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Thread: Lens advice for mixed M8/35mm outfit or upgrade to M9

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    Lens advice for mixed M8/35mm outfit or upgrade to M9

    35mm has long been my favorite focal length followed by 90mm, and while I generally stay between 35mm and 90mm, I rarely shoot wider or longer.

    I am new to rangefinders and recently dumped my DSLR kit and am in the process of dumping my Sony NEX kit for Leica M. I currently have both M8.2 and M6 bodies and a 35mm Summarit, 50mm Summicron and 90mm Tele-Elmarit. For film or full frame I consider this the perfect outfit as all three lenses are very small, but sharp and fast enough.

    Problem is the M8.2 isn't full frame. I bought it because I didn't want to drop the $4000 or so for a used M9 before I knew if rangefinders really were for me, and now that I know I like the feel (and the results), I have a bit of a conundrum.

    I am extremely happy with the image quality from the M8.2 and have little or no use for higher ISO than 640. I shoot 90% black and white and will occasionally print 11X14, but usually its 5X7 and 8X10, so the 10MP files are already overkill and I would have little or no benefit from 18. The only problem is that I can't go wide enough, and am missing my sweet-spot 90mm focal length.

    It would be about the same price to sell the M8.2 and buy an M9 as it would to buy a 24mm Elmar Asph or 28mm Elmarit Asph, and in the case of the 28 I'd probably have almost enough leftover to get a 75mm Summarit.

    Does anyone here have experience with the 24 Elmar and 28 Elmarit on the M8? The added benefit would be that I would now have more wide options on film and of course lenses are always a better investment than bodies. The downside is that I could not carry a small 3 lens kit for both formats unless I pick a primary format. I'm inclined to the 28mm simply because the 24mm frame lines are too large in the M8.2 viewfinder.

    24mm comes out equivalent to 32mm and 28mm equivalent to 37mm. Any current or former M8 shooters have an opinion on which feels closer to a 35mm lens on full frame?

    Thanks in advance. This Leica bug sure is expensive, so I want to do this right.
    "A fella, A quick fella, might have a weapon under there. I'd have to pin his head to the panel." The Gyro Captain

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    Re: Lens advice for mixed M8/35mm outfit or upgrade to M9

    Yes, I've a 24 Elmar and have used it on both M8.2 and M9-P. Frankly I prefer it on the M8.2. Never thought I would but I'm getting some color shift on the edges of the FF camera (which is easily taken care of in PP or by stopping down) and I really like the lens equivalent of 32mm on the M8.2. As always YMMV.
    When I had an M8 I used a 35 Cron ASPH and thought the combo was awesome.
    Personally the more I shoot the M9-P the more I like the M8.2 files.

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    Re: Lens advice for mixed M8/35mm outfit or upgrade to M9

    Did you ever try the 28 Elmarit or Summicron? I think I will like the 24 focal length better on the M8.2 especially as I already have the 35 Summarit, but that 28 Elmarit is just SOOOOOOO tiny and light.
    "A fella, A quick fella, might have a weapon under there. I'd have to pin his head to the panel." The Gyro Captain

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    Re: Lens advice for mixed M8/35mm outfit or upgrade to M9

    I think you'll find that your M8.2 is better for b/w than an M9. I have two of the former, and after testing, saw no reason to get the M9. Much of my rationale paralleled yours, e.g., not huge print size, not extreme ISO, etc. You might consider renting an M9 to help make your own assessment.

    Beyond that, I also like that the M8.2 provides features that a standard M9 does not, including a sapphire screen, 2m frame lines, top LCD, black chrome finish (with black dot on black versions) and better covering. Plus, there is no concern about SD card issues, red edge, etc. Also, while some complain about the use of UV/IR filters on the M8.2, my tests and others show that even the M9 benefits in many circumstances from external filters, as the internal filtration is not as effective.

    I love the 28 Summicron on the M8.2. It serves to replace the 35mm FOV (roughly) I got with my film Ms. The Elmarit of course is smaller, and a bit more contrasty, although PP can do a lot these days to modify renderings. You can also rent these to test. Lenses are a personal matter, and I've maintained the trio of 28, 35 and 50 for decades, regardless of 'full frame' or crop. I owned a 75 Summicron for a time, but sold it when I failed to get along with the 75 frame lines.

    While my M8.2s serve me well, and despite what I say above, I will likely add the new M to my took kit. This has nothing to do with full frame; rather, I'm looking forward to weather sealing, longer battery life, quiet shutter (no motor re-cock buzz), improved RF focusing, faster processor and use of live view to help determine if camera and/or lens are mis-calibrated. The new focus options may also prompt the purchase of a 90 lens, probably the Macro-Elmar, which is tiny and a stellar performer as a short tele.

    Jeff

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    Re: Lens advice for mixed M8/35mm outfit or upgrade to M9

    Thanks for the words of wisdom. I think I'm going to stick to the M8.2 for now, and add the 28 Elmarit. The 28 and 50 will make a great 2 lens travel kit.
    "A fella, A quick fella, might have a weapon under there. I'd have to pin his head to the panel." The Gyro Captain

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    Re: Lens advice for mixed M8/35mm outfit or upgrade to M9

    I appreciate the comment, but the wisdom part comes down to doing what's right for you, not what worked for me. I got there by testing (if there's any 'wisdom' involved, that's it), not by following others' practices, although sharing can help prompt questions and issues.

    No matter what you decide, my suggestion is to forget about gear for a good while and just use whatever you decide to get; all the options you're considering are plenty good enough to help produce good work.

    Personally, I find much greater improvement in my prints from enhancements to the PP end of the workflow...software, printer, papers, inks, profiles, techniques, etc... than from changes to the camera or lens.

    Jeff
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    Senior Member JohnBrew's Avatar
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    Re: Lens advice for mixed M8/35mm outfit or upgrade to M9

    I had a 28 Elmarit on my film M's but never did care for it. Somehow it never seemed to be the right focal length for the situation. Perhaps I didn't try hard enough.

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    Re: Lens advice for mixed M8/35mm outfit or upgrade to M9

    When I had an M8, I almost exclusively used the 28, an older one, and loved it. B&W especially, but additionally, I/R, so simple.
    But I can perhaps see the rationale for the 24 and 50, if you wanted to concentrate on the two lens way.
    I sold the M8 to venture into the M9, but wished I'd stayed where I was actually, the M8 is a very fine camera.
    Gary

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    Re: Lens advice for mixed M8/35mm outfit or upgrade to M9

    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff S View Post
    I appreciate the comment, but the wisdom part comes down to doing what's right for you, not what worked for me. I got there by testing (if there's any 'wisdom' involved, that's it), not by following others' practices, although sharing can help prompt questions and issues.

    No matter what you decide, my suggestion is to forget about gear for a good while and just use whatever you decide to get; all the options you're considering are plenty good enough to help produce good work.

    Personally, I find much greater improvement in my prints from enhancements to the PP end of the workflow...software, printer, papers, inks, profiles, techniques, etc... than from changes to the camera or lens.

    Jeff
    I actually really hate the computer end of the equation as I work in front of one all day as an attorney. I try to get the very best raw file I can that requires the least amount of PP.

    For printing I just go to my local photo shop, where I also have my film scanned. I know I could take a lot more control if I learned PP, but honestly I've been delighted with almost straight BW conversions from DNG in Lightroom from M8 files. I capture with DNG+JPEG (for BW review)and honestly, even the JPEGs look FANTASTIC, though the DNGs are slightly better and give me the option of making a color image when desired.
    "A fella, A quick fella, might have a weapon under there. I'd have to pin his head to the panel." The Gyro Captain

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    Re: Lens advice for mixed M8/35mm outfit or upgrade to M9

    Thanks to all. I got an offer for an exceptional price on the 28 so I'll start there. I've always been a three lens guy (35, 50, 90 in the R series).

    I will stick with the M8.2 and 28, 35, 50 for three lens kit. Eventually I'll probably settle into the 28 or 35 for most of my shooting.
    "A fella, A quick fella, might have a weapon under there. I'd have to pin his head to the panel." The Gyro Captain

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    Re: Lens advice for mixed M8/35mm outfit or upgrade to M9

    I have the 24 Elmarit ASPH, and it is a wonderful match for the M8.

    The rangefinder frames do match the 24, and I usually shoot with a 2 lens kit of the 24 and 50 with the M8.

    If I am shooting with just one lens, I go with the 28 Elmarit Ver. IV, a truly excellent and underrated lens.

    The 24 FOV on the M8 is very nice, especially in cities when sometimes a slightly wider FOV is helpful without getting into an extreme wide angle look.

    The 32mm equivalent FOV is very attractive.

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    Re: Lens advice for mixed M8/35mm outfit or upgrade to M9

    Quote Originally Posted by Seascape View Post
    I have the 24 Elmarit ASPH, and it is a wonderful match for the M8.

    The rangefinder frames do match the 24, and I usually shoot with a 2 lens kit of the 24 and 50 with the M8.

    If I am shooting with just one lens, I go with the 28 Elmarit Ver. IV, a truly excellent and underrated lens.

    The 24 FOV on the M8 is very nice, especially in cities when sometimes a slightly wider FOV is helpful without getting into an extreme wide angle look.

    The 32mm equivalent FOV is very attractive.
    That was the big decision, 32mm FOV or 37mm FOV. I ended up buying the 28 Elmarit ASPH from a forum member here earlier today and may look into an older 24 or 21 next year before my annual trip to Asia.

    Since I've often gone between 35mm and 50mm FOV, I figured I'd err on the longer side of 35mm in case I decide to go with just one lens. The 28 ASPH is also just so small and light. I got a good enough price on it that if I don't like it, it will be easy to resell without any loss. That it is also useable without an auxiliary viewfinder on my M6 is just a bonus.
    "A fella, A quick fella, might have a weapon under there. I'd have to pin his head to the panel." The Gyro Captain

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    Re: Lens advice for mixed M8/35mm outfit or upgrade to M9

    Good decision. Now find an I/R filter and give that a try, you will be surprised how easy the M8 does I/R.
    Gary

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    Re: Lens advice for mixed M8/35mm outfit or upgrade to M9

    Already ordered an IR filter. Should have it in about a week. Nice thing with this kit is that all four of my lenses take the same 39mm filters, and all four are very small and light.
    "A fella, A quick fella, might have a weapon under there. I'd have to pin his head to the panel." The Gyro Captain

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    Re: Lens advice for mixed M8/35mm outfit or upgrade to M9

    I found it difficult to find an I/R in 39mm, and all but self-fabricated one. In the end though the M28 I had ran (I think) 46mm or 49mm filters, and these were simple enough to find.
    Hand-held was simple enough, custom W/B IIRC.
    Gary
    Last edited by Gbealnz; 21st March 2015 at 15:38.
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    Re: Lens advice for mixed M8/35mm outfit or upgrade to M9

    B+W 092 IR Dark Red is the one I ordered in 39mm. BH has them new for $55.
    "A fella, A quick fella, might have a weapon under there. I'd have to pin his head to the panel." The Gyro Captain

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    Re: Lens advice for mixed M8/35mm outfit or upgrade to M9

    Hmmm, just looked it up, looks perfect. Mine was a cheap and nasty version from the bay, 720Nm.
    Gary

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    Re: Lens advice for mixed M8/35mm outfit or upgrade to M9

    FedEX tracking says I'll have it on Wednesday, then I will what the world looks like in IR.
    "A fella, A quick fella, might have a weapon under there. I'd have to pin his head to the panel." The Gyro Captain

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    Re: Lens advice for mixed M8/35mm outfit or upgrade to M9

    Quote Originally Posted by asiafish View Post
    24mm comes out equivalent to 32mm and 28mm equivalent to 37mm. Any current or former M8 shooters have an opinion on which feels closer to a 35mm lens on full frame?
    I now use a Zeiss 35 on an M9, but I previously used a Voigtlander 28/2.0 Ultron-M on an M8 and in side by side shooting with a 35 Summilux FLE on M9, the angle of view was close enough to be the same as far as I was concerned.

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    Re: Lens advice for mixed M8/35mm outfit or upgrade to M9

    Quote Originally Posted by Amin View Post
    I now use a Zeiss 35 on an M9, but I previously used a Voigtlander 28/2.0 Ultron-M on an M8 and in side by side shooting with a 35 Summilux FLE on M9, the angle of view was close enough to be the same as far as I was concerned.
    I'm very excited to start shooting with the 28.
    "A fella, A quick fella, might have a weapon under there. I'd have to pin his head to the panel." The Gyro Captain

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    Re: Lens advice for mixed M8/35mm outfit or upgrade to M9

    Good choice on the 28mm. I shot my 28 'Cron a lot on my M8 & M9 both. Next you want to try a 21mm. It makes a far better match focal length wise with the 28mm than the 24mm does. The 24mm is just too close in my experience.

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    Re: Lens advice for mixed M8/35mm outfit or upgrade to M9

    Thanks for asking the question OP
    Personally, I just bought a VC 28mm f1.9 for my m8 2 days ago off the world's biggest auction site and am waiting for delivery. I will stay in this focal length for a while to see how I like it.
    I have tried the 28mm Elmarit ASPH previously and it is wonderfully small, sharp details and soft colour
    I have also tried the zm 35mm f2 bigon, which gives a different draw with lots of pop in the colour.
    Really can't go wrong with Leica lens and in the perfect world I would like to try all of them to see which one I like! (I am still waiting to own my first leica lens...they are pricey...this Leica hobby is an expensive hobby...)

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    Re: Lens advice for mixed M8/35mm outfit or upgrade to M9

    Yes, they are pricey
    "A fella, A quick fella, might have a weapon under there. I'd have to pin his head to the panel." The Gyro Captain

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    Re: Lens advice for mixed M8/35mm outfit or upgrade to M9

    For you I think you've made the correct decision to keep the M8 since you take 90% B&W.

    Apologies in advance for the long post, but here's my own M8...M9 experience.

    I recently sold my nearly-mint ( I was the 2nd owner) M8 at a 20% profit, to buy an M9. I absolutely loved the M8 and also loved shooting in IR with the B+W 092 filter noted in another post.

    My M9 was bought at a suitably low price, with an 'unrecognised SD card' error following firmware upgrade, so I haven't been able to try it yet, but I suspect that I've been subject to a GAS attack rather than any logical decision about how much 'extra performance' I really need (as an amateur). A non-functional SD card reader is actually a very expensive fault, as it transpires that the card reader is on the mainboard that also contains the sensor and rear LCD screen. Leica have stated that they will repair my M9 under goodwill and this is a fantastic example of their good sales support (I am the 3rd reported owner and the camera was outside warranty).

    I own a 5D Mk III and many alt lenses, and this investment prevented me keeping the M8 as well as seeking an M9, as my RF experience since last Dec has been so good with the M8.

    I used the following lenses on my M8, in order of purchase: CV 35/1.4 Nokton, Jupiter-8 (Zeiss 50/2 copy), later also buying 2nd hand Summicron 50 and CV 90/3.5 APO lenses.

    I also have a fine Contax G 45/2 that I had converted to Leica M (lives up to its stellar reputation) and have also since bought a Canon LTM 50/1.4 and the CV21/4 with a VL 21/25 finder. Note that the 21 doesn't require a finder on the M8, however I also have an M6. The latter two lenses were bought in a brief period of deciding to hold onto the M8 and not 'upgrade' to M9 (before my GAS attack :-0 ).
    Last edited by lenticularis; 4th August 2013 at 06:33.

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    Re: Lens advice for mixed M8/35mm outfit or upgrade to M9

    Sorry to hear about your rocky upgrade path.

    I'm actually enjoying the M8.2 so much that my main issue now is deciding whether or not to get rid of the last of my NEX gear (NEX7 and Sonnar 24E) which would cover a Summarit 75 or Elmar 21.

    Black and white results are so good that I might even let my M6 go and pick up a second M8.2. I find with LR5 that the M8 is useable even at max ISO for very clean 5X7 prints and decent 8X10s. What I like most is that the "noise" is pleasing, very similar to Tri-X grain.

    Of course, I could save my pennies and get a Monochrom when they are obsolete in a year or three. I played with one at the Leica store in Hollywood and the (very boring) files captures in the parking lot have incredible tonality.
    "A fella, A quick fella, might have a weapon under there. I'd have to pin his head to the panel." The Gyro Captain

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    Re: Lens advice for mixed M8/35mm outfit or upgrade to M9

    Quote Originally Posted by asiafish View Post
    What I like most is that the "noise" is pleasing, very similar to Tri-X grain.
    This being a forum where we try to help each other, I have to chime in and stop you right there.
    You are helping nobody by comparing noise to grain, first. And by saying that the noise from a M8 is very similar to grain (why not HP5, why not Tmax100, why exactly Tri-X is beyond me) is total nonsense.
    I hardcore use my darkroom on a weekly basis for years now. I was never without a darkroom in the past 20 years.

    My objection to your post and service to this community is to put things straight: The M8 files have absolutely nothing to do with quality B+W imagery. Especially very far from Tri-X!

    I will also venture to say that the MM is also very far from Tri-X and from any other film.

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    Re: Lens advice for mixed M8/35mm outfit or upgrade to M9

    Quote Originally Posted by NB23 View Post
    This being a forum where we try to help each other, I have to chime in and stop you right there.
    You are helping nobody by comparing noise to grain, first. And by saying that the noise from a M8 is very similar to grain (why not HP5, why not Tmax100, why exactly Tri-X is beyond me) is total nonsense.
    I hardcore use my darkroom on a weekly basis for years now. I was never without a darkroom in the past 20 years.

    My objection to your post and service to this community is to put things straight: The M8 files have absolutely nothing to do with quality B+W imagery. Especially very far from Tri-X!

    I will also venture to say that the MM is also very far from Tri-X and from any other film.
    The prints I've made have a similar look. I have them printed at a lab as I do not have a darkroom and have not for decades, but where my Sony cameras never gave me a film-like look, I feel that the M8 files get me pretty close.

    If you don't like the M8 files, then don't use one.
    "A fella, A quick fella, might have a weapon under there. I'd have to pin his head to the panel." The Gyro Captain

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    Re: Lens advice for mixed M8/35mm outfit or upgrade to M9

    Quote Originally Posted by asiafish View Post
    The prints I've made have a similar look. I have them printed at a lab as I do not have a darkroom and have not for decades, but where my Sony cameras never gave me a film-like look, I feel that the M8 files get me pretty close.

    If you don't like the M8 files, then don't use one.
    Exactly. You haven't printed for decades and you don't seem to know (according to what you wrote and the way you sounded) what is film and Tri-x at all. And that's what worried me the most: people are searching on the internet to get the most accurate infos about a given camera and they end up reading things like this, where the M8 is a great substitute for Tri-X. It's a little bit wrong, isn't it?

    I like the M8 for what they are. The fun part about the M8 is all about using the camera. The files aren't spectacular by any means. It was outdated before it actually came to market.
    And I'm just not into the internet hyped Leica make-believe thing although I'm a huge fan of other things Leica (Focomats, M4s, MPs, M5s, the history, some lenses...) and so on.

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    Re: Lens advice for mixed M8/35mm outfit or upgrade to M9

    I know what film is, and know what Tri-X is. I shot tons of the stuff from the late 70s through the early 90s and have dozens of prints made from it.

    I don't think the M8 duplicates Tri-X, but its noise is very grain-like, and in about the same amount as I used to see in Tri-X, hence the comparison. Other digital cameras I've owned (Sony A850, NEX7) had noise that was not at all grain-like. While the M8 still isn't film and never will be, it looks more "like" film, and I've had good luck making some ISO 640 portraits look not unlike portraits I shot 25 or 30-years-ago with Tri-X when both printed (darkroom back in the day, local shop today).

    Nothing special about it looking more like Tri-X than other film, Tri-X just happens to be what I used to shoot.

    As for the M8 being outdated, of course it is. It still produces great files that convert very well to black and white in Lightroom 5, which is more than my much more modern Sony NEX7 can claim.
    "A fella, A quick fella, might have a weapon under there. I'd have to pin his head to the panel." The Gyro Captain
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    Re: Lens advice for mixed M8/35mm outfit or upgrade to M9

    I know exactly what you mean and I agree, I shot a lot of film before becoming a late adopter to digital and the M8 can indeed produce files have a 'film like' quality the likes of which I haven't seen from other digital cameras, not every M8 image - but some do, not more like film than film itself, not better than film but the some of the files have an aesthetic that is pleasing in similar way.

    Back to the topic - I'd go for a Summarit 75 over an Elmar 21.

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    Re: Lens advice for mixed M8/35mm outfit or upgrade to M9

    I've heard a lot of good things about the Summarit 75, so I will probably get one. I'm taking a Leica Akademie class in November and requested a loaner 75 Summarit for the class.
    "A fella, A quick fella, might have a weapon under there. I'd have to pin his head to the panel." The Gyro Captain

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    Re: Lens advice for mixed M8/35mm outfit or upgrade to M9

    Asiafish, I hope you like the 75 Summarit. I'm quite taken with mine. Lightweight and very sharp.

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    Re: Lens advice for mixed M8/35mm outfit or upgrade to M9

    Quote Originally Posted by JohnBrew View Post
    Asiafish, I hope you like the 75 Summarit. I'm quite taken with mine. Lightweight and very sharp.
    Thats what I want, small, light and sharp. For the M8 this and the 28 Elmarit would make a great two-lens travel kit.
    "A fella, A quick fella, might have a weapon under there. I'd have to pin his head to the panel." The Gyro Captain

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    Re: Lens advice for mixed M8/35mm outfit or upgrade to M9

    Quote Originally Posted by NB23 View Post
    The fun part about the M8 is all about using the camera. The files aren't spectacular by any means. It was outdated before it actually came to market....
    And I'm just not into the internet hyped Leica make-believe thing...
    The internet myth is that one needs an M9 or Monochrom or new M for good b/w files. Nonsense. I'll take the M8 for its terrific b/w, which in my testing proved better for my print making needs and preferences than the M9. The files can be wonderful.

    I've built and used 4 darkrooms spanning 30+ years, and don't compare my film versus digital prints. But I've exhibited lovely prints using my film Ms, my M8.2s, and lots of other cameras, including various formats and manufacturers. And I guarantee you that, apart from a lucky guess here or there, you'd have no idea what camera or lens was used. There are countless other variables involved. I have real life findings to demonstrate it.

    Enough with your own internet myth.

    Jeff
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    Re: Lens advice for mixed M8/35mm outfit or upgrade to M9

    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff S View Post
    The internet myth is that one needs an M9 or Monochrom or new M for good b/w files. Nonsense. I'll take the M8 for its terrific b/w, which in my testing proved better for my print making needs and preferences than the M9. The files can be wonderful.

    I've built and used 4 darkrooms spanning 30+ years, and don't compare my film versus digital prints. But I've exhibited lovely prints using my film Ms, my M8.2s, and lots of other cameras, including various formats and manufacturers. And I guarantee you that, apart from a lucky guess here or there, you'd have no idea what camera or lens was used. There are countless other variables involved. I have real life findings to demonstrate it.

    Enough with your own internet myth.

    Jeff
    I totally agree with you: any digital camera does B&W. I have some outstanding ones from my iphone. Now will you hear me say "the iphone (or M8 or monochrom) is very close to tri-x?

    Never. I would kill my whole reputation in one single second with such a lie.

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    Re: Lens advice for mixed M8/35mm outfit or upgrade to M9

    Quote Originally Posted by NB23 View Post
    I totally agree with you: any digital camera does B&W.
    Not really my point, but never mind.

    Jeff

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    Re: Lens advice for mixed M8/35mm outfit or upgrade to M9

    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff S View Post
    Not really my point, but never mind.

    Jeff
    But I've exhibited lovely prints using my film Ms, my M8.2s, and lots of other cameras, including various formats and manufacturers. And I guarantee you that, apart from a lucky guess here or there, you'd have no idea what camera or lens was used. There are countless other variables involved. I have real life findings to demonstrate it.
    Sure sounded like it.

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    Re: Lens advice for mixed M8/35mm outfit or upgrade to M9

    Well, if we're quoting out of context....


    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff S View Post
    I'll take the M8 for its terrific b/w, which in my testing proved better for my print making needs and preferences than the M9.

    But you wouldn't know the difference; I would, given the workflow. And you also wouldn't be able to distinguish the Tri-X derived prints from others, other than a lucky guess, given all the myriad variables involved from camera to final displayed print. It's not about print comparison; each print stands on its own.

    Your reputation? Silly notion.

    Jeff

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    Re: Lens advice for mixed M8/35mm outfit or upgrade to M9

    Ok so your point is that I wouldn't be able to differentiate an iphone shot from a M9 shot from a tri-x shot from a samsung shot.

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    Re: Lens advice for mixed M8/35mm outfit or upgrade to M9

    Once again, your words, not mine.

    You wouldn't be able to distinguish the prints I make, with the equipment and materials I choose, and the workflow and techniques I use. And, for me, the M8.2 gets me there more easily.

    I can't speak for your or anyone else's results. That's why generalizations, particularly those based on internet myths (like your own) don't matter to me. I only care about my own experience and results, which derive from many more variables, and a lot more work than choosing a camera, or film.

    Jeff
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    Re: Lens advice for mixed M8/35mm outfit or upgrade to M9

    You wouldn't be able to distinguish the prints I make, with the equipment and materials I choose, and the workflow and techniques I use. And, for me, the M8.2 gets me there more easily

    So just to be clear: You are actually saying that the M8.2 is the camera that allows you to create images that are the most indistinguishable from all the rest, in the most easy way.

    I don't quite understand what you are trying to say except that you are trying very hard to tell me that the M8.2 is fabulous but I'm not sure why exactly, other then that it makes files indistinguishable from other cameras. This is extremely confusing to me. But it's ok, it's your money and your time.

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    Re: Lens advice for mixed M8/35mm outfit or upgrade to M9

    He's saying that for the look he likes, with the workflow he uses, the M8.2 is the easiest starting point.

    Pretty clear.
    "A fella, A quick fella, might have a weapon under there. I'd have to pin his head to the panel." The Gyro Captain
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    Re: Lens advice for mixed M8/35mm outfit or upgrade to M9

    Asiafish, it is refreshing to hear you enjoy shooting M8.2 still. I used to have one myself paired with a 35 summarit, giving a close to 50 FOV. But have since sold the M8.2 while still keeping the lens. If I were to start all over again with a 8.2, I would go for a 25mm Zeiss & another 50mm. So this combo will give a 35mm format equivalent of 33mm & 65mm.

    33mm would be for general shooting and I foresee would be most used focal range. While 65mm would be more for portrait - my nephews & nieces.

    For some, 65mm for portrait may not be long enough, however, I find shooting anything longer than a 50mm on the M8.2 is going to be straining to my eyes.

    Just my personal preference & shooting style.
    Justin

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    Re: Lens advice for mixed M8/35mm outfit or upgrade to M9

    Sadly I sent my 90 Tele Elmarit to Sherry for CLA before I got the M8.2, but find 50 a nice portrait length on the crop sensor.

    I love the 35 Summarit on the M8.2 as well, and am waiting on delivery of my 28 Elmarit, which isn't quite a true 35mm fov, has a nicer (to my 45-year-old eyes) frame line than a 24 (or 25) would. The 24 frame line just doesn't give me much view outside the frame, which is a large part of why I moved to a rangefinder. Somehow I expect to sell the 90 and get a 75 Summarit. Not crazy about the bokeh from my 50 Cron, so looking to sell that for a 50 with better bokeh. I've been impressed with the Sonnar and the Jupiter 3 clones, so may go that route instead of Leica for my 50.
    "A fella, A quick fella, might have a weapon under there. I'd have to pin his head to the panel." The Gyro Captain

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    Re: Lens advice for mixed M8/35mm outfit or upgrade to M9

    Only reservation I gathered from those who shoot with the 50 Sonnar is the focus shift. Not sure how that will affect you, unless you constantly shoot at whatever aperture that particular piece was optimised for. Alternatively, there is also the new Nokton 50 1.5.

    But having said that, the lens collection that you already have will provide ample enjoyment to your current shooting.
    Justin

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    Re: Lens advice for mixed M8/35mm outfit or upgrade to M9

    Definitely no gaps in my enjoyment with current collection. I am something of a bokeh fiend though, and the Jupiter 3 and the Nokton 1.5 (old AND new) look good, as does the Summarit.

    Birthday and 20th anniversary are coming up, and I really don't want or need another watch.
    "A fella, A quick fella, might have a weapon under there. I'd have to pin his head to the panel." The Gyro Captain

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    Re: Lens advice for mixed M8/35mm outfit or upgrade to M9

    +1 for the 28 elmarit, +1 for the IR suggestion. I think the 28 is a no brainer given what you've said you mostly shoot. The 28 cron is also lovely.

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    Re: Lens advice for mixed M8/35mm outfit or upgrade to M9

    The 28 Cron would be nice, but I'd rather have the small size and light weight than the extra stop.

    My Elmarit should arrive next week, and I got a good enough price that if I don't like it, it will be easy to resell and try another 28 (or 24). Thats what I love about buying used with Leica resale values; its easy to just buy and then either keep or resell depending on characteristics. With rentals I always feel pressured to do as much testing as possible when I would rather just take my time and decide if a given lens is really for me.

    So far the Summarit 35 was probably my best purchase. I just love the way the lens renders. It is sharp and punchy like a modern lens, but has a very gentle transition to out-of-focus and smooth bokeh. It is so good that I often take it out as my only lens with no regrets except that I can't use all of it.
    "A fella, A quick fella, might have a weapon under there. I'd have to pin his head to the panel." The Gyro Captain

  49. #49
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    Re: Lens advice for mixed M8/35mm outfit or upgrade to M9

    I actually just traded up to the 28 Cron from the Elmarit. It is bigger, but still in the range of "small enough that I don't care" (this is on the Nex-7). It's about the same size as the 21 Super-Elmar, actually, except the hood is bigger and clunkier. They really should refresh the 28/2 and give it the same hood mechanism as the 21SE and the 35 FLE have, they are great. (that is one other thing going for the Elmarit, better hood and cap).

    From what I can tell, and looking at the MTF charts, the rendering of the Cron and Elmarit are nearly identical (at matching apertures).

    The Summarits are relative bargains. Results with those look great from what I've seen.

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    Re: Lens advice for mixed M8/35mm outfit or upgrade to M9

    Quote Originally Posted by Taylor Sherman View Post
    I actually just traded up to the 28 Cron from the Elmarit. It is bigger, but still in the range of "small enough that I don't care" (this is on the Nex-7). It's about the same size as the 21 Super-Elmar, actually, except the hood is bigger and clunkier. They really should refresh the 28/2 and give it the same hood mechanism as the 21SE and the 35 FLE have, they are great. (that is one other thing going for the Elmarit, better hood and cap).

    From what I can tell, and looking at the MTF charts, the rendering of the Cron and Elmarit are nearly identical (at matching apertures).

    The Summarits are relative bargains. Results with those look great from what I've seen.
    I wish there was a Summarit 28. I love the 35 and just bought the 75.
    "A fella, A quick fella, might have a weapon under there. I'd have to pin his head to the panel." The Gyro Captain

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