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Thread: An open letter to Leica (2015)...please share your own thoughts

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    An open letter to Leica (2015)...please share your own thoughts

    I desperately want Leica to release great products, and.......I think that the time is here. The Leica M246 Monochrom is fantastic. It sits on par with or supersedes the original in most key ways, and I can't wait to get my own in hopefully a short time (first on the list at my local Leica store).

    As Jono has already shown, and I have experienced, the now available Leica 28 mm f/1.4 Summilux Aspherical may well be the best 28 available, as long as you are okay with the lens' size. Having shot a production model recently, I can say that it's a joy to use, and it has edge-to-edge sharpness, a lovely rendering reminiscent of the 35 FLE, at a cost that's below what most had predicted (albeit still quite a hefty price of entry). One could imagine a 50 mm f/1.4 Summilux APO Asph or an updated 75 mm f/1.4 Summilux Asph as "next up" in the Peter Karbe lens party.

    Then, there's the lovely D-Lux, Albeit a rebadged Panny, that many of my friends seem to adore. While it's not for me, it's certainly for many like me.

    And now, coming June 10th, Leica appears to be set to release the Leica Q, which if properly implemented with responsive AF, great optics, and a user friendly layout, might just be the ultimate street shooter or Autofocus partner &second body to one's M set up.



    I can imagine that if the purported Q is successful, an interchangeable lens Q at a slightly reduced price, with the capacity to take both it's own lenses and Leica M lenses (while reading 6 bit codes) would be soon to follow. It would likely represent a a higher priced, yet better matched companion for those who would hope to use their M lenses on a body capable of focus peaking, while handling some of the corrections nessary for M lens utility. Pair that camera with an M9/240/or whatever color M comes next, and you really have a great option for most people in the Leica world, as well as for those looking to enter at the "relevant" price point.

    I am not sure where Leica was quite going with the T system, and I imagine that some of the C's, V's, X's and other in sundry cameras may hang around, but my guess is that many of these experiments and legacies will fade with time.

    Though I have never really left Leica, I have enjoyed forays into Fuji and Sony systems, and I imagine that many others have as well. Might we see some old friends return, with innovative products at hand or soon to come?

    One would hope

    Please share your own thoughts, ruminations, excitements, and frustrations.
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    Re: An open letter to Leica (2015)...please share your own thoughts

    My concerns are:

    1. Stop making faulty cameras.
    2. They are really not worth their price- understand this and accept it as the reality or become irrelevant since more versatile products are on the market.

    I am sure there will be a few die hards who would challenge these thoughts but they are a very small bunch with declining numbers.
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    Re: An open letter to Leica (2015)...please share your own thoughts

    I too will be curious how Leica responds to pricing structures. I would say that Leica has and will always view itself as a luxury product (akin to high end watch makers), and will price their products accordingly. However, pricing their products at exhorbitant levels in the digital era faces the consumer with a choice of considering luxury (and the RF experience of course) against much cheaper "competitiors" (not really, given the price difference) with similar or superior sensor technology and optically excellent lenses (I am thinking Sony, Fuji, and Olympus, given similar size/utilizaiton).

    I am not sure that Leica intends to compete, but rather to protect and develop its own space. I would argue that many here, myself included, have chosen to try other brands at lower price points, because the cost was so high to reboot at the latest product cycle release (which appears to be every 3-4 years for Leica). I for one would have a hard time justifying replacing a $7000 camera every 3 years, knowning that my old camera has lost half or more of its original value over that 3 year window. To me, brand loyalty would involving making products that are in fact superior in build, operation, and reliability, using high end supplies, excellent manufacturing strategies, and great customer service....and of course pricing products farirly... After all, if one pays for the price of entry, shouldn't one expect luxury service?
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    Re: An open letter to Leica (2015)...please share your own thoughts

    The price-to-value ratio matters to me. I'm coming around to the idea that Fuji's X-series has sufficient image quality, form/fun factor, and broader range of use for what I shoot that I may migrate away from Leica. The newest, greatest thing from Leica doesn't much matter for my photography, which is modest and served well by other mirrorless gear. I think that if I were printing quite large and wanted to shoot small format cameras for this output - and everything I shot could be captured well in focal lengths from about 18 to 90mm - then I'd continue to invest in cameras like the M246. But that's not what I do these days, so Leica for me is starting to feel like an affectation rather than a clear means to my photographic ends. Leica is always going to be a luxury-priced system, even the M-E and the M-Summarits are pretty pricey.

    I don't know ... maybe I'm just turned-off by the gear hyperbole, and getting cranky.

    More on topic: there's nothing I'd ask Leica to do differently since the M240, I believe it addressed deficiencies in the M8/9 bodies: reasonable weather-proofing, higher iso performance, write/buffer speed, shutter noise/feel. I'm not interested in X/T/other variations. It's the M lenses and form factor of the bodies that hold my interest. A few mm or grams here or there, adding or losing a feature or two, don't matter to me. Re service, no complaints. For a small company it's good enough, not pro level, but committed and fair and sufficient for my needs.
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    Re: An open letter to Leica (2015)...please share your own thoughts

    For all I know, today's Leica may be exactly where needs to be in order to survive in a changed marketplace, nevertheless here are a few of my thoughts:

    Reselling one's out-of-warranty digital M body is a royal pain because buyers live in fear of something breaking in an expensive, even unfixable way. New Leica products (at least as of a few years ago) were still too likely to need at least one trip back to the mothership for some sort of adjustment.

    What could they do? How's about a sub-$400 factory recertification program including transferrable worldwide warranty? Who cares if they even remove the top cover; the real value is in the new warranty. Do some basic detailing, seal it in a branded baggie and it's as good as (re)sold. For Leica: $Profit!

    But what's really changed over the past several years isn't Leica, the marketplace or anything else, it's me! I've finally begun to really believe that the je ne sais quoi I sought in my choice of camera and hifi gear was really a state of mind rather than some quality of the hardware. And that maybe, just maybe, I've been working too long to make money I don't really need in order to buy things that don't really matter. (But not to worry, I'll still be drooling over new toys for awhile longer).
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    Re: An open letter to Leica (2015)...please share your own thoughts

    I am happy with my M-P 240 (upgrade offer from M9) and a new Monochrom (original version) that I picked up a few weeks ago at a fantastic price (not much more than what people are asking for them used).

    I love the rangefinder camera experience and both purchases were in my eyes great buys.

    Not interested in the D-Lux, V-Lux, X's, X-E, T, C or the Q. Perhaps in few more years the full frame autofocus may be more desireable as the aging process continues and the eyesight diminishes but not at this moment in time.

    I am happy with my current M & LTM lenses that I currently use with my film and digital M cameras.

    I looked at the Sony but did not like the electronic finder at all. I was not interested in the Fuji since I already had another APS-C format camera and lenses set up.

    Leica has been putting out a lot of product and hopefully they are selling it all. It appears they have been offering a lot of discounts on the M, M-P, original Monochrom and their current 12% discount on lenses through June 30.

    In the classified sections lately a lot of used lenses are selling for great prices, for the buyer that is. I do not have an interest in the new 50 APO Cron, 28 LUX, or the other high priced lenses that Leica may be planning to release, but hopefully a lot of you other folks will line up and purchase them all. At the same time I am happy to see Leica release the new 2.4 line of lenses, great quality with pricing that a lot of folks can afford.

    Love to see Leica have a successful strategy and keep on producing great products for years to come.

    If I had a suggestion or perhaps a wish it would be that they offer fewer product lines and concentrate the R&D and and quality on the products they do offer.
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    Re: An open letter to Leica (2015)...please share your own thoughts

    I equate the Leica Q to the Sony RX1: an experiment to test the waters for a full-frame mirrorless camera system. If the Q does reasonably well (by Leica standards), then the interchangeable Q will soon follow. And with it the Q-mount (likely a full-frame version of the T-mount). Remember, the Q will not provide a rangefinder experience: mirrorless cameras provide an SLR experience via electronic viewfinder.

    As I stated in the first thread about this camera, if Leica plays their cards right this can become the their new bread-and-butter camera system. Priced right (target Lexus class consumers, not Lamborghini ones), with the right features (weather sealing, fast accurate AF, outstanding IQ, great high ISO) and an ecosystem of accessories that matters (battery grips, nice stable of lenses, lens adapters for M and others, flash for those that want it, and others I can't think of right now), Leica can reclaim their crown as the go-to camera for photojournalists, street photographers, and the knowledgeable.

    Am I dreaming? Maybe, but if we don't dream, then we don't innovate.
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    Re: An open letter to Leica (2015)...please share your own thoughts

    Frienkly I think allready the M8 was a great camera after the IR problem had been analyses and solved (I never had a prblem to use those filters). The M9 was even better and the current M is very good as well (even though a little on the heavy side).
    What I am not sure is how many people really like to spend 6k for a 28mm lens or 7k for a b&w camera.(Also after the current M body is more toward the end of its product life cycle).
    I have to say the strategy to offer f1.4 expensive lenses and f2.8-3.8 smaller sized lower priced lenses is ok, but I would prefer if they just offered an improved 21/24 Elmarit and an improved 28mm Summicron instead for a medium price.

    The T ... I find its better than many believe, and I really hope they will not give up on it. Give us an improved body, with more responsivness and some weather protection. The lenses are a very nice size / price/weight ration. I am afraif a FF system could become quite heavy and expensive.

    I am afraid that I miss a little a clear strategy in Leicas new products. It seems they present one thing after the other and you dont know what happens next.

    On the other side I love what IQ (specially color and transition) I can get with the S system, I seem to prefer the IQ I can achieve with the M system over many other systems (including Sony A7II which I still own), but I really hope Leica will be able to come back to a clearer product strategy.
    For example the chance what be much higher that I bough a new b&w M if they presented a new M body, slightly slimmer in 2016 and then offered it in color and in b&w version.
    Much nicer than buying upgrading my "old" MM with the current new MM 246, and then in 2016 Leica will present a slimmer and better color M body in 2016. And we have to wait till 2018 until we can buy a b& W version...
    It seems like getting profit from a cow which is not spending enough milk anymore.
    IMO the Summarits were the best product they have presented lately. If I didnt have other lenses allready I would probably just buy Summarits and safe the money for more expensive lenses.
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    Re: An open letter to Leica (2015)...please share your own thoughts

    That the new lux 28 is better than the previous one, should come as no surprise.
    That each M after the M8 was better than the previous one, too, should not be earth shattering.

    But what is, to me, is the never ending testers, testing and informing the plebes that the new such and such is better. Heck for that price, and coming from Leica,
    Why should it come as a surprise. Just pure and simple technology progressing and a new product introduced. And fuel the consumer.

    The important point, for me, remains the use of the Leica M for the rangefinder experience, and the use of the M lenses. I honestly have not tried and neither have the desire to try each iteration of the M. The M8 far exceeds my meager capabilities. Better the new ones maybe, but what do they offer me that I cannot
    do with my M8...besides bragging rights.

    So with the different Leica new mounts. Some enjoy the experience of af in the new Leica offerings. But that is not Leica for me. There are far better choices for an af system...sans the red dot.

    What I need is a lighter M mount rangefinder incorporating latest sensor technologies, a higher ISO at a competitive price.

    For me Leica is a rangefinder system. It has a superb stable of wonderful lenses.
    I do not need anything else from Leica..except sensible pricing.
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    Re: An open letter to Leica (2015)...please share your own thoughts

    Take the M240. Replace the mechanical RF with an electronic one, make the body 2mm thinner, 200 grams lighter, add a thumb grip, put the Sony 24MP FF sensor sans AA filter into it, make it $2000 cheaper, get rid of the movie mode. Where is the pre-order button?
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    Re: An open letter to Leica (2015)...please share your own thoughts

    Quote Originally Posted by Vivek View Post
    My concerns are:

    1. Stop making faulty cameras.
    Yes, this is my concern too. Of the last 5 M system bodies I have bought, 4 have been or become seriously faulty – an 80% failure rate! The latest is my M-A (bought last autumn) which has an ongoing, yet intermittent, light leak problem. So much for the "Pure Mechanical Excellence" strapline that that they use to advertise this camera. Leica no longer have the ability to repair anything in a reasonable time (and have largely conceded as much to me) and are going to replace the camera. Wetzlar still have my 28 Summicron after a couple of months and one failed attempt to adjust it (Leica UK customer care adjudged the first attempt to be a failure – I didn't even see the lens). For the average punter (as opposed to the favoured sons who blog, etc.) the service at Wetzlar is a total disgrace. IMO Leica would do well to stop making anything new until they have got this side of things straight because, without adequate long term service support, the products aren't worth a candle.
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    Re: An open letter to Leica (2015)...please share your own thoughts

    I only hope Leica the best with the Q series, even if its not my cup of tea - I hope they sell a boat load so they are able to continue making mechanical rangefinders in the future. I only have a film M (M2), and have owned a A7 and used some M mount glass on it. I didn't really enjoy that experience at all and realized that if I want to manual focus I want a rangefinder. Everyone is different I understand that, and having all these choices only puts pressure on manufactures to continue to innovate and make products better. I can only dream of a digital M at this point, but someday I hope to own a M-P (or whatever the current model is) and I hope it still somewhat resembles my M2 - I for one don't really want a Fuji hybrid lookalike...
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    Re: An open letter to Leica (2015)...please share your own thoughts

    I came late to Leica, starting with digital: Digilux2, M8, M9. I loved them all. But as newer digital systems became available, and Leica's commitment to luxury branding seemed to deepen, I moved on. I felt that, as a digital solution, Leica would become a very costly long-term partnership. The value is just not there for me, given all the other options. If I were a film shooter, however, I would have no problem buying a new M7 or M-A, knowing the value actually would be there for many years to come.

    I would like Leica to know that I don't mind paying a premium for their digital products because I admire their design philosophy so much. But digital cameras have become commodity products and their pricing needs to better reflect with that fact. At least if they care about the serious hobbyist market that I think I represent.

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    Re: An open letter to Leica (2015)...please share your own thoughts

    My letter to Leica would implore them to get the simple stuff right.

    I'm prepared to pay a premium for their wonderful lenses and for their beautifully made rangefinder cameras; that's the difficult stuff. But I'm incensed when expected to pay a premium for the same camera with a toy EVF, a camera that lacks scrolling liveview and a camera with a selection of format frame lines and yet no grid screen. Come on Leica, that's the simple stuff that most camera manufacturers have been offering for years and at a fraction of the cost of a Leica.

    Pretty please.

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    Re: An open letter to Leica (2015)...please share your own thoughts

    My main concern is not variety, but quality and price.
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    Re: An open letter to Leica (2015)...please share your own thoughts

    This Q body is EXACTLY the body, I've been asking for for the last few years. The ONLY difference is that I didn't want it to be a fixed lens. I wanted Leica to take their M designs (summicrons if need be) and to turn them into AF lenses very similar to the Q lens (clicks into AF mode, but unclick it and the focus is mechanical. Also aperture ring is a must). That would be ideal, I could even do away with the Macro switch, unless Leica could build it into the camera body so all lenses had slight Macro mode (wouldn't that be fun).

    I'd own a few of these, and still keep a few M-P240s or whatever replaces them.

    The two things that I need to be ergonomically smart are the shutter speeds (dial on top), and aperture (ring on lens). The ISO should be directly accessible as well. And I love the styling of the M, the shape is awesome. In fact, the Q looks awesome, to bad it's a fixed lens.


    I'd actually pay $5k for the body. If it didn't come with a lens, but had solid electronics, advanced EVF (at least A7 lvl) and quick non jittery AF (A7 focus hunts and racks a lot, it's jittery, Leica should do better). I'd also pay M prices for AF lenses (obviously it would need lenses).

    I think the S-system although amazing, suffers from it's slower AF speed (those lenses are huge, a lot of elements to push around, and it's already faster then the other medium format cameras I've owned/used). You know, I do have to give Leica credit for it's S-system AF though. It's dead-on accurate, and rarely hunts. It's slow, but it marches to the point of focus then stops sharp. To bad about the lenses AF going sour all the time.

    The last and final thing about Leica is their repair times, and customer service policies. It's ridiculous that I have to fight with them over faster turn around times on professional gear (M-system). And even more ridiculous that I have to fight with them on turn around times for the S-system (especially with my loaner swap warranty nonsense which BTW doesn't include lenses WTF?). And S-lenses have 1y warranty but they're twice as much as M lenses?! And I suppose twice as fragile, as "impact damage" is a term Leica's customer service likes to use to try and make you pay for their faulty lenses.

    The short:
    1) EVF M inspired body (main dials the same, body can be smaller, no RF is fine, Xpro1 idea would be cool though, or ContaxG2 style even)
    2) Good AF (like the S-system, but without faulty lenses etc, and faster)
    3) Top of the line EVF, none of this old tech nonsense like in the M240
    4) Convert Summicron lenses to AF (Summilux to follow)
    5) Make the body expensive like a 1Dx I don't care, make the lenses as expensive as M lenses, profit off of me. BUT make sure the product is solid, can compete with the best of them, and repair times are quick! I don't mind paying a premium for the lens designs, and ergonomic body as long as I have a modern system.
    6) Keep making electronic updates to the M240 architecture, keep the core principles the same. The size, weight, RF mechanism, all great for people who want it (myself included).
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    Re: An open letter to Leica (2015)...please share your own thoughts

    Let's say you owned Leica and had the resources to do pretty much anything with the company. Would you want to use the very best modern processes and materials to achieve the closest tolerances and greatest consistency & reliability?

    (I assume you answered with an enthusiastic "Yes")

    Now what do you say if it turns out that milling parts one at a time out of blocks of brass and aluminum is simply inconsistent with those goals, and that the real way forward is to invest in precision-casting technologies, and that among other things lens barrels will henceforth be made of some sort of mineral-filled acrylic not unlike that used by everyone else--would you accept that?

    Just a hunch that something of the sort is in fact the case, and that a truly state of the art Leica lens might have a core of mineral-filled acrylic, with cosmetic exterior shell of attractive metal not unlike the Sony/Zeiss glass. Leica experimented with composites years ago, and maybe it's time for them to bring themselves back up to date.

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    Re: An open letter to Leica (2015)...please share your own thoughts

    I recently purchased an M-P. I've had M8 & M9P and still have an M8.2, although I probably should sell it. All have been stellar cameras. I hope the M-P is my last Leica. It does everything I want from a rangefinder and then some. If I had my druthers, I'd want the latest iteration to be the same size as my old film rangefinders - I always loved the form & function of the M3 & 4. I suppose the M-P is a bit like me, getting older and putting on the odd pound or two. I still want to think of myself and my Leica as svelte and able to leap tall buildings in a single bound. Oh, well, they are still much fun to shoot and probably contribute quite a lot to my on-going joy of photography.
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    Re: An open letter to Leica (2015)...please share your own thoughts

    I love Rangefinders but how about innovating the Rangefinder mechanisms itself? A digital rangefinder would be interesting along with the ability the reposition the rangefinder patch to other areas of the frame (or anywhere in the frame).

    Speaking of that, any future Leica with Live View should have the ability to move anywhere in the frame not just the center portion. Critical focus becomes less meaningful when we are still forced to focus and recompose if we don't want our subject dead center. Another benefit would be in camera Image Stabilization. Sony has proven that it's possible to do with manual focus lenses. I think Leica should add this even to their rangefinders. It's certainly possible even if the shutter has to be an electronic based shutter.

    Keep innovating but remember why we love Leica to begin with.

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    Re: An open letter to Leica (2015)...please share your own thoughts

    Ashwin,
    I have always believed that errors happen, Leica is no exception to that. What is the most important thing is how you deal with the error. Leica has proven to be a loyal partner in dealing with mistakes, M8 IR, free filters, M9 cracked sensors, repaired even outside of warranty. The latest, corrosion of the M9 sensor, which they have agreed to remedy outside of warranty for every camera regardless of ownership. That to me says a lot about the company and the old adage "you get what you paid for".

    New products such as the rumored Q intrigue me more than a new M240 or 246 as I enjoy having a compact, high quality camera that I can carry on vacation with my wife. While she does put up with my need to record life around me on our vacations, I want the equipment to be light and not the sole purpose of our trip. I have enjoyed my X1 and now X2 on vacations without "wanting or wishing" that I brought the M9 and a brace of lenses on many a journey. My X2 goes with me on bike rides as the dangling weight does not interfere my movement and crash into the handlebars. It can be shielded from the elements by tucking it in my jacket easily.
    I have shot with the new 28 'Lux and it is nice, but for me, I will keep shooting with the 28 'Cron. I think for the time being, my M lineup is safe from trades and upgrade. But never say never!
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    Re: An open letter to Leica (2015)...please share your own thoughts

    Quote Originally Posted by animefx View Post
    I love Rangefinders but how about innovating the Rangefinder mechanisms itself? A digital rangefinder would be interesting along with the ability the reposition the rangefinder patch to other areas of the frame (or anywhere in the frame).

    Speaking of that, any future Leica with Live View should have the ability to move anywhere in the frame not just the center portion. Critical focus becomes less meaningful when we are still forced to focus and recompose if we don't want our subject dead center. Another benefit would be in camera Image Stabilization. Sony has proven that it's possible to do with manual focus lenses. I think Leica should add this even to their rangefinders. It's certainly possible even if the shutter has to be an electronic based shutter.

    Keep innovating but remember why we love Leica to begin with.
    There is a company called Konost which is doing just that: a digital rangefinder.

    http://www.echenique.com/2015/03/03/...amera-in-2016/
    Carlos Echenique | Carlos Echenique Photography |Olympus OM-D E-M1 MK II | Olympus Pen-F - M.Zuiko 17mm f/1.8, M.Zuiko 25mm f/1.8, M.Zuiko 45mm f/1.8, Rokinon 12mm f/2 NCS, M.Zuiko 75mm f/1.8, M.Zuiko 12-40mm f/2.8 PRO, M.Zuiko 40-150mm f/2.8 PRO

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    Re: An open letter to Leica (2015)...please share your own thoughts

    If the Q rumors are true about it being a fixed lens full frame camera, how much should we pay for that? I would say no more than $2500. If that's the price point, Leica wouldn't be able to make them fast enough.
    Brad Husick

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    Re: An open letter to Leica (2015)...please share your own thoughts

    I would only say one thing. Support your customers. That means to follow through with the new cover glass for the CCD sensor corrosion issue. It means making sure you can support the product with spare parts for at least 10 years. It means keep the small, light, slow and affordable lens line current alongside the impressive, fast and fancy stuff.

    The M-E was the perfect product for 2012, and a stripped M-E (Typ 240) is needed today. Something just enough less expensive that those who entered on the used market can aspire to buy new.

    Finally, listen to us, the customers, as I believe you have been doing. The X (Typ 113) was a direct result of what we said on the launch of the X Vario, which itself was a response to what we said on the launch of the X2. The same goes for the improvements to the Summarit line, which were always great lenses, but now are marketed that way.
    "A fella, A quick fella, might have a weapon under there. I'd have to pin his head to the panel." The Gyro Captain

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    Re: An open letter to Leica (2015)...please share your own thoughts

    I've finally gotten to a comfortable place in my photography, and the same can be said for my gear. I've decided to "opt out" of the current (M240) and probably next upgrade cycle and added a brand-new M-E to my 2-year-old M Monochrom. I've also kept it simple with two modern lenses, both small, light and not the fastest (35mm f/2.5 Summarit and 50mm f/2 Summicron non-APO). Yes, the new gear is probably better, but what I have is far better than anything available a decade ago, and there were plenty of photographers back then much better than I am today.
    "A fella, A quick fella, might have a weapon under there. I'd have to pin his head to the panel." The Gyro Captain
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    Re: An open letter to Leica (2015)...please share your own thoughts

    Great comments from everyone. I do feel that Leica does a reasonable job supporting their products, albeit that it takes some time for them to turn over equipment that we want back (having paid quite a bit for it).

    Brad, I suspect that the Q will be close to double the price...though I am hoping for under $4K. I'd consider strongly it for $3,500, but more would give me substantial pause....
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    Re: An open letter to Leica (2015)...please share your own thoughts

    I would hope that they keep the price point closer to $3500, X with the 23 f1.7 is $2000, next step would be the ME at $5000. Much higher than that and it will be a tough sell. I was almost all in for the X but the Q is intriguing.
    Al Tanabe my website https://www.altanabe.com

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    Re: An open letter to Leica (2015)...please share your own thoughts

    I'm not sure what the point of this "open letter to Leica" might be. Seems to me that, so far, it's been folks expressing what they personally would prefer Leica to make or do for them.

    If I were to address Leica as a corporate entity, I'd first thank them for the forty-five plus years I've had enjoying the use of the equipment they make as well as the excellent, personal service that their U.S. Distributor has provided me. I'd thank them for the outstanding and unusual service—I know of no other camera manufacturer whose service department would have given my 1964 Summicron-R 50mm lens a full CLA as well as a mount upgrade to allow full use on a later model body, itself discontinued since 1973 or so. I would praise their conservative development program and the way they have focused on the essentials that matter to my photography as much as their willingness to innovate with new control paradigms like the touch screen based UI of the T model. I would also praise their handling of the M9 sensor corrosion situation; after all, stuff like that happens now and then, and so far they've done as good a job of taking care of me and all the rest of their customers as I can imagine any company could when presented with such a devastating and unforeseen problem.

    If I had any advice to offer them, it would be to keep sticking to the things they've done well, keep the innovation moving, and do their best to keep pricing in check without sacrificing quality and service. They've done an excellent job of making equipment that does what I want, the way I want it to, and of staying relevant (to my photography, at least) in this time of turbulent change across the entire industry.

    Regards the Q, just days away seemingly, it certainly seems a fine effort from the rumored specs and design points, although I would prefer it with a 35 to 50 mm lens rather than a 28 (my personal predilection would be a 43mm lens for a fixed lens camera). A derivative or sibling model with interchangeable lenses—probably using the T mount and lenses as that automatically allows M mount lenses as well—would make good sense as a follow-on. I would not suggest abandoning the M line cameras at all, nor introducing yet another mount specification and lens line. There's certainly room in the market for the an M-like modern body as the X and X Vario have, as well as the innovation of the T body. As well as the incorporation of modern features like WiFi communication and control integration, etc.

    G
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    Re: An open letter to Leica (2015)...please share your own thoughts

    Quote Originally Posted by Godfrey View Post
    I'm not sure what the point of this "open letter to Leica" might be. Seems to me that, so far, it's been folks expressing what they personally would prefer Leica to make or do for them.

    If I were to address Leica as a corporate entity, I'd first thank them for the forty-five plus years I've had enjoying the use of the equipment they make as well as the excellent, personal service that their U.S. Distributor has provided me. I'd thank them for the outstanding and unusual service—I know of no other camera manufacturer whose service department would have given my 1964 Summicron-R 50mm lens a full CLA as well as a mount upgrade to allow full use on a later model body, itself discontinued since 1973 or so. I would praise their conservative development program and the way they have focused on the essentials that matter to my photography as much as their willingness to innovate with new control paradigms like the touch screen based UI of the T model. I would also praise their handling of the M9 sensor corrosion situation; after all, stuff like that happens now and then, and so far they've done as good a job of taking care of me and all the rest of their customers as I can imagine any company could when presented with such a devastating and unforeseen problem.

    If I had any advice to offer them, it would be to keep sticking to the things they've done well, keep the innovation moving, and do their best to keep pricing in check without sacrificing quality and service. They've done an excellent job of making equipment that does what I want, the way I want it to, and of staying relevant (to my photography, at least) in this time of turbulent change across the entire industry.

    Regards the Q, just days away seemingly, it certainly seems a fine effort from the rumored specs and design points, although I would prefer it with a 35 to 50 mm lens rather than a 28 (my personal predilection would be a 43mm lens for a fixed lens camera). A derivative or sibling model with interchangeable lenses—probably using the T mount and lenses as that automatically allows M mount lenses as well—would make good sense as a follow-on. I would not suggest abandoning the M line cameras at all, nor introducing yet another mount specification and lens line. There's certainly room in the market for the an M-like modern body as the X and X Vario have, as well as the innovation of the T body. As well as the incorporation of modern features like WiFi communication and control integration, etc.

    G
    And this is where we differ.. You use Leica for fun. I use them for business. Their customer service is inconsistent, and repair times horrible and not up to professional standards. Even with extended "premium" warranties, they let me down.

    Their service pales in comparison to Canon/Nikon/Sony. And for the price, their electronics should be better. And if their electronics continue to be "prototypes" at best, they should charge much less, period.

    The funny thing is, I really don't mind paying a premium, but I want them to deliver. You know how many e-mails I've sent Leica that said something like "I love your company. I love using your products, but I wish you would take your time, creating something more solid. Something professionals can rely on. And if/when it does break down, that you'd be quick about repairs, and would have a better system in place for loaners and repairs."

    So yeah, I can list out what I "WANT" as a product from Leica. But the core of my frustrations over the brand is that they release semi-functional prototypes into the market, and then don't offer the same level of service as other companies.
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    Re: An open letter to Leica (2015)...please share your own thoughts

    Quote Originally Posted by aDam007 View Post
    And this is where we differ.. You use Leica for fun. I use them for business. ...
    That's quite an assumption. I used them for "business" too; still do, when I take a client. They worked/work well for me.

    Sorry if the fact that I'm a satisfied customer offends you.
    If I weren't, I'd use some other vendor's equipment.

    G

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    Re: An open letter to Leica (2015)...please share your own thoughts

    If we have to list our use everytime in a thread..I am a rank amateur. Always wish to be and never get saturated, become stale and static. Also would like to have fun with photography. If there is no joy, forget it.

    But for the amateurs (not me) many of the online fora will be dead as well.

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    Re: An open letter to Leica (2015)...please share your own thoughts

    My thoughts are:

    Be careful with going overly boutique. IMHO the T system could have been a storming success, but the body is almost all wrong, from my perspective. I was seriously interested in a great quality APS-C very compact 'back to original M concept' type of T, where the investment would be less than M, but with performance great for street and documentary shooters. I understand the M and I get the S, but the T completely lost me as a concept. Please forget the original concept, reinvent it and give the lenses a body appealing to more users.

    Please do not forget that not everyone wants to pay a fortune for that extra 5% of performance. There are many other reasons why people buy into the Leica brand (utility, form factor, build quality etc) and so its great to see the Summarit-M range refreshed, but applying this approach to M bodies would be helpful. Get more bodies into the hands of more photographers and reap the benefits of economy of scale. Porsche has not done too badly out of the Boxster and Cayman.

    Please clean up quality control. Too many bodies and lenses seem to arrive in customers hands miles out of adjustment (or with other defects).

    Well done for your support on the CCD sensors. What a relief to this Monochrom owner. Had you not done this, I would have dropped Leica there and then and sold every last lens, never to return. Paying GBP 5500 for my body was a huge stretch and I have no regrets, thankfully.

    Please produce a super high resolution body (if possible) to allow your best lenses to deliver their potential. Maybe it would be financial suicide, but a M system 'S' and 'R' model (Speed and Resolution) would appeal to a lot of people. The problem with the M240 is that it isn't quite either (but to some that will be a good thing).

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    Re: An open letter to Leica (2015)...please share your own thoughts

    Quote Originally Posted by turtle View Post

    Well done for your support on the CCD sensors. What a relief to this Monochrom owner. Had you not done this, I would have dropped Leica there and then and sold every last lens, never to return. Paying GBP 5500 for my body was a huge stretch and I have no regrets, thankfully.
    +1 on that!

    Everytime an important monetary issue for a serious cause comes up, I go through that. Still can't believe how much money that cost!

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    Re: An open letter to Leica (2015)...please share your own thoughts

    Quote Originally Posted by Godfrey View Post
    That's quite an assumption. I used them for "business" too; still do, when I take a client. They worked/work well for me.

    Sorry if the fact that I'm a satisfied customer offends you.
    If I weren't, I'd use some other vendor's equipment.

    G
    Your satisfaction stems from the fact that they've replaced a mount on an old lens of yours, because their basic binary technology (which I admit is quite genius) has allowed them to. That's something I've done myself twice now in the last month in under ten minutes (save for enamel drying times). What other assumptions would I come up with, if that's your defence of the brand. Also I bet it took them a while to do said "modernising". Look, I'm not trying to bash you, or your working relationship with the brand, that wasn't my intention. It's just I find it hard to believe that you think Leica service is "professional level" based on the fact that they CLA & updated an old lens for you. Until you've had run ins with them, frequently on a professional level, it's really not fair to comment. Oh and sure I could use another vendors equipment, and I would, if Leica didn't check the boxes that were more important to me. Thankfully I have the money to invest heavily in backup gear. Some people don't, some people won't see the need. Anyway, see below.

    **I wrote a big long rant about all the various ways I've been mistreated by Leica. But I decided to erase it, because at the end of the day, I don't really think anyone cares. And, I think it's more productive to just offer a solution. And to be fair, Leica has on occasion made up for it. I've even received phone call apologies which is kinda nice considering. Below I have written a very viable solution. If it's not cost effective, or labor is harder to find then I think. Then I guess it's just not possible. But this is what will make Leica seem professional in my eyes, and will make me more tolerant of QC issues that always seem to crop up. Lastly would make me see value in the brand, as a working professional who uses Leica cameras only**

    Here it is, my #1 opinion on how to make Leica better: If every city that had a "Leica Store" it was mandatory to have a Leica repair shop. One or two trained technicians per "Leica Store" who sit in a little room and actually fix things. Rather then having everything be sent to Germany where you're already loosing two weeks due to shipping. At least if products break, I know they'd be fixed within the week. And I'd maybe be a little more tolerant of what fan boys call "quality control issues". Since at this point the repair center is almost on par with Canon/Nikon/Sony/Fuji.
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    Re: An open letter to Leica (2015)...please share your own thoughts

    Quote Originally Posted by aDam007 View Post
    Your satisfaction stems from the fact that they've replaced a mount on an old lens of yours, because their basic binary technology (which I admit is quite genius) has allowed them to. ...
    No. Not to mention that I have no idea what you mean by "their basic binary technology." (Being able to do what they did with the Summicron-R lens for the Leicaflex SL means that a) they had the parts in stock, b) they had the expertise to do the job correctly, and c) they are willing to do it at a reasonable price. Most manufacturers aren't interested in supporting customers with 50 year old products, it's not cost effective, and most manufacturer service personnel are not trained in how to work on such old equipment.)

    My satisfaction with Leica stems from the facts that

    • ... over the forty-six plus years of using their products, I've had very few needs to call upon their service. And when I did, they provided outstanding service.
    • ... the equipment they've made suits a large percentage of my photography very well.
    • ... the quality of the lenses and images produced by their equipment is outstanding.


    I've never had a "run-in" with Leica service; their equipment has been very robust and dependable. I've never doubted it would get the job done when I picked it out of the bag. When I did need service, I called them and they took care of me. Period.

    I have other equipment as well, of course. A Leica RF is not the ideal tool for all of my photographic needs. I've used Leica gear alongside, primarily, Nikon and Olympus SLR cameras as well as medium format cameras. I've had a similar amount of need for their service as well (very little overall). Of the others, Olympus has been the best to work with—almost on par with Leica.

    Your rant sounds like you have a chip on your shoulder about Leica and expectations that they are not prepared to meet. I can't see why you would persevere using Leica equipment if you have repeated problems with it, and don't with other vendors' wares. The magic in a photograph is only in a very small way dependent upon the equipment with which it is produced. Why persevere with equipment that annoys you, or that you find unreliable? I'd dump that stuff in an instant—which is why I don't buy Sigma, sold my Sony gear, etc.

    I just don't understand why you are so offended by my satisfaction with Leica. The fact that your experiences have been negative has no impact on my experiences with their gear. I'm not offended that you dislike them so much; I'm just mystified as to why you keep using them.

    G
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    Re: An open letter to Leica (2015)...please share your own thoughts

    Quote Originally Posted by Godfrey View Post
    No. Not to mention that I have no idea what you mean by "their basic binary technology." (Being able to do what they did with the Summicron-R lens for the Leicaflex SL means that a) they had the parts in stock, b) they had the expertise to do the job correctly, and c) they are willing to do it at a reasonable price. Most manufacturers aren't interested in supporting customers with 50 year old products, it's not cost effective, and most manufacturer service personnel are not trained in how to work on such old equipment.)

    My satisfaction with Leica stems from the facts that

    • ... over the forty-six plus years of using their products, I've had very few needs to call upon their service. And when I did, they provided outstanding service.
    • ... the equipment they've made suits a large percentage of my photography very well.
    • ... the quality of the lenses and images produced by their equipment is outstanding.


    I've never had a "run-in" with Leica service; their equipment has been very robust and dependable. I've never doubted it would get the job done when I picked it out of the bag. When I did need service, I called them and they took care of me. Period.

    I have other equipment as well, of course. A Leica RF is not the ideal tool for all of my photographic needs. I've used Leica gear alongside, primarily, Nikon and Olympus SLR cameras as well as medium format cameras. I've had a similar amount of need for their service as well (very little overall). Of the others, Olympus has been the best to work with—almost on par with Leica.

    Your rant sounds like you have a chip on your shoulder about Leica and expectations that they are not prepared to meet. I can't see why you would persevere using Leica equipment if you have repeated problems with it, and don't with other vendors' wares. The magic in a photograph is only in a very small way dependent upon the equipment with which it is produced. Why persevere with equipment that annoys you, or that you find unreliable? I'd dump that stuff in an instant—which is why I don't buy Sigma, sold my Sony gear, etc.

    I just don't understand why you are so offended by my satisfaction with Leica. The fact that your experiences have been negative has no impact on my experiences with their gear. I'm not offended that you dislike them so much; I'm just mystified as to why you keep using them.

    G
    I love rangefinders. I like the 50APO. I just wish Leica would get their stuff together. I can PM you if you'd like more details on my personal experiences. Maybe it'll help you understand how I can't see Leica as a company that offers professional level repairs and service. I ask myself why I even bother with them every time an issue crops up. But I like what I like.. I'm not a business man at the end of the day, I'm an artist I guess. I don't make rational decisions. Or else I wouldn't use Leica for anything professional. This I think is why I get so angry with them, and yeah I probably do have a chip on my shoulder after picking up my gear yesterday from the 8 week "spa" treatment, having it be worse then before it left.

    I'm not offended, I just can't believe that our opinions differ so much. And I think you may have misunderstood my intentions. Your opinion of the company, just shocks me, and I disagree with you strongly on the fact that they're up to professional standards. They are not up to par. I really wish they were, I use them professionally, so I need them to be, but they are not.

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    Re: An open letter to Leica (2015)...please share your own thoughts

    No need to send me your personal troubles. We're going to disagree. Let's leave it at that.

    I'm happy enough with Leica and their current products that I've recently put another $12,000 into another lens and another body, and will likely buy another new lens or two in the foreseeable future. For me, that's a huge statement of how much satisfaction I have with their products today.

    G
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    Re: An open letter to Leica (2015)...please share your own thoughts

    From my personal experience and the reason I bought out of Leica almost 100% (I retain a contingent of a few lenses in case they do make something I want at a price I'm willing to pay) is that they are a luxury company, with luxury prices, that don't exactly offer cutting edge technology to match. I've come to realize that a "Movado" (Sony in this analogy) with actual swiss movements (while not cheap) might actually perform better than an "Omega" (Leica in this analogy) that has changed to Chinese movements. They both tell time and one has a more prestigious lineage but it's not the standard of the world it once was any longer.

    I love my M and if money were no object and I had the time or thought to use it more I would not have sold it. The fact is it could not surpass what Sony was doing from a technology standpoint. While some don't like the constant updates/ revisions of the Sony bodies - I rather constant updates and have the choice to upgrade while retaining 30-50% of new value than to be stuck with a body technologically outdated when compared with the competition prior to release.

    That's just my view. Regarding what they are doing now and what they may do in the future regarding a mirrorless body - it's too little and too late I think for the price they will probably charge. I mean look at today alone - They announce the Q and it seems like it'll be a great camera but it's priced halfway between a A7RII and a new Leica M-E. Their one wildcard that I get the urge for is the Monochrom and if someone makes a less expensive FF alternative then I'd probably sell the rest of my M lenses towards it.
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    Re: An open letter to Leica (2015)...please share your own thoughts

    Quote Originally Posted by Godfrey View Post
    No need to send me your personal troubles. We're going to disagree. Let's leave it at that.

    I'm happy enough with Leica and their current products that I've recently put another $12,000 into another lens and another body, and will likely buy another new lens or two in the foreseeable future. For me, that's a huge statement of how much satisfaction I have with their products today.

    G

    Yep, satisfaction with their products is exactly why I have spent over $100K on Leica gear. That and I like stuff. But I never said anything about not being satisfied with their gear. That's the whole point of my frustration. I'm incredibly satisfied with the stuff... When it works.

    What I'm not satisfied with is their customer service, and repair times. And overall logistics in both areas could be vastly improved with minimal effort.
    There is no denying that. Anyone I know who uses Leica and has had need of a repair would say the same.

    It's kinda like having a bitchy bipolar girlfriend, but she's good in the sac. Though I'm married so maybe that's not the best analogy

    Obviously I'm just annoyed over my 50APO / M240 repairs, and the whole S-system nonsense I'v dealt with recently..

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    Re: An open letter to Leica (2015)...please share your own thoughts

    An open letter to Leica:

    I think more people would be likely to spend what it takes to buy a Leica if more people were talking about the art and craft of photography than about the photographic equipment they are interested in purchasing. Education is key: the more people know, the more they appreciate quality.

    My recommendation would be to make a line of special edition cameras and/or lenses, the proceeds of which are entirely dedicated to funding endowments for photographers. This might mean that tuition is paid for photography classes or workshops. This might mean that teachers--grade school, college, or workshop--are supported so that they can offer more people the chance to learn from them. It might mean something else. But I think that more than a few Leica collectors would happily rationalize their purchases if they knew they were sharing their passion for photography and for all things Leica. And I think that more than a few photographers who would never otherwise consider Leica might come to appreciate the value, as opposed to solely focusing on the cost, of Leica equipment.

    Oh, and if the next generation M-E is nothing more than an M 240 sensor and mount welded to the rest of the Q 116, I'd be very pleased to buy one. To top that, make a second generation R-Adapter M that includes a little motor to stop down the aperture.

    Cheers,
    Jon
    Last edited by JonPB; 10th June 2015 at 19:59. Reason: Trimming hyperbole.

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    Re: An open letter to Leica (2015)...please share your own thoughts

    Quote Originally Posted by JonPB View Post
    Oh, and if the next generation M-E is nothing more than an M 240 sensor and mount welded to the rest of the Q 116, I'd be very pleased to buy one. To top that, make a second generation R-Adapter M that includes a little motor to stop down the aperture.
    +1

    Interchangeable lens Q + smart adapter for R lenses = my checkbook is ready

    otherwise Sony gets my money
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    Re: An open letter to Leica (2015)...please share your own thoughts

    Suddenly I have a bad case of GAS.
    Life is an infinite series of moments called..."now".
    My job is to capture them.

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    Re: An open letter to Leica (2015)...please share your own thoughts

    I think the Q looks terrific, but I'd be in the crop mode for 35mm most of the time, in which case it becomes an X with eVF built in. My X and separate EVF are paid for.
    "A fella, A quick fella, might have a weapon under there. I'd have to pin his head to the panel." The Gyro Captain
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  43. #43
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    Re: An open letter to Leica (2015)...please share your own thoughts

    Coming late to this thread, but will add my 2¢:

    I'm a Leica photographer since 2010. I use the equipment professionally alongside Canon DSLRs. Leica is an integral part of how I cover many the events/jobs I photograph. I love the M system and am extremely encouraged by the technological progress evident in the M240 vs. the M9, the capability of the Q and what it likely bodes for the next round of cameras.

    The greatest failing of Leica, IMO, is service repair TIME. Often service quality is good, though I'm currently dealing with an incorrectly repaired lens and having some trouble getting it sorted out. And everyone at Leica has been great to deal with in person, when I've had the opportunity. But 6-8 week turnaround time is utterly ridiculous and must be improved.

    It is my #1 request of Leica.

    In terms of future product, it's more along narrowly focused details than a grand concept. Probably because I already like the M system so much...

    - An M body with much more reliable, much faster electronics package: deeper buffer, option for higher fps if desired, no more random lockups.
    - Fully electronic shutter option.
    - Aluminum top plate to reduce weight. Heck, make it composite, carbon fibre, polymer, whatever.

    A few comments about other comments/requests:

    T system: I briefly tried it and liked it in general. But it felt too slow and likely would benefit greatly from the Q's electronics package. Put the Maestro II in it, along with firmware improvements in a new body (current design is fine with me) before deciding whether to kill it off. Oh, and Leica blundered IMO with the lens release. While the zooms are fine, the system needs more than one prime. There should be at least 3 or 4. Something wider, a normal equivalent and a portrait lens. But maybe this is what the Q interchangeable lens system will be?

    Summarit-M lenses: Am I the only one extremely disappointed with the 'new' line? Fine, it's a cosmetic refresh, but with a ~40-50% price increase. Maybe it's our own faults. So often I read in forums about the inferiority of the Summarit lenses compared to the rest of the M lens lineup. I suppose the only way Leica could improve the line's credibility was to increase prices.
    Ron
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  44. #44
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    Re: An open letter to Leica (2015)...please share your own thoughts

    Quote Originally Posted by rscheffler View Post
    Coming late to this thread, but will add my 2¢:

    I'm a Leica photographer since 2010. I use the equipment professionally alongside Canon DSLRs. Leica is an integral part of how I cover many the events/jobs I photograph. I love the M system and am extremely encouraged by the technological progress evident in the M240 vs. the M9, the capability of the Q and what it likely bodes for the next round of cameras.

    The greatest failing of Leica, IMO, is service repair TIME. Often service quality is good, though I'm currently dealing with an incorrectly repaired lens and having some trouble getting it sorted out. And everyone at Leica has been great to deal with in person, when I've had the opportunity. But 6-8 week turnaround time is utterly ridiculous and must be improved.

    It is my #1 request of Leica.

    In terms of future product, it's more along narrowly focused details than a grand concept. Probably because I already like the M system so much...

    - An M body with much more reliable, much faster electronics package: deeper buffer, option for higher fps if desired, no more random lockups.
    - Fully electronic shutter option.
    - Aluminum top plate to reduce weight. Heck, make it composite, carbon fibre, polymer, whatever.

    A few comments about other comments/requests:

    T system: I briefly tried it and liked it in general. But it felt too slow and likely would benefit greatly from the Q's electronics package. Put the Maestro II in it, along with firmware improvements in a new body (current design is fine with me) before deciding whether to kill it off. Oh, and Leica blundered IMO with the lens release. While the zooms are fine, the system needs more than one prime. There should be at least 3 or 4. Something wider, a normal equivalent and a portrait lens. But maybe this is what the Q interchangeable lens system will be?

    Summarit-M lenses: Am I the only one extremely disappointed with the 'new' line? Fine, it's a cosmetic refresh, but with a ~40-50% price increase. Maybe it's our own faults. So often I read in forums about the inferiority of the Summarit lenses compared to the rest of the M lens lineup. I suppose the only way Leica could improve the line's credibility was to increase prices.

    All great points. The Summarit point is pretty spot on

  45. #45
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    Re: An open letter to Leica (2015)...please share your own thoughts

    I guess those of us who have had no problems with Leica's quick and personal service will go out and buy the excellent older Summarit lenses then.... ];-)

    G

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    Re: An open letter to Leica (2015)...please share your own thoughts

    Quote Originally Posted by Godfrey View Post
    I guess those of us who have had no problems with Leica's quick and personal service will go out and buy the excellent older Summarit lenses then.... ];-)

    G
    Umm... YES. The older Summarit lenses are stellar, and really cheap now considering what they were priced at. And also used market 2.5s are a no brainer.

    I've always liked them. The 75,35,50,90 in that order.. Although I've never had a need for the 50 and the 90 isn't last, just the last one I'd buy, since I find the 75 to be straight up awesome. And just to put it out there, 0.7m should have been on the first version of this lens.

  47. #47
    Senior Member KeithL's Avatar
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    Re: An open letter to Leica (2015)...please share your own thoughts

    My Summarit 90mm f2.5 is one of my favourite and most used lenses.

    If I had to replace it with a new lens today guess which I'd choose, the f2.5 at £1,039 or the new f2.4 at £1440? (Red Dot Camera prices).

  48. #48
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    Re: An open letter to Leica (2015)...please share your own thoughts

    Quote Originally Posted by aDam007 View Post
    Umm... YES. The older Summarit lenses are stellar, and really cheap now considering what they were priced at. And also used market 2.5s are a no brainer.

    I've always liked them. The 75,35,50,90 in that order.. Although I've never had a need for the 50 and the 90 isn't last, just the last one I'd buy, since I find the 75 to be straight up awesome. And just to put it out there, 0.7m should have been on the first version of this lens.
    So here's the thing ...

    Right now I can get a Summarit-M 75mm f/2.4 for $1892 (current discounted price) which includes 0.7m minimum focus and lens hood. Or I can get the Summarit-M 75mm f/2.5 for $1599 + $84 for the lens hood and hood cap, but can only focus to 0.9m minimum distance. That's a $200 premium for the updated design including hood and 8" worth of focusing distance.

    Is it worth it? (oh, the devil is in my mind today... ;-)

    G

  49. #49
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    Re: An open letter to Leica (2015)...please share your own thoughts

    Quote Originally Posted by Godfrey View Post
    So here's the thing ...

    Right now I can get a Summarit-M 75mm f/2.4 for $1892 (current discounted price) which includes 0.7m minimum focus and lens hood. Or I can get the Summarit-M 75mm f/2.5 for $1599 + $84 for the lens hood and hood cap, but can only focus to 0.9m minimum distance. That's a $200 premium for the updated design including hood and 8" worth of focusing distance.

    Is it worth it? (oh, the devil is in my mind today... ;-)

    G
    Tough call at that price. If you want to buy either of them new, the extra $200 might be worth it, since 75mm at .7m is actually a bit closer then most lenses in that range. Good for detail shots. I never used my hood on my 2.5 but I did have one. I prefer pull out hoods, like the 75APO has, it's just easier for me.

    I'd personally pickup a used 2.5 at $1k which is where I've seen them lately on the forums. Or check out this legit source:
    (I've bought from them before)
    Brand New Unused Leica Summarit M 75mm F2 5 6 Bit F 2 5 M 240 M9 M8 2 E 11645 4022243116450 | eBay

    But again... That .7m on 75mm is mighty close (worth the $200 I'd say).

  50. #50
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    Re: An open letter to Leica (2015)...please share your own thoughts

    Quote Originally Posted by KeithL View Post
    My Summarit 90mm f2.5 is one of my favourite and most used lenses.

    If I had to replace it with a new lens today guess which I'd choose, the f2.5 at £1,039 or the new f2.4 at £1440? (Red Dot Camera prices).
    For the 90 Summarit, I think I'd go for the old one. No real reason to update it.
    I actually like it better then the pre-APO cron and 90elmarit both tele and latest version.

    Actually one could make a pretty awesome kit with a summarit 35/75 or even a 50/90 and an M9 at the prices they are selling for these days. You'd be set for all of life's adventures

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