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Profoto D1 or Hensel Integra Plus

johnnygoesdigital

New member
I've mulled over the merits of each system, and how this fits into my style. I think one of the key factors for me, comes down to the user replaceable items, such as flash tubes and lamps. Personally, if considering Hensel, then order a flash tube/modeling lamp(s), and any modifier you think you might use now, because it can take weeks or longer to have them in stock. I'm going to try PCB and VLM on ski shoot soon, this combo's portability factor is hard to beat, and I know what I can do with 40w/s! Turnaround for Profoto is far better than Hensel, and its mount is good, but for what I need from a strobe PCB seems to be the answer. PCB has a really good warranty too, and turnaround for tubes and flash is approaching legendary status.
 
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I'm going to try PCB and VLM on ski shoot soon, this combo's portability factor is hard to beat
Let me know how that works out for you. I've been eying that system for a while. I think that a couple VMLs and a couple Einsteins would probably handle my outdoor portable needs pretty well.
 

Kirk Candlish

New member
In 30 years of shooting I've only had to replace a flashtube on a brand new Elinchrom. It failed the second day I used it and was covered by warranty.

I've watched so many users have PCB gear fail I wouldn't touch the stuff. He markets to a price point, quality is secondary. Look at the enthusiast market, weekend wedding shooter etc., they love his stuff. Read their forums, they're all sending something in for the 'great warranty' service. I don't remember the last time I had to send a Profoto or Elinchrom piece in for repair.

Just my opinion, work with whatever suits you.
 
Thanks Kirk, that's good info. I consider modeling lamps to be consumable, but aside from those my total lighting equipment failures are a Dynalite cap and a Norman socket that cracked from overheating, but that one was abuse, we were flogging that pony. I have also replaced a couple Norman 400b flash tubes, but they are cheap and I don't mind. The modeling light stopped working on one Integra on the last shoot and it isn't the bulb, so that is going to have to go in for repair.

If I bought into Buff gear it would replace the Norman 400s and the Dynalites as lightweight field gear. I like the idea of having a light stand or two where the light, power supply and stand are self contained, easy to move and have a short flash duration.

When the Einsteins first came out I heard a few horror stories of them melting, but I haven't really paid any attention to the current state of things.
 
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fotografz

Well-known member
Yes I do remember seeing people shooting with Hensel modified mounts. Hard to say which one is worse, the Hensel of the Elinchrom. I just use the Elinchrom > Profoto adapters and any time I use anything larger than the Maxi or 27" Deep Octa it's through the E>P mount adapter and a Profoto modifier.

Hensel makes some of the greatest modifiers in the world. But you have to be on the European side of the world to purchase them. North American availability is limited at best and typically non-existent.

Since the original Porty pre-dates the Elinchrom RX AS, and the old Porty hasn't been in production for a couple of years, I'd bet your experience with them is a few years ago Marc.
Yep, I used the older Porty for a number of years, and sold it only to get the newer Lithium version for it's much smaller size/weight and because it comes with three radio systems built in ... Hensel's strobe Wizard, Free Mask, and Profoto AIR (which allows me to mix lighting on locations with the Profoto Acute 600B AIR Lithium. The new one uses the same sealed digital touch controls.

-Marc
 

fotografz

Well-known member
In 30 years of shooting I've only had to replace a flashtube on a brand new Elinchrom. It failed the second day I used it and was covered by warranty.

I've watched so many users have PCB gear fail I wouldn't touch the stuff. He markets to a price point, quality is secondary. Look at the enthusiast market, weekend wedding shooter etc., they love his stuff. Read their forums, they're all sending something in for the 'great warranty' service. I don't remember the last time I had to send a Profoto or Elinchrom piece in for repair.

Just my opinion, work with whatever suits you.
Ditto, same opinion here.

I think it is great that PCB offers some decent stuff, if only because it has helped more people get involved with lighting that may not have other-wise. Kudos for that. However, I would tread carefully if you plan on any demanding enthusiast's use, or professional use, or intend on a longer term involvement with lighting ... or less importantly, prefer decent looking industrial design :eek:

I started out with stuff that was inexpensive but seemed decent, and quickly learned that no matter what hype is out there, you basic get what you pay for one way or the other.

The only recent change I made in my Profoto system was to sell off my Profoto Compact Rs and replace them with D1 AIRs to facilitate altering output on heads buried in a softbox 12' up on a stand. The value equation showed up immediately because I sold the 4 Compacts the day I listed them, and got almost as much as I had originally paid for them. As far as I know, those Compacts are still working just fine.

I have replacement tubes for my Hensel Heads, and a bunch of Porty modeling bulbs ... haven't had to replace anything yet (they'll probably last forever just because I have replacements, LOL!)

I have a Hensel Mini 1200 with round plug heads that I used for years and years doing industrial location stuff ... we used to shoot all day long with that little pup and a couple of Integra Pro Plus monos ... the only drawback was the Hensel Strobe Wizard didn't have the distance of a PW or Profoto AIR transmitter ... but I've since discovered they make a better antenna which significantly increases the distance for the Mini.

For location work that isn't terribly demanding, I'd opt for a Profoto Acute 600B and 600B head ... or a Elinchrom Quadra over anything PCB makes. Honestly, the EL Quadra is so comparatively demure that it actually promotes take-with. The freaking heads will fit in your pocket, I kid you not :) Putting a PCB Einstein with a modifier out on the end of a mobile painter's pole is a real back breaker compared to the Quadra head.

YMMV, etc.

-Marc
 

Kirk Candlish

New member
I have also replaced a couple Norman 400b flash tubes, but they are cheap and I don't mind.
I shot with 200Bs endlessly and never burned up a tube. By the time the 400B had come out I'd moved over to Metz because they offered TTL through the 500CM.

I also had Norman P4000D pack with a twin tube head that let me shoot 8X10 with fewer repeated pops in the studio. I just had to keep a window open because it created ozone when it fired at 4000WS. Sold all that gear after years of use and original tubes still working.

Though the Norman was built like a tank I sure don't miss watching an assistant plug a head into a charged Norman and go flying across the room.
 

johnnygoesdigital

New member
I'll know soon enough if PCB will fit my style for remote location stuff. I literally have to hike a thousand feet above tree line in 3feet of snow to the location, and with my ski gear and Think Tank bag loaded, there's no room for my Hensel L1200. PCB Einstein 's do much better in terms of freezing action when dialed down around 40 to 160 w/s, much better than Profoto or Hensel. If I do switch to Profoto, ll wait for a promo. At least with the VLM, i can plug in other lights, such as D1's in "bat" mode or charge a laptop.
 

fotografz

Well-known member
I'll know soon enough if PCB will fit my style for remote location stuff. I literally have to hike a thousand feet above tree line in 3feet of snow to the location, and with my ski gear and Think Tank bag loaded, there's no room for my Hensel L1200. PCB Einstein 's do much better in terms of freezing action when dialed down around 40 to 160 w/s, much better than Profoto or Hensel. If I do switch to Profoto, ll wait for a promo. At least with the VLM, i can plug in other lights, such as D1's in "bat" mode or charge a laptop.
Interesting problem John. Definitely wouldn't want to lug a Porty 1200L and Speed P heads in those conditions ...unless I had a Sherpa assistant ;)

To be honest, if I was doing the carrying, I wouldn't want to lug an Einstein or Einsteins and VML(s) either. Plus I really do not like their modifier mount even in the studio, let alone outdoor blustery conditions.

For your conditions/output needs, my choice would be the EL Quadra in a New York heartbeat ... which does 1/6000 duration @ 134Ws using A (Action) heads and the B outlet at full output. While the Lithium battery would provide more pops, I'd probably opt for using the lead-gell Quadra battery since Lithium is less robust in lower temps (this is according to Elinchrom). Living in Michigan, "The Winter Wonderland", I kept my Lead batteries just for this reason :) Let us know how the PCB VML's do in extend cold and/or damp conditions as I have a couple of them myself.

Personally, I've never once had an issue freezing action with most any of this gear, especially dialed to below 200Ws. Lots of winter sports and super action work being done with all types of gear ... but I don't know exactly what you are shooting, and am sure you have figured out exactly what you need and why.

All the best success with whatever you end up with, and please share your experiences and photos ... sounds intriguing :thumbs:

-Marc
 

johnnygoesdigital

New member
Thanks for the advice Marc, I'm doing a series of dramatic, above tree line skiing shots in New England. New England above tree line is a really cold location this time of year, nothing like the West. I did this hike last year without lights, and it was quite a workout! My modifier would be a LTR, and the battery(VLM) would be tucked right next to my "jimmies", so should stay warm...I hope! My concern with the Quadra is the mount, it looks like a turn and lock type of mount, but what's keeping it from turning back out? The Hensel mount, i've been told is similar to PCB. I've had great success with the Hensel, even driving on a truck rig, hanging out the back with the 22inch BD. The PCB seems like it would benefit with a recessed lip of sorts, to insure those prongs stay engaged. I'm not sure taking PCB to this location to demo their unit is fair, but at least it will be all downhill from there... I think the Quadra has a very cool product on paper though. The size looks perfect with two heads, and at 3.5 lbs very light indeed! The Hensel is strictly my battery supply, but studio stuff will be mostly D1 Air's, as i'm a big fan of the Air Sync, the best range of any! Yes, the AC mains adapter is possible, but i'd rather get a light or modifier and get full control over several lights. Now if only I can use the D1's on a VLM, with "bat" mode! As a side note, Joel Grimes shoots with Einsteins, although, I'm not a big fan of composite photography, his portraits are superbly lit!
 
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fotografz

Well-known member
Thanks for the advice Marc, I'm doing a series of dramatic, above tree line skiing shots in New England. New England above tree line is a really cold location this time of year, nothing like the West. I did this hike last year without lights, and it was quite a workout! My modifier would be a LTR, and the battery(VLM) would be tucked right next to my "jimmies", so should stay warm...I hope! My concern with the Quadra is the mount, it looks like a turn and lock type of mount, but what's keeping it from turning back out? The Hensel mount, i've been told is similar to PCB. I've had great success with the Hensel, even driving on a truck rig, hanging out the back with the 22inch BD. The PCB seems like it would benefit with a recessed lip of sorts, to insure those prongs stay engaged. I'm not sure taking PCB to this location to demo their unit is fair, but at least it will be all downhill from there... I think the Quadra has a very cool product on paper though. The size looks perfect with two heads, and at 3.5 lbs very light indeed! The Hensel is strictly my battery supply, but studio stuff will be mostly D1 Air's, as i'm a big fan of the Air Sync, the best range of any! Yes, the AC mains adapter is possible, but i'd rather get a light or modifier and get full control over several lights. Now if only I can use the D1's on a VLM, with "bat" mode! As a side note, Joel Grimes shoots with Einsteins, although, I'm not a big fan of composite photography, his portraits are superbly lit!
Well, I'm not exactly a fan of the Elinchrom mount, least of all the Quadra turn and lock one, then you push in and turn it back out. However, the Quadra uses an adapter with its own stand spigot to access the regular EL modifiers, so the little Quadra heads do not take the brunt of the weight.

I'd research that PCB mount, it isn't the same as the Hensel for the reasons you mentioned, and I've heard enough stories about mods falling off in the middle of a shoot to offer at least a caution.

Good luck,

-Marc
 

johnnygoesdigital

New member
Yeah, I've heard of those stories too, but if I keep the VLM and Einstein it will mostly be used for this type of photography. It just sucks that one has to trade the convenience of light power for not so robust attachments. It's curious why companies don't incorporate an attachment similar to how lenses are secured on cameras.
 

Kirk Candlish

New member
Here are a couple of Mola mounting rings I had laying around in the studio.

The top one is the original Balcar mount, adopted by PCB for reasons unknown. The second one is the Elinchrom mount.

One obvious conclusion we can draw is that one is much cheaper to manufacture. I can think of no other motivation for using the Balcar/PCB.





 
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