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Thread: New Mini M?

  1. #151
    Subscriber Member jaapv's Avatar
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    Re: New Mini M?

    A pity that this lens will be used for a few years only. As a P&S the RX1 will become obsolete in its class far more quickly than any digital rangefinder camera will. And a Summicron will still be around decades from now., when all RX1-s are residing in a landfill.
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  2. #152
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    Re: New Mini M?

    I would not mind to find a FF sensor body to mount my M glass to that doesn't cost a small fortune. So far I have been quite pleased with Ricoh GXR-M solution, but FF would always be a nice upgrade. But I don't think this is what this camera going to be. Oh well.

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    New Mini M ?


    Quote Originally Posted by monza View Post

    The more I look at this, the more I think it's not what we will see next month...
    + 1

    What a relief when it turns out that it has a system mount for interchangeable lenses and a built-in viewfinder.

  4. #154
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    Re: New Mini M?

    The X2 is already slightly outdated, irrespective of price. The Mini will be launched into a 2014 market. I can only guess what competition has up its sleeves for next year. But if Sony and Fuji keep up their pace of innovation and Pentax gets back into the game there will be a stiff wind blowing into Solms` face. The argument made by some that cameras like the RX1 will become obsolete in a few years and its lens a waste should not ignore the fact that the Leica Mini looks already obsolete before even being available in the marketplace.
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    Re: New Mini M?

    Quote Originally Posted by retow View Post
    The X2 is already slightly outdated, irrespective of price. The Mini will be launched into a 2014 market. I can only guess what competition has up its sleeves for next year. But if Sony and Fuji keep up their pace of innovation and Pentax gets back into the game there will be a stiff wind blowing into Solms` face. The argument made by some that cameras like the RX1 will become obsolete in a few years and its lens a waste should not ignore the fact that the Leica Mini looks already obsolete before even being available in the marketplace.
    I agree. On a specs basis, the x2 was outdated the day it was released. Most everyone, even hardcore Leica fans, were underwhelmed.

    And I disagree with the idea that the RX1 lens will be wasted... Sony will use that same lens on the RX2 that will probably have a slimmer body, a built in EVF, and much better autofocus, perhaps even improved sensor tech. It's a great camera already, and will fix any flaws and get even better when released.

    I don't want to assume the leaked camera is a reality, but if so, Leica is missing a big opportunity. An FF EVIL M with interchangeable lenses with a sleek body for 4.5k to 5kish would sell unbelievable well. And would probably be easier, faster to produce and ultimately more profitable than the rangefinder cameras. So who cares if it cannibalizes M 24O sales... the M24O is a small market and probably not going to grow much more, not to mention how slow likely is in producing those cameras anyway.

    With a true Mini M, Leica had [or maybe still has] the perfect opening to make a mark and win a lot of people over... but if this leak is correct, they will have only given up more ground to Sony and Fuji in markets other than rangefinder and MF.

  6. #156
    Senior Member thrice's Avatar
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    Re: New Mini M?

    The RX1 body is too slim for proper handling as it is!

  7. #157
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    Re: New Mini M?

    Quote Originally Posted by AnthonyFlores View Post

    And I disagree with the idea that the RX1 lens will be wasted... Sony will use that same lens on the RX2 that will probably have a slimmer body, a built in .
    Do you mean that it can be used to upgrade your RX1 to an RX2?
    I rather doubt that, the way it is fixed to the camera.

    My point is that fixed-lens compacts are in an update treadmill that sadly outdates excellent cameras as soon as they are released. Quite wasteful for overly expensive ones like the RX1 (and X2 for that matter).
    With the RDF, where Leica sets the pace,that is far less of a problem. The lenses which are the major part of the investment can be transferred to the next iteration and the bodies themselves, well, look at the M8 which is ancient by digital standards. I doubt that even one is retired. Either they are in full use, still used as a backup, or happily shot by second owners. Most of the one-day wonders of more than three years old are in landfills or at the bottom of cupboards.
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    Re: New Mini M?

    turning this into an rx1 bashing thread will not raise the value or quality of the new leica. leica has to do that on its own - by putting a marvelous product out there. if the "leaked photo," whether a mock-up or not, truly depicts the new product, imo it's a fail, though i don't doubt someone will buy it.

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    Re: New Mini M?

    Quote Originally Posted by jaapv View Post
    Do you mean that it can be used to upgrade your RX1 to an RX2?
    I rather doubt that, the way it is fixed to the camera.

    My point is that fixed-lens compacts are in an update treadmill that sadly outdates excellent cameras as soon as they are released. Quite wasteful for overly expensive ones like the RX1 (and X2 for that matter).
    With the RDF, where Leica sets the pace,that is far less of a problem. The lenses which are the major part of the investment can be transferred to the next iteration and the bodies themselves, well, look at the M8 which is ancient by digital standards. I doubt that even one is retired. Either they are in full use, still used as a backup, or happily shot by second owners. Most of the one-day wonders of more than three years old are in landfills or at the bottom of cupboards.
    Okay, I get your point... and it's a good one. And it only affirms why it would be in Leica's best interest to find a way to produce another FF body that took M lenses... which maintained their current profit margins and was, ideally, easier and faster to produce.

    Those are big assumptions since I don't really know Leica's production process, but from what everyone says, the rangefinder is the hardest and most expensive component of the camera to produce.

    So IF Leica could produce a FF mini M that took M lenses... and do it at a faster rate, charge less money yet keep their margins... and still sell more... tell me again why they would be worrying about cannibalizing M24O sales?

  10. #160
    Senior Member Tim's Avatar
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    Re: New Mini M?

    Quote Originally Posted by jaapv View Post
    Most of the one-day wonders of more than three years old are in landfills or at the bottom of cupboards.
    the total cost of my "one-day wonders" WITH their lenses attached don't come close to the "new" price of a M body (not yet - a long way to go) let alone the cost of investment of M lenses. If you sell the one-day wonder at the right time you can re-coupe a lot of the initial cost anyway and move on up in sensor and lens technology.

    IMO there is something special about a lens matched and built to the body that produces an image that is not easily attained for the same price.
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    Re: New Mini M ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Steen View Post


    + 1

    What a relief when it turns out that it has a system mount for interchangeable lenses and a built-in viewfinder.

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    Re: New Mini M?

    Quote Originally Posted by Vivek View Post
    Hi Jono,

    i do not have a problem with describing crap as crap just like you say that no mini M buyer would read a forum like this.
    One person's crap is another person's fertilizer
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  13. #163
    Senior Subscriber Member Steen's Avatar
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    New Mini M ?


    Quote Originally Posted by Vivek View Post


    I just happen to think the leak is fake, Vivek, and my guess is that the real product is better than the fake leak.

    And in case the (kit) zoom is really that slow, I guess there will be some interchangeable primes as well.

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    Re: New Mini M?

    Let me hope that your suspicion (and that of monza's) would be correct. Otherwise, the Mini M will become future landfill material.

  15. #165
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    Re: New Mini M?

    If true, to bad about the slow apertures ... at least for most Leica fans.

    However, the market for something like this need not only be defined by expert Leica users that naturally gravitate to the M FF class of camera ... or the casual shooter who has a number of APSc cameras to select from.

    Right now, since my main objective is shooting B&W work with the MM, I've slipped into the category of wanting a casual smaller color camera for the typical tourist shots with friends and family ... quite frankly mostly in good light since that's where I tend to spend winters (soon for 4 months at a time) .

    A zoom is preferred so I do not have to swap lenses in beach environs, so the Sony fixed lens is not an option. Nor are some of the overly electronic wonder-cams which I've had my fill of. Neither is the $7,000 M240, which is extreme over-kill for these applications and would not get used in place of the M Monochromatic for other work (my M9P went fallow the minute the MM was in hand, so I sold it).

    The real determination will be how good the lens is. Typically, when Leica slows down the aperture the IQ gets pretty good for the "relative" price ... so that remains to be seen.

    At the very least it is on the radar until fully revealed on June 11 ... with a big, fat maybe. I'm more in a sell mood than a buy mood, so it has to fit the bill or it is a "no go".

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    Re: New Mini M?

    Quote Originally Posted by thrice View Post
    The RX1 body is too slim for proper handling as it is!
    ridiculous.
    If I worked for Leica, I would go on
    vacation today to hide myself for a couple of month.
    By defending this "very exciting" product,
    you make a fool of yourself, sorry.
    And the way you and jaap are doing it
    by trashing a REALLY exciting RX1, is borderline pathetic

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    Re: New Mini M?

    Quote Originally Posted by AnthonyFlores View Post
    ...
    So IF Leica could produce a FF mini M that took M lenses... and do it at a faster rate, charge less money yet keep their margins... and still sell more... tell me again why they would be worrying about cannibalizing M24O sales?
    They can barely produce enough M(9/M/240) to meet the demand, so how could they produce more (high quality, non panasonic, FF) bodies? and why? Ms are small and beautiful enough. For the price? ME and used M9(-P) are "cheap" enough...

    ... and this new Leica Mini not-M-but-X is awful / wrong enough ;-)

  18. #168
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    Re: New Mini M?

    Landfill fodder or timeless classic?

    Leica Announces CM ZOOM Film Camera | PhotographyBLOG

    The titanium body of the LEICA CM ZOOM with its elegant leather finish is reminiscent of the classic style of LEICA M system cameras.
    ....
    The timeless titanium body is shockproof and affords reliable protection from many types of damage.
    .....
    In our times of fast-lived digital photography, the LEICA CM ZOOM sets new standards for compact cameras with its high retention of value and timeless elegance.
    ....
    The LED display is the same as the one used in the professional camera LEICA M7 and gives clear readings of the focus setting, flash readiness and shutter speed.
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  19. #169
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    Re: New Mini M?

    Quote Originally Posted by snowboarder View Post
    ridiculous.
    If I worked for Leica, I would go on
    vacation today to hide myself for a couple of month.
    By defending this "very exciting" product,
    you make a fool of yourself, sorry.
    And the way you and jaap are doing it
    by trashing a REALLY exciting RX1, is borderline pathetic
    I think some of the points they're making are valid for many who have no interest in the RX1. I personally have large hands and little interest to invest $3500 in a advanced point and shoot camera. That being said I find the X cameras and all of the other large sensor fixed lens cameras to be too expensive for what they are for me. RX1 would need a built in EVF and a wide range zoom for me to spend that much money. Yes I've seen great pics for it but its way to limiting for me to spend that much on a non system camera.
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  20. #170
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    Re: New Mini M?

    The folk I feel for are the Leica dealers; let's face it at the moment they haven't much to actually sell. Deposits on the M240 probably help but cash flow must be pretty desperate.

    As far as my own prospective Leica purchases are concerned, well, if the M240 was available I'd probably be using them now. As it is I refuse to buy into a system that's not available off shelf. I'd also be looking for protection plans that include 24hr loaners, rentals and fast servicing turnaround. The problem is by the time the M240 is on those shelves it'll be time for the M360 - or whatever. And so it starts again.

  21. #171
    Senior Member thrice's Avatar
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    Re: New Mini M?

    Quote Originally Posted by snowboarder View Post
    ridiculous.
    If I worked for Leica, I would go on
    vacation today to hide myself for a couple of month.
    By defending this "very exciting" product,
    you make a fool of yourself, sorry.
    And the way you and jaap are doing it
    by trashing a REALLY exciting RX1, is borderline pathetic
    I was a Sony employee when I first handled the RX1. I have no problems with the camera, I just don't think the body needs to get any thinner as the post above mine suggested.

    Since you asked so nicely I think it is time I bowed out of this forum as well lest I say something debased like some users do.

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    Re: New Mini M?

    Not sure why we are fighting over vapor ware at the moment. Lets chill than June 11 we can blend it and see what it does. We can resume the great user debate when we have FACTS.

    Also stop saying we are leaving this great forum, I heard it several times in the last couple weeks. This is Not life or death. Your not getting hit with a baseball bat either.
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    Re: New Mini M?

    Agree.

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    Re: New Mini M?

    Quote Originally Posted by jaapv View Post
    A pity that this lens will be used for a few years only. As a P&S the RX1 will become obsolete in its class far more quickly than any digital rangefinder camera will. And a Summicron will still be around decades from now., when all RX1-s are residing in a landfill.
    That would be an interesting argument if the prices were somewhat comparable, but they're not. My M9 has lost more value since being new than the entire price of the RX1, and used 35/2 ASPHs are selling for about $1200 less than new, too. That's a $4K-5K loss in a few years. The RX1 is remarkably inexpensive for what it is.

    Plenty of people still happily shoot 5+ year old 5Ds, D700s, 1Dsiiis, M8s, A900s, etc., and I don't see the RX1 as being any different. High IQ, full frame cameras tend to stick around a while.

    Leica makes fantastic lenses, probably the best lineup top to bottom, but there are other capable lens makers. I think it's still all about the rangefinder. This rumored fixed zoom camera looks misguided, to me, especially if it is more expensive than the RX1.
    Last edited by douglasf13; 30th May 2013 at 07:01.
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  25. #175
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    Re: New Mini M?

    Quote Originally Posted by douglasf13 View Post
    That would be an interesting argument if the prices were somewhat comparable, but they're not. My M9 has lost more value since being new than the entire price of the RX1, and used 35/2 ASPHs are selling for about $1200 less than new, too.

    Plenty of people still happily shoot 5+ year old 5Ds, D700s, 1Dsiiis, M8s, A900s, etc., and I don't see the RX1 as being any different.

    Leica makes fantastic lenses, probably the best lineup top to bottom, but there are other capable lens makers. I think it's still all about the rangefinder. This rumored fixed zoom camera looks misguided, to me.
    Don't feel bad, medium format users are pulling there hair out on depreciation. Actually if we look historically at this. Leica glass is maybe one of the better investments. Bodies usually are not though. Be a interesting case study no doubt.
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    Re: New Mini M?

    Quote Originally Posted by douglasf13 View Post
    This rumored fixed zoom camera looks misguided, to me, especially if it is more expensive than the RX1.
    I think it is a bloody fake with couple of ringers trying to make it real. It is a deceitful campaign. Check back on this post on the 11th June.

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    Re: New Mini M?

    As technophiles we always expect greater and greater achievement in our photographic world. Often, our expectations cannot be fulfilled in real life without significant technological breakthroughs. As much as I wanted Hasselblad to give us at least a full frame rangefinder camera that would accept Zeiss lenses, they chose to milk the reputation of their name to gain a few bucks. Other than Sony, Canon, or Nikon, most of the other and smaller camera companies simply do not have the resources to make breakthrough improvements.

    I applaud Leica for bringing the M to the market, and I do not begrudge their efforts to sell other products that offer added revenue for them to apply to research and development. Just because it does not excite dedicated M users does not make it bad. At least it does not resemble the horrible Lunar. I'm still upset about that.

    Greg

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    Re: New Mini M?

    Quote Originally Posted by snowboarder View Post
    ridiculous.
    If I worked for Leica, I would go on
    vacation today to hide myself for a couple of month.
    By defending this "very exciting" product,
    you make a fool of yourself, sorry.
    And the way you and jaap are doing it
    by trashing a REALLY exciting RX1, is borderline pathetic
    Hahaha, I couldn't help notice you expanded your hatred posts from Leica to Leica employees! I just hope Leica owners will not be next on your list LOL
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  29. #179
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    Re: New Mini M?

    Quote Originally Posted by douglasf13 View Post
    That would be an interesting argument if the prices were somewhat comparable, but they're not. My M9 has lost more value since being new than the entire price of the RX1, and used 35/2 ASPHs are selling for about $1200 less than new, too. That's a $4K-5K loss in a few years. The RX1 is remarkably inexpensive for what it is.

    Plenty of people still happily shoot 5+ year old 5Ds, D700s, 1Dsiiis, M8s, A900s, etc., and I don't see the RX1 as being any different. High IQ, full frame cameras tend to stick around a while.

    Leica makes fantastic lenses, probably the best lineup top to bottom, but there are other capable lens makers. I think it's still all about the rangefinder. This rumored fixed zoom camera looks misguided, to me, especially if it is more expensive than the RX1.
    But then, you are not the target customer...
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    Re: New Mini M?

    Quote Originally Posted by jaapv View Post
    A pity that this lens will be used for a few years only. As a P&S the RX1 will become obsolete in its class far more quickly than any digital rangefinder camera will. And a Summicron will still be around decades from now., when all RX1-s are residing in a landfill.
    LOL. I am sure a 20 year old Leica will not really be that attractive as the M23 or RX-54. And no one will want that Summicron when they can get an APO-ED-VR-AF Summicron-X Deluxe for 30 times the price.
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    Re: New Mini M?

    Quote Originally Posted by jaapv View Post
    Most of the one-day wonders of more than three years old are in landfills or at the bottom of cupboards.
    My Konica Hexar AF lasted more than a decade and I sold it for a very good price. I don't think my Pentax 645D is going to be put in a landfill in the next year or so. The M8 seems to have survived.

    So, what really bothers you about the existence of the RX-1? It has nothing to do with the camera. It certainly has gotten under your skin.

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    Re: New Mini M?

    Quote Originally Posted by snowboarder View Post
    ridiculous.
    If I worked for Leica, I would go on
    vacation today to hide myself for a couple of month.
    By defending this "very exciting" product,
    you make a fool of yourself, sorry.
    And the way you and jaap are doing it
    by trashing a REALLY exciting RX1, is borderline pathetic
    Chill.
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    Re: New Mini M?

    Quote Originally Posted by Vivek View Post
    Landfill fodder or timeless classic?

    Leica Announces CM ZOOM Film Camera | PhotographyBLOG
    Quote Originally Posted by Shashin View Post
    LOL. I am sure a 20 year old Leica will not really be that attractive as the M23 or RX-54. And no one will want that Summicron when they can get an APO-ED-VR-AF Summicron-X Deluxe for 30 times the price.
    M users would scream "heresy and blasphemy" at the thought of an autofocus M lens. LOL
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    Re: New Mini M?

    Quote Originally Posted by HiredArm View Post
    M users would scream "heresy and blasphemy" at the thought of an autofocus M lens. LOL
    Such M users are long gone. most are shooting with an EM-5, XE-1, and NEX' and oh yes, it is the "M users" who buy the zooms first.

  35. #185
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    Re: New Mini M?

    Quote Originally Posted by Shashin View Post
    Chill.
    I agree and if we can't have a discussion here without throwing personal insults than Im just going to have to be a asshole here and start wiping people out. You do not want me to get on a roll here folks. I'm busy , I have a lot of work and I'm losing my patience.
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    Re: New Mini M?

    Look, the new Mini M is not for this the majority of this crowd. That does not make it a bad camera, that makes it a different camera. With Leica having the M, MM, and ME, it is hardly surprising that they would even want to run another rangefinder--the ME is the poor mans rangefinder.

    I know that camera bashing is a common sport, but not everyone will agree that any particular camera is trash for them. (The Lunar may be the only exception--it has to excel at something.) And when you bash a camera as [email protected], you are also implying that those interested in the camera are stupid. If you want a diverse community, I would suggest camera bashing works against that. You also miss learning why some very talented photographers have found limited equipment like the RX-1 is an exciting tool--just maybe they know something you don't.
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  37. #187
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: New Mini M?

    If I may I have no interest in the RX-1 myself as it is limited for me . I like interchangeable lenses why I bought the Fuji X-E1. That does not make the Fuji better and the RX-1 bad its just my preference but a lot of folks are out there with these single lens cams like the RX-1 the Fuji 100s and having a ball with them. Bottom line if you like photography and enjoy the industry and like to see others enjoy it with you than someone else's preference has zero amount of bearing on you and frankly they may just kick your *** artistically with something you do not like. Its us that makes the images we just to have metal, plastic, electronics and glass to make it happen.

    There is a very old saying one mans junk is another mans treasure. Tell me where that has changed.

    No one ever said we have to all agree or even disagree for that matter but do it with respect.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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  38. #188
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    Re: New Mini M?

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Mancuso View Post

    There is a very old saying one mans junk is another mans treasure. Tell me where that has changed.

    .
    OT

    I think in the modern context of usage of the word junk- "one man's junk", yeah, it has changed.

    I do not have any disagreement with the rest.

  39. #189
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: New Mini M?

    LOL
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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  40. #190
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    Re: New Mini M?

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Mancuso View Post
    If I may I have no interest in the RX-1 myself as it is limited for me . I like interchangeable lenses why I bought the Fuji X-E1. That does not make the Fuji better and the RX-1 bad its just my preference but a lot of folks are out there with these single lens cams like the RX-1 the Fuji 100s and having a ball with them. Bottom line if you like photography and enjoy the industry and like to see others enjoy it with you than someone else's preference has zero amount of bearing on you and frankly they may just kick your *** artistically with something you do not like. Its us that makes the images we just to have metal, plastic, electronics and glass to make it happen.

    There is a very old saying one mans junk is another mans treasure. Tell me where that has changed.

    No one ever said we have to all agree or even disagree for that matter but do it with respect.
    Great points. The camera is rarely the weakest link in the chain, when it comes to bad photography.

    I'm certainly not bashing this alleged new Leica, in terms of the kind of camera that it is. I think many shooters would like a fixed-zoom, aps-c camera. I'm just not sure that it's the kind of thing that should come from Leica for $3000 (if the rumors are true,) considering the other cameras on the market, but to each his/her own.

  41. #191
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    Re: New Mini M?

    Well 3 k is a lot of money in anyones purse for sure. I think the main thing we all look for is value spent on products that do what we want. If it does what you want it to do than really money becomes secondary. The question always remains in any system and any brand is is it worth it to you. Some folks throw money around regardless of costs and some are more value added budget minded. Hell the hobbyists that come on my workshops have far better gear than me and i work this for a living. LOL

    But on the same hand I'm excited for them as they are doing what they enjoy and really end of day that is all that really counts. To me watching everyone here on this forum go out and create art is my pleasure to see. Ive done this so long now its time to watch all of you grow. It maybe the only reason i am even here ( I still learn though and thats invaluable). I enjoy seeing your images and creating art and frankly there are some really damn good shooters here. Thats the really cool part. I dont care what gear they are shooting. It all comes down to is the image killer or not.

    Okay off to go shoot a gig and put food on the table.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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  42. #192
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    Re: New Mini M?

    Quote Originally Posted by douglasf13 View Post
    Great points. The camera is rarely the weakest link in the chain, when it comes to bad photography.

    I'm certainly not bashing this alleged new Leica, in terms of the kind of camera that it is. I think many shooters would like a fixed-zoom, aps-c camera. I'm just not sure that it's the kind of thing that should come from Leica for $3000 (if the rumors are true,) considering the other cameras on the market, but to each his/her own.
    The thing is, Leica doesn't seem to compete with the other cameras on the market. It has a certain clientele for this kind of product, which is different from that of the M line, even if both sectors may overlap somewhat. This camera may not make sense for us M users, but for Leica's clientele, it may be an ideal option. Leica's clientele is definitely not amateurs comparing prices vs performance. It's people who buy luxury products and for them a Sony or a Fuji is not prestigious enough.
    M262 ZM 25/2.8 35/1.4 50/2 85/2

  43. #193
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    Re: New Mini M?

    Quote Originally Posted by thrice View Post
    The RX1 body is too slim for proper handling as it is!
    Much agree.... However I have yet to try one with the grip which should help greatly.

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    Re: New Mini M?

    Quote Originally Posted by edwardkaraa View Post
    Hahaha, I couldn't help notice you expanded your hatred posts from Leica to Leica employees! I just hope Leica owners will not be next on your list LOL
    Would you expect anything different?
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    Re: New Mini M?

    I find the handling of the RX-1 really good. I can get a comfortable grip and you can easily hold it in many orientations. Now, if you are talking about waving it around with one hand, well, even an M would be poor for that. It is a camera, not a table tennis paddle.

  46. #196
    Senior Member Gary Clennan's Avatar
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    Re: New Mini M?

    It is all a matter of personal taste I suppose. I find it very tiny with almost a toy like feel. Either way, it is a great performing camera which I would love to try out for a week or so....
    Last edited by Gary Clennan; 30th May 2013 at 13:23.

  47. #197
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    Re: New Mini M?

    Quote Originally Posted by edwardkaraa View Post
    The thing is, Leica doesn't seem to compete with the other cameras on the market. It has a certain clientele for this kind of product, which is different from that of the M line, even if both sectors may overlap somewhat. This camera may not make sense for us M users, but for Leica's clientele, it may be an ideal option. Leica's clientele is definitely not amateurs comparing prices vs performance. It's people who buy luxury products and for them a Sony or a Fuji is not prestigious enough.
    Good points, and that's why, although everyone gets mad at me about it, I always come back to equating Leica with Rolex (Hasselblad is apparently going for Patek territory with the Lunar!) Their appeal to some is very similar. Oddly enough, my automatic Seiko is currently keeping slightly better time than my Rolex. LOL
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  48. #198
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    Re: New Mini M?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gary Clennan View Post
    Much agree.... However I have yet to try one with the grip which should help greatly.
    The RX1 is a little on the small side, to me, although, on the other hand, I think the M9 is a little too thick. M6 sized seems about right, but I can wave either of them like a table tennis paddle without much worry.

    The good thing is that there are several grips and half cases out there that can be used to bulk a camera up a bit.

  49. #199
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    Re: New Mini M?

    Quote Originally Posted by edwardkaraa View Post
    The thing is, Leica doesn't seem to compete with the other cameras on the market. It has a certain clientele for this kind of product, which is different from that of the M line, even if both sectors may overlap somewhat. This camera may not make sense for us M users, but for Leica's clientele, it may be an ideal option. Leica's clientele is definitely not amateurs comparing prices vs performance. It's people who buy luxury products and for them a Sony or a Fuji is not prestigious enough.
    Even though I can imagine that there are some people who buy Leica as a luxury product I am sure that there are many people who buy it because they feel its the best solution for them. Thats at least the reason why I use Leica M and S, but also an OMD, (and probably not a Mini M).
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  50. #200
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    Re: New Mini M?

    Tom thats what branding is all about. Leica branding is a major reason for sales. That came with a lot of history and fact is they deserve it. No matter how anyone feels about the products this part of leica is unmistakeable. You simply have to give them credit even though they make silly Hermes and such products the fact is they actually sell that stuff. Geez i even came within inches of buying a Safari Green 28mm R elmarit. Sorry i would have looked like a idiot with that in my bag. LOL

    No offense to the green collectors
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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