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X1D II or maybe a III

ndwgolf

Member
Guys
Im thinking of buying a new X1D II ..............I’m just throwing it out there, is there a X1D III on the horizon maybe?

Neil
 

tcdeveau

Active member
Have not seen anything about it. AFAIK, Hasselblad and/or DJI are the only people that has any info on it. If a new X body is on the horizon, I'm guessing we won't see an announcement until mid-to-late next year, with shipping happening who knows when after that. I'm patiently waiting for a 100mp X-body, so I'd love for HB to prove me wrong and come out with something sooner.

The only thing I've seen: DJI filed a design patent in China last year directed to a new X body that adds an articulating screen and a joystick, but the filing of a design patent doesn't even mean that a product will materialize, let alone provide any information on the timing even if it does mature into a product. There is also a possibility that the camera of the design patent may not even mature into a Hasselblad-branded product if it ever comes out, although I doubt it wouldn't be a HB X body.

I'd probably look for a used X1DII or even an X1D (I) if I were buying into the X system today and not looking at the 907x/CFVII.
 

onasj

Active member
My hope and expectation, for what it's worth, is that the commercial success of the x1d m1 and m2, as well as the CFV-ii-50c, will give Hasselblad the courage to make a x2d that uses the 100 MP Sony IMX461BSI sensor (same as is in the Fuji GFX-100, and basically a 44x33 crop of the 54x40 sensor in the world-class Phase One IQ4 back), as well as a CFV-iii-100c that uses the same sensor. The BSI makes a big difference-- about 1 stop of better noise performance, no need for a dark frame or color shift correction frame, and faster as well.

Though even better would be using the 54x40 sensor in the IQ4 and cropping to 40x40 electronically, which would give a 112 MP square image reminiscent of Hasselblad's historic 6x6 format.

I would be thrilled with either or both :)
 

tcdeveau

Active member
My hope and expectation, for what it's worth, is that the commercial success of the x1d m1 and m2, as well as the CFV-ii-50c, will give Hasselblad the courage to make a x2d that uses the 100 MP Sony IMX461BSI sensor (same as is in the Fuji GFX-100, and basically a 44x33 crop of the 54x40 sensor in the world-class Phase One IQ4 back), as well as a CFV-iii-100c that uses the same sensor. The BSI makes a big difference-- about 1 stop of better noise performance, no need for a dark frame or color shift correction frame, and faster as well.

Though even better would be using the 54x40 sensor in the IQ4 and cropping to 40x40 electronically, which would give a 112 MP square image reminiscent of Hasselblad's historic 6x6 format.

I would be thrilled with either or both :)
Definitely agree here.

FYI the "no need for a dark frame" really only applies to P1, and an advantage of the IQ4 150 compared to other P1 backs. Every HB cam I'm aware of (H, X, and CFV) doesn't use a dark frame, regardless of the sensor. This was one thing that drew me to the H4D-40 over P1 when i ventured into medium format. Long exposures were limited to 256 seconds on the H4D-40 but there was still no dark frame. I predominately do long exposures with my X1D and lack of a dark frame is awesome. P1 only did away with it with the IQ4 150, if they had done it earlier they may have my $$ instead of HB.
 

PSS

New member
The 100mpix sony sensor (from the GFX100) has faster readout, BSI and PDAF....it also requires much better cooling, it wont fit into a X1D (or CFV) size body....
I am sure hasselblad is looking at a next gen model but that mostly depends on sony providing a sensor.....and considering the 907 is just now starting to ship, even if there was an announcement (which would not be good for sales of existing bodies) i cant see anything shipping before end 2021....
and again, right now, there is no sensor unless hasselblad completely redesigns all bodies....
i hope sony keeps working on 33x44 size sensors, it seems to be the ratio and size that makes the most sense.....hasselblad and fuji have mature lines of glass out now, it is a definite step up from FF35mm and still easy enough to manufacture....
I personally would not mind seeing a newer version of the 50mpix sensor, BSI, maybe PDAF (banding is an issue and AF will never compete with smaller bodies) better DR and higher ISO while keeping bodies the same size , maybe faster readout To enable video and for eshutter to make more sense?
either way, X1D is pretty cheap now, X1DII are available used already as well, 907/CFV will ship soon.....no reason to wait....buy glass, next year we will know more about what is coming....
 

tcdeveau

Active member
The 100mpix sony sensor (from the GFX100) has faster readout, BSI and PDAF....it also requires much better cooling, it wont fit into a X1D (or CFV) size body....
I am sure hasselblad is looking at a next gen model but that mostly depends on sony providing a sensor.....

and again, right now, there is no sensor unless hasselblad completely redesigns all bodies....
out of curiosity, why do you say the [IMX461BSI sensor of the GFX100] won’t fit into the X1D/CFV body? Are you just going on the assumption that it requires more cooling, or do you have additional data/insight?

physically, it should fit, and the X1D body is also designed as a giant heat sink, unlike the GFX bodies. My understanding of the GFX100 is a lot of the size accommodations are due to the IBIS mechanism and not the sensor itself. Hasselblad probably was aware of this sensor when the X1DII and CFVII were announced last year (around the same time of GFX100), it would’ve also been pretty short sighted of their engineers to not have the 100mp sensor in mind when designing the X1DII and CFVII.

Phase One is also using this sensor in a digital back for its industrial products, so I’d have a hard time believing the CFVII back itself is not suitable for the sensor.

sure, maybe some redesign/retrofit is needed, which could be an underlying reason hasselblad hasn’t come out with a 100mp 33x44mm product yet, but saying it won’t fit and there’s no sensor from Sony suitable for hasselblad currently?
 
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PSS

New member
out of curiosity, why do you say the [IMX461BSI sensor of the GFX100] won’t fit into the X1D/CFV body? Are you just going on the assumption that it requires more cooling, or do you have additional data/insight?

physically, it should fit, and the X1D body is also designed as a giant heat sink, unlike the GFX bodies. My understanding of the GFX100 is a lot of the size accommodations are due to the IBIS mechanism and not the sensor itself. Hasselblad probably was aware of this sensor when the X1DII and CFVII were announced last year (around the same time of GFX100), it would’ve also been pretty short sighted of their engineers to not have the 100mp sensor in mind when designing the X1DII and CFVII.

Phase One is also using this sensor in a digital back for its industrial products, so I’d have a hard time believing the CFVII back itself is not suitable for the sensor.

sure, maybe some redesign/retrofit is needed, which could be an underlying reason hasselblad hasn’t come out with a 100mp 33x44mm product yet, but saying it won’t fit and there’s no sensor from Sony suitable for hasselblad currently?
AFAIK fuji could not fit the 100 sensor into their smaller bodies without IBIS, the X1D/X1DII get hot to the touch with the 50mpix sensor....the phase drone camera using the sensor is similar in size to the CVF but has no screen or on board power (and probably not much onboard processing?)
I am not saying there wont be a hasselblad X2D/X1DIII/... follow up model, I hope there will be!
the information available from the fuji launch and physical size of available hasselblad product does not point to the use of the existing 100mpix sony sensor....but who knows? Maybe they can tweak it, obviously the next hasselblad models will be tweaked as well but regardless, i doubt we will see an announcement in the next year, which means no shipping product for at least 18 months....
hopefully i am wrong, but i ordered my 907 combo 2 months ago, looks like i wont get it for another 6-8 weeks, so......
 

ndwgolf

Member
Thanks for all the feedback.Let me take a look at the second hand market for the X1D II and see if it anything like the H6D or S007 market.........almost give away price.

Quite a few of you mentioned the 907.........without being rude surly that is a more of a gimmicky kind of camera not something that someone would seriously consider as a everyday camera.
I managed to sell all my Leica M gear, I eventually got rid of my H6D100c along with a bunch of HC lenses, I am still trying to give away my Leica S007 plus 3 S lenses. My everyday camera now is a Nikon D850 (I’m a keen wildlife and birder photographer) and a iPhone as my walk about camera...........this is the bit that is missing for me hence looking at getting a X1D as a travel camera with the 80mm f1.9 lens attached (new they are ~USD10k plus 20% import duty so if I can pick up a good X1D II second hand for say $2500 then that would cancel out the VAT/Duty into Thailand.
Lets go shopping :) :) :)

Neil
 
Thanks for all the feedback.Let me take a look at the second hand market for the X1D II and see if it anything like the H6D or S007 market.........almost give away price.

Quite a few of you mentioned the 907.........without being rude surly that is a more of a gimmicky kind of camera not something that someone would seriously consider as a everyday camera.
I managed to sell all my Leica M gear, I eventually got rid of my H6D100c along with a bunch of HC lenses, I am still trying to give away my Leica S007 plus 3 S lenses. My everyday camera now is a Nikon D850 (I’m a keen wildlife and birder photographer) and a iPhone as my walk about camera...........this is the bit that is missing for me hence looking at getting a X1D as a travel camera with the 80mm f1.9 lens attached (new they are ~USD10k plus 20% import duty so if I can pick up a good X1D II second hand for say $2500 then that would cancel out the VAT/Duty into Thailand.
Lets go shopping :) :) :)

Neil
If you can find an x1d II for $2500 please get two and I'll take one off your hands :) Right now the x1d is going for anywhere between $2300-2500 and the mark II is hovering around $5000 used. I ended up buying a GFX 50R for $2750 and so far not disappointed. Happy shopping and good luck.
 

olafphoto

Administrator
Staff member
Both the X1D II and the GFX 50R are great cameras. Hasselblad is beautifully made therefore higher pricing. The image quality is very similar (the same sensor) with slight differences in colour science. If you are thinking about the X1DII, get it now. New cameras are in the works with planned debut for next year but with the COVID situation I wouldn't be surprised if they postpone some announcements. I don't think we will see anything this year.
 
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Godfrey

Well-known member
...
Quite a few of you mentioned the 907.........without being rude surly that is a more of a gimmicky kind of camera not something that someone would seriously consider as a everyday camera.
...
Not sure why you consider the 907x a "gimmicky camera" or why I couldn't use it for "everyday" stuff. It's a traditional, modular Hasselblad camera. As it turns out, I have used it almost every day, for most of my photography, since it arrived in March. It's quite a nice piece of equipment. With it, I can also pop the back from it onto my 500CM and use that for "everyday photography" too.

I used a Hasselblad 903SWC as my "everyday camera" once upon a time. It did a wonderful job of it too. :)
 

Paratom

Active member
I think the 907 is a very good example that judging a camera just based on feature list can be very misleading.
Without ever having handeled one, and while I am pretty sure the x1dII is the better solution for me I can see the appeal for the 907x. I CAN IMAGE THAT IT assume it can give close to the feeling of WLF medium format film cameras. I also can see that it should work great on a tripod as well.
 

ndwgolf

Member
Not sure why you consider the 907x a "gimmicky camera" or why I couldn't use it for "everyday" stuff. It's a traditional, modular Hasselblad camera. As it turns out, I have used it almost every day, for most of my photography, since it arrived in March. It's quite a nice piece of equipment. With it, I can also pop the back from it onto my 500CM and use that for "everyday photography" too.

I used a Hasselblad 903SWC as my "everyday camera" once upon a time. It did a wonderful job of it too. :)
Hay Godfrey........it just looks akward having to manually focus it, or maybe I am missing something?
Neil
 

ndwgolf

Member
You might be missing that the 907x supports autofocus :)
Godfrey......I've currently got my head berried in the user manual for the 907x, something tells me that will be my next camera........and yes I'm excited that it supports AF.........how is the AF?
Neil
 

Godfrey

Well-known member
Neil,

It's just as easy to manually focus the 907x as it is to focus any other camera with an LCD or waist level viewfinder. Easier in some ways than an optical WLF camera because you can use magnification assist and peaking if you so desire. But that's a "six and one-half dozen or the other" thought that is dependent on your own predilections and preferences.

Yes, the 907x supports AF with XCD and most H-system lenses (using the XH Adapter) as well. Autofocus is a relatively minor part of my shooting workflow so I'm not very critical of it, but it works very nicely when I use it. I have both the XCD 21 and 45P lenses at the present time ... it works well with both of them. The speed of AF isn't going to compete with a camera designed for sports photography with either of these lenses, but the 907x isn't really designed for eye-level, fast moving work (the X1D II would be better for that due to the shape of the body and the built-in EVF).

Neil, you've had and sold so many cameras and systems in the years I've seen your posts in various places. If you're tugging between the X1D II, waiting for an X1D III, or the 907x, well: just buy whichever one is available and go make photographs with it. Enjoy the experience, make some lovely photographs, don't think you'll be finding "The One Camera" that you'll hold onto forever. Accept that you'll probably keep it a while and move on to something else within some period of time as your interests and ideas move on. Whether a new one is coming or not is inconsequential. :D

I've been in just that position at times, as the technology was changing rapidly around me or as I was learning and looking for The Solution to whatever problem was in my head. But at other times, like now for instance, I am buying for longer term reasons: I like shooting with Hasselblad gear, have been off and on for almost thirty years. I bought the 907x/CFVII 50c to extend and secure doing that for a long time to come. I like the modularity of the system, the fact that the back makes my 30+ year old cameras almost new again, the fact that the 907x gives me access to the latest lenses and features, etc etc. I even like the quirkiness of some of the equipment, the sometimes unusual design meme that the engineers at Hasselblad had in mind: it suits my own notions well. I have no illusions about it being the best on the spec sheet, the best in the hand, or The Most Fabulous Object ... I just like the gear, the way it works, and find what it produces to be satisfying. I like figuring out how to make it do what I want it to.

Life's too short to be Don Quixote all the time. :D


A Lamp, A Step, A Forgotten Door - Santa Clara 2020
Hasselblad 907x + XCD 45P f/4
ISO 800 @ f/5.6 @ 1/100

enjoy,
G

"A Stone, A Leaf, A Forgotten Door ... Oh Lost, and by the wind-grieved, Ghost: Come back again!" - Look Homeward Angel, Thomas Wolfe

Equipment is transitory. Photographs endure.
 

PSS

New member
New cameras are in the works with planned debut for next year but with the COVID situation I wouldn't be surprised if they postpone some announcements. I don't think we will see anything this year.
Do you have any actual information about this? I just had a conversation with a dealer here in Los Angeles and they at this point have not even seen or held a 907 chrome edition....mid September 2020....
 
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