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DMR sits idle - reluctant to let it go

My DMR has not been used much recently, and with winter settling in, it will get even less attention. I have been waffling back and forth about selling it. My head knows I can get by without it, but my heart is reluctant to let it go (and be without an SLR). It is sort of like letting go of a security blanket, I suppose. If I do sell, is now a good time to list it?
--Mark
 
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workingcamera

Guest
Mark the obvious remedy to your dilemma would be to simply send your DMR to me on a long-term loan basis.

This I feel would be the brilliant strategy all-round not to mention fitting in nicely with my current DMRlessness and less than ideal fiscal position.
 

David K

Workshop Member
I've gone back and forth a couple of times on the DMR and have decided to keep it. I love my M8 and MFDB but don't want to be without any SLR. If you're going to sell it, sooner is probably better than later... but hang on to the glass for the R10.
 
I was all set to follow the Guy path and went to my local camera $hop (some high end stuff but jerks for the most part) and tried an M8. You know, it is a great camera, but I'm not sure it is really what I was looking for. At some point I may pick up one and lens to get more familiar with, but I could not see parting with my SLR for one.

Someone commented a while back that it sounded like what I really needed was a DMR and either a D-Lux or Digilux, and the more I evaluate my needs I think that may be the best way to go. For the most part what I really want a M8 for can be reasonably well handled by a good P&S because when I want to go light, the M8 is still too big and heavy and when I want good pictures I want a big screen. I will pick up an M8 when money isn't a concern, but until then it strikes me as too much of a compromise for my current needs.
 
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Michael B. Elmer

Guest
My DMR has not been used much recently, and with winter settling in, it will get even less attention. I have been waffling back and forth about selling it. My head knows I can get by without it, but my heart is reluctant to let it go (and be without an SLR). It is sort of like letting go of a security blanket, I suppose. If I do sell, is now a good time to list it?
--Mark
Mark, I think now is the proper time to list the DMR for sale. I did so myself 3 months ago by entrusting my dealer (Mr. Meister in Hamburg, Germany) to sell it on a commission basis. It was sold at almost the same price I had given myself when it appeared, and within only few days.

Now, I am more speculative as regards the 6 fine R-lenses that I kept (19/2.8, 24/2.8, 28/2.8, 35/1.4, 50/1.4 and 80/1.4).

Since new R-lenses to be launched with the R 10 will probably have autofocus, exisiting lenses will not be able to use the full functionality of the R10.

Logically, non-AF-lenses must decrease in value, unless Leica offers to re-build them to include AF. Perhaps the decrease has already taken place in whole or part.

I think that it might not be a good idea to have some lenses for the R 10 with AF and some without. It is probably no good to have to switch between AF and non-AF lenses. It would be too confusing and be an obstacle for working fast and without too much headwork.

Do you think it realistic that they could be re-built by Leica - or should I also sell the lenses now and get a relatively good price, so that I can get funding for new AF R-lenses???
 

LCT

Member
...Since new R-lenses to be launched with the R 10 will probably have autofocus, exisiting lenses will not be able to use the full functionality of the R10. Logically, non-AF-lenses must decrease in value, unless Leica offers to re-build them to include AF... I think that it might not be a good idea to have some lenses for the R 10 with AF and some without. It is probably no good to have to switch between AF and non-AF lenses. It would be too confusing and be an obstacle for working fast and without too much headwork. Do you think it realistic that they could be re-built by Leica - or should I also sell the lenses now and get a relatively good price, so that I can get funding for new AF R-lenses???
I would be surprised if Leica re-build any lens. I'd expect new AF lenses, probably a few zooms to begin with, and perhaps new AF primes afterwards but existing lenses would remain as is. Then my best advice would be for you to spread your excellent post above all over the Leica world, wait a couple of months until s/h prices drop even more, then you sell me your 19/2.8 (latest version i guess) for 400 or 500 euros and we will be both very happy.
Good idea no?
 

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
I have to agree with LCT there is no way they will change the mount, the manual lenses will work and I think the key is the ROM. Maybe and this is remote if they change the mount we may have to use a adapter but I am betting no on this
 

cmb_

Subscriber & Workshop Member
Logically, non-AF-lenses must decrease in value. . .
While existing R lenses may or may not decrease in monetary value in the marketplace, the current R lenses that I have will retain their value (to me) for quite some time, even after the introduction a new R DSLR . I look forward to Leica's release of the R10 and whatever lenses (AF/Non AF) that may accompany it but I quite enjoy using the current lineup of manual focus R lenses. The image quality, and handling is remarkable.
 
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Michael B. Elmer

Guest
Thank you for your interesting proposal, LCT, but I think the Leica community is far too intelligent to let prices on used gear depend on exchanges of opinion between a couple of Leica nerds on a Leica Forum!

Guy, I agree with you that the key is the ROM contact. I don't think Leica would like to have to change bayonets on all old lenses for many years to come. And, I remember that when the ROM contact was introduced, LFI described the function of the various contact points, and I noted that to my mind it seemed that Leica had reserved 2 contacts for future use, probably in connection with lenses with built in Auto Focus.

So new lenses would probably use the existing ROM contact as interface, whether an AF-function or just Focus confirmation be built in into future lenses.

There have, however, been many strange rumours on different Forums about the R10. One of the rumours that have had the longest life is the idea that the R10 would not only become full frame but go even further, e.g. 36 x 36 or 40 x 30. Perhaps Leica's earlier take over of Sinar may have added to this rumour.

However, I do not think, Leica would really benefit from going further than the format - 24 x 36 - for which they set the world standard (socalled Full Frame). And Leica has always taken one step at a time - often some time after every body else. so why should they take an enormous risk this time and do something completely fifferent from all other big brands? Leica needs a safe success also with the R in order to survive and cannot afford unnecessary risks.
 
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fotografz

Well-known member
I also debated the whole "sell or not sell" issue.

In the end I've decided to keep the DMR for 3 key reasons: Eventual back-up to a R-10. Film use option at will. Increased ISO functionality by using Flexcolor version 4.8.3 for current use, and use through out the coming year. The R10 is a ways off. Having all that R glass sit idle would be a crime.

Even if there are AF lenses ... which is pure speculation right now ... I'm sure they will also include focus confirmation for the manual glass ... which would be just fine with me. Adding "good" AF motors to some of these lenses would probably make them huge ... especially the fast glass.
 

robsteve

Subscriber
Adding "good" AF motors to some of these lenses would probably make them huge ... especially the fast glass.
I don't know if you would consider this 50mm Summilux with AF compact :) Leica invented AF. The AF SL2 was introduced at Photokina in 1976.

 

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
I would not be surprised if it truly was bigger than full frame because that would give Leica a edge in the market , it would also pump up the mega pixels and able to keep the the better size photosites like the MF backs. Honestly this gives Leica a leg up if you think about it a 35mm form factor with close to MF back quality. Now that is something to reckon with. The key will be the image circle that the existing lenses and future lenses can throw off. I wish someone actually knew what the limit is in regards to image circle or the average they could use. Now larger than FF could be maybe 28 x 40 or just slightly proportional to the existing 24x36 just a little bigger, that is what I am expecting . Not a ton bigger but just enough to take advantage of the image circle in the lenses today and new ones built. It has been said there are 24 lenses coming , well the Summarits are 4 of them for the M . That makes 20 more to build for the M and R. The M side does not need that much except for extreme wide angles. So lets say 3 wides for M a new Nocti and new 75 lux, completely guessing folks . But that only is a handful on the M side but also we should remember this may take two years for 24 new lenses too. Let's say one thing for sure it is going to be pretty damn interesting come Photokina. Now if one or two M lenses slip in for PMA you know me being there i will give a full report on it.
 

Jan Brittenson

Senior Subscriber Member
My DMR is very idle, too. Yet I can't make myself part with it! I can't even find any for sale or recently sold - how much do they even go for nowadays?
 

Jack

Sr. Administrator
Staff member
I would not be surprised if it truly was bigger than full frame because that would give Leica a edge in the market , it would also pump up the mega pixels and able to keep the the better size photosites like the MF backs.
I agree that it makes a lot of sense for Leica, BUT....

I don't think that physics supports the concept of "bigger than full frame" along with "keeping the same lens mount" as we were discussing in another thread. IOW, something has to give --- you are only going to get to have it one way, full frame and uses the existing mount or larger than full frame with a new mount. And bottom line, 26 new lenses sounds like an entirely new system to me.
 

Steen

Senior Subscriber Member
Jack wrote: "And bottom line, 26 new lenses sounds like an entirely new system to me."

I would love to see a new Medium Format (MF) Leica Mount - or a new larger Leica mount in between 35mm small format and MF. Sounds very refreshing.

BUT ... IF at this time the R mount is in fact discontinued, Leica certainly ought to at least tell the audience !

So I expect the famous remark about a somewhat larger sensor than "Full Frame" to be something like the 4:5 aspect mentioned by Doug.
 
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