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Thread: Fun with the Leica SL (digital)

  1. #1251
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    Cat Nap

    S1040844 by scott kirkpatrick, on Flickr

  2. #1252
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    spring has sprung

    In Jerusalem, we have some wildflowers at all seasons, but warm weather and spring season has now brought out the flowering trees, at least some of them:

    R1000106 by scott kirkpatrick, on Flickr

    SL [email protected]

  3. #1253
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    Re: Spring

    Also some of the succulents:

    R1000109 by scott kirkpatrick, on Flickr

  4. #1254
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    SL 16-36 at heights of 3' or less

    R1000169 by scott kirkpatrick, on Flickr SL, SVE [email protected] f/4.1

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    SL APO 75, close up

    S1040860 by scott kirkpatrick, on Flickr

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    Two more, couldn't resist


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    Re: Two more, couldn't resist

    Quote Originally Posted by scott kirkpatrick View Post
    Two more, couldn't resist
    Resistance is futile, but I don't mind. Nice flower shots
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  8. #1258
    Senior Member vieri's Avatar
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    Stormy sunset at Playa Barrika, Basque Country (Spain)

    Storm at sunset, a 2-minutes exposure taken at amazing Playa Barrika in the Basque Country on the Atlantic Coast of Spain during a Workshop I led there. Leica SL, Leica Vario-Elmarit-SL 24-90mm and Formatt-Hitech Firecrest filters.



    Thank you for viewing, best regards

    Vieri
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    Re: Stormy sunset at Playa Barrika, Basque Country (Spain)

    Quote Originally Posted by vieri View Post
    Storm at sunset, a 2-minutes exposure taken at amazing Playa Barrika in the Basque Country on the Atlantic Coast of Spain during a Workshop I led there. Leica SL, Leica Vario-Elmarit-SL 24-90mm and Formatt-Hitech Firecrest filters.



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    Vieri
    That’s a beautiful shot!

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    Re: Stormy sunset at Playa Barrika, Basque Country (Spain)

    Quote Originally Posted by Greg Haag View Post
    That’s a beautiful shot!
    Thank you very much Greg, I am glad you enjoyed it

    Best regards,

    Vieri
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    Tre Cime di Lavaredo, Italy

    A different view of Tre Cime di Lavaredo at sunset, in the amazing Dolomites mountain range in Italy. This is a 24 seconds exposure taken with Leica SL, Laowa 12mm Zero-D and Formatt Hitech Filters Firecrest Ultra.



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    Vieri
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    Sunset at Urro del Manzano, Cantabria (Spain)

    Urro del Manzano at Sunset, in Cantabria (Spain). This is a 60 second long exposure taken with Leica SL, Leica Vario-Elmarit-SL 24-90mm and Formatt-Hitech Firecrest filters.



    Thank you for viewing, best regards

    Vieri
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  13. #1263
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    Holding on

    Summilux 50-M ASPH at f/5.6.

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  14. #1264
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    San Giovanni in Ranui, Dolomites

    When you arrive to the tiny church of San Giovanni in Ranui, on the Dolomites (Italy), you are faced with one of these classic views that have been photographed to death but which timeless beauty is just undeniable. On a beautiful May sunset, I forewent the sunset colours and portrayed it in a dramatic black & white, with the help of an amazing sky and of a 2-minutes long exposure. With Leica SL, Leica Vario-Elmarit-SL 24-90mm and the incredible Formatt-Hitech Firecrest Ultra filters.



    Thank you for viewing, best regards

    Vieri
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    Re: Sunset at Urro del Manzano, Cantabria (Spain)

    Quote Originally Posted by vieri View Post
    Urro del Manzano at Sunset, in Cantabria (Spain). This is a 60 second long exposure taken with Leica SL, Leica Vario-Elmarit-SL 24-90mm and Formatt-Hitech Firecrest filters.

    Vieri, it took me a while to work out what puzzled me about this picture. You don't say what focal length you used, but you generally favour (very) wide angles.

    The horizon is not just level, but perfectly straight. In reality (in a very wide angle view) would we not be able to see the slight curvature of the earth's surface? I realise this is an odd statement, as if I was expecting some barrel distortion; that's not what I have in mind, just that the horizon seems too straight.
    Sláinte

    Robert.
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    Re: Sunset at Urro del Manzano, Cantabria (Spain)

    Quote Originally Posted by Robert Campbell View Post
    The horizon is not just level, but perfectly straight. In reality (in a very wide angle view) would we not be able to see the slight curvature of the earth's surface? I realise this is an odd statement, as if I was expecting some barrel distortion; that's not what I have in mind, just that the horizon seems too straight.
    The exif says the shot is taken at 28 mm, so not super wide.

    Secondly I think the horizon looking out over the sea is always straight, even with the widest angle lens, the points at which we see the horizon are all at exactly the same distance from where we stand, and therefore by definition perfectly horizontal and straight.
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    Re: Sunset at Urro del Manzano, Cantabria (Spain)

    Quote Originally Posted by Robert Campbell View Post
    Vieri, it took me a while to work out what puzzled me about this picture. You don't say what focal length you used, but you generally favour (very) wide angles.

    The horizon is not just level, but perfectly straight. In reality (in a very wide angle view) would we not be able to see the slight curvature of the earth's surface? I realise this is an odd statement, as if I was expecting some barrel distortion; that's not what I have in mind, just that the horizon seems too straight.
    Quote Originally Posted by pegelli View Post
    The exif says the shot is taken at 28 mm, so not super wide.

    Secondly I think the horizon looking out over the sea is always straight, even with the widest angle lens, the points at which we see the horizon are all at exactly the same distance from where we stand, and therefore by definition perfectly horizontal and straight.
    Robert, I think pegelli's explanation makes sense - possibly, what you always thought it's the Earth curvature in other photographs was, in fact, some lens' barrel distortion?

    Best regards,

    Vieri
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    Re: Fun with the Leica SL (digital)

    Quote Originally Posted by pegelli View Post
    The exif says the shot is taken at 28 mm, so not super wide.

    Secondly I think the horizon looking out over the sea is always straight, even with the widest angle lens, the points at which we see the horizon are all at exactly the same distance from where we stand, and therefore by definition perfectly horizontal and straight.
    Quote Originally Posted by vieri View Post
    Robert, I think pegelli's explanation makes sense - possibly, what you always thought it's the Earth curvature in other photographs was, in fact, some lens' barrel distortion?
    Thanks both for your comments.

    1. pegelli: I'm not sure about this. I'm sure that if you have a wide enough view you can see the curvature of the earth, though it is very slight. You do often need to be high up to experience properly.

    2. Vieri: I wasn't thinking about other photos, rather (as above) what I'd experienced previously.

    I'd not noticed this absolutely level and straight horizon in other photos of yours; I suspect that may be because you generally have something at the edge blocking one end of the horizon.

    3. I was also thinking of entasis. This is a feature of Greek architecture, where vertical columns bulge very slightly in the middle. This isn't apparent to the naked eye, but makes their proportions appear "more natural"; it's a sort of visual illusion. The Parthenon uses entasis in its columns.

    There is a similar architectural "trick" on the horizontal. The Library of Celsus at Ephesus was built on a very constricted site, and to make it look bigger it is slightly bowed in the middle, and the outer columns are slightly shorter than the central ones. The Parthenon also has this, as apparently does the radiator grille of older Rolls-Royces; alas, I'm not in a position to confirm this.

    I'm not criticising your image, Vieri; as usual, it is technically perfect. But because of this, in relation to the horizon, it appears to me to be not quite right. I'm rather suggesting that there should be a very slight curve to the horizon, concave downwards, to make it appear straight.
    Sláinte

    Robert.

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    Re: Sunset at Urro del Manzano, Cantabria (Spain)

    Quote Originally Posted by pegelli View Post
    The exif says the shot is taken at 28 mm, so not super wide.

    Secondly I think the horizon looking out over the sea is always straight, even with the widest angle lens, the points at which we see the horizon are all at exactly the same distance from where we stand, and therefore by definition perfectly horizontal and straight.
    \begin
    In a cylindrical projection, this is true. But projecting a circle onto a plane makes a conic section. In this case, a hyperbola - a VERY flat hyperbola, but one nonetheless.

    Another way to think of it - If you were at an altitude of 100,000 miles, the earth's horizon would certainly not look straight, so why would it at an altitude of 5 feet?

    To be precise, if the entire horizon is visible to the plane, then you see an ellipse - otherwise a hyperbola. Circles and parabolas require infinitely precise positioning.
    \end

    Matt
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    Re: Sunset at Urro del Manzano, Cantabria (Spain)

    Quote Originally Posted by MGrayson View Post
    \begin
    In a cylindrical projection, this is true. But projecting a circle onto a plane makes a conic section. In this case, it is a hyperbola - a VERY flat hyperbola, but one nonetheless.

    Another way to think of it - If you were at an altitude of 100,000 miles, the earth's horizon would certainly not look straight, so why would it at an altitude of 5 feet?

    To be precise, if the entire horizon is visible to the plane, then you see an ellipse - otherwise a hyperbola. Circles and parabolas require very exact positioning.
    \end

    Matt
    You might be right, but I have difficulty understanding why my theory doesn't work.

    Imagine yourself standing at the shoreline, with your eyes about 6 feet above ground.
    From that point you would have a 180 degree view of the horizon, and if the earth (or the water surface) were a perfect sphere you would be able to look the same distance, left, center and right, and you would see the horizon at all these points at the same height. I think connecting these points would give you a straight line.

    In other words, your eyes are the exact center of a circle, which lies in the plane of your eyes to the horizon, hence the inside of that circle looks like a straight line.

    Any real mathematical help to debunk or confirm my theory is appreciated

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    Re: Fun with the Leica SL (digital)

    Quote Originally Posted by Robert Campbell View Post
    ...

    2. Vieri: I wasn't thinking about other photos, rather (as above) what I'd experienced previously.
    You mean experienced in the real world? Sorry - I thought you meant experienced previously looking at photos;

    I'd not noticed this absolutely level and straight horizon in other photos of yours; I suspect that may be because you generally have something at the edge blocking one end of the horizon.

    ...
    Now I am confused You said you weren't thinking about other photos, now you talk about comparisons with my other photos...

    Anyway, your point is well taken

    ...

    3. I was also thinking of entasis. This is a feature of Greek architecture, where vertical columns bulge very slightly in the middle. This isn't apparent to the naked eye, but makes their proportions appear "more natural"; it's a sort of visual illusion. The Parthenon uses entasis in its columns.

    There is a similar architectural "trick" on the horizontal. The Library of Celsus at Ephesus was built on a very constricted site, and to make it look bigger it is slightly bowed in the middle, and the outer columns are slightly shorter than the central ones. The Parthenon also has this, as apparently does the radiator grille of older Rolls-Royces; alas, I'm not in a position to confirm this.

    I'm not criticising your image, Vieri; as usual, it is technically perfect. But because of this, in relation to the horizon, it appears to me to be not quite right. I'm rather suggesting that there should be a very slight curve to the horizon, concave downwards, to make it appear straight.
    This makes a lot of sense - it has been a long time since I studied classic architecture, and while I find myself applying these principles without thinking when shooting architecture, where I never go for perfectly straight verticals even if I could, always leaving an extremely subtle "converging" feel to them because it just "looks right", I never thought about using this trick for horizon on the sea. I'll think about it, but - at the moment - "adding it in" is something that does not feel quite right... for some reason, I would feel OK with not correcting it were it present, but adding it in goes a bit against my approach. Again, thank you for your comment, very stimulating - I will definitely think about it.

    Best regards,

    Vieri
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    Re: Sunset at Urro del Manzano, Cantabria (Spain)

    Quote Originally Posted by pegelli View Post
    You might be right, but I have difficulty understanding why my theory doesn't work.

    Imagine yourself standing at the shoreline, with your eyes about 6 feet above ground.
    From that point you would have a 180 degree view of the horizon, and if the earth (or the water surface) were a perfect sphere you would be able to look the same distance, left, center and right, and you would see the horizon at all these points at the same height. I think connecting these points would give you a straight line.

    In other words, your eyes are the exact center of a circle, which lies in the plane of your eyes to the horizon, hence the inside of that circle looks like a straight line.

    Any real mathematical help to debunk or confirm my theory is appreciated
    The problem is that the circle is NOT at your eye level, but somewhat below it. I will calculate the exact distance, but it is obviously at least the height of your eyes above the ground. Mind you, the effect I'm talking about is probably so small that I doubt any existing camera could detect it. I was being pedantic.

    If the film were cylindrical with some nodal point at the center, then your argument would be exactly correct. Since film is a plane, there is a slight distortion.

    Here is the actual math. Assume a perfectly spherical Earth. Let r=4000 miles be the radius of the earth and h=5 feet the height of the camera above the surface. The height of the horizon circle is exactly h*r/(r+h) below the ground, making it h+h*r/(r+h) below the camera. Given how much bigger r is than h, this is VERY closely approximated by 2*h, or about 10 feet (the second term in the expansion is about 1/80,000 of an inch). The horizon circle has radius very closely approximated by Sqrt[2*r*h], or about 2.75 miles. So our cone has slope 10/(2.75*5280), or about 0.0007.

    The hyperbola on the sensor plane using, say, a 25 mm focal length lens, gives the curve -.0007*Sqrt[625+x^2], where x is the number of mm off-axis. This drops from 17 microns below center to 21 microns by the edge for a drop of 4 microns. So about 1 pixel.

    Now if you were on top of a mile high mountain looking out to sea, the calculation puts the horizon over half a mm below dead center, and dropping another 0.12 mm by the edge. With 5 micron pixels, this is 24 pixels. The horizon would appear curved.

    Matt
    Last edited by MGrayson; 3 Weeks Ago at 10:07.
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    Re: Sunset at Urro del Manzano, Cantabria (Spain)

    Quote Originally Posted by MGrayson View Post
    The problem is that the circle is NOT at your eye level, but somewhat below it. I will calculate the exact distance, but it is obviously at least the height of your eyes above the ground. Mind you, the effect I'm talking about is probably so small that I doubt any existing camera could detect it. I was being pedantic.
    Thanks Matt, and I don't mind you being pedantic and after your explanation I think I understand it better.

    So from the top of the table mountain in South Africa you should be able to spot the curvature of the earth. Maybe a reason to go there and see if I can see it
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    Re: Fun with the Leica SL (digital)

    A bit of curvature @ 35,000 feet
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    Re: Fun with the Leica SL (digital)

    Quote Originally Posted by vieri View Post
    ...
    This makes a lot of sense - it has been a long time since I studied classic architecture, and while I find myself applying these principles without thinking when shooting architecture, where I never go for perfectly straight verticals even if I could, always leaving an extremely subtle "converging" feel to them because it just "looks right", I never thought about using this trick for horizon on the sea. I'll think about it, but - at the moment - "adding it in" is something that does not feel quite right... for some reason, I would feel OK with not correcting it were it present, but adding it in goes a bit against my approach. Again, thank you for your comment, very stimulating - I will definitely think about it.
    My apologies for any confusion, Vieri; and thanks for responding to this rather arcane discussion.

    Perhaps I'm just particularly sensitive to level horizons (and plumb verticals). My mother had a strange and rather embarrassing habit when out visiting, or even going to a restaurant, of looking at the pictures on the walls, deciding they weren't level, and then correcting them. I seem to have inherited this; I have to make a real effort not to change other people's pictures

    Your point about verticals is interesting. I often find that in architectural photos of tallish buildings, say a cathedral, and ones taken with a tilt/shift lens, that the upper part "dominates" as if it is leaning out towards me. I find this unsettling. I know we are supposed to have the verticals of buildings exactly plumb, but for me this appearance is "wrong". I think, as you say, that the upper parts should lead ever so slightly backwards (that is, the verticals should slightly converge) to give a "natural" appearance.
    Sláinte

    Robert.

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    Triangles at Playa de Mexota, Spain

    At Playa de Mexota, Asturias (Spain), you'll find yourself facing a sail-shaped sea stack towering in the Atlantic ocean. After climbing on the rocks facing the stack and finding a composition, it was just a matter of waiting for the sunset...*This is a 36 seconds exposures, with the help of Leica SL, Voigtlander 15mm Super Wide-Heliar and my beloved Formatt-Hitech Firecrest filters.



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    San Giovanni in Ranui, Dolomites - in colour

    This is again the famous church of San Giovanni in Ranui at sunset, on the Dolomites (Italy). This is a one-minute long exposure and this time, after posting the B&W version a few days ago, I present it to you in colour. With Leica SL, Leica Vario-Elmarit-SL 24-90mm and the incredible Formatt-Hitech Firecrest Ultra filters.



    Thank you for viewing, best regards

    Vieri
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    Re: San Giovanni in Ranui, Dolomites

    Quote Originally Posted by vieri View Post
    When you arrive to the tiny church of San Giovanni in Ranui, on the Dolomites (Italy), you are faced with one of these classic views that have been photographed to death but which timeless beauty is just undeniable. On a beautiful May sunset, I forewent the sunset colours and portrayed it in a dramatic black & white, with the help of an amazing sky and of a 2-minutes long exposure. With Leica SL, Leica Vario-Elmarit-SL 24-90mm and the incredible Formatt-Hitech Firecrest Ultra filters.



    Thank you for viewing, best regards

    Vieri
    I prefer this b/w version to the one in colour, though I'd crop the sky a bit.
    Sláinte

    Robert.

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    Senior Member vieri's Avatar
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    Land's End sunset

    Land's End, in Cornwall, is a truly magical place. Once you get past the (terrible!) amusement park-like thing close to the parking lot and start wandering along the cliffs, you realise that west of you there is nothing but ocean until the American continent's shores. Enys Dodnan Arch looks and feels like a door open towards the New World. Leica SL, Leica Super-Vario-Elmar-SL 16-35mm and the great Formatt-Hitech Firecrest Ultra filters.



    Thank you for viewing, best regards

    Vieri
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    More weird things

    S1000160 by scott kirkpatrick, on Flickr

    S1000153 by scott kirkpatrick, on Flickr

    S1000148 by scott kirkpatrick, on Flickr

    S1000147 by scott kirkpatrick, on Flickr

    all SL with APO 75 SC

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    Double cave & arch at Campiecho, Spain

    It takes wading in the ocean, water nearly chest high, to get to the Arch at Playa de Campiecho with high enough tide for the cave to be filled with water. Once you get there, however, the feeling and the view are simply amazing! Taken at sunset during the Workshop I led in Atlantic Spain in 2017 with Leica SL, Voigtlander 15mm and Formatt-Hitech Firecrest filters.



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    Vieri
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    Re: Fun with the Leica SL (digital)

    "Batter down!" Had to chop him off below the shoulders or lose the shot. 50/2-M version IV at f/5.6.

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    Re: Fun with the Leica SL (digital)

    My granny used to make drop-scones like this on her coke fired kitchen range....it was so hot it used to 'tick' and the scones cooked instantly to be scooped onto a plate!......delicous!

    ............You could have cut off the gas cylinders and feet instead and made a much better shot!

  34. #1284
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
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    Jerusalem, Israel
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    Re: Fun with the Leica SL (digital)


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