doug
Well-known member
No. It causes a focus error, seen most clearly with a wide lens & fast aperture. The error will still be present with longer lenses and smaller apertures but not quite as obvious.
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Have a probem -sharpness - DMR or what reason?
- Thread starter Nitnaros
- Start date
Stuart Richardson
Active member
Sorry to see this Peter, but I agree, something is not right. That 180/2.8 should be razor sharp (it is my lens, so I know it is capable of it), and wide open it looked really soft. Did you buy your R9 new? This looks like either some sort of misalignment of the focusing screen or sensor, or god forbid, a misalignment of the lens mount. I had this problem because I bought my R9 used, and it turned out the previous owner had dropped it (and apparently not bothered to tell KEH...it was not obvious that the camera had been damaged), which had knocked the lens mount out of alignment, causing a general softness to the images.
Stuart Richardson
Active member
P.S. The next time we meet, you are welcome to try the DMR on my R9 and see if it makes any difference...
Thanks for the kind offer, Stuart.
I bought both R9 and DMR used; dealers still ask close to $3000 for a new R9, which is kind of crazy these days, and I am not willing to pay.
My R9 certainly looks like new; I cannot see any signs of usage. But who knows, you are right, what kind of history it has. Maybe it needs some kind of adjustment and the previous owner got fed up and sold it.
But since both pieces of equipment look very well overall, I am optimistic that Leica will be able to straighten it out without too much hassle. Then its all rock-and-roll and will put some serious mileage on the equipment. I keep you posted for sure.
Peter
I bought both R9 and DMR used; dealers still ask close to $3000 for a new R9, which is kind of crazy these days, and I am not willing to pay.
My R9 certainly looks like new; I cannot see any signs of usage. But who knows, you are right, what kind of history it has. Maybe it needs some kind of adjustment and the previous owner got fed up and sold it.
But since both pieces of equipment look very well overall, I am optimistic that Leica will be able to straighten it out without too much hassle. Then its all rock-and-roll and will put some serious mileage on the equipment. I keep you posted for sure.
Peter
robsteve
Subscriber
Peter:
With the DMR, you need to focus on what you want in focus and not trust DOF. DOF is fine for smaller prints, but with pixel peeping you posted above, you shots will not look sharp.
Some lenses are also off at infinity with the DMR. Your 60mm may need the infinity set if you were shooting with it at the infinity stop. The tolerances are much finer with the digital sensor than with film, so a lens in spec but on the wrong side of the tolerances may not focus all the way to infinity. I have had at least three Leica lenses that were off a touch at infinity. When they were correct, the difference was night and day.
You also need to shoot a carefully focused scene with a tripod and mirror lockup. You 60mm Macro will be at its peak performance at about f5.6.
Robert
robsteve
Subscriber
Peter:
I just read the thread a little further and saw your other tests. My guess is you screen is in wrong. The DMR screens are a tighter fit into the frame than the stock screen, so it is easy to not have it in the frame propery before closing the frame. I suppose you could even bend something in the frame if you try too hard to close it when a screen isn't in right.
As for the R9, I think there is also an adjustment for the mirror down position, which would affect focus.
Robert
I just read the thread a little further and saw your other tests. My guess is you screen is in wrong. The DMR screens are a tighter fit into the frame than the stock screen, so it is easy to not have it in the frame propery before closing the frame. I suppose you could even bend something in the frame if you try too hard to close it when a screen isn't in right.
As for the R9, I think there is also an adjustment for the mirror down position, which would affect focus.
Robert
I hear you, Robert, regarding the screen;
I felt that the Maxwell screen was a little bit tighter to put in.
The DMR Leica screen was easy to mount.
The focus screen actually sits on two tiny noses that are on the underside of the left and right edge of a screen. That seems to be on purpose.
You are also right that the lenses can have additional issues; don't understand why the 35-lux front-focuses so strongly and whether this is related to a potential focus screen issue or not.
I believe the prudent thing is to drop off tomorrow both DMR/R9 and my two lenses (60 and 35-lux) at Leica NJ; if it is indeed a focus screen issue, they should be able to fix it quickly. And they can check out my lenses too at the same time...
Peter
I felt that the Maxwell screen was a little bit tighter to put in.
The DMR Leica screen was easy to mount.
The focus screen actually sits on two tiny noses that are on the underside of the left and right edge of a screen. That seems to be on purpose.
You are also right that the lenses can have additional issues; don't understand why the 35-lux front-focuses so strongly and whether this is related to a potential focus screen issue or not.
I believe the prudent thing is to drop off tomorrow both DMR/R9 and my two lenses (60 and 35-lux) at Leica NJ; if it is indeed a focus screen issue, they should be able to fix it quickly. And they can check out my lenses too at the same time...
Peter
overgaarcom
Member
Have the exact same problem. It make perfectly sense that the focus is more off on the 35mm than on a tele lens; not related to the DOF of the lens, but because of the lesser tolerance in a 35mm where then lens glass and focus is closer to the sensor.
Good luck with the Leica NJ visit.
Good luck with the Leica NJ visit.
Hey Thorsten,
So did you do any testing yourself? Do you know where the problem sits in your setup - is it the screen?
I have suffered through some focus issues with the M8; it was hard to pin down with the M, since the effect was not as distinct as here and now with the DMR. That left always the question of "operator error" open.
Finally took a heart and sent my whole M equipment - camera and four lenses - to DAG here in the US. Came back and what a relief - now my 35-lux-M is tack sharp wide open, and so is my 28-cron. Only the 75-lux can trouble me, but then it is indeed operator error...
Peter
So did you do any testing yourself? Do you know where the problem sits in your setup - is it the screen?
I have suffered through some focus issues with the M8; it was hard to pin down with the M, since the effect was not as distinct as here and now with the DMR. That left always the question of "operator error" open.
Finally took a heart and sent my whole M equipment - camera and four lenses - to DAG here in the US. Came back and what a relief - now my 35-lux-M is tack sharp wide open, and so is my 28-cron. Only the 75-lux can trouble me, but then it is indeed operator error...
Peter
overgaarcom
Member
No, I haven't done that much testing as it can be the sensor placement, the focus screen or the mirror. And of course "operator error" which it is not.
I have an R9 with Brightscreen focusing screen, and right now the DMR sits on a R8 with ordinary R8 focusing screen which has a bit less backfocus; not the screen but the whole setup, either it is the sensor placement, the focusing screen or the mirror.
It's so small adjustments it has to be done by Leica or some technician. You go nuts trying to figure it out yourself. And as for focusing screens, there could be small tolerances between different brands, though I think my Brightscreen is a Leica screen modified.
I have had the same focusing problems on my two Leicaflex SL which, in turn, has been off focus. Again, this could be mainly the mirror as the focusing screen sits tight in those. Or the whole body out of adjustment from bumps, etc. But what I did then was just changed camera and after a while the one sitting might have changed back in focus! Anyway, that is a historic problem now, more or less, could also have been the film plane - and in some instances, simply the user.
The good thing about the digital age and the DMR is that you can test and know rather instantly what the result is of your tests. So for sure the problem is in the camera why it is simply a matter of getting the whole camera adjusted.
I have an R9 with Brightscreen focusing screen, and right now the DMR sits on a R8 with ordinary R8 focusing screen which has a bit less backfocus; not the screen but the whole setup, either it is the sensor placement, the focusing screen or the mirror.
It's so small adjustments it has to be done by Leica or some technician. You go nuts trying to figure it out yourself. And as for focusing screens, there could be small tolerances between different brands, though I think my Brightscreen is a Leica screen modified.
I have had the same focusing problems on my two Leicaflex SL which, in turn, has been off focus. Again, this could be mainly the mirror as the focusing screen sits tight in those. Or the whole body out of adjustment from bumps, etc. But what I did then was just changed camera and after a while the one sitting might have changed back in focus! Anyway, that is a historic problem now, more or less, could also have been the film plane - and in some instances, simply the user.
The good thing about the digital age and the DMR is that you can test and know rather instantly what the result is of your tests. So for sure the problem is in the camera why it is simply a matter of getting the whole camera adjusted.
"Patient" dropped off at Leica NJ today incl. my two lenses - 35-lux and 60-macro.
I hope its a simple case (say indeed the focus screen), comes back quickly, and I can get going again; I also have a 15mm/f2.8 coming, which should be a fire cracker!
I keep you posted on the outcome.
Peter
I hope its a simple case (say indeed the focus screen), comes back quickly, and I can get going again; I also have a 15mm/f2.8 coming, which should be a fire cracker!
I keep you posted on the outcome.
Peter
woodyspedden
New member
The 15 Elmarit is in the same class as the 180 2.0, 280 4.0 and the 35-70 Elmarit. All are exotic and all are amazing.
Woody
Woody
woodyspedden
New member
Peter
Au Contraire mon ami! The 180 2.0 is one of the easiest of the R lenses to focus! The focus range is very short and when you reach the point of focus it just "snaps" into the proper focus. This is one of the reasons I use the matte screens to assist me. When the image is in proper focus, the snap on the matte screen is so dramatic that one needs not worry further. It is in focus (unless the screen itself is not in registration!!)
JMHO AND YMMV
woody
Au Contraire mon ami! The 180 2.0 is one of the easiest of the R lenses to focus! The focus range is very short and when you reach the point of focus it just "snaps" into the proper focus. This is one of the reasons I use the matte screens to assist me. When the image is in proper focus, the snap on the matte screen is so dramatic that one needs not worry further. It is in focus (unless the screen itself is not in registration!!)
JMHO AND YMMV
woody
doug
Well-known member
One of the joys of a camera designed for manual focus
Guy Mancuso
Administrator, Instructor
My FAVORITE R lens is the 180 F2. I agree focus was very easy with this lens. Rarely missed
robsteve
Subscriber
Isn't your Avatar shot with the 180mm f2?