Site Sponsors
Results 1 to 23 of 23

Thread: So how's that M10 treating you?

  1. #1
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Posts
    1,585
    Post Thanks / Like

    So how's that M10 treating you?

    Thought I'd start a new thread asking how the M10 is performing out in the wild, as good information on the camera's performance after the initial hype of release has died down seems burried in other threads, etc.

    To state my background, I cut my photographic teeth on Leica, with an M3, then M6, M7 and M4-P. My favourite body by far was the M3–although if shooting them all today I'd say the M6 (classic) as I need the 35mm framelines. My favourite lenses were the collapsable 50mm Summicron and the V2 35mm Summicron. I also owned the last version 50mm Summicron (was an amazing lens at the time and I loved it, but loved the little focusing tab with rotating ball "thing" on the collapsable version more,) and a 35mm Summilux ASPH (which I thought was good, but wished I got the smaller Summicron as it didn't block the VF as much.) THe last lens I bought was the 28mm Elmarit ASPH.

    My love affair with Leica took a dramatic nose dive when I bought the M8. I sold three film bodies to get it, and so started a total disaster. Without going over the IR debacle–I was stupid enough to trust a good many internet reviews before buying that said the M8 had that 'Leica glow', i.e. not disclosing that synthetic blacks would appear purple–but the M8 spent 10 out of 12 months in service, and two of my lenses had to be sent back to Leica 3 times for a total of 10 months of a year to be calibrated and coded, each time returning with either no work done on them or something forgotten... Anyway, at this point I got angry and sold my entire Leica kit, swearing never to buy any of their products again... After a long period with Mamiya 7ii and Imacon 949 scanners, I've been shooting only technical cameras, 4x5" and 6x7cm for over 8 years now. But my back and shoulders hurt, and I'd like to go for a walk with a camera that doesn't cripple me for days afterwards...

    Well, now I see the M10. Is it possible that this is the M camera that will finally put all that bad history to bed? It seems like the perfect body to me. Bigger, better VF. Slimmer like an M7 or M6TTL. Pretty good noise levels up to 6400ISO. Finally, an ISO dial on the body. What's not to like, except maybe the price? (Gulp.)

    Anyway, I'm interested to know what people feel about the new camera now that it has been out for a while. Can people post general or specific thoughts here, and share some M10 pictures to fuel my gear lust?

  2. #2
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Jerusalem, Israel
    Posts
    1,274
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: So how's that M10 treating you?

    I've had mine for just a few weeks, and am very happy with it. I went through the M8 period, and still have an M8.2, which needs the IR filters but is quite reliable. I have an M240 and will hang on to it, although I had thought of selling. The M10 is a big step up in ability to recover shadow detail, not just higher ISO than the M240, and its handling, menus, etc, have been cleaned up a bit. (Although the M240 is not particularly complicated.) And the ISO dial is nice. I have exposure compensation on the rear dial, usually work in A mode, and everything just works without thinking. I post pictures in the M image thread or maybe the M10 image thread from time to time. I wear glasses but can finally see the entire frame with a 28mm (the little Elmarit-asph) using the M10's viewfinder. So far I've been shooting my M10 with that 28 and with an APO Summicron 50. I got a Visoflex 020 used on E-Bay while I was waiting for the M10. It's quite useable (the VF-2 that was used with the 240 was not), but for working with very long lenses, I find there are better solutions. But for flowers and stuff close, the tilt-up viewfinder works very well.

    So sign up. The wait is getting shorter.

    scott
    pre 2015: http://www.pbase.com/skirkp
    current: https://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/albums
    Thanks 1 Member(s) thanked for this post

  3. #3
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Posts
    1,585
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: So how's that M10 treating you?

    Thanks for your reply. I'm yet to cobble together the cash for such a purchase, but to be honest the M10 is right up there on my list.
    For what I'd want to use it for, it'd be a bit of a toss up between it and the Hasselblad X1d. Two very different cameras, I know, but great form factors. The Leica has the VF experience and smaller size that I appreciate, while the X1d is a great modern alternative to my old Mamiya 7ii.

    It's a good time to buy cameras, I guess!

  4. #4
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Posts
    1,585
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: So how's that M10 treating you?

    Anyone else out there got some M10 experiences to share? I was going through some old scans of negatives yesterday and now acutely miss my old Leica cameras...

  5. #5
    New Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2015
    Posts
    16
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: So how's that M10 treating you?

    Quote Originally Posted by tjv View Post
    Anyone else out there got some M10 experiences to share? I was going through some old scans of negatives yesterday and now acutely miss my old Leica cameras...

    NO NO NO - waiting, waiting, waiting ........
    while Sony starts a grand celebration and availability.
    Maybe Leica should have said, New M10 coming August 2017 - maybe then the demand and supply would be aligned. I'm thinking of cancelling my "preorder".
    Thanks 1 Member(s) thanked for this post

  6. #6
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Posts
    1,585
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: So how's that M10 treating you?

    But the Sony is a completely different camera. I understand the frustrations–I waited for 12 months after prepaying for an F1 Noctilux that I ended up cancelling out of principle–but after a day with a EVF, I'm not convinced I'll ever like anything as much as a Leica or Mamiya 7 RF. For digital, it's pretty much the M10 or nothing, right?

    Quote Originally Posted by gregkoz View Post
    NO NO NO - waiting, waiting, waiting ........
    while Sony starts a grand celebration and availability.
    Maybe Leica should have said, New M10 coming August 2017 - maybe then the demand and supply would be aligned. I'm thinking of cancelling my "preorder".
    Likes 1 Member(s) liked this post

  7. #7
    New Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2015
    Posts
    16
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: So how's that M10 treating you?

    Quote Originally Posted by gregkoz View Post
    NO NO NO - waiting, waiting, waiting ........
    while Sony starts a grand celebration and availability.
    Maybe Leica should have said, New M10 coming August 2017 - maybe then the demand and supply would be aligned. I'm thinking of cancelling my "preorder".
    Ok - I have both and just love bouncing back and forth between them. Can't touch Sony's focusing speed and Leica's image Q.

  8. #8
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Abu Dhabi
    Posts
    264
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    6

    Re: So how's that M10 treating you?

    I got mine (black) after only 3 weeks waiting in March, 5 days after is was produced according to the sticker. I can't really answer your question since this is my first M ( I also have a X2 which I love but this is a different league ) and I come from a Nikon D4s but I am happy to give my impression. Meanwhile I took around 1500 shots and it is still a learning curve but I love the camera. I have no issues at all (battery life, memory card) and last week I completed my set of lenses (Summilux 28 + 50) by getting the APO Summicron 1:2/90. The whole set feels like a feather compared to the Nikon gear in the backpack. The body feels really solid and first time I held it in my hands, I was surprised about the weight (nothing in comparison to the D4s), the attached lens fits tight, nothing wobbles (for that much money I wouldn't expect anything less ) and my biggest concern, focussing, is getting better and better.

  9. #9
    Super Duper
    Senior Member
    Godfrey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Near San Jose, California
    Posts
    7,902
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: So how's that M10 treating you?

    Great idea for a thread, it's good to get feedback about a camera that isn't still in the "just released hype and nirvana" stage of its market life. Only issue is that for many the M10 is still a 'soon to be received' purchase ... it seems a little early in the product cycle to have the kind of longish-term feedback that would be most interesting.

    I don't have an M10, I have an M-D typ 262 and the SL system. I'm about at the point where I can give this kind of longish-term review on them since I've had the SL for a year and a half and the M-D for about a year, and I've used both of them extensively (for me ... I'm not a "thousand shots a week" kind of photographer ;-). But that would be a little OT for your query. Suffice it to say that I am happy enough with both of these cameras that a) I still enjoy using them as if I bought them yesterday, and b) I have not looked seriously at any new camera announcements (other than the Hasselblad X1D) since I purchased the M-D. I have no bad experiences of any kind with either of these cameras to report: they just work, and work, and satisfy me with what I can do with them.

    I mention the X1D because I continue to be intrigued with it as a specialist niche machine, the same way that the Hasselblad SWC has been my specialist niche camera of choice. That body with its larger sensor and the pair of lenses (22 and macro 100 mm) would complement the M-D and the SL nicely, with different strengths. But I continue to question whether I'd get enough use of it to be worth the expense, where I know now that I use both the M-D and the SL quite a lot, well worth what I paid for them, and will continue to for years to come.

    G

  10. #10
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Reykjavik, Iceland
    Posts
    2,309
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    9

    Re: So how's that M10 treating you?

    Quote Originally Posted by tjv View Post
    Thought I'd start a new thread asking how the M10 is performing out in the wild, as good information on the camera's performance after the initial hype of release has died down seems burried in other threads, etc.

    To state my background, I cut my photographic teeth on Leica, with an M3, then M6, M7 and M4-P. My favourite body by far was the M3–although if shooting them all today I'd say the M6 (classic) as I need the 35mm framelines. My favourite lenses were the collapsable 50mm Summicron and the V2 35mm Summicron. I also owned the last version 50mm Summicron (was an amazing lens at the time and I loved it, but loved the little focusing tab with rotating ball "thing" on the collapsable version more,) and a 35mm Summilux ASPH (which I thought was good, but wished I got the smaller Summicron as it didn't block the VF as much.) THe last lens I bought was the 28mm Elmarit ASPH.

    My love affair with Leica took a dramatic nose dive when I bought the M8. I sold three film bodies to get it, and so started a total disaster. Without going over the IR debacle–I was stupid enough to trust a good many internet reviews before buying that said the M8 had that 'Leica glow', i.e. not disclosing that synthetic blacks would appear purple–but the M8 spent 10 out of 12 months in service, and two of my lenses had to be sent back to Leica 3 times for a total of 10 months of a year to be calibrated and coded, each time returning with either no work done on them or something forgotten... Anyway, at this point I got angry and sold my entire Leica kit, swearing never to buy any of their products again... After a long period with Mamiya 7ii and Imacon 949 scanners, I've been shooting only technical cameras, 4x5" and 6x7cm for over 8 years now. But my back and shoulders hurt, and I'd like to go for a walk with a camera that doesn't cripple me for days afterwards...

    Well, now I see the M10. Is it possible that this is the M camera that will finally put all that bad history to bed? It seems like the perfect body to me. Bigger, better VF. Slimmer like an M7 or M6TTL. Pretty good noise levels up to 6400ISO. Finally, an ISO dial on the body. What's not to like, except maybe the price? (Gulp.)

    Anyway, I'm interested to know what people feel about the new camera now that it has been out for a while. Can people post general or specific thoughts here, and share some M10 pictures to fuel my gear lust?
    I am in the same boat. I am doing an MFA right now, and everything is on the Mamiya 7 and 4x5. It is a very satisfying way of working, but it is also a ton of work (I process, scan and print myself). One area where we differ, however, is that while I lived through the troublesome M8 days, I also got the M9. My experience with the M9 was excellent. It was (and is) a really great camera if you are willing to stick to base ISO or very slightly higher. That was not a barrier for me. I was rewarded with a compact camera with incredible color and excellent image quality using great lenses. I just recently sold mine for about a third of what I bought it for about seven years earlier. Not so bad for the digital era. I skipped the M, as I did not like the added bulk or new colors from the CMOS sensor. I had also gotten the S and had primarily shifted over to that (the 006, which I still use and love). I have had service issues with all the cameras, but Leica has always tried to resolve the issues as well as they could. All in all, I have gotten much better service from them than I did from Hasselblad, Rollei, or Mamiya which I used previously. It is comforting that you can call the factory and talk to someone sitting right next to the production line who will actually listen to what you have to say. They even wrote custom firmware for my S after it had a shutter release delay because of a quirk with the GPS software and my location in Iceland. When I got ready to sell the M9, they completely overhauled it and replaced the sensor and only charged 100 euros (the sensor replacement was free, the rest of the cost was a reduced price for a CLA). Granted, the camera's sensors had faults, but it is still something to do a very labor intensive fix a camera six years out of warranty and charge basically nothing.

    In any case, I view the M10 through this prism. It is a very well designed camera from a photographic standpoint -- it gets out of your way and allows you to focus on the scene in front of you. It attaches natively to some of the best lenses available. It is small, quiet and unobtrusive. The company behind it does make mistakes (too many for many people), but they do seem to go the extra mile to solve those mistakes, at least in my experience. In terms of file quality, I downloaded some of the original DNG's from their website. Once I zeroed out the images and loaded the embedded profile, they looked fantastic to me. I am very excited to get my hands on one. The M9 basically took the biggest flaws from the M8 and fixed them to the best of Leica's ability at the time. I think the M10 will continue in that vein -- it goes more back to the M9 in philosophy and character, and seems to solve many of the problems that it had -- more film M-like body, external ISO control, better viewfinder, better screen with live view, higher resolution, better high ISO performance, quieter shutter and so on. If it does indeed deliver good color and good reliability, I think it will be an excellent companion for a long time to come. 24mp with no AA filter and good lenses can print very well indeed.
    My photos are here: http://www.stuartrichardson.com and more recent work here: http://stuartrichardson.tumblr.com/ Please have a look at my book!
    My lab is here: http://www.customphotolab.is and on facebook
    Thanks 2 Member(s) thanked for this post
    Likes 1 Member(s) liked this post

  11. #11
    Senior Member DougDolde's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2015
    Location
    Joshua Tree, CA
    Posts
    471
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: So how's that M10 treating you?

    Apart from the ability to use different lenses, is the M10 any better than the Q ?

  12. #12
    Super Duper
    Senior Member
    Godfrey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Near San Jose, California
    Posts
    7,902
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: So how's that M10 treating you?

    Quote Originally Posted by DougDolde View Post
    Apart from the ability to use different lenses, is the M10 any better than the Q ?
    What would "better" mean in the context of comparing two such completely different cameras?

    G

  13. #13
    Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Location
    Colorado
    Posts
    194
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: So how's that M10 treating you?

    Quote Originally Posted by gregkoz View Post
    NO NO NO - waiting, waiting, waiting ........
    while Sony starts a grand celebration and availability.
    Maybe Leica should have said, New M10 coming August 2017 - maybe then the demand and supply would be aligned. I'm thinking of cancelling my "preorder".
    I'm absolutely fed up with Leica as a company, they are truly pathetic on this product roll out. I placed my order back in early February while in Chicago on a job, checked it out at Tamarkin, so I placed an order there and B&H.

    Now, with $75K worth of corporate PJ and advertising jobs lined up for the next 10 weeks, no damned M10. They have really pissed off a lot of people, especially those who want to use it for their jobs!
    Likes 2 Member(s) liked this post

  14. #14
    Super Duper
    Senior Member

    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Germany
    Posts
    3,621
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: So how's that M10 treating you?

    I certainly like my M10. Went through M6 (still here) ,M8,M9,MM,M-240,M-262..., I liked them all but in case of the M10 I find:
    + I like the slimmer body, feels like a film M
    + I do like the color I get, I feel it is a little easier to get pleasing color compared to previous models
    + I like the Visoflex better than the previous EVF, I dont use it much but for 135mm or Noctilux it can help
    it is not worlds better than previous M bodies but IMO a very satisfying and well thought out camera.
    Likes 1 Member(s) liked this post

  15. #15
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Jerusalem, Israel
    Posts
    1,274
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Small Bokeh exercise

    L8001457 1 by scott kirkpatrick, on Flickr

    craft beer from Socorro, NM

    M10, APO SC @ f/2 ISO 250

    scott

  16. #16
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Jerusalem, Israel
    Posts
    1,274
    Post Thanks / Like

    Baffin Island's most extreme challenge from the comfort of a 787

    L8001615 by scott kirkpatrick, on Flickr

    The clouds cleared and it's sunny all summer on Baffin Island. This view from 35000' is of Sam Ford fjord, site of the Polar Sun Spire and some 10 1000m vertical rock walls. When climbing conditions are right, the sun is out and temperatures are only -10 C or so, the ice is still firm, and the area is just a few days by dog sled from the nearest airstrip. It has become a bit less obscure Arctic destination than it was when I got as far as Clyde River (that nearest airstrip) in 1996.

    M10 and APO SC 50

    scott

  17. #17
    Subscriber & Workshop Member GrahamWelland's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Vancouver, WA
    Posts
    5,782
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    562

    Re: So how's that M10 treating you?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ai_Print View Post
    I'm absolutely fed up with Leica as a company, they are truly pathetic on this product roll out. I placed my order back in early February while in Chicago on a job, checked it out at Tamarkin, so I placed an order there and B&H.

    Now, with $75K worth of corporate PJ and advertising jobs lined up for the next 10 weeks, no damned M10. They have really pissed off a lot of people, especially those who want to use it for their jobs!
    It's worth the wait although frustrating. I have a silver and now want a black to go with it but will now have to wait. Got mine in 2 months from a feb order but through a smaller dealer.
    Remember: adventure before dementia!

    As Oscar Wilde said, "my tastes are simple, I only like the best"

  18. #18
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2016
    Posts
    404
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: So how's that M10 treating you?

    Try PopFlash Photo, they are the small dealer that can probably get you a chrome M10 faster than most, as most want black. Personally, chrome holds up better if you decide to sell it.

  19. #19
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Location
    Neutral Zone
    Posts
    47
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: So how's that M10 treating you?

    Mentioning the M10 alongside with the X1D for a potential new camera can only mean ... GAS I know it all too well. I've got my M10 relatively quick end Feb 2017. No digital quirks but lost the frame selector lever and the rubber eye piece - both will be reinstalled by Leica at no cost. No other issues, but nice photos.

    Is it better than the Q? Yes, it is, if you like the rangefinder and versatility. The M10 also feels better in hand. IQ-wise, I like the M10 images sightly better, but I am not an expert, so take my judgement with a large grain of salt. Clearly not the main point.

    This is the best M ever to date. Simply that good. Battery lasts longer than the internet makes you believe. I can shoot days with one battery, but then I do take pictures more considered and normally do not use EVF or image preview a lot. If I had to stay with only one camera, this would be it (if I am allowed to chose a couple of lenses alongside).

    I also like the handling of the X1D a lot. Tried it at a local shot. The M just wins in terms of subject isolation, finder, versatility, portability and maturity of product. That leaves much higher Flash sync and more Megapickels in favour of the X1D. Both did not interest me a lot and will not in near future. Ability of subject isolation for me is is more important.
    My Gallery
    Thanks 1 Member(s) thanked for this post
    Likes 1 Member(s) liked this post

  20. #20
    Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Location
    Colorado
    Posts
    194
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: So how's that M10 treating you?

    After doing a really big job last week in which I used my M240 for a lot of it, I canceled my M10 order. The M240 is such a good camera already and mine is just perfect, so why bother?

    Leica really blew it on this one, you have to get the products in the hands of those who want it when they are hot for it. A lot of friends of mine who had orders in since February and March have cooled off and canceled, most of them pros like me.

    If it were a night and day camera from the M240 it would be different but it is simply not and my photographs as of late bear that out.

  21. #21
    Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Posts
    237
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: So how's that M10 treating you?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ai_Print View Post
    After doing a really big job last week in which I used my M240 for a lot of it, I canceled my M10 order. The M240 is such a good camera already and mine is just perfect, so why bother?

    Leica really blew it on this one, you have to get the products in the hands of those who want it when they are hot for it. A lot of friends of mine who had orders in since February and March have cooled off and canceled, most of them pros like me.

    If it were a night and day camera from the M240 it would be different but it is simply not and my photographs as of late bear that out.


    I've not yet push the «buy it» buton, but i've play with few raws, and i must say the sensor is definitly way better than the m240 one.
    As an architectural photographer, i often need to shoot for highligt and then push the shadow (exemple for interior shot, or strong artificial light, etc...), where i'm confortable to push at base iso the m240 by 2 stop, the m10 allow to push 4stop and still get clean shadow( captureone v10), speaking only of grain, not even speaking of the m240shadow greencast .

  22. #22
    Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Location
    Colorado
    Posts
    194
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: So how's that M10 treating you?

    Quote Originally Posted by daf View Post
    I've not yet push the «buy it» buton, but i've play with few raws, and i must say the sensor is definitly way better than the m240 one.
    As an architectural photographer, i often need to shoot for highligt and then push the shadow (exemple for interior shot, or strong artificial light, etc...), where i'm confortable to push at base iso the m240 by 2 stop, the m10 allow to push 4stop and still get clean shadow( captureone v10), speaking only of grain, not even speaking of the m240shadow greencast .
    I played with it for two hours at Tamarkin back in Feb when I placed the order there and two other places, one small dealer and then B&H. I do a little bit of architectural work when doing lifestyle ad campaigns for major resort and 5 star hotel chains and use either my D810 or CFV50c back for those which are stellar in the situation you give. For the most part, I never really have to push files around that hard because I always prefer to make sure the lighting takes care of it.

    That said I did like the way the M10 handled the higher ISO range which is what I use Leica for, available light editorial and photojournalism work. It's still only 24MP and it is really only about 1 to 1.5 stops better high ISO so to me, it is just not worth fighting and searching for anymore, especially when photo enthusiasts are posting snap shots of frigging beer cans for christ's sake!

    I'm done with it, this company pisses me off to no end and they don't get my money. Period.

  23. #23
    Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Posts
    237
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: So how's that M10 treating you?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ai_Print View Post
    I played with it for two hours at Tamarkin back in Feb when I placed the order there and two other places, one small dealer and then B&H. I do a little bit of architectural work when doing lifestyle ad campaigns for major resort and 5 star hotel chains and use either my D810 or CFV50c back for those which are stellar in the situation you give. For the most part, I never really have to push files around that hard because I always prefer to make sure the lighting takes care of it.

    That said I did like the way the M10 handled the higher ISO range which is what I use Leica for, available light editorial and photojournalism work. It's still only 24MP and it is really only about 1 to 1.5 stops better high ISO so to me, it is just not worth fighting and searching for anymore, especially when photo enthusiasts are posting snap shots of frigging beer cans for christ's sake!

    I'm done with it, this company pisses me off to no end and they don't get my money. Period.
    My leica is not my main system for architecture, i mostly use my cambo/leaf or my sony/hcam ... but i really love my leica, and for quality snap, it is still the best around

    Regarding the lightening of architectural works, i really believe that light is a major part of the work of an architecte, and so i always respect the ambiance, the way the architecte has think the light in is work. Re-ligthing it would be just like killing is work ...

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •