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Thread: Elinchrom Ranger or Ranger Quadra

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    Workshop Member kuau's Avatar
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    Elinchrom Ranger or Ranger Quadra

    I am going to be doing some outdoor family portraits in the mountains of Utah,
    So I am looking for a system that can handle the elements ie, cold weather, etc.
    I have been looking at both the ranger and the quadra which has gotten so many good reviews. I really don't need the power of the Ranger, but I was wondering if it would handle hold up better outdoors then the quadra.

    Any advice?

    Steven
    Steven Kornreich
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    Sr. Administrator Jack's Avatar
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    Re: Elinchrom Ranger or Ranger Quadra

    They are both well sealed units with a membrane top over the controls and sealed caps on all the connectors. If you don't need the power of a full Ranger, then the Quadra is about 1/3rd the total size and weight.
    Jack
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    "Perfection is not attainable. But if we chase perfection, we can catch excellence."

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    Workshop Member kuau's Avatar
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    Re: Elinchrom Ranger or Ranger Quadra

    Thanks for the info Jack.
    Since I am living in park city utah now, my wife has gotten me a photo gig at the hotel she works at for doing outdoor family portraits. I will be using my H3D-39 and maybe shooting groups up to 4-6 people, so I am not sure how much light I need and what modifiers to use.
    So either getting the Ranger RX, the lighter of the two rangers with 1 head and a bigger light box or getting the quadra with two heads and smaller boxes.
    Not really sure what Is the best way to go..
    Any advice?

    Steven
    Steven Kornreich
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    Re: Elinchrom Ranger or Ranger Quadra

    Quote Originally Posted by kuau View Post
    Thanks for the info Jack.
    Since I am living in park city utah now, my wife has gotten me a photo gig at the hotel she works at for doing outdoor family portraits. I will be using my H3D-39 and maybe shooting groups up to 4-6 people, so I am not sure how much light I need and what modifiers to use.
    So either getting the Ranger RX, the lighter of the two rangers with 1 head and a bigger light box or getting the quadra with two heads and smaller boxes.
    Not really sure what Is the best way to go..
    Any advice?

    Steven
    Hmmm... Tough call. What I can tell you is that full power out of post A on my Quadra A/S with with one head and the standard reflector at 14 feet (about your light distance for 5 people), will give you f8 at ISO 100. The same with the Ranger is about f11-1/3. A pair of Quadra's at 10 feet would get you f11 which is more like it when you're filling in sunlight.
    Jack
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    Re: Elinchrom Ranger or Ranger Quadra

    Jack,
    Thanks for all the help.
    When you say "a pair of quadra's" do you mean 1 pack 2 heads or 2 packs each with one head.??

    I also noticed in the buy/sell section of the forum Joseph Ramos is selling his Ranger he said he purchased from you. Do you know what model it is and what it all includes?
    I asked Joseph the question and was not to sure.

    Steven
    Steven Kornreich
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    Re: Elinchrom Ranger or Ranger Quadra

    Quote Originally Posted by kuau View Post
    Jack,
    Thanks for all the help.
    When you say "a pair of quadra's" do you mean 1 pack 2 heads or 2 packs each with one head.??

    I also noticed in the buy/sell section of the forum Joseph Ramos is selling his Ranger he said he purchased from you. Do you know what model it is and what it all includes?
    I asked Joseph the question and was not to sure.

    Steven
    I meant a pair of Quadra packs and a head for each.

    Re Joe's Ranger, I'm not sure exactly which he is selling because he has two of them. I honestly don't remember which version he bought from me either as I've owned several of them, all versions.
    Jack
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    "Perfection is not attainable. But if we chase perfection, we can catch excellence."

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    Re: Elinchrom Ranger or Ranger Quadra

    Have not owned the Ranger, but have owned the Quadra (since moved to Profoto). The Quadra is tiny and at 400WS (one head or ~267+133WS with two heads), pretty zippy, but (you knew there was one coming), if only buying one unit, I'd personally suggest a Ranger.

    A 'proper' Ranger would give you power to spare (especially outside) at lower ISOs and give you ability to use any modifier you want at any point without having to worry about light-loss, coverage for larger groups, using an adapter or if the modifier is too heavy for or could even be used effectively with the Quadra adapter.

    The Quadra could be made to work, but isn't hellishly cheap vs the more powerful/versatile Ranger (if you can't tell I was never a fan of my Quadra ;>). As Jack suggests, multiple Quadras (or a Ranger/Quadra combo) would work as well.

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    Workshop Member kuau's Avatar
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    Re: Elinchrom Ranger or Ranger Quadra

    Rob,
    right now I am leaning towards the Ranger, I just cant decide if I should go for the RX or the RX AS which is the bigger unit, but has faster recycle times.
    Steven Kornreich
    www.kuau.com

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    Sr. Administrator Jack's Avatar
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    Re: Elinchrom Ranger or Ranger Quadra

    Steven:

    Re Rangers: RX and RX A/S are the same (smaller) sizes, the only difference is the balance in output between each head post; 50/50 or 67/33. THE SPEED versions are taller with larger batteries that 1) allow for faster recycling and 2) give more pops per charge. The Speed units are also heavier due to the larger batteries.

    Same additional FWIW notes:

    A) Since they are simply taller but everything else is the same, you can use the SPEED batteries in the non-speed packs for more battery life, but no gains in recycle time.

    B) You can mix and match S (Standard) and A (Action or speed) HEADS for further varied output; if you use one of each on the non-A/S pack, you will get whatever the set power is for the A head, but 1/2 of set power for the S head. In this configuration you would get a 2:1 ratio output on a regular pack and a 4:1 OR 1:1 ratio from an A/S pack.

    Hope this additional info makes sense and helps!
    Jack
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    "Perfection is not attainable. But if we chase perfection, we can catch excellence."

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    Re: Elinchrom Ranger or Ranger Quadra

    Well its certainly would be easier with Rangers, b/c of more watts, but doable with single pro Quadra kit (i.e two heads and single powerpack).

    Here is example (two heads to light group and pair in background + wee bit of sunlight)


    Rangers harder to lug around, but another good thing about them is that you wont be limited by soft modifiers (you pretty much stuck with umbrellas when you go Quadra route). But i travelled world with me Quadras and only thing bad about them - pack got broken (handling luggage.. yay) by SQ and channel B need fixing.
    Leaf 54s + two Quadra heads, and some available light dragged in by slower shutter.

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    Re: Elinchrom Ranger or Ranger Quadra

    You cannot use a softbox on a quadra? Is that true I thought they had adapters so you could use a softbox on them. What is the deal? Thanks David

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    Re: Elinchrom Ranger or Ranger Quadra

    Sure you can. There are even a few specially designed, lightweight softboxes that attach directly to the Quadra head. Via the adapter, ANY Quadra head can be mounted in any regular Elinchrom-mount softbox.
    Jack
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    "Perfection is not attainable. But if we chase perfection, we can catch excellence."

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    Re: Elinchrom Ranger or Ranger Quadra

    Can my chimeras be used on the quadra with an adapter?

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    Re: Elinchrom Ranger or Ranger Quadra

    Yep. You just need a standard Elinchrom-fit softbox ring for your whatever type Chimera you have, plus the Elinchrom to Quadra ring adapter.
    Jack
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    "Perfection is not attainable. But if we chase perfection, we can catch excellence."

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    Re: Elinchrom Ranger or Ranger Quadra

    I'm using a Quadra and Hassey H4D/40 for weddings Steven. I've never used a Ranger, so cannot comment.

    Quadra Pros:

    The Quadra is simply the smallest, lightest, least complex, most versatile solution going as far as my research could determine. If working alone without an assistant it's much easier to transport than most solutions (I use http://www.thelightcaddy.com to transport the light stands, 60" umbrellas, cords etc. with the tiny Quadra heads already mounted on the stands and ready to go ... and a small Kata shoulder bag that perfectly fits the Quadra box and spare battery.

    My most frequent use of the Quadra is: 1) lighting large wedding formals in lower light of a church using both heads AND a Metz shoe mount ... 2) outdoor groups, families, and wedding formals using one head for directional light and more power, with a Metz shoe-mount or Potato masher for fill ... 3) Single Quadra head on a light pole and an 30" umbrella or 20" Beauty dish for directional light with the Metz shoe-mount or potato masher for fill.

    IMO the Limitations are:

    400w/s which are asymmetrically distributed when using 2 heads. Provides classic key and fill distribution. Whether 400w/s is a limitation is strictly determined by your shooting conditions, distance to subject, degree of light modification, and creative intentions ... i.e., if shooting with very bright backgrounds and desire to both stop down and use the fastest shutter speeds that the Skyport radio system will allow with a leaf shutter (see Guy's thread in the MF section about sync speeds and the Elinchrom Speed transmitter) ... then you may run out of w/s. Only you can determine that. Also using a shoe mount or potato masher Metz for general camera position additive fill helps boost this by about 70 to 100w/s

    Limited use of light modifiers. While I do have the adapter which allows use of main-line Elinchrom light modifiers (other than large umbrellas, the Quadra modifiers are too small for lighting big groups of people), I would not recommend use of direct-mount large soft-boxes, especially outdoors (as Jack already knows, I am not a fan of the standard Elinchrom mount anyway, and the adapter isn't quite as robust as direct mounting to an Elinchrom head like with the Ranger). I got the Quadra to Elinchrom standard mount adapter for only one reason ... to use a 20" Elinchrom beauty dish mounted on a light pole wielded by an assistant. IMO, larger light modifiers could be used if they are the type that you mount the head separately without the head holding the weight of the modifier.

    Be aware that the standard umbrella mount on the Quadra head only takes the slimmer Elinchrom spec shafts ... which I believe is true for all Elinchrom heads. I use a separate elbow type umbrella holder so I can use other larger 60" ribless umbrellas.

    You will need the 11' and 16' extension cords for the heads. The Quadra comes with 8' head cords and they are too short.

    I should add the cavate that I have a full blown Hensel Porty 1200 with heads etc. and a huge array of light modifiers for more demanding assignments where I have assistants. Eventually, I will secure one of the much smaller new Hensel Porty Lihtium battery kits. I also have a Braun 900 inverter to use any mono-head.

    Here is the set-up I use with the H4D/40 to use the Metz shoe mount flash in tandem with the Quadra. It's a very light weight but very sturdy Kirk grip with Arca type quick release top and bottom, and I mount the Skyport on the handle ... sinc cord from Skyport to the Hassey sinc port. The Quadra comes with the correct sync cord.

    The photo shows use of a Quadra head on location at a reception hall, positioned camera right using an 30" umbrella feathered off the background flowers, and the Metz for camera position fill. In this case I wanted to avoid showing the cluttered background with people milling around etc., so I used ISO 200, 1/180th shutter @ f/7 with the Quadra single head at about 320w/s and the Metz full manual. The low available light was not part of this shot at all.

    -Marc
    Last edited by fotografz; 27th September 2010 at 01:46.

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    Re: Elinchrom Ranger or Ranger Quadra

    Marc,
    Thanks for your excellent post in regards to the quadra.
    I attached a photo I took last weekend with my H3D39, and just using a onboard Metz 54mz with a stofen diffuser.
    This is the kind of work I Maybe doing this winter.
    My friends loved the image but for me I really didn't like the light to much.
    I was thinking about what this would have looked like if I used a quadra with the there small Ranger Quadra Portalite 40 x 40 cm
    or.
    Ranger rx with there Elinchrom 39" Mini Octa Lite Bank Softbox

    Steven
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    Re: Elinchrom Ranger or Ranger Quadra

    Quote Originally Posted by kuau View Post
    Marc,

    I was thinking about what this would have looked like if I used a quadra with the there small Ranger Quadra Portalite 40 x 40 cm
    or.
    Ranger rx with there Elinchrom 39" Mini Octa Lite Bank Softbox

    Steven
    First of all it would be moved out from axis, so even without any modifiers it would look more 3D and less "deer in headllghts".

    To do groups like that 40x40 is a bit smallish, so you will need something else for second head (aye, you will want second head, or huge umbrella/softbox on one).

    There has been rumors about Deep Octa been adapted for Quadra's, and i think it even popped in catalogue, but i dont see it for sale yet..

    Oh and Ringflash was just announced in Quadra system.. so there we go

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    Re: Elinchrom Ranger or Ranger Quadra

    Quote Originally Posted by dseelig View Post
    You cannot use a softbox on a quadra? Is that true I thought they had adapters so you could use a softbox on them. What is the deal? Thanks David
    you can use pretty much anything from Elinca via adapter (about 98$). Bonus of using specially designed boxes is that they are designed with Quadra in mind, so angles are done properly, lightpaths and so on. But presently choice of softboxes for Quadra's is fairly poor, and they are about as expensive as "big brothers" so you kind of paying twice if you shooting in studio with "serious gear".

    Difference in how big modifiers work with small quadras is not something major, but every now and then its fairly visible. Hence why i am normally using mine with somewhat neutral modifiers like Hensel's umbrellas (untill said Deep Octa will be finally modified and up for sale )

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    Re: Elinchrom Ranger or Ranger Quadra

    We use both the Ranger RX AS and the Quadra as well. We take a look outside before we shoot, if it's an outdoor shoot and its cloudy, we bring the Quadra. If it's sunny, we bring the Ranger. And that's really just about it. You can see a bunch of shots we do with it here: http://www.flickr.com/photos/symbolp...7624913368149/

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    Re: Elinchrom Ranger or Ranger Quadra

    Btw, Marc, you may want to consider the 39" Deep Octa instead of the beauty dish. Very easy to weild and lightweight.

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    Re: Elinchrom Ranger or Ranger Quadra

    Quote Originally Posted by symbolphoto View Post
    Btw, Marc, you may want to consider the 39" Deep Octa instead of the beauty dish. Very easy to weild and lightweight.
    Thanks, I'll take a look at it.

    -Marc

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    Re: Elinchrom Ranger or Ranger Quadra

    Yeah, it has many different looks to it as well. Without using the outer diffuser, most people tend to think it's just like the beauty dish.

    If you use both it's softer, of course. And best of all it folds up. We've done a lot with the Maxilite as well, but this is quite efficient and fairly large.

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    Re: Elinchrom Ranger or Ranger Quadra

    IME, the shallow 37" octa without the front diffuser renders *similarly* to the Elinchrom 27" maxi-soft, and is clearly more portable, expecially with the snap-out ring mount. However, and IMHO only, the hard beauty dishes still rule the day for gorgeous light, especially with people --- there's just a look they give that I've never seen from a soft modifier...
    Jack
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    Re: Elinchrom Ranger or Ranger Quadra

    Jack. which Elinchrom Beauty Dish do you use outdoors with people?
    Steven Kornreich
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    Re: Elinchrom Ranger or Ranger Quadra

    I use the small (16") one -- the big 27" one is way too big to haul around. One other issue to consider is wind --- here smaller and heavier is better than larger and lighter -- think of them like sails on boats
    Jack
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    Senior Member symbolphoto's Avatar
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    Re: Elinchrom Ranger or Ranger Quadra

    You can see this guy using the larger one on his Quadra in the video at the bottom. (Gutsy )

    http://www.tomaswhitehouse.com/2010/...e-shot-the-dj/

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    Re: Elinchrom Ranger or Ranger Quadra

    Well after serious internal debate I think I am going to start with the Ranger RX, getting it from Joseph on this site. Then based on Jacks recommendation I will start with the 19" beauty dish:
    http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/cont...=126520&is=REG

    and I may get the shallow 39" octa.:
    http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/cont...=176939&is=REG


    Now I just need help with picking out a light stand that will work well outdoors. Any recommendations?

    -Steven
    Steven Kornreich
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    Re: Elinchrom Ranger or Ranger Quadra

    I'm personally very partial to Avenger. I've had other brands, but Avenger has the right cost/strength ratio in my book.

    http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produc...ght_Stand.html
    Last edited by symbolphoto; 8th October 2010 at 11:25.

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    Re: Elinchrom Ranger or Ranger Quadra

    I am a total newbie when it comes to light stands.
    Which Avenger do you like?
    Steven Kornreich
    www.kuau.com

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    Re: Elinchrom Ranger or Ranger Quadra

    http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produc...ght_Stand.html

    These are pretty good, if you don't have anything too large on it. If you do, you'd want the steel ones, assuming you are strong enough to hold onto them.

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    Re: Elinchrom Ranger or Ranger Quadra

    Actually, I prefer the aluminum tri stands over steel for the field, but get some sandbags. I like theses because they're easy to see: http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produc...e_Sandbag.html

    I have a mix of Avenger and Manfrotto tri-leg stands as they're virtually identical. For the studio I prefer steel C stands as my main stands, also with the sandbags on them.
    Jack
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    Re: Elinchrom Ranger or Ranger Quadra

    So hanging the ranger pack on the stand is not such a great idea? Better to get a sand bag.
    This was the stand I was thinking about getting:
    http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/cont...specifications
    Steven Kornreich
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    Re: Elinchrom Ranger or Ranger Quadra

    I hang the ranger pack on ours from time to time. We usually have someon holding our stands, so i don't go all nuts with sandbags, but they are a good alternative.

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