Site Sponsors
Results 1 to 13 of 13

Thread: Nocti or 75 lux? As well, 21 or 24 lux?

  1. #1
    Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Australia
    Posts
    198
    Post Thanks / Like

    Nocti or 75 lux? As well, 21 or 24 lux?

    Hi everyone,

    Need a little help here...nothing financial, just opinions will suffice !!!

    I've been thinking about getting back into the M system... I was planning to "upgrade" to M240 at some stage recently (pardon me, M9-afficionados), but saw an opportunity to part exchange my gear for the S(006) and went ahead. Now with the recently introduced Australian budget, opportunity knocks again, what with all this coinciding with my plans to get a new website, possibly a gallery space and hire a couple of staff.

    Getting to the crux, I would like to start with a 2-3 lens kit for the M240 (which I will likely buy next week). I use the M6+35v4 cron for film addiction, and my eventual kit will also be including the M246.

    What are your preferences in relation to:

    1. 75 lux vs 0.95 nocti
    2. 21 lux vs 24 lux

    FWIW, my landscapes are taken care of by the S006 + 30-90 combo (- see the recent short review I posted on getdpi).
    The M kit will be used for street, city-architecture, casual, family outings, dinners and indoor shoots, hence my predilection towards wide-open lenses. For eg, I sold the 21SEM when it became superfluous after I indulged in the S30-90.

    Thanks in advance !!
    Last edited by satybhat; 14th May 2015 at 23:33.

  2. #2
    Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Kihei, Maui
    Posts
    103
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Nocti or 75 lux? As well, 21 or 24 lux?

    I have both the 75 lux and Noctilux ASPH and love them both. I recommend to get them both but if only one for now, then the 75 lux. I don't use it often but when I have a need for this lens, it is like none other. Just be aware to allocate budget and time to get this lens focus adjusted. I had DAG adjust mine to be totally accurate.
    Thanks 1 Member(s) thanked for this post

  3. #3
    Workshop Member glenerrolrd's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Jupiter FL/Atlanta GA
    Posts
    2,279
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Nocti or 75 lux? As well, 21 or 24 lux?

    75LUX or 50 NOCT......neither both are too large and heavy for comfortable walking around lenses . Preferred would be the 50/1.4 LUX or the 50 APO or the 75/2 sum micron. A big part of using a Leica M is the CRF and the feel and handling of a precision camera . Size and balance is important .

    Aesthetics ...the 75LUX is (I believe ) a Mandler design ..it produces a beautiful bokeh wide open and is prized for its medium macro contrast yet excellent micro contrast and resolution. It is an excellent portrait lens . The 50/0.95 is a modern design....still has excellent bokeh but also is a terrific all around lens as you stop down . IQ in technical terms is much better with the new NOCT but many still praise the 75 LUX for its beauty . Both are very difficult to focus wide open do to razor thin depth of field . They require careful calibration and superb technique to get the best out of them . Most users report that “ it seemed like a great idea ...but I don t use my 50 NOCT as much as I planned “.

    Doesn t mean you should t try one or the other . If I had to pick I would go with the 50 NOCT as it has broader potential usage under a variety of situations .

    21LUX/24LUX.....this one is easier . The 24LUX is smaller and better balanced . It had a field of view that is easier on the street to utilize and compliments the 50 as a two lens set . Both lenses were designed together and produce a similar “modern” aesthetic . The 21 has slightly better IQ but both are terrific lenses. The 21 FOV is however more difficult to manage distortion and adds to the complexity of composition when street shooting .

    I frequently use the 24/1.4 and the 35/1.4 on separate M bodies and that would be my favorite setup for a large city ...Paris,NYC etc. Waiting impatiently for the new 28/1.4(not released yet but overdue) as the 28/1.4 and the 50/1.4 would be my preferred set for street shooting .

    The only caution ....handling ,FOV,speed and aesthetic (look) are the major considerations . Subject ,light and location differ by “what you shoot” .....in Maui for example I would expect that you need less speed and maybe a tighter field of view . I could see a 35/1.4 and 75/2 as a possible combination .
    Roger Dunham
    http://rogerdunham.com/
    Thanks 1 Member(s) thanked for this post
    Likes 5 Member(s) liked this post

  4. #4
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Posts
    2,058
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    1

    Re: Nocti or 75 lux? As well, 21 or 24 lux?

    Listen to Roger, he knows what he is talking about and can usually back up his comments with real world usage.

    I for one go for the small is better on the M approach. I recently sold my Noctis (1.0 & 0.95) and 75 lux in favor of keeping my APO50 and 75/2. On the other hand I found the light and small macro 90 just not my cup of tea and decided to keep my Elmarit-M 90/2.8 and also sold my excellent 90/2.0.

    As for wide, this for me depends on what and where I shoot. Keeping with the small form factor idea I now have the 28/2.8 and love the results. I like it so much I sold my 28/2.0 and for now have decided to forego the 28/1.4 unless Roger can convince me otherwise in the field.

    I sold both my 24 (1.4 and 3.4) as they just were not FL that I went for first or second. I have kept the SEM 21 in an effort to keep weight and size down when I feel I need it (like on longer international trips), but also kept the 21/1.4 for use in very low light levels and will use it with the new M246 once it arrives as well as the M-P.

    No matter where I go I would never travel without the APO50 and 35/1.4 so going either longer or wider than those two lenses becomes a personal choice mostly based on venue.
    Thanks 1 Member(s) thanked for this post
    Likes 3 Member(s) liked this post

  5. #5
    Super Duper
    Senior Member

    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Germany
    Posts
    3,623
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Nocti or 75 lux? As well, 21 or 24 lux?

    I prefer the 50 APO over the Noctilux (because I found the Nocti too big an dheavy on the M) and I prefer the 75APO over the 75/1.4.(Because I found the 75/1.4 to show slight focus shifting when stopping down).
    I also feel the "pop" of the more modern lenses works quite well with the new M.
    If I had to choose between the 75/1.4 and 50 Nocti I would prefer the Nocti. Because IMO 35 and50mm are the focal lengths which work best with the Leica M finder.
    Thats also the reason why my most used fast lens is the 35/1.4FLE.

    Regarding 21 vs 24 mm Summiluxes - I once had a 24/1.4 and its a great lens.
    I once also had a 21/1.4 for some time but gave it back, my sample didnt seem to deliver the quality I did expect.
    Now I use the 21 SEM, because I dont need it often and if I need it, I usually dont need f1.4 in my UWA-lens.

    These days I really enjoy the smaller lenses on the M, and I do 80% of my shots with 35 and 50mm, even though I also own 21,28,75,90,135 lenses.

    Tom
    Thanks 1 Member(s) thanked for this post
    Likes 2 Member(s) liked this post

  6. #6
    Super Duper
    Senior Member
    jonoslack's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    East Anglia & Cornwall (UK)
    Posts
    11,778
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    1

    Re: Nocti or 75 lux? As well, 21 or 24 lux?

    Such good advice
    I really agree with Algrove and Paratom here.

    I've been lent a 75 summilux, and I have a Noctilux 50 'lux Asph 28 'lux and I've had the 24 'lux (but not the 21).

    In the end, even with the 0.95 Nocti - but especially with the 75 'lux I end up shooting at f1.4 or f2 respectively (because of the teeny dof and not wanting to get it wrong) . .. in which case I might as well be using the 50 'lux and the 75 'cron . . which is what I mostly do. They're smaller, with floating elements (no focus shift)

    the 24 'lux was lovely - but for me 24mm is an 'opportunist' lens, and it was too heavy to carry with me on the off chance it would get used. . . so I didn't carry it, and it didn't get used. I sold it, and got the 24mm elmar . . but found that soft corners spoiled the otherwise excellent results. Now I don't have a 24

    28 is much more complicated - for me it's an important primary lens - I started with the 28 elmarit Asph . . . realised that I used it so much I ought to go for the 'better' 28 'cron . . . but I never really loved it. These days I have the 28 'lux (which is quite big but really lovely) and the 28 elmarit Asph (which is brutally sharp and tiny for travelling).

    I'm not sure that this rambling is very helpful - suffice to say that if someone told me I must limit myself to 3 lenses I would have
    28 'lux Asph
    50 'lux Asph
    75 'cron APO

    Just this guy you know
    Thanks 1 Member(s) thanked for this post
    Likes 3 Member(s) liked this post

  7. #7
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Posts
    422
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Nocti or 75 lux? As well, 21 or 24 lux?

    35 lux asph + 75 cron are my one, two choices

    28 cron + 50 lux if I need to work closer

    Cannot reliably focus the 75 lux wide open, have tried two copies without success. No noct experience.
    --Mike

    My Flickr
    Likes 1 Member(s) liked this post

  8. #8
    Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2014
    Posts
    29
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Nocti or 75 lux? As well, 21 or 24 lux?

    Don't overlook the f/1.0 Noctilux - it too is a Mandler design and is an outstanding performer. It is also lighter than the 0.95 Noctilux, but is still big and bulky compared to most other M lenses.

    A good M kit for your stated purposes - street, city-architecture, casual, family outings, dinners and indoor shoots - would be a 28 and/or 35, a 50 and a 75 or 90. To be honest, a 28 and a 50 will cover the vast majority of shooting situations.

    If the Noctilux is too big and heavy, look at the Mandler design 50 Summicrons and 50 Summiluxes - the last non-ASPH version of the 50 Summilux in particular.

    "It is an illusion that photos are made with the camera… they are made with the eye, heart and head." - Henri Cartier-Bresson
    Likes 2 Member(s) liked this post

  9. #9
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Posts
    590
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Nocti or 75 lux? As well, 21 or 24 lux?

    If I had just the choices you mention I would take the nocti and the 24 Lux, neither of which I own LOL.

    I do have a perfect 75 Lux which I shoot often.

    My thinking? the .95 is unbelievable. I see incredible shots with this lens. It's modern so likely will be good out of the box. As noted for the 75 lux, this is not likely.

    For the wides, I choose the 24 simply because it's an easier lens to frame on the street and well anywhere.
    Likes 1 Member(s) liked this post

  10. #10
    Super Duper
    Senior Member

    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Royal Oak, MI and Palm Harbor, FL
    Posts
    8,498
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    44

    Re: Nocti or 75 lux? As well, 21 or 24 lux?

    50 Nocti or 75 Lux? Neither. Too fussy to keep accurate. The 50/1/4 ASPH is the perfect balance of size/speed, and the bokeh provides more of the OOF qualities of the Mandler lenses but more acuity in the in-focus areas.

    21/1.4 or 24/1.4? I had both for a while and kept the 21. The 24mm was just to close to the 28mm and found the focal length to be a bit of an odd-duck … either not wide enough, or too wide for people work. The 21/1.4 is a unique lens and I've enjoyed it a lot … love to do interiors of landmarks and churches with it.

    So … 21, 28, 35, 50, 75, 90 is my line-up … 21/1.4 and 35/1.4 are my most used M lenses.

    - Marc

  11. #11
    Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Australia
    Posts
    198
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Nocti or 75 lux? As well, 21 or 24 lux?

    Thanks for the august replies..
    So, on this whole Mandler thing, I happen to be a bit waylaid on the rendering issue. Clinical / non-clinical etc makes no difference to me (crosses heart: I am a physician !!), but I am interested in some intentional spherical aberration if I can get it at a reasonable price.....
    Does any one know of any comparative review of something like say a 35 v4 cron vs asph on same subjects ? or say a 75 cron vs 75 lux at f2?
    Ashwin Rao seems convinced, for eg... : so what would be your two definitive desert-island-Mandler-aberrated lenses?
    Or is it all a hype and fad?

  12. #12
    Super Duper
    Senior Member

    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Royal Oak, MI and Palm Harbor, FL
    Posts
    8,498
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    44

    Re: Nocti or 75 lux? As well, 21 or 24 lux?

    Quote Originally Posted by satybhat View Post
    Thanks for the august replies..
    So, on this whole Mandler thing, I happen to be a bit waylaid on the rendering issue. Clinical / non-clinical etc makes no difference to me (crosses heart: I am a physician !!), but I am interested in some intentional spherical aberration if I can get it at a reasonable price.....
    Does any one know of any comparative review of something like say a 35 v4 cron vs asph on same subjects ? or say a 75 cron vs 75 lux at f2?
    Ashwin Rao seems convinced, for eg... : so what would be your two definitive desert-island-Mandler-aberrated lenses?
    Or is it all a hype and fad?
    Can't wait to see the responses to that …

  13. #13
    Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Australia
    Posts
    198
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Nocti or 75 lux? As well, 21 or 24 lux?

    Hold on..... the thread topic is misguiding.... I should move this discussion to another thread.

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •