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M9?

Moonshine

New member
I regret selling my M9 earlier as the pictures I took from it are equal to none. As much as I like my X2 I miss having a full frame camera. And so the hunt for a used M9 begins..

My previous M9 was bought from a friend so I wasn't worried about what I should be careful about but this time around can someone advise about what points I should be most aware of? Most of them that are available on the forums do not have any warranty left and so is it better to get the M-E with a warranty or given how sturdy these cameras are should I just get a M9 without the warranty? The color of the M-E doesn't appeal to me though. Are M9's going to drop further in price? (would like to save some money as the buying and selling has left a big dent in my savings!)

Is it better to buy from a dealer or the forums? Any advice would be helpful.
Thanks
 

douglasf13

New member
I bought my lightly used M9 w/o warranty on these forums back in Sept. '12 for $4k, and that included some accessories like a half-case, extra battery, thumbs-up, etc. The camera had some slight brassing marks, but looked good, and it was built in 2011, so it isn't that old.

I haven't had any issues, ""knock on wood,"" so, compared to the M-E, I'm glad I saved $1500 and got a black camera. Who knows, though?? Maybe I just got lucky.

I'd been wanting to buy an M9 since it came out, and the $4K price point was always my breaking point, because, even if the value drops another $1K in the next year or two, that isn't a ton of money to lose, although I plan on shooting into the ground, anyways.

It's tough to predict how the M9's value will behave when the M 240 is finally released. The M-E will probably hold the value of the M9 up for a while, I'd imagine. Heck, once M9 and M 240 comparisons start coming out, some may even prefer the M9 for low ISO work, so that could hold the value up, too...or, it could drop like a rock. Who knows??
 
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Moonshine

New member
I bought my lightly used M9 w/o warranty on these forums back in Sept. '12 for $4k, and that included some accessories like a half-case, extra battery, thumbs-up, etc. The camera had some slight brassing marks, but looked good, and it was built in 2011, so it isn't that old.

I haven't had any issues, ""knock on wood,"" so, compared to the M-E, I'm glad I saved $1500 and got a black camera. Who knows, though?? Maybe I just got lucky.

I'd been wanting to buy an M9 since it came out, and the $4K price point was always my breaking pointl, because, even if the value drops another $1K in the next year or two, that isn't a ton of money to lose, although I plan on shooting into the ground, anyways.

It's tough to predict how the M9's value will behave when the M 240 is finally released. The M-E will probably hold the value of the M9 up for a while, I'd imagine. Heck, once M9 and M 240 comparisons start coming out, some may even prefer the M9 for low ISO work, so that could hold the value up, too...or, it could drop like a rock. Who knows??
That sounds like you got a nice deal :)
How does one find out when the camera was built? Asking Leica from the serial number i imagine?
I'm looking for the silver one this time :)
 

jstaben

Member
I think prices will stabilize around the $3.5k-4k range depending on condition, maybe M9Ps going for $4.5-5 still.

Maybe after the M240s come out you will have an initial price drop for folks desperate to sell but I don't see them coming down much further because as the price goes down demand will rise in comparison to a new camera. M8s are still going to go for $1-1.5k and the M9 is still going to be worth a considerable premium over those. As long as MEs are sold the M9/P is going to hold its value too.

Who knows too...they may rise in price as someone suggests. They can't go much lower though IMHO
 

Double Negative

Not Available
As for the M9... Yeah. I may very well be buried with mine.

Nothing wrong with buying gear from your fellow members here at GetDPI. Just exercise normal caution and due diligence as when buying anything on the Internet. I've bought and sold countless items online, as I'm sure many others here have as well.

Buying from a dealer is also an excellent option and often nets you some sort of protection (warranty, return period, etc.).

Some dealers are even known to be members here and hang out on the buy and sell forum... ;)
 

Godfrey

Well-known member
I bought my black M9 in Jan 2012 from Dan Tamarkin at America's Premier Leica Specialist Since 1971
It was a Leica USA demo camera, went through their recondition/inspection process and sold with a 1 year warranty with an $800 discount.

I couldn't be happier with the service or with the camera. It has operated flawlessly since the moment I bought it, and I could not tell that it had ever been out of the box, it was so clean and new looking.

At the time, I considered a gray M9 from a GetDPI forum member and that would saved another $500 or so, but I thought long and hard about it and decided I wanted the black finish. I intend to keep it a long time—might as well have what you really want when you pay these prices for a camera!

My advice:
- If a private sale, buy from someone you trust.
- If a dealer sale, again buy from someone you trust.

I have heard a lot of stories and gripes about M9 problems online. But of the eight or nine people I know local to me who have them, none of them has had any problems at all, just like me. I don't know what the explanation for that is.

(The X2 is particularly useful as an adjunct to the M9 for me. It's small and light, great for when I want to carry less, and the sensitivity is such that I can get results in light where the M9 struggles a bit. But if I could only have one of them, there's no question which is the keeper. :)

G
 

iiiNelson

Well-known member
It's your money and you can't put a value on peace of mind. That being said everyone has offered sound advice on buying used or a demo. For me though the warranty is worth it (again peace of mind) with the cracked sensor issue of the past or at least a camera insurance policy.

As for the M-E, it looks much better in person and if the frameline lever isn't important to you then it's a great deal. It's possible to get them new in the same range as used M9-P's (~$4800-5200) as well as I understand they don't move as fast as dealer's have hoped if M9 stock is available.
 

douglasf13

New member
FWIW, and please don't take my word for it, but, according to the sensor cracked sensor thread over on LUF, even those that purchased their M9s used are apparently able to get their sensors repaired free of charge.
 

iiiNelson

Well-known member
FWIW, and please don't take my word for it, but, according to the sensor cracked sensor thread over on LUF, even those that purchased their M9s used are apparently able to get their sensors repaired free of charge.
Wasn't aware of that. That would be great to know and would make the decision somewhat easier to make.

I know my first M9 (that I sold used) developed a sensor crack about 9 months after I sold it to another forum member. I offered to help them out since I did register under my name but his insurance took care of the bill that wasn't free (about a $3000 repair or so) in late 2011.
 

douglasf13

New member
Wasn't aware of that. That would be great to know and would make the decision somewhat easier to make.

I know my first M9 (that I sold used) developed a sensor crack about 9 months after I sold it to another forum member. I offered to help them out since I did register under my name but his insurance took care of the bill that wasn't free (about a $3000 repair or so) in late 2011.
Yeah, I was surprised to see that Leica repaired an out of warranty, second user camera for free, but don't take my word for it. I don't know any of those forum members personally, so I don't know who to trust. I believe the gentleman with the free repair didn't exactly say that it was purchased second hand.
 

iiiNelson

Well-known member
Yeah, I was surprised to see that Leica repaired an out of warranty, second user camera for free, but don't take my word for it. I don't know any of those forum members personally, so I don't know who to trust.
I hear you and I completely agree. Buying is always a risk. Buying used is a larger risk. Buying used from an untrusted person or someone who isn't a "regular" is not an option for me personally especially when there are many trusted dealers on the forum who have always given me fair to great prices.
 

Moonshine

New member
.

(The X2 is particularly useful as an adjunct to the M9 for me. It's small and light, great for when I want to carry less, and the sensitivity is such that I can get results in light where the M9 struggles a bit. But if I could only have one of them, there's no question which is the keeper. :)

G[/QUOTE]

I really like the simplicity of the X2 and it's image quality...have listed it for sale here though, as I can't afford to have both the cameras :(
Godfrey, what is the highest ISO you have comfortably used the X2 for? I haven't done any low light shooting on it yet..
 

Moonshine

New member
Thanks for all the advice everyone :)

At this point i have 2 options; either buy a M9 from a forum member without a warranty or pay $700 more and buy it from the dealer with a full Leica warranty as it was an unregistered camera. The dealer contacted Leica who reassured him that the new buyer will be fully covered. Both cameras are in good shape with just a few scratches here and there. The dealers camera has only 2000 actuations and the forum member's camera has just over 6000. Oh, and I don't know either parties personally.

Can't decide which option to take.....
 

tele_player

New member
I have heard a lot of stories and gripes about M9 problems online. But of the eight or nine people I know local to me who have them, none of them has had any problems at all, just like me. I don't know what the explanation for that is.
Explanation - just luck, I'm in the Bay Area too, and my M9 sensor cracked right after the warranty expired. Leica took care of it, whew.

-robert
 

Godfrey

Well-known member
Explanation - just luck, I'm in the Bay Area too, and my M9 sensor cracked right after the warranty expired. Leica took care of it, whew.
I've had little interaction with Leica USA directly to base a judgement on, but working through my usual Leica contacts (Tom Brichta, our district Leica Sales Rep and Dan Tamarkin of Tamarkin.com in Chicago), I've always gotten quick response and attention to any questions I had, parts I wanted, etc.

So a broken or defective part, to me, is the occasional bad luck. The good part is that the service and support seems to be there to take care of it; that's not luck. ;-)

G
 

tele_player

New member
Leica did the right thing on the sensors, but I'd feel better if they went a bit further in explicitly controlling the financial risk for owners of out-of-warranty cameras. Sensor, shutter, LCD, processor board - there's things in there that will cost a fortune to fix, and can only be fixed using Leica parts. I feel a bit exposed.

I suppose that's why I don't drive an exotic car.
 

Godfrey

Well-known member
Leica did the right thing on the sensors, but I'd feel better if they went a bit further in explicitly controlling the financial risk for owners of out-of-warranty cameras. Sensor, shutter, LCD, processor board - there's things in there that will cost a fortune to fix, and can only be fixed using Leica parts. I feel a bit exposed.

I suppose that's why I don't drive an exotic car.
I can't imagine this could be different from any other camera. There are a ton of expensive, manufacturer-only parts in every camera—You can't fix an Olympus with a generic or Nikon part. Doesn't have to be exotic. Like most modern cameras, these bits are specific to the brand and model.

G
 

250swb

Member
....but his insurance took care of the bill that wasn't free (about a $3000 repair or so) in late 2011.
:eek: As Leica are replacing cracked sensors for free (cracked without warning in normal use) this can only be because it was cracked by being dropped.

Moonshine, I think you could ask if the sensor has been replaced whe buying an M9, and if it has put that camera to the top of your list. I haven't heard of any cracking twice. But cracked sensors are rare in the overall number of M9's sold and the reason we talk about them is because of the internet, not because it has been seen on the TV news.

I think you could also ask what the shutter count is, the hex number in the 'Unique Image ID' section of the EXIF file, not the file number on the SD card. Shutters are good for upwards of 150,000 actuations, and a lot of hard used M9's have gone well above that without problems.

And if you are going to a dealers to try an M9 take with you two different brands of SD card and use the camera with each, ideally take a San Disk Extreme as one, to see if you can make the camera mis-behave. Some seem to be sensitive to SD card brand, others aren't, and the head scratching still goes on about why. Try the camera at all distances with a known and trusted lens to check focusing accuracy.

Other than those small issues I really think you could assume that most M9's for sale in the next few weeks/months, are being sold for genuine reasons because the owner is buying an M240, so there is likely to be far less risk in the gene pool from people off loading because of an undisclosed problem. In this sense a genuine Leica dealer taking trade-in's would be the ideal person to buy from, any good dealer will charge a reasonable market price and give a six month or year warranty and will be happy to turn his stock around quickly.

Steve
 
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