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panasonic sr1 cameras and impact on leica

glenerrolrd

Workshop Member
Been watching the progress of the L alliance carefully since the beginning . Agree that Leica will extensively use the Panasonic S1R components for the SL2 (as mentioned similar to the long run with the R4-R7 based on the Minolta camera ).

If you use one of the camera size comparators ..you will see the s1R is much thicker and 20% heavier than the SL . This is not a good trend .

If Leica goes this way with the SL2 they will continue to undercut the S3 .


Hopefully Leica will stay true to its culture and produce products that are focused on fundamental excellence not features and specifications .
 

ptomsu

Workshop Member
Been watching the progress of the L alliance carefully since the beginning . Agree that Leica will extensively use the Panasonic S1R components for the SL2 (as mentioned similar to the long run with the R4-R7 based on the Minolta camera ).

If you use one of the camera size comparators ..you will see the s1R is much thicker and 20% heavier than the SL . This is not a good trend .

If Leica goes this way with the SL2 they will continue to undercut the S3 .


Hopefully Leica will stay true to its culture and produce products that are focused on fundamental excellence not features and specifications .
If they integrate IBIS then the camera (SL2) has to be thicker. Same if they integrate a tilting screen.

I would always take these additional functions (features) over a thinner body!

With fundamental excellence alone they will not stay competitive in this market segment IMO!
 

Paratom

Well-known member
But they need to make something where people are willing to pay the higher price. Therefore I dont think it is enough to put a S1r in nice "clothes".
I believe (hope) Leica makes their own camera. If they use some of the inside components, ok, but overall it should be a cleaner body, with less buttons. Since they have IS in their Zooms I think we dont need it in body, and while I like tilting screen in theory, I dont use it often in reality. So I would accept to have no tilt screen to avoid a thicker camera.
 

glenerrolrd

Workshop Member
If they integrate IBIS then the camera (SL2) has to be thicker. Same if they integrate a tilting screen.

I would always take these additional functions (features) over a thinner body!

With fundamental excellence alone they will not stay competitive in this market segment IMO!
Leica competes in a different way . For the most part their products are elegant ...materials ,fit, finish are as good as it gets . They are durable and with some maintenance can last a very long time . They are a joy to use with a straightforward and logical user interface . They produce outstanding image quality often much better than the specs would have you believe .

They lead in specifications ONLY when they can make a significant impact on their primary function . For example best in class EVF . Technology innovation does not dictate Leica s product design nor does marketing driven specifications . Trade offs are involved for the early adopters (like the heat of large sensors for the EVF medium format cameras ) .

The S1R has been designed as an “all purpose “ class leading design with a very competitive list of features and a professional build quality . I am hopeful Leica takes a different approach and goes for a smaller ,lighter ,simpler purpose driven design AND if they chose to lead in something get their AF design to become class leading . NOT LIKELY .
 
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Unless the SR1 has a lot of empty space, which is highly unlikely, Leica is not going to be able to fit it in an SL body. Somethings got to give. I haven't heard many complaints about the SL except as to size, so maybe just substituting sensors and tweaking a few things is enough for an SL2. I doubt anyone is going to be shooting sports and wildlife with a Leica.
 

msadat

Member
the more I think about it, the more I think sl2 cannot be sr1, why would anybody want to pay twice as much? no,sl2 must be different but Leica has been using panasonic guts to build the sl. if i were leica, i would put my resources where i have little competion, developing a modern m camera with digital RF!!
 

iiiNelson

Well-known member
If you use one of the camera size comparators ..you will see the s1R is much thicker and 20% heavier than the SL . This is not a good trend .
By most accounts of people that have used both, the S1R apparently feels lighter in the hand due to the ergonomics of the camera. I find that most of the camera comparisons aren’t quite as accurate in real life. The LUMIX S is about half and inch wider, and half an inch taller than the Micro 4/3 pro cameras. The lenses are obviously larger but apparently they aren’t unnaturally so.

Its long been rumored that Panasonic had a lot to do with the SL and they’ve recently admitted that development on the LUMIX S began around the time the Leica SL was released (late 2015). I’d think that the SL2 would see this same “natural progression.” This isn’t really a bad thing or something to look down on if Panasonic has a lot of DNA into the next SL. They’re a capable company.
 

Shashin

Well-known member
the more I think about it, the more I think sl2 cannot be sr1, why would anybody want to pay twice as much? no,sl2 must be different but Leica has been using panasonic guts to build the sl. if i were leica, i would put my resources where i have little competion, developing a modern m camera with digital RF!!
Fuji did that. If they hold a patent, it might be hard for Leica to come up with their own solution. Naturally, Leica is going to still need all the coupled rangefinder mechanics as none for their lenses can communicate distance another way.
 

iiiNelson

Well-known member
the more I think about it, the more I think sl2 cannot be sr1, why would anybody want to pay twice as much? no,sl2 must be different but Leica has been using panasonic guts to build the sl. if i were leica, i would put my resources where i have little competion, developing a modern m camera with digital RF!!
I think the M will likely always stay a M... I think it’s more likely that Leica releases a “QL” to offer a different type of FF body in the L mount that can also be advertised to work with the M lenses.
 

Timkr

Member
Having had direct experience with the S1R for the past couple of weeks, I'm guessing the S1, S1R are going to hurt Leica SL(2) sales. Have been using the SL, 2 bodies, with the 24-90,90-280, 16-35 and the 75 cron and have loved using them. However, after spending time with the S1R I wouldn't go back. The body feels great in hand, the tech is easily accessible with the intuitive button layout. The EVF is outstanding, making using manual focus lenses even easier than on the SL. The best thing is the IBIS. Its really a game changer for me. You can easily hand-hold to almost a second. The SL lenses are outstanding on this body. The AF-S is faster than the SL and the AF-C, while not DSLR worthy, is very good.
I don't see how the SL2 won't lose share if its the same megapixel with no IBIS for twice the price. I'm contemplating selling my remaining SL body to fund an S1. I'm so relieved that the SL alliance happened otherwise, I think the investment I made in the SL glass would have ended badly.
 

msadat

Member
i also got the s1r and its a lovely body, more complicated than the sl but the same as panasonic g9. overall i love it and i am waiting to catch another sale (grip and battery included) to get the s1. have not used the sl since s1. it is also imminent that the new sl will use the same 47 meg sensor with some gots from the s1r. what to do what do!
 
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