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leica 50mm apo or 50mm lux

Seascape

Seascape

New member
Vivek said:
Hi, There is a rare black paint version of the DR Summicron.

I did say "design wise", perhaps I should have said "optical design wise"? :)

PS: There might have been odd Titanium versions and Hermes versions as well. :)
Click to expand...

Don't forget the Panda version :OT: :)
 
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algrove

Well-known member
@onesixeight

Today, according to B&H's website. Let's hope B&H DID NOT have them arrive just before the storm & flooding and had them stored in their basement!

OP-Just get the APO and be done with it.
 
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Kokoshawnuff

Kokoshawnuff

New member
I don't get it. The 'lux asph will out-resolve any 35mm sensor on the market. Those that think they "need" the APO are deluding themselves. You can want it, but don't say you "need" it, because no one does...
 
bradhusick

bradhusick

Active member
There is a difference especially at the edges, so no, they don't perform equally on a 35mm sensor.
 
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Kokoshawnuff

Kokoshawnuff

New member
No one said equally. But they will both out resolve any 35mm sensor, therefore print size will always be limited by the sensor not the lens. So unless you shoot test charts for a living, you don't need the APO. Its perfectly ok to want one, but any technical justifications to 'upgrade' from the lux asph just don't make real world sense
 
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algrove

Well-known member
If you own an MM and can afford it, then get the APO for that camera and use your 1.4 or 0.95 on your M9.
 
glenerrolrd

glenerrolrd

Workshop Member
Kokoshawnuff said:
No one said equally. But they will both out resolve any 35mm sensor, therefore print size will always be limited by the sensor not the lens. So unless you shoot test charts for a living, you don't need the APO. Its perfectly ok to want one, but any technical justifications to 'upgrade' from the lux asph just don't make real world sense
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Maybe I missed something in selecting my M lenses over the years . Its seems that the lenses often render images differently and rarely am I concerned about resolution . Rendering of fine detail is of course important and the 50 summilux ASPH is for anything I might do plenty good enough .

However a part of the 50SLX bitting sharpness comes from strong macro contrast which gives the appearance of sharpness. In harsh light it can overwhelm the M9 s DR ..in diffused available light it can be a joy .

In a Leica M lens I look at how the lens transmits color ...in a Noct 0.95 you can see a brilliance in the highlights that come from clean whites . The 50SLX is no slouch but you can see the difference if you shoot side by side with 50NOCT.95 . The 2nd area I look at is the bokeh and I want a smooth roll off from sharp to out of focus and a back ground that is smooth and without swirls and clumpy areas of high contrast . Then finally I look at the microcontrast in the various colors ..do I see a nice transition of the tones .

Now granted the sensor plays a big part in how the final rendering comes out ..but the signature of the lens is always apparent . Which lens is sharper doesn t seem to apply to the current Leica M lenses ?

Most of the 50 APO photographs have been done using the MONO and much has been written about the advantages of a APO lens for use in B&W . But Leica also commissioned ByBrett to shoot some samples in color . I don t have the link but its not hard to locate . I was impressed and I have used the 50SLX in very similar shooting conditions .

Whether the 50 APO is a worthy higher priced alternative to the 50SLX will depend on the subjects you shoot,your technique and the desired aesthetic. The differences I think will be obvious (to be proven out ) whether they justify spending twice as much for the APO is rarely based on logic.
 
D

D&A

Well-known member
With regards to the purity of whites seen with the 0.95 Noct (especiallly in highlighted regions) as compared to the 50 Lux asph, I suspect that it may incorporate some form of APO elements in it's optical design. If so, I'd be curious to see a matchef pair of color images taken with the 0.95 Noct and new 50mm Cron APO.

Dave (D&A)
 
douglasf13

douglasf13

New member
You could just buy a used, newest version 50 Summicron V for well under $2k and spend the other $4-6K on a photo vacation. :poke: :LOL:

In all seriousness, all of the current Leica 50s are technically great enough to satisfy most of us up to a pretty nice print size. As others have said, the "look" of the lens is more important to me, and I'm not sure how great that "look" would have to be to buy an f2 lens for over $7K, even though 50mm is about all that I shoot.

My 50 Summicron I and 50 Summicron V give me a nice selection of "looks" for under $2K combined. Add another $1K-ish and you could add the ZM 50/1.5, which gives yet another distinct look.
 
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vdeakin

Member
Or one could buy a used Contarex Planar 50/2.0 for close to $500 and a Contarex - M adapter for around $130 and mount both on future 'M'. It is not a given that the result would be in any way inferior to the APO's. The Contarex MTF's look strikingly similar to the APO:
Contarex lenses
and there exists some anecdotal evidence about it being superior to the old Summicrons and any other Zeiss Planars. There are plenty of samples on Flickr with both Contarex Planars (this and 55/1.4) somehow mounted on D700 or 5DII.
 
douglasf13

douglasf13

New member
vdeakin said:
Or one could buy a used Contarex Planar 50/2.0 for close to $500 and a Contarex - M adapter for around $130 and mount both on future 'M'. It is not a given that the result would be in any way inferior to the APO's. The Contarex MTF's look strikingly similar to the APO:
Contarex lenses
and there exists some anecdotal evidence about it being superior to the old Summicrons and any other Zeiss Planars. There are plenty of samples on Flickr with both Contarex Planars (this and 55/1.4) somehow mounted on D700 or 5DII.
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That's interesting. Where can you find a Contarex to M adapter?

That Contarex Planar looks pretty nice and flat field, although the overall resolution doesn't look all that amazing, according to those mtfs.
 
D

docmoore

Subscriber and Workshop Member
I assume that APO means all wavelengths are coherent at the focal point for the plane in focus...and that for OOF areas this is not the case...this holds true for my astronomic APO's.

Bob
 
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Vivek

Guest
Hi Bob,

The astronomic APOs are never ever used outside of infinity. That isn't the case with a regular photographic lens (despite the astronomic price).

If the bokeh is distracting because of the CA, it is a problem, especially for Leica lens, I would think.
 
V

vdeakin

Member
douglasf13 said:
That's interesting. Where can you find a Contarex to M adapter?

That Contarex Planar looks pretty nice and flat field, although the overall resolution doesn't look all that amazing, according to those mtfs.
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There is an Italian outfit called COMA which makes all possible Contarex adapters including two for Leica (for M and M39). They are usually a permanent fixture on Ebay, but today I found only one for M39:
Leica ZORKI Voigtlander M39 Adattatore Lens Contarex | eBay
- when searching use "adattatore".
I personally debated how to adapt my Contarex to 5N and chose the most direct route with Kipon, but the one from COMA is definitely more versatile.
I thought the Flickr samples looked amazing enough, especially the 'pop.
 
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NB23

New member
Lotsa funny info going on here and in the Leica world in general.

APO is beneficial for Color where all three primary colors match at the same focus point. The people and the weekend-reviewers who want to sound expert about it and who recommend the APO for the MM are not to be listened to. They give very weak arguments.

Also, the APO is not a no-brainer. Just look at a HCB print, or McCurry print, for example. The last thing you'll even think about it all this technical junk. And no, none of their images would have benefited from a better lens. Not even Capa's famous blurry/soft image of the soldiers. All the magic is in the eye connected to the finger.

At last, I have always been very disapointed in the Leica crowd in general as they're usually proven that they don't really know much about photography in general. Take the 50 Lux Asph for example: It used to be maligned because it was "too perfect", or "too clinical", which just isn't true. That particular lens is a top performer on all aspects and it has plenty of character. Plenty. Exactly the opposite from "clinical", a term that I suspect was simply coined by a couch photographer who couldn't' afford it and was looking for a reason to love his old glass a bit longer. And now, it seems that good old "modern 50 asph lux which is too clinical" has suddenly become old glass to the Leica crowd. Quite funny.

The 50 APO is a status symbol. Your girlfriend loves Gold and big Diamonds? You love the 50 APO. It's as simple as that.

At last, my take on the APO is very simple. It is a status symbol. And probably a very solid performer. A total waste on the MM. And a total waste if you want to improve your photography. And I don't believe in diffraction. It's true in theory, but in practice it vanishes. This is why even cheap glass picks up more and more details as the sensor has more and more MPs. And it's all about viewing distance, anyways.

The 50 APO? Only for fondlers. Capa wouldn't have benefited from it even if he had run for his life, case proven by his famous shot. Or Ulevich's Pulitzer image, where he almost got killed. No APO or ASPH would have been relevant at all. A Pulitzer just doesn't doesn't care. I believe the APO, beyond any of its "perfections" will show a unique character.
Will it be worth it? If the resale value doesn't drop, it's always worth it, even at 25,000$. Simply logical.
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A great book that I recommend to all those who think that photography is about the equipment, be prepared to be smashed: Moments: The Pulitzer Prize Winning Photographs by Hal Buell
 
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