Site Sponsors
Page 1 of 13 1 2 3 11 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 50 of 645

Thread: Leica SL (601) ..Oct 20th?

  1. #1
    Workshop Member glenerrolrd's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Jupiter FL/Atlanta GA
    Posts
    2,279
    Post Thanks / Like

    Leica SL (601) ..Oct 20th?

    This looks to be a decent rumor as the camera has been registered as the Leica SL(601) and Leica has a major event scheduled for October 20th in Wetzler . The specifications look reasonable ...same 24MP sensor as the Q with maybe improved high ISO performance , SL style body with EVF ,new line of AF lenses ....larger than the M but lighter .

    The big surprise was the speculation that the new body would have “IN BODY AF” ...as I understand it the sensor is moved to achieve focus . This would be a game changer for someone that loves the Leica R lenses as well as the manual focus gems from Zeiss . Do I understand this correctly that its possible to focus a manual focus lenses in this manner ?

    I know Contax had this capability in one body ..but I have no experience in how well it worked or even if it worked with manual focus lenses.
    Roger Dunham
    http://rogerdunham.com/
    Thanks 1 Member(s) thanked for this post

  2. #2
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Posts
    314
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Leica SL (601) ..Oct 20th?

    First three lenses could be:
    24-90mm ASPH 2.8-4
    90-280mm APO 2.8-4
    50mm 1.4 ASPH 1.4
    according to http://digicame-info.com/2015/09/sl3.html

  3. #3
    Senior Member Lars's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Sunnyvale, California
    Posts
    1,811
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    19

    Re: Leica SL (601) ..Oct 20th?

    Very interesting - out of my price/value range for sure but it's good to hear that Leica is finally stepping into the 21st century with some innovation rather than being a follower. I could see other manufacturers following the idea of in-body AF.
    In-body AF should actually be technically easier to implement than in-lens AF (less mass to move, no concern over MF ring feel).
    And if you use an MF lens focused at minimum range the AF can effectively work as a variable extension ring.
    Body has to be deeper to accommodate near focus though - don't expect a thin body like the A7. But body + lens will be the same depth.
    Limitation for long lenses - don't expect full-range AF or macro on your 500 mm lens. It will be more like set approximate MF, then let the body do the AF part.
    As you all probably remember, 1:1 macro requires an extension equal to focal length. So in-body is great for wide angles and up to perhaps 100 mm focal length, after that is gets a bit limiting.
    For smaller sensor size (and thus shorter focal lengths) it's an even better idea.
    Last edited by Lars; 28th September 2015 at 13:48.
    Monochrome: http://mochro.com

  4. #4
    Senior Member segedi's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Calgary, Canada
    Posts
    363
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Leica SL (601) ..Oct 20th?

    This might be a silly question, but why would they come out with AF lenses if the AF was in-body?
    Segedi.com

    flickr
    Thanks 1 Member(s) thanked for this post
    Likes 1 Member(s) liked this post

  5. #5
    Workshop Member glenerrolrd's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Jupiter FL/Atlanta GA
    Posts
    2,279
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Leica SL (601) ..Oct 20th?

    Quote Originally Posted by segedi View Post
    This might be a silly question, but why would they come out with AF lenses if the AF was in-body?
    Agreed seems inconsistent with body based AF ...this is what I don t follow in the rumors . The lenses however don t indicate they are AF.

  6. #6
    Senior Member Lars's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Sunnyvale, California
    Posts
    1,811
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    19

    Re: Leica SL (601) ..Oct 20th?

    Quote Originally Posted by segedi View Post
    This might be a silly question, but why would they come out with AF lenses if the AF was in-body?
    In-body AF allows for AF using legacy (M, R?) lenses, in-lens AF allows for full range AF. No contradiction if you think about it, quite clever actually, and rhymes with Leica philosophy - existing lenses is a tremendous asset.

    Then again, it's just a rumor, right?
    Monochrome: http://mochro.com

  7. #7
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Jerusalem, Israel
    Posts
    1,282
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Leica SL (601) ..Oct 20th?

    Quote Originally Posted by glenerrolrd View Post
    This looks to be a decent rumor as the camera has been registered as the Leica SL(601) and Leica has a major event scheduled for October 20th in Wetzler . The specifications look reasonable ...same 24MP sensor as the Q with maybe improved high ISO performance , SL style body with EVF ,new line of AF lenses ....larger than the M but lighter .

    The big surprise was the speculation that the new body would have “IN BODY AF” ...as I understand it the sensor is moved to achieve focus . This would be a game changer for someone that loves the Leica R lenses as well as the manual focus gems from Zeiss . Do I understand this correctly that its possible to focus a manual focus lenses in this manner ?

    I know Contax had this capability in one body ..but I have no experience in how well it worked or even if it worked with manual focus lenses.
    The Contax AX put the whole film transport, mirror box and pentaprism on ceramic rails and moved it in and out with a powerful USM motor. It worked, but required an extra cm of body thickness and reached the market as film was dying. There is a description at Contax AX - photo.net. 1 cm of motion (away from the lens) lets you focus down to 0.7m (Leica's standard minimum) for lenses up to about 85 mm focal length. After that, manual rough focus is required. But to do AF down to 0.7 m with lenses 50 mm or less by moving the sensor requires a bit less than 0.4 cm of movement. Maybe that's OK in a body that has an R-like appearance.

    Still, I guess it's unlikely. Even though the current magnetically-suspended image chip makes it much easier and faster to offer z-axis motion, the Rube Goldberg (Heath Robinson) nature of the system invites ridicule, and ridicule undercuts the "Das Wesentliche" message of Leica's current marketing. And Leica doesn't make money selling R lenses which are no longer manufactured. We'll have to wait for Oct 20, or perhaps Michael Hussman (MJH on the Leica Forum), a journalist who frequently writes for Leica, will straighten this out if someone decides that it is not a speculation that should be encouraged.

    scott
    Last edited by scott kirkpatrick; 29th September 2015 at 03:44.
    Thanks 1 Member(s) thanked for this post

  8. #8
    Super Duper
    Senior Member
    jonoslack's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    East Anglia & Cornwall (UK)
    Posts
    11,778
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    1

    Re: Leica SL (601) ..Oct 20th?

    HI There
    Moving the sensor back and forth by 1cm doesn't sound like it would be very fast (it certainly wasn't in the Contax AX).

    I believe that this rumour came from LaVide Leica, together with the idea that the X-U typ 113 would be M like, but with an electronic rangefinder like the Konost system(Konost).

    He keeps telling us what a tremendous track record he has with predictions, so maybe he's right here as well.

    If so, we live in exciting times!

    Just this guy you know
    Likes 2 Member(s) liked this post

  9. #9
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Melbourne, Australia
    Posts
    2,338
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    52

    Re: Leica SL (601) ..Oct 20th?

    Well I'm fascinated by the potential announcement of a new camera- capable of using existing M manual lenses - as well as a new line of autofocus lenses...pretty big news for Leica - strategically important move - Sony one body for all lenses has huge appeal to owners of legacy or other system lenses - it is a genuine lens horse - if we take extreme levels of pixel peeping out of the equation - and maybe concentrate on a print..I found my lenses - even wides - delivered useful prints...

    Of curse I' rather use my Leica lenses on a Leica body - and wouldnt it be great if I could use my Nikon/Canon lenses

    Maybe Leica has just a put a cap on Sony's pricing plans for the Ar3/4/5/6/7 etc..

    anyway I'm really interested in what this camera is going to be...

    I would pay megabucks for a digital XPan...that is the killer format just waiting to be rebirthed....( one can only dream)
    Likes 1 Member(s) liked this post

  10. #10
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Jerusalem, Israel
    Posts
    1,282
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Leica SL (601) ..Oct 20th?

    Quote Originally Posted by jonoslack View Post
    HI There
    Moving the sensor back and forth by 1cm doesn't sound like it would be very fast (it certainly wasn't in the Contax AX).

    I believe that this rumour came from LaVide Leica, together with the idea that the X-U typ 113 would be M like, but with an electronic rangefinder like the Konost system(Konost).
    The most recent rumor update has a really intriguing lens list and says "in-body AF." It's in Japanese, so reading it through Google translate adds to the mystery. I see that MJH has weighed in suggesting that it is possible that "LaVidaLeica hasn't got a clue." But moving a magnetically suspended sensor back and forth could be pretty fast, certainly when compared with what Contax had to do. And I think 4 mm motion would be enough. But it just isn't very "wesentlich."

    Are we having fun now?

    scott
    Likes 1 Member(s) liked this post

  11. #11
    Super Duper
    Senior Member
    Vivek's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Netherlands
    Posts
    13,601
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    21

    Re: Leica SL (601) ..Oct 20th?

    Quote Originally Posted by PeterA View Post
    Maybe Leica has just a put a cap on Sony's pricing plans for the Ar3/4/5/6/7 etc..
    My thoughts, exactly!

    This could be the major fallout from this as the prices of the rumored Leica will be affordable for only a few.

  12. #12
    Super Duper
    Senior Member

    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    3,672
    Post Thanks / Like

    Thumbs down Re: Leica SL (601) ..Oct 20th?

    I used the Contax AX quite extensively and although thr AF was slow compared to what was then state of the art in Af SLR's, it aquainted itself quite well and could virtually allow AF with almost any manual focus lens one could mount to the body. This meant not only native Contax SLR lenses but any brand lens via an adapter.

    As mentioned, the mass required to move a sensor is quite a bit less than what ContX had to deal with and I suspect AF speed will be acceptable. The added benifit of allowing any mounted lens to focus closer than its normal minimum distance, cannot br overstated.

    I think the major advancement of this system if true, would be not only in-body AF, but also a line of native AF lenses if one chooses that route. I suspect this is actually what the entire system is designed for but with the added benifit of allowing most any mounted lens to derive benifit from an in-camera based AF system if so desired.

    I supose the new mount won't allow all native legacy R lenses to be mounted without an adapter or will it actually have a modified R mount with additional contacts? Something tells me this body is not really designed for M lens use but I'm sure some sort of adapter to mount M lenses will exist or be developed (3rd party).

    Like the S system, I suspect the orice will prevent it from becoming a mainstream DSLR system that would compete against the likes of Nikon, Canon etc., but then again thats never been Leicas goal.

    Dave (D&A)
    Last edited by D&A; 29th September 2015 at 10:43.

  13. #13
    Senior Member JohnBrew's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Location
    South Carolina
    Posts
    532
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Leica SL (601) ..Oct 20th?

    Quote Originally Posted by PeterA View Post
    I would pay megabucks for a digital XPan...that is the killer format just waiting to be rebirthed....( one can only dream)
    Okay, NOW we're really on point. That is a dream I share with you, Peter.

    Just received an email from Thorsten Overgaard and he seems pretty sure we will see this camera before year's end.

    But then, I'd lay even money Jono has the goods behind that bewitching smile of his .

  14. #14
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Jerusalem, Israel
    Posts
    1,282
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Leica SL (601) ..Oct 20th?

    Quote Originally Posted by JohnBrew View Post
    Okay, NOW we're really on point. That is a dream I share with you, Peter.

    Just received an email from Thorsten Overgaard and he seems pretty sure we will see this camera before year's end.

    But then, I'd lay even money Jono has the goods behind that bewitching smile of his .
    I read somewhere that after Josef Koudelka had his MF wide camera trashed by our border police (he was photographing the Wall in israel), Leica made him a digital equivalent. I'd love to know what that is. It was supposed to be based on an S, so maybe it was just cut down to a wide strip. I'm not selling my XPan and I'm hanging onto a few rolls of FP-4.

    scott
    Likes 1 Member(s) liked this post

  15. #15
    Senior Member doug's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    708
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Leica SL (601) ..Oct 20th?

    Quote Originally Posted by D&A View Post
    I used the Contax AX quite extensively and although thr AF was slow compared to what was then state of the art in Af SLR's, it aquainted itself quite well and could virtually allow AF with almost any manual focus lens one could mount to the body. This meant not only native Contax SLR lenses but any brand lens via an adapter.

    ...

    I suppose the new mount won't all native legacy R lenses to be mounted without an adapter or eill it actually have a modified R mount with additional contacts? Something tells me this body is not really designed for M lens use but I'm sure some sort of adapter to mount M lenses will exist or be developed (3rd party).
    mjh on the l-camera-forum has shot down the notion of AF via a moving sensor. He often knows much more than he lets on in public forums. IMHO it's very unlikely that Leica would use the moving-sensor AF technology because altering the distance between the sensor and the lens throws out the window the need for all the precise calculations and manufacturing that a floating-element or zoom or internal-focus lens requires. Might as well just use a CaNikon lens

    Like the S system, I suspect the orice will prevent it from becoming a mainstream DSLR system that would compete against the likes of Nikon, Canon etc., but then again thats never been Leicas goal.
    The SL isn't expected to be a mainstream DSLR camera. Mirrorless is not a DSLR.
    Doug Herr http://www.wildlightphoto.com
    Likes 4 Member(s) liked this post

  16. #16
    Super Duper
    Senior Member
    jonoslack's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    East Anglia & Cornwall (UK)
    Posts
    11,778
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    1

    Re: Leica SL (601) ..Oct 20th?

    Quote Originally Posted by doug View Post
    mjh on the l-camera-forum has shot down the notion of AF via a moving sensor. He often knows much more than he lets on in public forums.
    HI Writes for LFI magazine these days, so he probably will know. . . . But he will have signed an NDA - so he might just be toying with us

    Just this guy you know
    Likes 2 Member(s) liked this post

  17. #17
    Member Seascape's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Toronto
    Posts
    239
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Leica SL (601) ..Oct 20th?

    [QUOTE=doug;661733]mjh on the l-camera-forum has shot down the notion of AF via a moving sensor. He often knows much more than he lets on in public forums. IMHO it's very unlikely that Leica would use the moving-sensor AF technology because altering the distance between the sensor and the lens throws out the window the need for all the precise calculations and manufacturing that a floating-element or zoom or internal-focus lens requires. Might as well just use a CaNikon lens

    I agree completely.
    With today's high resolution sensors, optical alignment is crucial, a moving sensor or IS sensor makes no sense to me.
    Other manufacturers seem to use these concepts to sell cameras, Leica understands the importance of precision alignment better than anyone.
    I sure they are happy to leave these "magical" designs to manufacturers for whom marketing hype is more important than real world results.
    Last edited by Seascape; 29th September 2015 at 07:53.

  18. #18
    Workshop Member ptomsu's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Austria, close to Vienna
    Posts
    3,868
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Leica SL (601) ..Oct 20th?

    Ok guys,

    not knowing anything about this upcoming Leica, but I will lean myself now out of the window

    Moving sensor for achieving AF is simply nonsense IMHO, because alignment would need to be so exact and control of movement for achieving AF even more crucial. I think Leica will be happy to launch this new system with some decent AF lenses and connectivity for maybe old R glass via an adapter. I even doubt that M glass is an option but maybe ....

    Well, you can call me ..... or whatever you like if it still happens

    Peter
    Last edited by ptomsu; 29th September 2015 at 09:24.

  19. #19
    Subscriber and Workshop Member MGrayson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    NYC
    Posts
    1,575
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    4

    Re: Leica SL (601) ..Oct 20th?

    The dark hints I've heard are "feels like an S, but smaller". And having played with an 007 for a few days, I think that would be a VERY good thing. The blurry pictures circulating look like no OVF. <shrug>

    As far as in-body AF, is there any reason a focusing motor couldn't be built into the mount as a spinning ring? I'm thinking of taking the motor from a modern AF lens and just moving it back into the body, then coupling it to the mounted lens. Every lens uses the same motor. Maybe a stupid idea, but anyone here in mechanical engineering?

    Or it works just like the Q or S (but with more robust gears).

    Interesting times...

    Matt

  20. #20
    Senior Member doug's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    708
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Leica SL (601) ..Oct 20th?

    Quote Originally Posted by MGrayson View Post
    As far as in-body AF, is there any reason a focusing motor couldn't be built into the mount as a spinning ring? I'm thinking of taking the motor from a modern AF lens and just moving it back into the body, then coupling it to the mounted lens. Every lens uses the same motor. Maybe a stupid idea, but anyone here in mechanical engineering?
    Using a motor to move the mount would result in a compromise of inadequate precision for wide-angle lenses, insufficient focussing range for long lenses, an inability to take advantage of floating elements, zoom lenses that change focus when zoomed, and compromised mechanical strength which could be significant with larger lenses.
    Last edited by doug; 29th September 2015 at 08:55.
    Doug Herr http://www.wildlightphoto.com
    Thanks 2 Member(s) thanked for this post
    Likes 2 Member(s) liked this post

  21. #21
    Subscriber and Workshop Member MGrayson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    NYC
    Posts
    1,575
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    4

    Re: Leica SL (601) ..Oct 20th?

    Doug,

    I don't mean move the mount! I agree that that would be too imprecise and useless for floating elements. I mean just have one motor in the camera body to move the lens elements, but have that be a modern Ultrasonic motor in a ring around the mount, and not the tiny screw drive that is usually found in in-body AF motors.

    The motor would couple to a ring on the lens and drive the lens elements as usual. This might allow for smaller lenses. It's probably a bad idea because the motor would have to be strong enough for the largest lens in the system, and so that weight would be added, in effect, to every smaller lens.

    To be clear - this would not be for any adapted or manual lenses. It would be a new system of AF lenses where the weight savings would be in having only one AF motor in the entire kit.

    --Matt
    Last edited by MGrayson; 29th September 2015 at 09:36.
    Thanks 1 Member(s) thanked for this post

  22. #22
    Super Duper
    Senior Member
    ashwinrao1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Seattle, WA - USA
    Posts
    3,276
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Leica SL (601) ..Oct 20th?

    Fun fun, rumor time. I love to pontificate, speculate, and suspect....and this thread has piqued my curiosity.

    The use of in-body AF seems to me to be as likely as using a "digital" film cannister in a film M body to record digital images...Could be fun, interesting, and there are patents, but will it ever happen? I doubt it....

    Leica would really create a stir with such a camera, and maybe that would distinguish them in permitting the use of manual focus lenses with AF. However, Sony's already invented the AF equivalent, using AF lenses of any type on their A7 series cameras. While this might bring those from Canikon over to Sony, Leica plays in an entirely different sandbox.

    I suspect that what we'll see is essentially a ILC Q with a new mount and adapters to play with R (and hopefully M) lenses....This would presumably use tech that they already have developed (from the Q) in a body that sets it apart from their M line.... The fact that the SL has already been registered yields the thought that this camera is coming, or that Leica's playing elaborate games with us. I doubt they care that much about our rumors, though....

    That being said, I'd prefer a "slim M" built more in line with M7/MP dimensions. Or, gasp gahhhh, an AF version of the M rangefinder concept...now that would be tasty, but unlikely to work since the AF mechanism adapted onto M lenses will yield bulky or longer lenses....
    Ashwin Rao
    Seattle, WA
    My Photography
    Likes 2 Member(s) liked this post

  23. #23
    Workshop Member glenerrolrd's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Jupiter FL/Atlanta GA
    Posts
    2,279
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Leica SL (601) ..Oct 20th?

    Agree that in body AF seems a reach . Pretty much why I started the thread . Based on the rumors and just common sense ...Leica seems to be headed for a EVF reflex “style” body . Sean Reid is testing the “R” lenses and I doubt thats for the M body . Sharing the “Q” sensor would make sense ..24MP is still the sweet spot for Full Frame .

    Very interesting ..I ve used every Leica SL since the first one (that had the exposure metering thru a small window ) . My favorite was the R4-6 body ...which is tiny by digital standards for an SLR . A body based on the technology in the Q (which I think is terrific) and the size and handling of a small SLR(but using an EVF with focus confirmation) ..accepting R lenses has been on my wish list since the demise of the DMR .
    Roger Dunham
    http://rogerdunham.com/
    Likes 2 Member(s) liked this post

  24. #24
    Senior Member atanabe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Napa Valley, CA
    Posts
    470
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    2

    Re: Leica SL (601) ..Oct 20th?

    Could it have been a typo? In body IS instead of AF? For a company unwilling to give users the ability to fine tune the body and lens focus points on the S, the idea of a moving sensor is a far reach.
    Al Tanabe my website https://www.altanabe.com

  25. #25
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Posts
    449
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Leica SL (601) ..Oct 20th?

    I imagine AF is a typo and what is implied is an 'in body' IS system, which if you think about it would be pretty essential (in this day and age) if using legacy R lenses is the main aim and of course especially the long ones. It would also allow IS with any other lenses used on the body. And if Leica can overcome the smeared corners from wide M lenses that are such a distinctive turn off for the Sony camera's then the SL could become the universal camera to own.

    Steve

  26. #26
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2015
    Posts
    268
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Leica SL (601) ..Oct 20th?

    Quote Originally Posted by PeterA View Post

    I would pay megabucks for a digital XPan...that is the killer format just waiting to be rebirthed....( one can only dream)
    Your dream is nearly reality. The (excellent) Sigma Quattro DP0 has a 14mm (21mm FOV) lens and an in camera 21:9 framing option. Sure, no view finder or rangefinder focusing. From memmory the crop drops the (tiff) files size from around 120mb to 80mb which is still useful enough for big prints.

    I had an xpan for several years and this DP0 is as good as you'll get in a digital format.
    Thanks 1 Member(s) thanked for this post

  27. #27
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Melbourne, Australia
    Posts
    2,338
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    52

    Re: Leica SL (601) ..Oct 20th?

    Quote Originally Posted by JohnBrew View Post
    Okay, NOW we're really on point. That is a dream I share with you, Peter.

    Just received an email from Thorsten Overgaard and he seems pretty sure we will see this camera before year's end.

    But then, I'd lay even money Jono has the goods behind that bewitching smile of his .

    John - you just made my heart beat faster!..
    I seriously hope Thorsten is correct - would be a game changer for me and my photography I see everything more in Pano format...and I cant shoot what I see...too good to be true??

  28. #28
    Super Duper
    Senior Member

    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Germany
    Posts
    3,623
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Leica SL (601) ..Oct 20th?

    just wondering...what would this camera make us spend the double price of a D810 or a A7(r)II?
    lenses? user interface?
    Last edited by Paratom; 2nd October 2015 at 14:23.
    Thanks 1 Member(s) thanked for this post
    Likes 1 Member(s) liked this post

  29. #29
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Los Angeles, CA
    Posts
    673
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Leica SL (601) ..Oct 20th?

    Quote Originally Posted by Paratom View Post
    just wondering...what would this camera make us spend the double price of a D810 or a A7(r)II?
    lenses? user interface?
    The following:

    1) Lenses (M lvl lenses please, unique rendering is welcome)
    2) User Interface (anything Leica has been doing is fine)
    3) Adaptability (mostly with M wides, since that's problematic for other cameras)
    4) EVF-Qualty (assuming it's Q or better)
    5) AF speed (assuming it's Q or better)
    6) Leica colors (love the S,M,Q colors)

    7) Sexy looks (which sadly it seems this camera doesn't have)

  30. #30
    Super Duper
    Senior Member

    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Germany
    Posts
    3,623
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Leica SL (601) ..Oct 20th?

    colors...I hope for subtile S colors.
    I hope the lenses have a nice transition between focused plane and background.
    I am quite interested in images produced with this camera. But for the price it really has to show special rendering (IMO)

  31. #31
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    North Sweden
    Posts
    1,401
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Leica SL (601) ..Oct 20th?

    I've not seen what it looks like or the price yet, where are you guys looking for this info? Wouldn't mind having a look!

  32. #32
    Super Duper
    Senior Member

    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Germany
    Posts
    3,623
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Leica SL (601) ..Oct 20th?

    Quote Originally Posted by mjr View Post
    I've not seen what it looks like or the price yet, where are you guys looking for this info? Wouldn't mind having a look!
    I dont remember where but they wrote in the 7-8k range for the body. I dont know if this is reliable info.

  33. #33
    Senior Member doug's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    708
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Leica SL (601) ..Oct 20th?

    Quote Originally Posted by Paratom View Post
    just wondering...what would this camera make us spend the double price of a D810 or a A7(r)II?
    lenses? user interface?
    For myself, an adapter for R lenses that operates the auto-diaphragm would be a biggie. DMR colors, no lossy RAW files, a great EVF and the user interface will help. I'll look at the size & weight too.

  34. #34
    Senior Member Lars's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Sunnyvale, California
    Posts
    1,811
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    19

    Re: Leica SL (601) ..Oct 20th?

    Quote Originally Posted by ptomsu View Post
    Moving sensor for achieving AF is simply nonsense IMHO, because alignment would need to be so exact and control of movement for achieving AF even more crucial.
    Just for argument's sake: Think about it - moving the lens or moving the sensor for focusing is technically the same thing. Focus is determined by lens distance from focal plane.
    In some lenses there is internal focus whereby not all lenses move for focus.
    So you need pretty much the same precision and speed whether you move the sensor or the glass.
    For larger lenses there will be far more mass to move than in the sensor assembly.

    Now, if someone could make an in-body tilt+shift+focus+IS sensor, wouldn't that be something?
    Monochrome: http://mochro.com
    Likes 1 Member(s) liked this post

  35. #35
    Super Duper
    Senior Member
    ashwinrao1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Seattle, WA - USA
    Posts
    3,276
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Leica SL (601) ..Oct 20th?

    Quote Originally Posted by Paratom View Post
    just wondering...what would this camera make us spend the double price of a D810 or a A7(r)II?
    lenses? user interface?
    For me, I would want a sensor that could work with M lenses...basically, that takes 6 bit coding, applies the appropriate correction, and does okay with RF wides. THis may well be asking too much, but having the 6 bit option and another way to utilize my M lens kit would be cool.

    If it does not take M lenses, then the proposition becomes a bit more difficult, as it would be investing in a new system. That new system, with the reported lenses, could still be very promising. The 3 lenses proposed would go a long way towards rounding out a nice kit, as long as the lenses are good.
    Ashwin Rao
    Seattle, WA
    My Photography

  36. #36
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    804
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Leica SL (601) ..Oct 20th?

    Ok, let this be real so that I can ditch my unloved (though excellent files producing) Sony a7rII along with the boring (though some of them technically really good) e-mount lenses and use all my sweet m-mount glass on a 21st century digital Leica body.
    Likes 1 Member(s) liked this post

  37. #37
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Los Angeles, CA
    Posts
    673
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Leica SL (601) ..Oct 20th?

    Quote Originally Posted by mjr View Post
    I've not seen what it looks like or the price yet, where are you guys looking for this info? Wouldn't mind having a look!
    There's a blurry photo of it floating around the rumour sites. It's in the background of a picture of S.E. Leica binoculars.

  38. #38
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Los Angeles, CA
    Posts
    673
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Leica SL (601) ..Oct 20th?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lars Vinberg View Post
    Just for argument's sake: Think about it - moving the lens or moving the sensor for focusing is technically the same thing. Focus is determined by lens distance from focal plane.
    In some lenses there is internal focus whereby not all lenses move for focus.
    So you need pretty much the same precision and speed whether you move the sensor or the glass.
    For larger lenses there will be far more mass to move than in the sensor assembly.

    Now, if someone could make an in-body tilt+shift+focus+IS sensor, wouldn't that be something?

    It won't work for all lens designs. FLE lenses in particular don't work that way.

    The in-body shift wouldn't be a problem assuming the lenses were designed in such a way that they could handle a larger area then the sensor. As in. Say you had a S lens mounted on a 35mm camera and the sensor shifted, that'd work. But of course the 35mm camera would have to have the S-flange distance and mount/camera box size.
    Likes 1 Member(s) liked this post

  39. #39
    Super Duper
    Senior Member

    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Germany
    Posts
    3,623
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Leica SL (601) ..Oct 20th?

    Quote Originally Posted by ashwinrao1 View Post
    For me, I would want a sensor that could work with M lenses...basically, that takes 6 bit coding, applies the appropriate correction, and does okay with RF wides. THis may well be asking too much, but having the 6 bit option and another way to utilize my M lens kit would be cool.

    If it does not take M lenses, then the proposition becomes a bit more difficult, as it would be investing in a new system. That new system, with the reported lenses, could still be very promising. The 3 lenses proposed would go a long way towards rounding out a nice kit, as long as the lenses are good.
    But if you want to use it with M lenses, I would probably rather use a M body.

  40. #40
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Reykjavik, Iceland
    Posts
    2,310
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    9

    Re: Leica SL (601) ..Oct 20th?

    Quote Originally Posted by retow View Post
    Ok, let this be real so that I can ditch my unloved (though excellent files producing) Sony a7rII along with the boring (though some of them technically really good) e-mount lenses and use all my sweet m-mount glass on a 21st century digital Leica body.
    You and me both, sir. I mostly use the Sonys for video though, and I think it is probably a bit too much to hope that whatever Leica produces will be able to match them on that front. Nothing they have released so far seems to do video that can keep up with Sony, Panasonic or Canon, so it seems like Sony will still have a role in workflows that include video...Still holding out hope for the 007 on that regard, but getting any information at all from anyone about its video capabilities is basically like pulling teeth...I had some questions that even Leica customer service in Germany could not answer at the time.
    In any case, I am curious to see what they come up with and optimistic that it will be good!
    My photos are here: http://www.stuartrichardson.com and more recent work here: http://stuartrichardson.tumblr.com/ Please have a look at my book!
    My lab is here: http://www.customphotolab.is and on facebook

  41. #41
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    North Sweden
    Posts
    1,401
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Leica SL (601) ..Oct 20th?

    Stuart, the 007 is pretty cool for video, the 4k recorded internally is amazing but I have not used it in anger yet. I have a job in 2 weeks that will involve recording an interview and I will use the S for that but only in HD, small things annoy me like the lemo audio adapter not being available yet so I am picking up an external sound recorder, it has taken me 2 weeks to get them to send me a spare battery and the ac adapter is also not available at the moment, things like that cripple what should be a very capable system. I am only using the 007 for video in corporate situations like interviews and things, not making a movie with it but the few tests I did with 4k shot through the 180mm looked absolutely beautiful. I have no experience with Sony for video.

    Mat
    http://matrichardson.com/
    Workshops for 2018! http://www.matrichardson.com/workshops
    Likes 2 Member(s) liked this post

  42. #42
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Los Angeles, CA
    Posts
    673
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Leica SL (601) ..Oct 20th?

    Quote Originally Posted by Stuart Richardson View Post
    You and me both, sir. I mostly use the Sonys for video though, and I think it is probably a bit too much to hope that whatever Leica produces will be able to match them on that front. Nothing they have released so far seems to do video that can keep up with Sony, Panasonic or Canon, so it seems like Sony will still have a role in workflows that include video...Still holding out hope for the 007 on that regard, but getting any information at all from anyone about its video capabilities is basically like pulling teeth...I had some questions that even Leica customer service in Germany could not answer at the time.
    In any case, I am curious to see what they come up with and optimistic that it will be good!
    What did you want to know about the video?

    Rolling shutter/jello is the worst I've seen in a DSLR. If that matters to you.

    Would be AMAZING for interviews though.

  43. #43
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Posts
    314
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Leica SL (601) ..Oct 20th?

    Quote Originally Posted by aDam007 View Post
    What did you want to know about the video?

    Rolling shutter/jello is the worst I've seen in a DSLR. If that matters to you.

    Would be AMAZING for interviews though.
    aDam007,

    I may have to do a series of interviews / talking heads.

    Would you have any frame grabs from 30x45 1080p video to post?

    Billy

  44. #44
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Reykjavik, Iceland
    Posts
    2,310
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    9

    Re: Leica SL (601) ..Oct 20th?

    Quote Originally Posted by aDam007 View Post
    What did you want to know about the video?

    Rolling shutter/jello is the worst I've seen in a DSLR. If that matters to you.

    Would be AMAZING for interviews though.
    Rolling shutter does not matter to me. I am mostly interested in static shots with very high image quality for use in art installations. I wanted to know what happened if you plugged in an external recorder like the Pix-e 5h into the HDMI port. The manual says that 4k is only recordable on SD cards, and David Farkas seemed to indicate that it could not output 4k over HDMI, but at the same time they say it can output 4:2:2 video over HDMI. So is it only 1080p? And what happens if you are using the monitor while recording 4k...what does it output? If it does not output 4k, can I record 4:2:2 1080p to the external recorder at the same time it is recording 4k to the SD card, or does it just not work at all?

    Anyway, not trying to hijack the thread, but indicating that Leica still seems like video is somewhat of an afterthought for them. If it is, that is still totally fine, it just means that other cameras might still be necessary to deploy, if that is a concern.
    My photos are here: http://www.stuartrichardson.com and more recent work here: http://stuartrichardson.tumblr.com/ Please have a look at my book!
    My lab is here: http://www.customphotolab.is and on facebook

  45. #45
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Los Angeles, CA
    Posts
    673
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Leica SL (601) ..Oct 20th?

    Quote Originally Posted by Stuart Richardson View Post
    Rolling shutter does not matter to me. I am mostly interested in static shots with very high image quality for use in art installations. I wanted to know what happened if you plugged in an external recorder like the Pix-e 5h into the HDMI port. The manual says that 4k is only recordable on SD cards, and David Farkas seemed to indicate that it could not output 4k over HDMI, but at the same time they say it can output 4:2:2 video over HDMI. So is it only 1080p? And what happens if you are using the monitor while recording 4k...what does it output? If it does not output 4k, can I record 4:2:2 1080p to the external recorder at the same time it is recording 4k to the SD card, or does it just not work at all?

    Anyway, not trying to hijack the thread, but indicating that Leica still seems like video is somewhat of an afterthought for them. If it is, that is still totally fine, it just means that other cameras might still be necessary to deploy, if that is a concern.

    Yes, it's still very much an afterthought. I'll send a PM to not hijack the thread.
    Thanks 1 Member(s) thanked for this post

  46. #46
    Workshop Member ptomsu's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Austria, close to Vienna
    Posts
    3,868
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Leica SL (601) ..Oct 20th?

    Latest Update on the release from MirrorlessRumors

    Here are the full Leica SL specs! - mirrorlessrumors

    Leica SL Typ601 camera:
    – Sensor 24MP CMOS
    – Full autofocus support
    – 4K Video

    New SL lenses:
    – Leica Vario-Elmarit-SL 1: 2.8-4 / 24-90 mm ASPH.
    – Leica Apo-Vario-Elmarit-SL 1: 2.8-4 / 90-280 mm
    – Leica Summilux-SL 1: 1.4 / 50 mm ASPH.
    – Summilux-TL 35mm ASPH.
    – Macro-Elmarit-TL 60mm ASPH


    Especially the Summilux 50 and 35 as well as the Macro Elmarit got my attention. The 2.8/60 was my favorite Leical lens back in my Leicaflex and Leica R days

    Well, you never should say never again!



  47. #47
    Senior Member KeithL's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    832
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Leica SL (601) ..Oct 20th?

    Full autofocus support?

    Anyone care to expand?

  48. #48
    Workshop Member ptomsu's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Austria, close to Vienna
    Posts
    3,868
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Leica SL (601) ..Oct 20th?

    Interestingly enough, a few minutes after my prior post, MirrorleeRumors removed the 35 and 60 lenses

    Leica SL Typ601 camera:
    – Sensor 24MP CMOS
    – Full autofocus support
    – 4K Video

    New SL lenses:
    – Leica Vario-Elmarit-SL 1: 2.8-4 / 24-90 mm ASPH.
    – Leica Apo-Vario-Elmarit-SL 1: 2.8-4 / 90-280 mm
    – Leica Summilux-SL 1: 1.4 / 50 mm ASPH.

  49. #49
    Super Duper
    Senior Member
    Godfrey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Near San Jose, California
    Posts
    7,928
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Leica SL (601) ..Oct 20th?

    It's best to me to just sit tight and wait to see what Leica actually announces at this point. It should be only another week ... :-)

    G

  50. #50
    Senior Member Ario Arioldi's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Milano, Italy
    Posts
    784
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Leica SL (601) ..Oct 20th?

    Quote Originally Posted by KeithL View Post
    Full autofocus support?

    Anyone care to expand?
    Somebody has rumored a sensor based AF

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •