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Thread: Winter conditions- filters?

  1. #1
    roubaix
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    Winter conditions- filters?

    Looking at the snow in recent posts got me thinking, and jealous..., are there any filters, polarizing etc., that might be useful in these conditions? Or can all this stuff be corrected post processing now that everything is "raw?" Even if things can be corrected, is it better pre or post?

    Rank beginner,

    Thanks,

    Peter

    P.S. My M8 has been out for repair for 8 weeks, coming next week...now I see why you guys have two bodies.

  2. #2
    Administrator Bob's Avatar
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    Re: Winter conditions- filters?

    Nope, just shoot it.
    -bob

  3. #3
    Subscriber Member jaapv's Avatar
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    Re: Winter conditions- filters?

    Quote Originally Posted by roubaix View Post
    Looking at the snow in recent posts got me thinking, and jealous..., are there any filters, polarizing etc., that might be useful in these conditions? Or can all this stuff be corrected post processing now that everything is "raw?" Even if things can be corrected, is it better pre or post?

    Rank beginner,

    Thanks,

    Peter

    P.S. My M8 has been out for repair for 8 weeks, coming next week...now I see why you guys have two bodies.

    About the only filter you cannot simulate (apart from specializd stuff like IR or UV) is the polarizer. It works very dramatically on sunlit snow.






    But you can do fine without it...






    And it can be overdone:


    Last edited by jaapv; 17th December 2007 at 09:20.
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  4. #4
    roubaix
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    Re: Winter conditions- filters?

    That's a great series of shots Jaap. Can you recommend a polarizer for the M8?

    Peter

  5. #5
    Super Duper
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    Re: Winter conditions- filters?

    Do you put that on over the UV-IR cut filter?

  6. #6
    Subscriber Member jaapv's Avatar
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    Re: Winter conditions- filters?

    Yes Maggie. The point is, that IR light is not polarized. when you use a polarizer, you lose 2 to 3 stops in visible light, BUT NOT IN IR, which means that relatively the IR contamination is doubled to tripled.
    So the stacking of a polarizer with an IR cut filter is mandatory on the M8. Fortunately one uses a polarizer at 90m degrees off the direction of the light, so the negatives of stacking filters are minimized.
    JAAP
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  7. #7
    Super Duper
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    Re: Winter conditions- filters?

    Interesting. I wonder what B&W would look like with just the polarizer.

  8. #8
    Subscriber Member jaapv's Avatar
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    Re: Winter conditions- filters?

    Quote Originally Posted by roubaix View Post
    That's a great series of shots Jaap. Can you recommend a polarizer for the M8?

    Peter
    See this thread, Peter



    http://www.rangefinderforum.com/foru...ight=polarizer
    JAAP
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  9. #9
    roubaix
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    Re: Winter conditions- filters?

    Thanks very much.

    Peter

  10. #10
    Subscriber Member jaapv's Avatar
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    Re: Winter conditions- filters?

    Quote Originally Posted by Maggie O View Post
    Interesting. I wonder what B&W would look like with just the polarizer.
    Difficult to predict, I would think. It depends on the relationship between polarized light and IR light in any given area of the image.
    Btw IR cut filters are interference filters, which means that they may influence the polarisation of the light. So one must put a polfilter in front of the IR filter and use a circular one.
    JAAP
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  11. #11
    Senior Member Lisa's Avatar
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    Re: Winter conditions- filters?

    Sorry to be off topic, but, jaapv, can you tell me where your three mountain photos were taken? Just curious...

    Thanks
    Lisa

  12. #12
    Subscriber Member jaapv's Avatar
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    Re: Winter conditions- filters?

    Italy, the Dolomites, Alta Badia. I've got hundreds of them, I go there for a few weeks every year, and those are the most beautiful mountains in the world. These three are not really the best for showing the mountains off, I chose them for Polfilters.
    I see by your website you are into mountains. You missed out on these!









    Last edited by jaapv; 18th December 2007 at 08:55.
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  13. #13
    Senior Member Lisa's Avatar
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    Re: Winter conditions- filters?

    Italy, the Dolomites, Alta Badia. I've got hundreds of them, I go there for a few weeks every year, and those are the most beautiful mountains in the world. These three are not really the best for showing the mountains off, I chose them for Polfilters.
    I see by your website you are into mountains. You missed out on these!
    I *thought* those could have been the Dolomites! That's on my list of places to go in the next year or two. I have a few questions about visiting them, and will send you a private message later today if you have the time to answer it.

    Thanks,
    Lisa

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    Re: Winter conditions- filters?

    Here is a shot taken from my backyard with the M8 and my rapidly becoming most favorite lens, the 75 Lux. Not the sharpest tool in the shed but love the drawing style. No filter was used. Shot at 4800K and trimmed in Lightroom 1.3.1.

    Enjoy

    Woody

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    Re: Winter conditions- filters?

    Hey Guy, Jack or anyone

    I am still having problems posting my images. All of them turn into far more saturated versions of what I have before resizing, and converting to SRGB. Any ideas as to why this might happen? It looks more saturated but when I look side by side at the image opened in PS CS3 I would now say the issue is as much or more an increase in contrast. By the way the image I am now looking at in PS is the same Srgb Jpeg that I attached to this message. This really bugs me. I have looked at the image both in Safari and in Firefox and they both show the same way.

    Thanks for any help

    Woody

  16. #16
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: Winter conditions- filters?

    Woody is that 900 pixels wide or wider. The software will downsize to 900 so if your larger it gets funky looking
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

  17. #17
    Administrator Bob's Avatar
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    Re: Winter conditions- filters?

    Woody,
    Are you using Photoshop?
    Is the initial color space in one of Joe Holms special spaces or a higher sat version of ProPhoto RGB?
    thanks
    -bob

  18. #18
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    Re: Winter conditions- filters?

    Thanks guys for replying

    I have sized it for 940 pixels max dimension. The original was in ProPhoto RGB with an assignment from Joe Holmes to ProPhoto 25. Then the image was converted to Srgb and Jpeg for inclusion on the web.

    Woody

  19. #19
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    Re: Winter conditions- filters?

    Here is a version which was converted to SRGB earlier in the process. Let's see what it looks like.

  20. #20
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    Re: Winter conditions- filters?

    O.K.

    I am trying again with an image at 900 Px max dimension. Hopefully with the image converted to SRGB earlier I will have better results. I guess that I am fundamentally a printer and don't understand the web very well at all. Let's see

    By the way this is looking out over golf hole number 14, across a horse breeding ranch to the foothills of the Rockies. Temp is about 15 degrees at this time of morning (6:30 A.M.) and the sun is way off to the East at the right hand side of the frame. God it is nice to be up at this time of day. God must love us Photogs who are willing to get up and live with his morning light.

    Best

    Woody

  21. #21
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    Re: Winter conditions- filters?

    O.K.

    This is definitely better and way closer to the original image. Thanks to all for being very patient while I learn how to post images correctly for the web

    Yours

    Woody Spedden

  22. #22
    Subscriber Member jaapv's Avatar
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    Re: Winter conditions- filters?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lisa View Post
    I *thought* those could have been the Dolomites! That's on my list of places to go in the next year or two. I have a few questions about visiting them, and will send you a private message later today if you have the time to answer it.

    Thanks,
    Lisa

    You're most welcome
    JAAP
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    The colours of my generation are black and white.

  23. #23
    Sr. Administrator Jack's Avatar
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    Re: Winter conditions- filters?

    Woody:

    In the set of workshop actions I gave you in Yosemite, there is a web conversion action that automatically sizes, sharpens and converts your working file IN ANY FORMAT OR COLORSPACE to an sRGB jpegfor web output, at a max of 900 pixels wide or 750 tall. Just run that on your working file and you will be set

    NOTE: I forget if you're on Mac or PC, but the action includes a java script for PC. A Mac can read it and use it and it works, but issues an error notice. For anybody on that workshop with a Mac, let me know and I can tell you how to correct it for Mac to eliminate the error notice.

    Cheers,


    Quote Originally Posted by woodyspedden View Post
    O.K.

    I am trying again with an image at 900 Px max dimension. Hopefully with the image converted to SRGB earlier I will have better results. I guess that I am fundamentally a printer and don't understand the web very well at all. Let's see

    By the way this is looking out over golf hole number 14, across a horse breeding ranch to the foothills of the Rockies. Temp is about 15 degrees at this time of morning (6:30 A.M.) and the sun is way off to the East at the right hand side of the frame. God it is nice to be up at this time of day. God must love us Photogs who are willing to get up and live with his morning light.

    Best

    Woody
    Jack
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  24. #24
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: Winter conditions- filters?

    How about me bud.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

  25. #25
    Sr. Administrator Jack's Avatar
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    Re: Winter conditions- filters?

    Guys:

    I have posted and uploaded the action sets in the workshop area on the forum, so all you have to do is just download the set for Mac or PC as appropriate and follow the instructions I posted for loading them --- enjoy!

    Cheers,
    Jack
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    "Perfection is not attainable. But if we chase perfection, we can catch excellence."

  26. #26
    Subscriber robsteve's Avatar
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    Re: Winter conditions- filters?

    Woody:

    Do you have soft proofing on in photoshop? I may have the terminology wrong and Jack can correct me, but I am referring to Photoshop displaying your images taking your printer profile into account. In other words, you are seeing an image in Photoshop which reduces the saturation a bit to mimic what you will get printed on your printer.

    I also noticed that photoshop had an option to desaturate colors by 20% under the advanced color settings. This could also be your problem. I notice I do not have this option enabled.

    Robert

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    Sr. Administrator Jack's Avatar
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    Re: Winter conditions- filters?

    You've got it right Robert, but if Woody uses the web converter action I sent him, it's simpler and quicker
    Jack
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    "Perfection is not attainable. But if we chase perfection, we can catch excellence."

  28. #28
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    Re: Winter conditions- filters?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Flesher View Post
    You've got it right Robert, but if Woody uses the web converter action I sent him, it's simpler and quicker
    I don't think the action would undo Woody boosting the saturation too much because his photoshop is displaying an artificially low saturation.

  29. #29
    Sr. Administrator Jack's Avatar
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    Re: Winter conditions- filters?

    Good point Robert...

    Woody, by any chance do yo have the "desaturate monitor colors by 20%" set turned on in CS? If so, turn it off and see if that helps.
    Jack
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    Re: Winter conditions- filters?

    Jack, Robert and all

    First so many thanks for the time you took to help me get on track here.

    I do not have the desaturate colors by 20% enabled

    The soft proofing is set to simulate Adobe RGB

    The attached image was processed using Jack's actions from the workshop

    I am on a Mac using and Eizo monitor

    Woody

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    Re: Winter conditions- filters?

    Jack
    I think this looks similar to the second image I posted on page one of the thread but the saturation is much more like the full psd.

    I tell you that posting images on the web is not so simple as one would guess. But thanks Jack for the action as I will now use it constantly.

    Best

    Woody

  32. #32
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    Re: Winter conditions- filters?

    Quote Originally Posted by woodyspedden View Post
    Jack, Robert and all

    First so many thanks for the time you took to help me get on track here.

    I do not have the desaturate colors by 20% enabled

    The soft proofing is set to simulate Adobe RGB

    The attached image was processed using Jack's actions from the workshop

    I am on a Mac using and Eizo monitor

    Woody

    Woody:

    I think you need to turn off the soft proofing if you want to have photoshop display them like they will look in a web browser.

    Jack knows more about this than me and may be able to tell us how it should be set.

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    Re: Winter conditions- filters?

    Thanks Robert

    I am not sure how to "turn off" proofing but I have it set so that proofing is set to simulate the working profoto RGB space, not any of the printer papers etc. Should I do something else?

    Woody

  34. #34
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    Re: Winter conditions- filters?

    Woody:

    I think you can just turn proofing view on and off using ctrl-Y in a Windows environment. It is also under the view menu.

    Robert

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    Re: Winter conditions- filters?

    Robert

    Thanks for the input. I am on a Mac so the turnoff is CMD Y. However I noticed that with the proofing set for my working space, i.e. profoto RGB switching proofing on and off does nothing (which is a good thing as that is the way you would expect it to react.) Anyway, I now know how to get things on the web the right way; no proofing and use Jack's really quick action to size at 900 px and convert to Srgb.

    Thanks to all and sorry if I bored the rest who probably already knew these things.

    Woody

  36. #36
    Flavio
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    Re: Winter conditions- filters?

    Jaapv,
    wonderful pictures.
    Have you ever shot in the Alpe di Siusi area?

    Flavio

  37. #37
    Workshop Member ChrisDauer's Avatar
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    Re: Winter conditions- filters?

    Any chance we can get a portion of this thread copied to the Image Processing sub-forum? There are some really great ideas on how to deal with issues arising from posting images online.

  38. #38
    Subscriber Member jaapv's Avatar
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    Re: Winter conditions- filters?

    Quote Originally Posted by Flavio View Post
    Jaapv,
    wonderful pictures.
    Have you ever shot in the Alpe di Siusi area?

    Flavio
    Thanks!

    Of course....

    JAAP
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    The colours of my generation are black and white.

  39. #39
    Flavio
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    Re: Winter conditions- filters?

    Hi Jaap,
    I love that area indeed. We use to go there since 1986. Just in Summer!
    There was a lovely Rifugio (shelter) called Zallinger, small, built in wood only, no TV, no radio (all people inside got news through my Icom radio). Through the years it went bigger and bigger and now we do not realize big difference with other fine hotels all around.
    But in the Alpe no car can run and it is still one more good reason to go up there.
    Hope to meet you in the Alpe! Maybe a Siusi photo meeting? :-)

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