H4D with new "True Focus/Absolute Position Lock" feature

[fotografz]

I'd rather blow my dough on wild women, fast cars and booze
******
Stick with camera gear and booze....the women and fast cars are a bottomless money pit.

Steve

I think Peter's capacity to toss cash into the money pit is deeper than ours Steve.

Those days are long gone for me, but it was fun back in the "Financially Fat, 1990s single boy days": Souped up Porches and even faster women, (insert wistful sigh) ..:ROTFL:

Wish I had some of that money back ... especially the Jewelry

-Marc

 

[PeterA]

Well Marc - you know the old saying ...?

If it floats, f**ks or flies - rent it dont buy it...

:ROTFL::ROTFL::ROTFL::ROTFL:

*btw it is a non sexist gender neutral parable..

 

[fotografz]

Thats good - you guys can show me why I 'have to have one' -

Marc - I want the Old Nocti for the 'look' - on full frame I think it will sing - and unlike the film days - I will know when I have missed the wide open shot -

Both arriving later this week *fingers crossed. (M9 in steel colour)

Well today I should be receiving a f/1.0 Nocti to try on the M9. Same reasoning. Since I already have a 50/1.4 ASPH, I'm looking for that "old time rock 'n roll look." It's the same reason I prefer the "Plain Jane" M90/2.8 over the 90AA. Ability to focus the darned Nocti will be the criteria. I have a 1.35X mag for the M9 which should help.

RE: the H4D/60

Talked with my Hassey rep and the pricing options from Hassey are REALLY aggressively good. They are smart to do this and blunt any considerations about jumping ship.

-Marc

 

[PeterA]

Marc- post some shots when it arrives please! Will be very intersted to see how it looks on full frame

Sheeesh - its like someone has sent us the same play book...re lenses..

ok back on topic..

I am ALL EARS for a good deal trading up from 39 - 60...somehow I doubt it very much though..but - I am ALL ears.

 

[steflaurent974]

Peter, I have already post one shot with that combination (M9 NOCTI 1.0 ) , it really works well and the focus is not so tricky.
I have to look to another serie, I will post more Nocti shots in the dedicated thread.

 

[jotloob]

It is a joy to read all the contributions in this thread .

But . . . . I came to the conclusion , that pixelmania is a serious desease .
It seems to be an addiction without a chance of curing . That includes me .

Back to technical stuff .
The CFV-39 has a pixelsize of 6,8 microns .
The H3DII-50/H4d-50 has a pixelsize of 6,0 microns .

Does anyone of you know the sensor and pixel sizes of the 60MP sensor ? ? ?

Jürgen

 

[Ranger 9]

Well today I should be receiving a f/1.0 Nocti to try on the M9. Same reasoning. Since I already have a 50/1.4 ASPH, I'm looking for that "old time rock 'n roll look."

If you want a really old time look, hunt up a Canon 50/0.95 with an M-mount conversion. Your photos will look as if they were shot in 1958 in a beatnik jazz club filled with reefer smoke and broken dreams...

 

[tetsrfun]

I think Peter's capacity to toss cash into the money pit is deeper than ours Steve.

Those days are long gone for me, but it was fun back in the "Financially Fat, 1990s single boy days": Souped up Porches and even faster women, (insert wistful sigh) ..:ROTFL:

Wish I had some of that money back ... especially the Jewelry

-Marc

Jewelry is especially bad...In a "D" settlement the judge decides that 1/2 of every thing that you have is hers but the jewelry is 100% hers.

A few routine services on a Italian "horse" car will put a good dent in the cost of an S2.

Steve

 

[LJL]

Hum hum, as a 22mpix Hassy user, I think the time will eventually come to upgrade to 39mp. There will be some H3DII-39 systems searching for new owners soon. Hassy upgrade are nice but still a bit bitter for those that payed the full price some years ago.
Hope the 2nd hand market will work to satisfy guys like me and happy upgrader

This may or may not get interesting, since Hasselblad will retain the H3DII-31/39 rigs as part of the existing production line. There may be some good refurbs as well as some outright sales from folks wanting the H4D cameras.

It is just a bit too bad that there is no H4D-31/39 solution that could take advantage of the new AF device and other tweaks, plus just maybe a bit better LCD. I do think there would be a lot of folks looking at a H4D-39 solution, if it existed, and at a competitive price, as well as an H4D-31 solution with higher ISO performance and the new AF. Those could be very attractive kits for some users. Guess we can just keep hoping something like that comes to pass.

LJ

 

[anGy]

I made a simple (too simple ?) test tonight:
Facing a wall I measured the distance between me and the part of the wall just in front of me (this point being the center position of the frame) = 10 feet. Then I measured again between me (at the exact same position) to what would be the position of the corner of the frame on this wall. Distance increased by 3 inches.
So if I had to focus on the corner position and move to center to recompose, does that mean that the focus point would be 3 inches to far for a correct corner focus ?

In my example, and if I was using a 100mm lens at f5,6, it will also mean that I will also not have any OOF problem (15 inches DOF at this distance, normally 5 in front and 10 backwards, but here 5-3 = 2 in front and 13 backwards) so no big deal after all.

 

[Nick-T]

I made a simple (too simple ?) test tonight:
Facing a wall I measured the distance between me and the part of the wall just in front of me (this point being the center position of the frame) = 10 feet. Then I measured again between me (at the exact same position) to what would be the position of the corner of the frame on this wall. Distance increased by 3 inches.
So if I had to focus on the corner position and move to center to recompose, does that mean that the focus point would be 3 inches to far for a correct corner focus ?

In my example, and if I was using a 100mm lens at f5,6, it will also mean that I will also not have any OOF problem (15 inches DOF at this distance, normally 5 in front and 10 backwards, but here 5-3 = 2 in front and 13 backwards) so no big deal after all.

Sure at 10ft from the wall the focus/recompose effect will be less, ie you will have sufficient DOF to compensate for the error. I shoot a fair bit of head and shoulder type crops wide open and there the effect (of the correction) is very apparent and (for me) extremely useful. Oh and don't forget the system works sideways as well very handy for say a nature guy wanting something to the edge of frame sharp.

Nick-T

 

[fotografz]

It is a joy to read all the contributions in this thread .

But . . . . I came to the conclusion , that pixelmania is a serious desease .
It seems to be an addiction without a chance of curing . That includes me .

Back to technical stuff .
The CFV-39 has a pixelsize of 6,8 microns .
The H3DII-50/H4d-50 has a pixelsize of 6,0 microns .

Does anyone of you know the sensor and pixel sizes of the 60MP sensor ? ? ?

Jürgen

6 also. It's a bigger sensor.

 

[anGy]

Sure at 10ft from the wall the focus/recompose effect will be less, ie you will have sufficient DOF to compensate for the error. I shoot a fair bit of head and shoulder type crops wide open and there the effect (of the correction) is very apparent and (for me) extremely useful. Oh and don't forget the system works sideways as well very handy for say a nature guy wanting something to the edge of frame sharp.

Nick-T

Okay, another test at closer range will possibly show quicker OOF problems then. It should be nice to have a better feeling of the improvements of this new technique. Maybe it's a must only for close-ups, maybe it's useless for landscapes .

 

[jotloob]

6 also. It's a bigger sensor.

Thanks Marc

It did some research at KODAK and DALSA .
The H4D-60 sensor as well as the H4D-50 must be DALSA sensors .

The 60MP sensor is 40,4x53,9 mm and has the new 6 micron technology .
The 50MP sensor is 37x49 mm and also has the 6 micron technology but obviously a different crop factor .

I wonder , if the V-system ZEISS lenses have a sufficient enough resolution for the 6 micron pixels .

If the ZEISS glass is good enough , why do we then have SCHNEIDER and LINOS/RODENSTOCK special "digitars and digital" lenses ? ? ?

Is this just a trick to make more money ? ? ?

I have done some tests with the ZEISS MACRO PLANAR CFE 4/120 and the CFV-39 (6,8 micron pixels) and have the impresion , this lens has come to its limit .
With or without lens correction in PHOCUS .

Jürgen

 

[yaya]

Thanks Marc
It did some research at KODAK and DALSA .
The H4D-60 sensor as well as the H4D-50 must be DALSA sensors .

The 60MP sensor is 40,4x53,9 mm and has the new 6 micron technology .
The 50MP sensor is 37x49 mm and also has the 6 micron technology but obviously a different crop factor .
Jürgen

The 50MP is from Kodak

 

[Steve Hendrix]

Thanks Marc

It did some research at KODAK and DALSA .
The H4D-60 sensor as well as the H4D-50 must be DALSA sensors .

The 60MP sensor is 40,4x53,9 mm and has the new 6 micron technology .
The 50MP sensor is 37x49 mm and also has the 6 micron technology but obviously a different crop factor .

I wonder , if the V-system ZEISS lenses have a sufficient enough resolution for the 6 micron pixels .

If the ZEISS glass is good enough , why do we then have SCHNEIDER and LINOS/RODENSTOCK special "digitars and digital" lenses ? ? ?

Is this just a trick to make more money ? ? ?

I have done some tests with the ZEISS MACRO PLANAR CFE 4/120 and the CFV-39 (6,8 micron pixels) and have the impresion , this lens has come to its limit .
With or without lens correction in PHOCUS .

Jürgen

Most of the V series zeiss lenses come very close to the resolution of the H series lenses but are optimized differently. The H lenses are very similar in resolution to the new Phase One D lenses. It is true that the Schneider/Rodenstock lenses are better, resolve higher, especially at the edges.

The 120mm in particular may not be a great lens for digital. I haven't compared it to the H series 120mm version, but we have compared the H series 120mm to the Phase One 120mm and I was surprised at the difference. By inference, this perhaps sheds some light on the capability of the CFE 120mm/F4.

http://www.captureintegration.com/tests/phase-one/


Steve Hendrix

 

[georgl]

The Zeiss-lenses from the V-systems are quite old, most of them are over 30 years old designs. The 40IF is one of the few current designs and superior to most other WA-lenses.
The Schneider/Rodenstock-"digital"-lenses are much newer designs and take the cover glass in front of the sensor into account which may help to reduce aberrations.
Delivering high contrast with few aberrations at 80lp/mm (6µm-pixel-pitch) is possible with most current lenses stopped down and medium image height. Open aperture and corner performance make the difference.

 

[Ranger 9]

I made a simple (too simple ?) test tonight:

You can actually test the principle without needing a camera! Take a stick about 1 meter long and hold one end securely against the side of your head. Stand so the other end of the stick just touches a wall. Tilt your head up and down and notice how the distance between the wall and the end of the stick varies. (Warning: You will look really silly doing this, so make sure you have privacy!)

Just playing with this idea for a few seconds, I found it was easy to get 1-1/2 to 2 inches of change with only a small head tilt -- about the amount I might need recomposing from a centered to an off-center point.

Two inches isn't significant in most kinds of photography, but it definitely IS significant if you're shooting head shots at fairly wide apertures (such as to throw distracting backgrounds out of focus.) A two-inch change is enough to shift the plane of best focus from your subject's eye to the tip of his/her nose, and this definitely will be noticeable in the final results!

 

[cmb_]

Here is the data sheet for the H4D 60:
http://www.hasselbladusa.com/media/2081132/uk_h4d60_datasheets_v1.pdf

 

[fotografz]

I just read an interesting tid-bit on another forum dedicated to Hasselblad. Evidently a photographer on that forum ordered the new focus upgrade for an existing 39 meg camera.

If that is true ... it is a big deal since I wouldn't sell off my existing H3D-II/39 just upgrade it. I will investigate if this true.