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Thread: Using 2 Nissin i40?

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    Senior Member Rawfa's Avatar
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    Using 2 Nissin i40?

    Hi guys,

    I'm new to flash photography and I'm just starting to explore it's creative possibilities. I just got 2 Nissin I40 units and I was wondering how to have one flash on camera triggering the other flash (I would like to be able to use it in TTL and manual). Will I need a wireless remote trigger or something?

    This was taken from their website http://www.nissindigital.com/i40.html

    "Slave Mode
    i40 has a wireless remote flash system as a slave unit.
    
You can enjoy creative flash photography with multiple lightings from the various directions. There are 3 slave modes provided.

    Slave Digital (SD): i40 synchronizes to the pre-flash system. The master flash is to be set at TTL mode.
    Slave Film (SF): i40 synchronizes to the traditional single flash system. The master flash is to be set at manual mode.
    Wireless TTL
    i40 synchronizes to the wireless remote flash system. (*3) (*4)"
    Last edited by Rawfa; 18th December 2014 at 02:29.

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    Re: Using 2 Nissin i40?

    I just got an i40 myself. I can try it out today to see which is the correct mode for optical slaving.
    Sony Visible Light & IR Photographer
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    Senior Member Rawfa's Avatar
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    Re: Using 2 Nissin i40?

    The DS option is for digital slave, and there is also an option called RMT (Wireless Remote Mode). I'd like to know if I can use one Nissin I40 as a master and the other one as a slave. I mean, if I adjust the settings on the Nissin I40 that is on my camera, will these changes reflect on the slave I40 unit?

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    Re: Using 2 Nissin i40?

    Rawfa, there are a number of ways to accomplish what you want to do.

    1) "Optical" triggering can do it, but be aware that in environments like a wedding or event, anyone shooting with flash will also trigger your off-camera speed-lights via their optical receivers.

    2) Wireless Infrared triggering requires "line of sight" set-ups where the main flash infrared signal can be "seen" by the remote light's receiver. If there is anything blocking the line of sight, or if the remote light is too far away, it will not work reliably. The Nissin i40 does provide TTL wireless slave for on camera speed-lights which offer that function. This also sucks for most wedding and event work.

    3) The more reliable method is radio triggering. However, not many speed-lights are radio wireless, and the camera has to have that function … some Canon system cameras have it and can use their newer radio flashes, Nikon and Sony do not … yet.

    There are 3rd party radio systems that allow what is called pass-through TTL … the radio sender goes in the Hot Shoe, then the flash is attached to that sender which preserves TTL functions for the on camera flash …. BUT the remote receivers are not TTL. I'm not currently aware of any 3rd party radio with pass-through TTL for Sony's new multifunctional hot-shoe as of yet. There were ones for the old Minolta/Sony mount like on the A900, and in fact I used them to good result.

    The problem with speed-lights are that they are super weak compared to even a small mono-light strobe … and the modifiers for speed-lights are quite limited.

    Lastly, many of the speed-lights have thermal protectors built-in and in any situation where shooting at higher power or in rapid succession, they will shut down for up to 10 to 15 minutes. Trust me, that really sucks …been there done that.

    - Marc
    Last edited by fotografz; 22nd December 2014 at 05:54.

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    Re: Using 2 Nissin i40?

    What you want is the latest Photix set-up. If I were you, I would forego the Nissin i40 and get the Photix mitros flashes and/or the ODIN commander + flashes.

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    Re: Using 2 Nissin i40?

    Thanks for the update Vivek. Phottix indeed does now offer their Mitros TTL units with the newer Sony ISO hot-shoe foot.

    This looks to be the solution for my A99 set-up which balances with the larger speed-lights … so I'll stick with the Nissen i40 on the A7R for a puff of fill-flash use because of its' size in relation to the camera/lens … which I already know works great.

    Personally, I tend to use a TTL speed-light on-camera for fill in concert with a strobe key light when working mobile.

    - Marc

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    Re: Using 2 Nissin i40?

    Marc,

    When you use the strobe as key do you trigger it optically or via radio and if radio how do you set that up while using the on camera TTL flash?

    Jim

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    Re: Using 2 Nissin i40?

    Marc, It is the HSS with TTL feature that makes the Photix setup attractive.

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    Re: Using 2 Nissin i40?

    Quote Originally Posted by Vivek View Post
    Marc, It is the HSS with TTL feature that makes the Photix setup attractive.
    You can do HSS with the Nissin i40 as well.

    For was it is the Nissin i40 is a great match for the A7 series. It's simple to control with all the dials right there on the back so no need to cycle through menus.

    I bought a Nissin i40 along with a PCB Einstein lighting Cyber Commander setup to teach myself some flash stuff. The Phottix setup looks great too but I think I'd rather have strobes personally (now that I actually own some) for a multi-light setup when/where possible.
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    Re: Using 2 Nissin i40?

    Come on, Tre! The i40 uses Sony type line of sight (optical) communication besides being puny.

    The Phottix system uses radio control with decent power (though not all that great). If it is the mount size (on camera) that is a problem, the ODIN controller will take of that.

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    Re: Using 2 Nissin i40?

    Quote Originally Posted by Vivek View Post
    Come on, Tre! The i40 uses Sony type line of sight (optical) communication besides being puny.

    The Phottix system uses radio control with decent power (though not all that great). If it is the mount size (on camera) that is a problem, the ODIN controller will take of that.
    Yep, radio is the way to go.

    Not terribly interested in HSS TTL as the total light is a fraction of full "wimpy" speed-light output. However, there are some circumstances when that works just fine (like close up) … or when you just don't need that much supplemental light.

    Interestingly, Profoto just updated their B1 firmware to allow HHS to 1/8000 … but that is a lot more juice behind the strobing-pulsing of light for HSS. Wish they would make a Sony version in addition to the Canon/Nikon

    - Marc
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    Re: Using 2 Nissin i40?

    Quote Originally Posted by JMaher View Post
    Marc,

    When you use the strobe as key do you trigger it optically or via radio and if radio how do you set that up while using the on camera TTL flash?

    Jim
    Hi Jim, I do mobile strobe work a lot, so have a set-up specifically to accomplish it.

    I mount the camera on a Kirk Grip with a radio sender attached and hard-wired to the camera via the sync port … in my case it is a Profoto AIR Transmitter. This frees the camera's hot-shoe to take a TTL flash for fill.

    My key light is either a Profoto Acute B600AIR or now a Profoto B1. I expose for the key light, and the TTL on-camera speed-light provides the fill. If needed, I can adjust the B1 key with the AIR transmitter, and ride the compensation controls for the TTL speed-light for creative effect.

    Very simple to do on the fly.

    Same can be done with the Phottix set-up, just with a lot less light on the subject. In my work, I have to be ready for just about any lighting scenario, so I use strobes.

    I also prefer more light than less because it allows me to lower the ISO for higher IQ.

    - Marc

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    Re: Using 2 Nissin i40?

    Marc,

    Now i am really jealous. The Profoto sounds great but I have been making do with a Godox 360 (actually its not bad at all for a battery powered strobe). The problem I see is a lack of a sync port on the new Sony A models.

    I just looked up the Kirk grip - interesting little add-on.

    Jim

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    Re: Using 2 Nissin i40?

    Quote Originally Posted by JMaher View Post
    Marc,

    Now i am really jealous. The Profoto sounds great but I have been making do with a Godox 360 (actually its not bad at all for a battery powered strobe). The problem I see is a lack of a sync port on the new Sony A models.

    I just looked up the Kirk grip - interesting little add-on.

    Jim
    Yes, no sync port is why the Sony A cameras cannot replace my A99 which does have one. The Kirk Grip is pretty comfortable and works with Arca type QR camera plates.

    Actually, I mostly use a leaf shutter camera with the Profoto strobes because it allows higher sync speeds up to 1/1000 shutter without pulsing the light. The Profoto AIR system syncs at those shutter speeds when set to the Speed Mode on the transmitter. Most systems top out at 1/500 with leaf-shutter cameras.

    A faster shutter allows better control of the background exposures … very valuable in brighter ambient light with blown out backgrounds so you can under-expose them.

    - Marc

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    Re: Using 2 Nissin i40?

    I was checking out the Nissin Manual and it tells me I should rotate the dial to RMT to use it in wireless remote mode with Sony cameras, but even though I can see the RMT option on the dial it WON'T rotate until RMT. It only goes as far as TTL2.

    I set the A77II's flash option to Wireless and tried it out with ALL options on the Nissin and I was not able to trigger it remotely. I thought it could have something to do with the camera being on airplane mode but I've tried both ways and could not get it to work.

    Am I doing something wrong?

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    Re: Using 2 Nissin i40?

    Marc,

    After the holidays I need to try out your technique, however with out the benefit of the Profoto strobes. I should be able to find and adapter that goes into the Sony hot shoe and provides a sync port and allows for full TTL pass through for a flash on top. I know I could do this with another camera brand but will have to research one for the A7 line.

    **** After some quick research I can find one for just about any camera including the older Sony's but not for the new cameras.

    Any suggestions?

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    Re: Using 2 Nissin i40?

    Quote Originally Posted by JMaher View Post
    Marc,

    After the holidays I need to try out your technique, however with out the benefit of the Profoto strobes. I should be able to find and adapter that goes into the Sony hot shoe and provides a sync port and allows for full TTL pass through for a flash on top. I know I could do this with another camera brand but will have to research one for the A7 line.

    **** After some quick research I can find one for just about any camera including the older Sony's but not for the new cameras.

    Any suggestions?
    High end strobes aren't necessary for that technique. Any lighting kit will work.

    I'm still waiting for a radio transmitter with TTL pass through that is compatible with the new Sony multifunctional ISO hot-shoe for my A7R.

    I used to use a Phottix system with my A900 and Sony 58 speed-lights. But that was the old hot-shoe design. Worked great.

    If you find something, let me know please.

    - Marc

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