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Thread: Leica's new APS-C Interchangeable lens camera

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    Leica's new APS-C Interchangeable lens camera

    Looks Like April 24th will be the day.

    Our friend DoubleNegative's La Vida Leica has posted some specs and thoughts:
    Leica Special Event in Berlin on April 24! | La Vida Leica!

    Anyways, I figured I'd start the rumor fornication debate as follows.

    1. Interchangeable lens mount: I would suspect that this camera will be and "X" camera with a new interchangeable lens mount.
    2. APS-C: Widely rumored. I suspect that the camera will lack an AA filter, given the present sensor trends and desires of users
    3. AF lens mount. Plus/Minus This makes using an M mount far less likely ...bummer...but let's see how fast AF is. I am presuming that the M mount could possibly be modified to permit AF, but I am doubtful, as the camera will likely be thinner than an M and using a different mount will permit Leica to sell a $500 M adapter
    4. Focus peaking: Some version of this, probably the same as employed on the M
    4. Built in EVF....probably similar to what Sony/Oly/Fuji are sporting now. I am hoping for this over an externally mountable EVF
    5. I am guessing this will look a LOT like the X-vario, just with an interchangeable mount.
    6. I wouldn't be suprised if 2 primes and 1 zoom are available at launch...Probably a 35 and 50 or 28 and 50, along with a zoom

    Okay, friends, let the speculation continue forth until April 24th!
    Ashwin Rao
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    Re: Leica's new APS-C Interchangeable lens camera

    Now that is cruel Ashwin. Here I am in sell off mode, cleaning up as much of my debt (mortgage) as will allow, and you drop this revelation.

    If it is as good as my X1, with an interchangeable lens, I might be very tempted. The X1 really spun me out, I picked it up as we left NZ on a 7 week sojourn of Europe. As back-up I took an M6 and Summicrons 35 and 50, but after a week the M6 slept while the X1 was used, all day, every day. Loved it, still do.
    The fears of having a single and fixed lens were allayed. Sure I missed a couple of shots where I needed a tele, or some where wider than what I could walk was needed, but by and large, the X1 was perfect.
    Don't tell too many, but to me (weird I know) the best thing was the there was no decision as to what lens to fit. It was already fitted, just compose and shoot.

    So, this new interchangeable APS-C camera will be interesting, very. Thank you (I think) for bringing this to my attention.
    Gary

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    Re: Leica's new APS-C Interchangeable lens camera

    Thanks for the post, Ashwin.

    What I posted - is what's coming. Not rumors.

    Now for a little speculation. Not sure if they're related (yet).

    New Leica X (Type 113) Camera?

    It could mean that the T is really that; a T. Perhaps "X like" yes. Or, it could mean that Leica is rebranding something properly (the new camera IS an X).

    What I do know is that it's not a Panasonic. It is a 16MP APS-C with interchangeable lenses. It's also not an "enthusiast" camera... Which makes you wonder where exactly the X fits in, then.

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    Re: Leica's new APS-C Interchangeable lens camera

    Yeah, I don't get that "consumer/prosumer" vs "not an enthusiast" distinction. I think they must want to differentiate it from their M and S system as something more for casual shooters/hobbyists, but those are enthusiasts, no? Who knows. Probably intended for a different audience, and I personally will wait to see
    1. What is the lens support
    2. How is IQ?
    3. How fast is AF?
    4. What is the quality of the VF (Leica has sorely lagged here).

    I have the Fuji X-T1 at the moment as my "other" system, and I don't see this release as trumping it...but time will tell...it will diversify the market for sure...

    I am equally curious if Leica will release an M240-P that day....

    Ashwin
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    Re: Leica's new APS-C Interchangeable lens camera

    Some of that is my wording; because I don't want to say more. Basically, don't expect an advanced type of camera (e.g. a Sony A7 or Fuji X-T1 competitor)...

    There were initial rumblings about a 100th anniversary X. But I wouldn't count on it. This event is all about the new camera (and any associated lenses).

    As for the rest... Time will tell.

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    Re: Leica's new APS-C Interchangeable lens camera

    As long as it's not a $3K Canon EOS-M....interesting strategy on Leica's part....I guess new markets are being targeted...
    Ashwin Rao
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    Re: Leica's new APS-C Interchangeable lens camera

    Yeah, I don't think it'll be that low-end... But it IS Leica after all.

    If I had to guess, it'll be a new X variant (or close) - which also explains recent price drops on the X Vario. Leica wouldn't hold a special event for something like a Leica C or D-LUX type camera, so it's got to be somewhat higher end. The "Leica T" might be misleading, but who knows. The internal codename is "Typhoon" and it's Type 701; the X Vario is Type 107... Could be that Korean registration is Leica going official with the real name now?

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    Re: Leica's new APS-C Interchangeable lens camera

    Sorry, DN, but your 'rumour site' does not seem particularly well informed.

    Updated March 28, 2014!

    We have a bombshell update... Turns out this will NOT be a Panasonic after all!


    This was publicly known over at LUF last year

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    Re: Leica's new APS-C Interchangeable lens camera

    I don't follow LUF. And "publicly known" doesn't mean "confirmed." Do they know who really makes it? We do.

    I suppose LUF also knew all the other specs too, eh?

    Finally, it's not a "rumor site." We post rumors occasionally, yes.

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    Re: Leica's new APS-C Interchangeable lens camera

    Quote Originally Posted by ashwinrao1 View Post
    Okay, friends, let the speculation continue forth until April 24th!
    APS-C,built in EVF /or externally mountable EVF3/, M mount could possibly be modified to permit AF...3 new lenses AF..

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    Re: Leica's new APS-C Interchangeable lens camera

    Quote Originally Posted by Double Negative View Post
    I don't follow LUF. And "publicly known" doesn't mean "confirmed."
    Confirmed by who? Leica? Or your 'trusted' source?

    Quote Originally Posted by Double Negative View Post
    Do they know who really makes it? We do.
    Than please share this info. Leica CEO Alfred Schopf stated already in the autumn of 2013 that it will be German built. I see no reason not to believe him. Do you have new info?

    Quote Originally Posted by Double Negative View Post
    I suppose LUF also knew all the other specs too, eh?
    Which specs are you talking about? Not much info on your site, besides the obvious.

    Quote Originally Posted by Double Negative View Post
    Finally, it's not a "rumor site." We post rumors occasionally, yes.
    If you say so. Sure don't mean to start a fight, just don't see a 'bombshell' of new info.

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    Re: Leica's new APS-C Interchangeable lens camera

    Wow, another LUF hater crawled out from under the rocks...

    Suffice it to say, I have reliable sources (who I will never reveal). What I posted is what's coming. I don't see anyone else posting specs, and I've confirmed many aspects; APS-C, 16MP, interchangeable lenses, AF, codename, cost, etc. Take it - or leave it. We'll find out in three weeks, won't we?

    P.S. We were the only site that knew the M-E was coming.

    It's only partially "German." They have a Japanese partner making most of it - and it's not Panasonic.

    As for being a "rumor site" - yes, I do say so. Check out the Rumor tag... Not much there... Unlike some sites. Like I said, we occasionally post rumors. If we have confirmed info, it's not a rumor - and we say so.

    Sheesh.

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    Re: Leica's new APS-C Interchangeable lens camera

    No need to be rude.
    I object to being called a LUF hater, and I certainly don't crawl.

    This is a discussion board, you can not expect everyone to take your word for granted. Franky, all I see on your little website is half-informed messages and FUD creation. I'll stop here, like I said, I'm not looking for a fight, good luck.

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    Re: Leica's new APS-C Interchangeable lens camera

    Okay guys, just stop. Make posts about the upcoming Leica and quit the attacks and snide remarks. I expected better from you.
    Brad Husick

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    Re: Leica's new APS-C Interchangeable lens camera

    I think my Magpie Syndrome has gone into remission. I am so delighted with my Leica R lenses working on the A7, and with the E-M1, that I haven't even bothered to look at DN's expected specs.

    Ach, what's the world coming to? A fuller bank account? More photographs? ];-)

    G

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    Re: Leica's new APS-C Interchangeable lens camera

    Double, heed Brad's advice and cool your jets. If you want to argue, take it offline. Keep it up on this forum and I'll send you to your room with a timeout.
    Jack
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    Re: Leica's new APS-C Interchangeable lens camera

    Done with this thread. See y'all on the 24th.

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    Re: Leica's new APS-C Interchangeable lens camera

    With all of the work that Leica has been doing for the m4/3 lenses, they must have gained a lot of knowledge on how to make a compact AF lens. Would it be a stretch to think that a lot of the m4/3 designs they have done can also cover the APS-C sensor?
    Al Tanabe my website https://www.altanabe.com

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    Re: Leica's new APS-C Interchangeable lens camera

    I can't help myself - we probably should let this thread lie dormant, however, I've heard the upcoming Leica T is a collaboration between Sony (gasp) and Leica. I've recently been to Asia and that's the 'whispers in the dark alleys of the sensor/semiconductor' world.

    APS-C, 24 megapixels CMOS is the only part of the puzzle I might venture to add.

    I take it all with a grain of salt, of course, and it will be fun to see what shows up on the 24th.

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    Re: Leica's new APS-C Interchangeable lens camera

    Perhaps the 'not an enthusiast camera' means it is to compete with the Nikon V series? The statement in itself doesn't imply to me the new camera is going to be above an enthusiast camera, so why not below? Which is the whole point of spoiling a nice surprise on the 24th, rather than just leave Leica to have their moment of glory (?) the race is on to say 'I told you so', so any wild idea can jockey for position. The voices in my head also say a leather half case and grip will be available, and there won't be any spare batteries available until six months after release. That may be 'stating the bleeding obvious' but it is the sort of information people need to complete the fantasy.

    Steve

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    Re: Leica's new APS-C Interchangeable lens camera

    Let's all hope this is not another "mini M" marketing disaster Leica made with the X.
    Brad Husick
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    Re: Leica's new APS-C Interchangeable lens camera

    Pictures are up on some is the rumor sites.looks like a nex type design. No EVF ....looks like it won't hold much for me, but we will have to see how the lenses and interface play out. Could be the right camera for a certain group, and leica's clean/simple design concept could work well....
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    Re: Leica's new APS-C Interchangeable lens camera

    I apologize to everyone and especially Ashwin, who started this topic, for my part in almost letting this thread derail in the wrong direction.

    FWIW, here's more rumours:

    More Details on the Compact System Camera Leica T (Codenamed

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    Re: Leica's new APS-C Interchangeable lens camera

    If it exists, let's hope it takes nice pictures

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    Re: Leica's new APS-C Interchangeable lens camera

    If focus peaking is as weak as the M240's then I might have to pass on the adapter for anything manual focus (which is a shame)

    16 megapixels at just over $3000? Hmm... This better be pretty damn impressive.

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    Re: Leica's new APS-C Interchangeable lens camera

    Quote Originally Posted by ashwinrao1 View Post
    Yeah, I don't get that "consumer/prosumer" vs "not an enthusiast" distinction. I think they must want to differentiate it from their M and S system as something more for casual shooters/hobbyists, but those are enthusiasts, no? Who knows. Probably intended for a different audience, and I personally will wait to see
    1. What is the lens support
    2. How is IQ?
    3. How fast is AF?
    4. What is the quality of the VF (Leica has sorely lagged here).

    I have the Fuji X-T1 at the moment as my "other" system, and I don't see this release as trumping it...but time will tell...it will diversify the market for sure...

    I am equally curious if Leica will release an M240-P that day....

    Ashwin
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    I can guarantee you I will answer each of your questions on 25 April and not a day sooner. Lou
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    Re: Leica's new APS-C Interchangeable lens camera

    I just want a nice M9 sensor in a small package.

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    Re: Leica's new APS-C Interchangeable lens camera

    From the most recent set of rumors released, I see "comes with an optional viewfinder." Yay! There will be an elegant Olympus VF-4 with "Leica" printed on it and a firmware upgrade to let existing Leica systems use it! And some of us will feel smug about our homely Olympus VF4s until the following month, when Olympus releases its utterly incredible VF6.

    scott
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    Re: Leica's new APS-C Interchangeable lens camera

    Design inspired by soap bars and looks as if it could make phone calls as well.
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    Re: Leica's new APS-C Interchangeable lens camera

    Leica could have taken the X body and modified it for interchangeable lenses. I like the knobs on the X - this new camera seems to have dropped most of the knobs.

    Ugh.

    I am glad I bought the Fuji X-T1. Enjoying it more every day, and using M lenses on it.
    Brad Husick

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    Re: Leica's new APS-C Interchangeable lens camera

    Quote Originally Posted by bradhusick View Post
    Leica could have taken the X body and modified it for interchangeable lenses. I like the knobs on the X - this new camera seems to have dropped most of the knobs.

    ...
    If the image I saw on another website is true then I agree with you - I also like the knobs on the X-series cameras.
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    Re: Leica's new APS-C Interchangeable lens camera

    Quote Originally Posted by bradhusick View Post
    I am glad I bought the Fuji X-T1. Enjoying it more every day, and using M lenses on it.
    Mine's on back-order at the moment... I love my X-Pro 1 but can't wait for the X-T1

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    Re: Leica's new APS-C Interchangeable lens camera

    If the pictures are true it really is a low end (big price) 'back up' camera, the sort people buy to use their M lenses with, but then don't. Who is going to take seriously a slippery fat P&S? APSC sensors are two a penny, adapting lenses from one manufactures body to another is commonplace, so where oh where is any sort of innovation or spark?

    Steve

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    Re: Leica's new APS-C Interchangeable lens camera

    Quote Originally Posted by 250swb View Post
    If the pictures are true it really is a low end (big price) 'back up' camera, the sort people buy to use their M lenses with, but then don't. Who is going to take seriously a slippery fat P&S? APSC sensors are two a penny, adapting lenses from one manufactures body to another is commonplace, so where oh where is any sort of innovation or spark?

    Steve
    Agreed, if that's the case, in terms of aps-c backup body, A6000 here I come.

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    Re: Leica's new APS-C Interchangeable lens camera

    who needs a apsc backup body for M-lenses. And if I needed one it would be a M8.2.
    So I still hope the new system will be an attractive camera/system as an own solution, not as a backup.

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    Re: Leica's new APS-C Interchangeable lens camera

    >It's only partially "German." They have a Japanese partner making most of it - and it's not Panasonic.

    I was told to anticipate some Sigma partnership on the lens side of this camera (an interesting thought, their latest ART series for DSLR's are getting very positive reviews, so some of those smarts in a new series of lenses for this new camera would be interesting)

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    Re: Leica's new APS-C Interchangeable lens camera

    Quote Originally Posted by Paratom View Post
    who needs a apsc backup body for M-lenses. And if I needed one it would be a M8.2.
    So I still hope the new system will be an attractive camera/system as an own solution, not as a backup.
    As for need of a backup--Anyone who shoots in places/ times where failure of one body means loss of opportunity-- I've been shooting M bodies off and on since the late 80's, and had rangefinders drift, or get knocked out of alignment several times.

    In film days, you found out when you processed, too late. With digital, instant feedback means backup can be deployed.

    I'm thinking aps-c backup strictly because it's just that-- a backup, a fail safe. I'd rather invest in glass than a duplicate M240 or M9 or MM body. Additionally, an aps-c backup instantly gives you access to longer reach without the need to bring longer lenses-- and the alternative of cropping from an M body image isn't the same.

    In terms of the M8, I'm not interested in spending money on a backup that is already to some extent irreparable, when there is a viable, much smaller, alternative that doesn't require IR filters, has better low light performance, higher MP, and is 1/5 the cost. Granted, it wouldn't have the CCD look, but a light, tiny back up body tucked in a side pocket makes much more sense for my style of shooting...
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    Re: Leica's new APS-C Interchangeable lens camera

    for me the IR filters killed the idea of an M8 or M8.2 as a backup long ago.
    Brad Husick

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    Re: Leica's new APS-C Interchangeable lens camera

    I still use my M8s as my primary cameras. Nothing wrong with them, if it is
    Images one needs to make.

    I just didn't have the underwater housing for them, this time.

    As for the new Leica....I shall wait for the inevitable ' fun with ...' thread.

    I believe the M8 was ( and is ) the game changer rangefinder.

    YMMV.
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    Re: Leica's new APS-C Interchangeable lens camera

    Quote Originally Posted by mdg137 View Post
    As for need of a backup--Anyone who shoots in places/ times where failure of one body means loss of opportunity-- I've been shooting M bodies off and on since the late 80's, and had rangefinders drift, or get knocked out of alignment several times.

    In film days, you found out when you processed, too late. With digital, instant feedback means backup can be deployed.

    I'm thinking aps-c backup strictly because it's just that-- a backup, a fail safe. I'd rather invest in glass than a duplicate M240 or M9 or MM body. Additionally, an aps-c backup instantly gives you access to longer reach without the need to bring longer lenses-- and the alternative of cropping from an M body image isn't the same.

    In terms of the M8, I'm not interested in spending money on a backup that is already to some extent irreparable, when there is a viable, much smaller, alternative that doesn't require IR filters, has better low light performance, higher MP, and is 1/5 the cost. Granted, it wouldn't have the CCD look, but a light, tiny back up body tucked in a side pocket makes much more sense for my style of shooting...
    Yes, sorry, I didnt mean to question that it can make sense for some.
    Lately my "backup" for vacation has been a gm1 with the kit zoom and a 17/2.5. It also has the advantage to be much smaller so it is not just backup but also gets used when I want very small camera (for example when riding the bike or going x-country ski).
    I have tried using M-lenses on m43 and on Nex cameras but in the end I was never convinced by the handling of such combination and rather use M lenses on the M and native lenses on m43/Nex (ok, I dont own Nex any more).

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    Re: Leica's new APS-C Interchangeable lens camera

    Quote Originally Posted by Paratom View Post
    I have tried using M-lenses on m43 and on Nex cameras but in the end I was never convinced by the handling of such combination and rather use M lenses on the M and native lenses on m43/Nex (ok, I dont own Nex any more).
    Tried doing the same with NEX and I too don't own any NEX anymore. If the AF would have been better, I might have kept the 5N...

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    Re: Leica's new APS-C Interchangeable lens camera

    Quote Originally Posted by bradhusick View Post
    ...I like the knobs on the X - this new camera seems to have dropped most of the knobs.
    That's because it has a touchscreen. Leica is getting modern on this one.

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    Re: Leica's new APS-C Interchangeable lens camera

    Quote Originally Posted by rayyan View Post
    I still use my M8s as my primary cameras. Nothing wrong with them, if it is
    Images one needs to make.

    I just didn't have the underwater housing for them, this time.

    As for the new Leica....I shall wait for the inevitable ' fun with ...' thread.

    I believe the M8 was ( and is ) the game changer rangefinder.

    YMMV.
    Actually the Epson RD was the "Game Changer" wasn't it? Prior to that, Leica kept saying it wasn't possible. So, the Epson "got them into the game" so to speak.

    If he M8 were fully supported for repairs, I'd seriously look at one as back-up to my M Monochrome the B&W conversions from that camera are really quite special IMO.

    - Marc
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    Re: Leica's new APS-C Interchangeable lens camera

    Quote Originally Posted by fotografz View Post
    Actually the Epson RD was the "Game Changer" wasn't it? Prior to that, Leica kept saying it wasn't possible. So, the Epson "got them into the game" so to speak.

    If he M8 were fully supported for repairs, I'd seriously look at one as back-up to my M Monochrome the B&W conversions from that camera are really quite special IMO.

    - Marc
    I agree, I remember Canon D30 times when I didnt have any hope for a digital camera to use my Leica M glass and I was quite happy with the rd1.

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    Re: Leica's new APS-C Interchangeable lens camera

    Quote Originally Posted by fotografz View Post
    Actually the Epson RD was the "Game Changer" wasn't it? Prior to that, Leica kept saying it wasn't possible. So, the Epson "got them into the game" so to speak.
    - Marc
    Not really, Leica started developing the M8 a couple of years before the RD1 hit the market. Development was a bit slow due to lack of funds.
    JAAP
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    Re: Leica's new APS-C Interchangeable lens camera

    Quote Originally Posted by fotografz View Post
    Actually the Epson RD was the "Game Changer" wasn't it? Prior to that, Leica kept saying it wasn't possible. So, the Epson "got them into the game" so to speak.

    If he M8 were fully supported for repairs, I'd seriously look at one as back-up to my M Monochrome the B&W conversions from that camera are really quite special IMO.

    - Marc
    Marc, this is correct.

    Best.

    p.s. when I think of Leica, I tend to forget there are other cameras too!!
    koffee & kamera
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    Re: Leica's new APS-C Interchangeable lens camera

    Quote Originally Posted by jaapv View Post
    Not really, Leica started developing the M8 a couple of years before the RD1 hit the market. Development was a bit slow due to lack of funds.
    Let's not get into an argument like that between Newton and Leibniz.

    Take care.
    koffee & kamera
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    Re: Leica's new APS-C Interchangeable lens camera

    Quote Originally Posted by rayyan View Post
    Let's not get into an argument like that between Newton and Leibniz.

    Take care.
    Hi There - the Epson was announced on March 11th 2004 (if we can believe dPreview). The Leica M8 in September 2006.

    Hard to gather the exact truth of these matters . . . . but if anyone would know, then it would be Jaap.

    For me it's enough to know that Epson announced their digital rangefinder 2.1/2 years before Leica . . . and what a lovely camera it was!

    all the best

    Just this guy you know
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    Re: Leica's new APS-C Interchangeable lens camera

    Quote Originally Posted by jonoslack View Post
    Hi There - the Epson was announced on March 11th 2004 (if we can believe dPreview). The Leica M8 in September 2006.

    Hard to gather the exact truth of these matters . . . . but if anyone would know, then it would be Jaap.

    For me it's enough to know that Epson announced their digital rangefinder 2.1/2 years before Leica . . . and what a lovely camera it was!

    all the best
    Correct in what you state Jono.

    Regards.

    p.s never owned the Epson RD1. Did buy Seiko watches though.
    koffee & kamera
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    Re: Leica's new APS-C Interchangeable lens camera

    All sorts of updates to report. "T" for Touchscreen, Visoflex EVF w/GPS, specs and pics of the (two) new T lenses, and the M adapter will support 6-bit coding (for in-camera corrections).

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