica's S loaner policy IF they had the product in question available, which did help to be sure.
Not everything I own is critical need, the body and a few key lenses are essential but I can manage without some things. So, for example, I sent in a CS180 for the failed AF issue and didn't press for a loaner after I was supposedly fast tracked on that repair. That lens went off to Leica USA mid-May with an official repair request attached, and was signed for at the Leica loading dock according to UPS Tracking. Not one peep since. No acknowledgement from Leica USA or Germany. No e-mail, no letter, nothing. My $7,000+ lens is God knows where and will be returned God knows when. Frankly, it is unnerving.
I had an issue with the S charger, they sent me a demo replacement until a new one could be had ... that was 3 months ago and the new one never arrived, and not one word of communication. BTW, while the S(006) is warrantied for 3 years, the accessories are not, including the charger. That fact must be buried in fine print somewhere.
Sigh.
- Marc
Other than travel distance, it should not make any difference where you are located.
I just received an e-mail blast titled ... "Leica SL and S: The Perfect Professional Tools" ... So, Leica is touting some of its products as professional choices, but seem unable to grasp what that means for professional after purchase service.
In the USA Kelsey Haines used to be the S specialist, now John Kreidler is her replacement ... sort of ... it isn't clear if he works for Leica or is a sub-contracted ombudsman. Both Kelsey and John have been very helpful, but it has proven to be of no avail when it comes to getting defective products fixed in a reasonably timely manner.
In past, I availed myself of Leica's S loaner policy IF they had the product in question available, which did help to be sure.
Not everything I own is critical need, the body and a few key lenses are essential but I can manage without some things. So, for example, I sent in a CS180 for the failed AF issue and didn't press for a loaner after I was supposedly fast tracked on that repair. That lens went off to Leica USA mid-May with an official repair request attached, and was signed for at the Leica loading dock according to UPS Tracking. Not one peep since. No acknowledgement from Leica USA or Germany. No e-mail, no letter, nothing. My $7,000+ lens is God knows where and will be returned God knows when. Frankly, it is unnerving.
I had an issue with the S charger, they sent me a demo replacement until a new one could be had ... that was 3 months ago and the new one never arrived, and not one word of communication. BTW, while the S(006) is warrantied for 3 years, the accessories are not, including the charger. That fact must be buried in fine print somewhere.
Sigh.
- Marc
erick.boileau
Member
Exactly ! you have to prove that your are professional , I gave my VAT number, and asked before how long it will take and which day I should send it
but first of all I have asked to Wetzlar directly by email or phone (generally to Gabriele Arnold) ... and I live in Germany (130km from Wetzlar)
(on my experience only of course !) I find Leica's support very good and friendly, they have coded my 135 APO for free in one week when the date for coding without charge was one month over
Last edited:
erick.boileau
Member
If I had such a bad experience with Leica I shall sell all my gear at once I think
Last edited:
Kolor-Pikker
Member
This thread is getting me concerned since the MF community is far too small for this to be an anecdote of "people only talk about their gear online when there's a problem with it".
For something made by a German company that supposedly prides itself on making immaculately crafted devices, you'd think that your gear shouldn't break at all, right? or is this really just the horror stories thread?
erick.boileau
Member
My gear broke twice and was repaired in one week, I only report my own experience
doug
Well-known member
I'm not far from this decision. What's the point of fabulous image quality if the downtime is 25%?
It's becoming increasingly difficult to rationalize the high cost of this lens (and the backup lens to cover the other one's downtime) in a saturated market for wildlife images.
The fact that it broke twice is not good. Most in Europe do not realize how frustrating it is to deal with Leica IF the gear has to go to Germany. Even if problems can be solved in the US it's a bit better, but even a simple CLA can take 3 months from my recent experiences. I the past that is why I have bought duplicate bodies so I at least have one working copy. Thjis make Leica ownership EXTREMELY expensive versus other manufacturers. Personel changes over the last few years have not helped and in fact might have lenghtened wait times.
glenerrolrd
Workshop Member
Leica service is on the average ...terrible . Don t use it unless you have to and when you do make sure you have a good dealer ( I use Dale in the USA) . Normal turnaround is 6-12 weeks ....but as we approach (1) summer plant shut down and (2) Photokina year new product introduction ....service is just understaffed . Expect 6 months and hope for the best .
If the service is in Germany ..you have to speak with Germany to learn anything . If you track you service order ..you will see that it loses 2-4 weeks getting from you to NJ and then to Germany . In the past I have paid to air freight it to Germany ....turn around was excellent .
A few years back I complied my full history of repairs which included ...losing my Noctilux in NJ,damaging the front element in Germany , 4 round trips on my 50 summilux and on and on . Well over 30 service orders . Since then I have had another 10 ....surprisingly the work done in NJ came back quickly and was well done . The work sent to Germany was about 50% with several knock down fights to get things correct . Never once did Germany acknowledge any issue with service or apologize for issues .
My advice ..if you are a working Pro on a budget ...find another option . If you can afford some down time on your equipment occasionally ......its still my favorite system ever ! The only system with better image quality are the new 100MP backs with the new lenses (and they have a totally different size and form ).
If the service is in Germany ..you have to speak with Germany to learn anything . If you track you service order ..you will see that it loses 2-4 weeks getting from you to NJ and then to Germany . In the past I have paid to air freight it to Germany ....turn around was excellent .
A few years back I complied my full history of repairs which included ...losing my Noctilux in NJ,damaging the front element in Germany , 4 round trips on my 50 summilux and on and on . Well over 30 service orders . Since then I have had another 10 ....surprisingly the work done in NJ came back quickly and was well done . The work sent to Germany was about 50% with several knock down fights to get things correct . Never once did Germany acknowledge any issue with service or apologize for issues .
My advice ..if you are a working Pro on a budget ...find another option . If you can afford some down time on your equipment occasionally ......its still my favorite system ever ! The only system with better image quality are the new 100MP backs with the new lenses (and they have a totally different size and form ).
erick.boileau
Member
Is it only in US that you have these problems ? the distance ? I agree that this is unacceptable for a material at this price
The main problem with Leica : the lenses are fabulous , and it is very difficult to decide to sell all
I never had any problem before with Canon or Hasselblad or even Sony, and yes it is very frustrating, I have the chance to drive 1:30 hours to go to Wetzlar
The main problem with Leica : the lenses are fabulous , and it is very difficult to decide to sell all
Last edited:
Photo Lawyer
Member
I'm very happy with my 007 and 006. Wouldn't want to trade them for anything.
The resolution issue is for bragging now. Yes, I would like the most, just for bragging.
But David Farkas addressed resolution for me in that post two years ago.
I printed S2 files years ago to 7.5 feet by 5 feet and got handsomely rewarded for the effort. I would not upgrade from my now 007 just for resolution gains. I would prefer they not bother to increase to 50 but wait until 80-100 can be achieved with the sensor quality that have now. The lenses can handle that, but again, other than for cropping in, I don't need such resolution for other than bragging. But to attract new buyers to the system, maybe they need higher resolution just for marketing.
The price of used S gear, and the lowered cost of new gear makes price so much less of an issue now.
Format is heading more and more to 9x16 so 4x5 now sometimes seems just a bit strange to me.
I have had excellent service and rarely needed it. But Dale made that all so smooth when necessary.
If the question is which MF system I would choose from scratch today?
Leica makes it even easier choice as I would just buy all used S gear.
Unfortunately, when they finally introduce that 350mm S, there will not be any used lenses to buy.
But David Farkas addressed resolution for me in that post two years ago.
I printed S2 files years ago to 7.5 feet by 5 feet and got handsomely rewarded for the effort. I would not upgrade from my now 007 just for resolution gains. I would prefer they not bother to increase to 50 but wait until 80-100 can be achieved with the sensor quality that have now. The lenses can handle that, but again, other than for cropping in, I don't need such resolution for other than bragging. But to attract new buyers to the system, maybe they need higher resolution just for marketing.
The price of used S gear, and the lowered cost of new gear makes price so much less of an issue now.
Format is heading more and more to 9x16 so 4x5 now sometimes seems just a bit strange to me.
I have had excellent service and rarely needed it. But Dale made that all so smooth when necessary.
If the question is which MF system I would choose from scratch today?
Leica makes it even easier choice as I would just buy all used S gear.
Unfortunately, when they finally introduce that 350mm S, there will not be any used lenses to buy.
Jan
Member
Perhaps the claim dates back to the times when all was mechanical. Electronics is an entire different ball game.
Kolor-Pikker
Member
Well, perhaps.., I'm knocking on wood here but my Canon cameras never had issues, even though one is 10 years old and the other is 7. I own a whole bunch of digital cameras and none of them needed repairs, some of which were just $600 entry-level cams made of plastic, but have more shots on them than the rated life. None of my original CF cards work anymore, but the cameras do.
OMG... If I told you the troubles I've had in the last two years you'd think me the fool for still owning anything with a red dot.
I feel like a fool. And my wife says that I have a toxic relationship with Leica. Anyway, no more I'm selling it all if I can get reasonable offers for the items. It's a shame but I need to be strong.
Honestly, I have no idea what I'll do next. Guess I'll be miserable shooting with gear I'm not 100% in love with.