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Mr. Kaltner out...

rayyan

Well-known member
It might be hard to imagine ( if you live in Europe e.g ) that getting sensor replaced is not as easy as just sending it in by DHL, or whatever. And worse getting it back...hopefully repaired.

I have experienced the pain. Most on this forum have not. And I paid the same money as most of you for my Ms and lenses.

Luckily we don't have to send our German cars back to Munich or Stuttgart.

p.s. No more Leicas for me...I think!
 

fotografz

Well-known member
And this is one of the things that stays in the forefront of my mind. I've already had a bride at a consultation wag her iPhone under my nose and state disdainfully, "I have 150 friends with these. I don't need you." :angry::cussing:
Maybe I need to find that forest in Japan that elderly people walk into and don't come out. (Aokigahara Forest)
Nah, I'm too stubborn.

But, that is all off topic. Sorry, took an off ramp there.

2017 will hopefully draw back the curtain on a lot of Leica's plans. Hopefully, the new CEO will do a fantastic job.
Yeah Rick, nothing brought the shift in photography into sharp focus for me more than the demise of wedding photography. The proliferation of cell-phones, and propensity for brief moments of satisfaction with poor images on social media, combined to gut any recognition of craftsmanship and ability to tell a poignant story. Even brides with some taste and appreciation of good work would mix in horribly lit, badly composed, ill time shots with their paid images on FB, and not make any distinction. Nor did the viewers who bestowed a zillion likes on pics most of us would delete as mistakes. (sigh).

When I first started doing weddings I primarily shot B&W film with a few posed shots in color, and made books with hand-done B&W silver-prints. Back then, I predominately marketed myself to other creative people. Most all of the B&W work was shot with a pair of Ms (M6s then M7s).

IF I "sparingly" do any more weddings I am considering a return to that business model ... which is one reason why the new M-10 is of interest ... but more importantly the reliability and service has to be cleaned up in the USA so it can be something we can professionally count on. Hope the new "Leader of Leica" comes to grips with what is happening here.

- Marc
 

fotoism

Member
When my daughter got married last year she hired wedding photographers.

At the beginning of the ceremony she made the MC announced to the audience that professional photographers were hired and no cell phone or ipad photography from the audience was to be allowed during the ceremony. And no one other than the official photographers were to run around taking pictures. Her reason was simple: She wants to see the faces of her guests at the ceremony, not their cellphones or ipads obliterating themselves. After the ceremony (such as the reception), they could do whatever they want.

I think she imposed a very wise policy.
 

peterv

New member
This may be of interest to you guys too:

http://forum.luminous-landscape.com/index.php?topic=116259.0

Me, I'm still very happy with my S2-P, 24, 70CS and 120CS. I've had my moments of doubt because of all the FUD that's being spread around the net. Especially during these past few months, it seems. People with what, a history of 5-10 posts on this board, LuLa and LUF preaching that the sky is falling ...

I get so fed up with this that I don't even bother anymore. Nowadays I just skim over what's written, lots of haters. So much so that it gets a bit annoying, really.

My S system just keeps on delivering outstanding IQ, even with '10 year old tech'.
 

jonoslack

Active member
Because the MM replacement sensor isn't a corrected one ... so it also will fail. I don't know about anyone else, but I've already spent an inordinate amount of time getting Leica Products fixed, as well as being without them while they take a month of Sundays to fix it.

Like you, I also am happy with the interface and results for the most part. But if you do not "generally" trust a product, or the company's ability to provide timely reliable service, then the IQ doesn't matter.

- Marc
HI Marc
As I understand it the MM sensor is corrected - I had one of the early ones in my MM (which showed corrosion).

Where have you learned otherwise?


Best
 

fotografz

Well-known member
HI Marc
As I understand it the MM sensor is corrected - I had one of the early ones in my MM (which showed corrosion).

Where have you learned otherwise?


Best
Thanks Jono ... where is there any official communication (private or public) from Leica that the replacement sensor for the MM(9) is a permanent corrosion free solution into future?

My info came from someone close to Leica that was told that CCD sensor camera is eventually terminal due to corrosion ... that doesn't sound like sensor replacements are permanent.

Personally, I hope you are right! I so not need or want any other B&W camera other than my MM, and to my eye no color camera + conversions has come close to the files it produces except on occasion the CCD based S2/S006 in certain types of light (good quality/quantity).

- Marc
 

KeithL

Well-known member
Thanks Jono ... where is there any official communication (private or public) from Leica that the replacement sensor for the MM(9) is a permanent corrosion free solution into future?

My info came from someone close to Leica that was told that CCD sensor camera is eventually terminal due to corrosion ... that doesn't sound like sensor replacements are permanent.


Personally, I hope you are right! I so not need or want any other B&W camera other than my MM, and to my eye no color camera + conversions has come close to the files it produces except on occasion the CCD based S2/S006 in certain types of light (good quality/quantity).

- Marc
My emphasis.

Marc, just wondering, have CCD sensors used by other manufacturers suffered from corrosion?
 

docmoore

Subscriber and Workshop Member
Personally, I hope you are right! I so not need or want any other B&W camera other than my MM, and to my eye no color camera + conversions has come close to the files it produces except on occasion the CCD based S2/S006 in certain types of light (good quality/quantity).

- Marc
I too hope so ... as I am negotiating for an unused MM1 ... had both and really preferred the image of the MM1 over the M246 ... although the live view video and better battery in the M246 were
great.

Should know this afternoon ... about the MM1.

Bob
 

D&A

Well-known member
My understanding is that the sensor corrosion issue as elaborated on elsewhere, was due to the coverglass used, not the sensor itself.

Initially the repacement sensors (with coverglass) were simply the same old sensors/coverglass which were subject to same corrosion issues. Yet when the new redesigned ones were ready, they began employing these and from what I understand they are supposed to be corrosion resistant. This is whats now being employed for both M9/MM1 cameras that need their original sensors replaced.

As for the tonality of B&W imagery created by MM1, I concur with Marc that few of any cameras I used to convert color files to B&W can match the MM1.

Dave (D&A)
 
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glenerrolrd

Workshop Member
I just spoke with my dealer..who is in a position to know and he swears the MM sensor replacement is a permanent fix . :banghead:
 

docmoore

Subscriber and Workshop Member
My understanding is that the sensor corrosion issue as elbaorated on elsewhere, was due to the coverglass used, not the sesor itself.

Initially the repacement sesnors (with coverglass) were simply the same old sensors/coverglass which were subject to same corrosion issues. Yet when the new redesigned ones were ready, they began employing these and from what I understand they are supposed to be corrosion resistant. This is not whats employed for both M9/MM1 cameras that need their sesnors replaced.


Dave (D&A)
Hi Dave


The apposition of this sentence ..."This is not whats employed for both M9/MM1 cameras that need their sesnors replaced." to the preceding one lends one to think you are suggesting
that the M9/MM1 replacement is a kludge that will fail in time. Perhaps I am reading this incorrectly ... but I do not follow your statement otherwise.

Thanks

Bob
 

D&A

Well-known member
Hi Bob,

My apologies for the confusion. Thats what happens when I try typing a response on my cell phone while running off to a meeting.

I corrected my post above (the one you quoted) and it should now read correctly. To emphasize, the replacement sensors/coverglass now employed should be corrosion resistant and for all intent and purposes puts an end to this sensor issue.

Dave (D&A)
 
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V

Vivek

Guest
Any chance that the MM's price will go up? Should i hold onto to mine?
 

jonoslack

Active member
Because the MM replacement sensor isn't a corrected one ... so it also will fail. I don't know about anyone else, but I've already spent an inordinate amount of time getting Leica Products fixed, as well as being without them while they take a month of Sundays to fix it.

Like you, I also am happy with the interface and results for the most part. But if you do not "generally" trust a product, or the company's ability to provide timely reliable service, then the IQ doesn't matter.

- Marc
Hi Marc
I've properly checked up on this one.
The MM sensor replacement, Like the M9 sensor replacement - is a corrected one
The same problem will not happen again, because the glass used which 'exfoliated' is not used in the replacement sensors (since the announcement that it was fixed).

I'm actually going to repeat this as a thread header, because it's unfortunate if people are doubting the longevity of the new sensor (of course, it's not immortal, any more than you, I, or the sensor in the Nikon D5)

best
 
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