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Thread: S2 in the "Real World"

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    Re: S2 in the "Real World"

    The Arca Plate or RRS or Kirk systems screw into the bottom of the Hasselblad connector plate - so there is no problem. I use simple Arca type bottom of camera connectors when I dont need vertical orientation. My experience is that teh L connectors interfere some what with some functionality of most camera bodies - this is especially true with Hy6.

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    Re: S2 in the "Real World"

    ...so I guess it is a really handy feature of teh 75LVr that teh back rotates on camera, huh? -

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    Re: S2 in the "Real World"

    Quote Originally Posted by PeterA View Post
    ...so I guess it is a really handy feature of teh 75LVr that teh back rotates on camera, huh? -
    YA FINKZ?

  4. #204
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    Re: S2 in the "Real World"

    Quote Originally Posted by carstenw View Post
    One day when the prices of the CFV39 come down, I will examine what quality I would get from that combo. The CFV is too small though, physically and resolution.
    A CFV39 would be nice but the deadly combo of Girl friend, Cameras and Cars eats away at the new "toys" budget. :>)

    Steve

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    Workshop Member ptomsu's Avatar
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    Re: S2 in the "Real World"

    Quote Originally Posted by fotografz View Post
    My thinking exactly.

    I am strongly leaning toward my final upgrade with Hasselblad to the H4D/60 which distances itself from the pack of 35mm dogs nipping at the heals of the lower end MFD backs ... at a trade up price + the Hassey extended service contract that totals less than just the S2 body. Plus, I am very interested in the new focusing system in the H4D which has real world value to me and the way I shoot.

    I took the time to carefully process the shots I had done with the S2 rather than the laptop ones I did in a rush while on vacation ... but also did a search of my archives for some shots I had done in identical beach conditions with a H3D/31 and 100/2.2 lens. That was a revelation itself in that we forget how good all these existing MFD systems already are.

    Also, I do not feel the same way about the form factor differences as others may, but fully appreciate their point of view. I have shot with 645 for so long it is second nature to me ... and the H system is very user friendly in areas that are important to me, like being able to compensate the camera or flash without removing my eye from the viewfinder. With a hand strap in place I feel as much or more stability for hand held work as I do the S2. I won't even reiterate all the "studio" reasons which has been covered to death already.

    While my decision is not totally complete, and I do greatly appreciate the opportunity to have used the S2, I doubt it is ready for my prime time use. Once the H4D/60 is in hand, and the next rumored step by Sony is here, it may never be my cup of tea.

    If I had been starting from scratch, and the MFD competition had not progressed past a 39 meg sensor and not progressed with their integrated systems and related software, it may well have been a different story.

    I actually dearly hope I'm in the minority, and the S2 is a raging success ... I want Leica to stay fat and healthy and bring me a M10 some day ... prefferably a real chrome version
    If I were you, I would go the Hasselblad upgrade path and vote for a H4D60. Doing so, you will get most value for your money (which is the reason of course why these companies offer the upgrades in order to keep their customers ) and keep you on the save side for the next 2 years before something newer and maybe upgrade worth is coming!

    The decision to wait and see WRT S system is definitely the right one. My stomach or what else internal organs tell me, that the release date will further drop and even if the manage to ship some units in January a kind of predictable purchase will be not possible before autumn 2010. WRT S glass same feeling plus you cannot count on the availability of say 80% of the S lens lineup within the next 2 years. That makes full system availability 2012 in my opinion and then - I can predict for sure - the current S2 will be completely out of date and fully overtaken by 35mm DSLRs (or at least equal level) and completely left behind the 60-80MP backs available by then from Phase and Hasselblad. So you can call this generations behind - generations in terms of digital evolution.

    Will they have a S3 as answer for that? Maybe, maybe not. But even if they would do this homework then the S3 would have a maximum of 55MP (or similar range), while you would be in the 80MP plus area with Phase and Hasselblad.

    I am also sure that both Phase and Hasselblad will do their homework to upgrade and complete their lens lineup to make it fit the next generation high resolution backs, so the argument of just Leica glass can be as good is no longer true.

    I for myself decided - after almost 9 months of research, testing and trying and reading all material and reports I could get hold of in different forums, mainly here in GetDPI I must give this compliment - to go for Hasselblad. It could have been Phase if they did not screw up the final pricing, but from the product both vendors were finally equally appealing and also readiness and openness (even if only internal) of their systems in terms of upgradability.

    Deciding for Hasselblad allows me an upgrade early next year to H4D60, I will add 1 or 2 more lenses to my lineup - 28, 35-90, 100, 150 or 210 - and be a happy shooter. And if I desire so I can expand with any tech camera and their legendary glass, which I still have to prove if it delivers better results for me than the system I have by then.

    And in 2 years - who knows, upgrade to the H5D80 ???

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    Re: S2 in the "Real World"

    Quote Originally Posted by Bob View Post
    YA FINKZ?


    yeah the L brackets make for less than optimal access ot exposure and metering switches..- also see the poor mating of the RRL bracket ( stolen from H camera as RRS dont make an L bracket for the Hy6 ).. to Hy6 base - because base has some protrusions ..still you can get enough firmness to make it irrelevant in practical use - and mated to the ball head or even better the cube - level ling is no problem -

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    Re: S2 in the "Real World"

    Quote Originally Posted by PeterA View Post


    yeah the L brackets make for less than optimal access ot exposure and metering switches..- also see the poor mating of the RRL bracket ( stolen from H camera as RRS dont make an L bracket for the Hy6 ).. to Hy6 base - because base has some protrusions ..still you can get enough firmness to make it irrelevant in practical use - and mated to the ball head or even better the cube - level ling is no problem -
    For what purpose does one need a L Bracket for a camera with rotating back?
    I use the Novoflex Q-Base so you dont even need to srcrew the Hy6 on any plate but just use the Hy6-Integrated plate which fits in the Q-Base. This means one elements less which could bring instability in the system
    Last edited by Paratom; 29th November 2009 at 04:27.

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    Re: S2 in the "Real World"

    Quote Originally Posted by ptomsu View Post
    If I were you, I would go the Hasselblad upgrade path and vote for a H4D60. Doing so, you will get most value for your money (which is the reason of course why these companies offer the upgrades in order to keep their customers ) and keep you on the save side for the next 2 years before something newer and maybe upgrade worth is coming!

    The decision to wait and see WRT S system is definitely the right one. My stomach or what else internal organs tell me, that the release date will further drop and even if the manage to ship some units in January a kind of predictable purchase will be not possible before autumn 2010. WRT S glass same feeling plus you cannot count on the availability of say 80% of the S lens lineup within the next 2 years. That makes full system availability 2012 in my opinion and then - I can predict for sure - the current S2 will be completely out of date and fully overtaken by 35mm DSLRs (or at least equal level) and completely left behind the 60-80MP backs available by then from Phase and Hasselblad. So you can call this generations behind - generations in terms of digital evolution.

    Will they have a S3 as answer for that? Maybe, maybe not. But even if they would do this homework then the S3 would have a maximum of 55MP (or similar range), while you would be in the 80MP plus area with Phase and Hasselblad.

    I am also sure that both Phase and Hasselblad will do their homework to upgrade and complete their lens lineup to make it fit the next generation high resolution backs, so the argument of just Leica glass can be as good is no longer true.

    I for myself decided - after almost 9 months of research, testing and trying and reading all material and reports I could get hold of in different forums, mainly here in GetDPI I must give this compliment - to go for Hasselblad. It could have been Phase if they did not screw up the final pricing, but from the product both vendors were finally equally appealing and also readiness and openness (even if only internal) of their systems in terms of upgradability.

    Deciding for Hasselblad allows me an upgrade early next year to H4D60, I will add 1 or 2 more lenses to my lineup - 28, 35-90, 100, 150 or 210 - and be a happy shooter. And if I desire so I can expand with any tech camera and their legendary glass, which I still have to prove if it delivers better results for me than the system I have by then.

    And in 2 years - who knows, upgrade to the H5D80 ???

    Congrats Peter , wish you well with your new system. Hassy makes nice stuff and wish you well with your choice. I'm really glad you finally made your decision, I know and the members know you did your research well and went through many changing decisions. I think we all can say we are glad you finally got in the door and will be shooting with MF very soon. Myself I am looking into financing to see if I can upgrade before the year is out, need the tax deduction.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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    Re: S2 in the "Real World"

    Quote Originally Posted by t_streng View Post
    For what purpose does one need a L Bracket for a camera with rotating back?
    I use the Novoflex Q-Base so you dont even need to srcrew the Hy6 on any plate but just use the Hy6-Integrated plate which fits in the Q-Base. This means one elements less which could bring instability in the system
    The L bracket on the Hy6 is a total waste of time on a rotating back as pointed out..trying to add some humour to a thread on teh S2 which as far as I am concerned went out of control days ago,...

    Thansk for the heads up but - as for the Novoflex system - I dont wish to buy into a a system to satisfy one camera as I use arca cube and RRS stuff ballhead with arca type adaptor ( and L plates) on a variety of cameras.

    Pete

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    Re: S2 in the "Real World"

    The Novoflex Q system works fine with all arca, RRS or Kirks stuff so far.

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    Re: S2 in the "Real World"

    Quote Originally Posted by PeterA View Post
    ...so I guess it is a really handy feature of teh 75LVr that teh back rotates on camera, huh? -
    This is one feature of the Hy6 that I really like and use frequently, especially when using the WLF. Leaf accomplished the same goal by rotating the sensor internally.

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    Re: S2 in the "Real World"

    Quote Originally Posted by PeterA View Post
    The L bracket on the Hy6 is a total waste of time on a rotating back as pointed out..trying to add some humour to a thread on teh S2 which as far as I am concerned went out of control days ago,...

    Thansk for the heads up but - as for the Novoflex system - I dont wish to buy into a a system to satisfy one camera as I use arca cube and RRS stuff ballhead with arca type adaptor ( and L plates) on a variety of cameras.

    Pete
    sorry Peter - seems I didnt get it

    I agree that the thread got out of control.
    Its strange - some days of discussion and some people get from totally interested to not interested any more regarding the S2.
    And all that without any new facts.

    Personally I still believe the S2 should have a 24x36mm ccd sensor and use a R bajonet.

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    Re: S2 in the "Real World"

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Mancuso View Post
    Congrats Peter , wish you well with your new system. Hassy makes nice stuff and wish you well with your choice. I'm really glad you finally made your decision, I know and the members know you did your research well and went through many changing decisions. I think we all can say we are glad you finally got in the door and will be shooting with MF very soon. Myself I am looking into financing to see if I can upgrade before the year is out, need the tax deduction.
    Guy,

    many thanks! Yes I am really happy I came to a conclusion and what is even better - I am sure I made the right choice for me.

    May I say now, that I am VERY thankful to all the discussions here in the forum, this was and is the best place to be if you try to make such tough decisions. Great help and absolutely wonderful input and feedback!

    I really hope that this stays the same way in the future and I am looking forward to many interesting topics and discussions over the next years. And of course also workshops - could learn a lot and find out new things during my attendance.

    WRT upgrade of your system, all the best for the financing and the upgrade, know how these things work. For me it was also very important to do the purchase now (this year) because of tax reasons.

    Many thanks again!

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    Re: S2 in the "Real World"

    yes. unfortunately leica is doing its digital homework late and at the expense of the customer. a three lens MF system is ridiculous and it takes much more than leica dealers like dave F to convince everyone that this is the way it should be. when finally leica will have its lens lineup ready nikon will have surpassed from below and hassy/phase will be miles away above. but still there will be those desparately trying to convince us that the red dot is winning in MF.
    kudos to steve hendrix, david grover, yaya and others from hasselblad, capture integration and phase/leaf for providing us with objective information.
    peter


    Quote Originally Posted by ptomsu View Post
    If I were you, I would go the Hasselblad upgrade path and vote for a H4D60. Doing so, you will get most value for your money (which is the reason of course why these companies offer the upgrades in order to keep their customers ) and keep you on the save side for the next 2 years before something newer and maybe upgrade worth is coming!

    The decision to wait and see WRT S system is definitely the right one. My stomach or what else internal organs tell me, that the release date will further drop and even if the manage to ship some units in January a kind of predictable purchase will be not possible before autumn 2010. WRT S glass same feeling plus you cannot count on the availability of say 80% of the S lens lineup within the next 2 years. That makes full system availability 2012 in my opinion and then - I can predict for sure - the current S2 will be completely out of date and fully overtaken by 35mm DSLRs (or at least equal level) and completely left behind the 60-80MP backs available by then from Phase and Hasselblad. So you can call this generations behind - generations in terms of digital evolution.

    Will they have a S3 as answer for that? Maybe, maybe not. But even if they would do this homework then the S3 would have a maximum of 55MP (or similar range), while you would be in the 80MP plus area with Phase and Hasselblad.

    I am also sure that both Phase and Hasselblad will do their homework to upgrade and complete their lens lineup to make it fit the next generation high resolution backs, so the argument of just Leica glass can be as good is no longer true.

    I for myself decided - after almost 9 months of research, testing and trying and reading all material and reports I could get hold of in different forums, mainly here in GetDPI I must give this compliment - to go for Hasselblad. It could have been Phase if they did not screw up the final pricing, but from the product both vendors were finally equally appealing and also readiness and openness (even if only internal) of their systems in terms of upgradability.

    Deciding for Hasselblad allows me an upgrade early next year to H4D60, I will add 1 or 2 more lenses to my lineup - 28, 35-90, 100, 150 or 210 - and be a happy shooter. And if I desire so I can expand with any tech camera and their legendary glass, which I still have to prove if it delivers better results for me than the system I have by then.

    And in 2 years - who knows, upgrade to the H5D80 ???

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    Re: S2 in the "Real World"

    Quote Originally Posted by ptomsu View Post
    If I were you, I would go the Hasselblad upgrade path and vote for a H4D60. Doing so, you will get most value for your money (which is the reason of course why these companies offer the upgrades in order to keep their customers ) and keep you on the save side for the next 2 years before something newer and maybe upgrade worth is coming!

    The decision to wait and see WRT S system is definitely the right one. My stomach or what else internal organs tell me, that the release date will further drop and even if the manage to ship some units in January a kind of predictable purchase will be not possible before autumn 2010. WRT S glass same feeling plus you cannot count on the availability of say 80% of the S lens lineup within the next 2 years. That makes full system availability 2012 in my opinion and then - I can predict for sure - the current S2 will be completely out of date and fully overtaken by 35mm DSLRs (or at least equal level) and completely left behind the 60-80MP backs available by then from Phase and Hasselblad. So you can call this generations behind - generations in terms of digital evolution.

    Will they have a S3 as answer for that? Maybe, maybe not. But even if they would do this homework then the S3 would have a maximum of 55MP (or similar range), while you would be in the 80MP plus area with Phase and Hasselblad.

    I am also sure that both Phase and Hasselblad will do their homework to upgrade and complete their lens lineup to make it fit the next generation high resolution backs, so the argument of just Leica glass can be as good is no longer true.

    I for myself decided - after almost 9 months of research, testing and trying and reading all material and reports I could get hold of in different forums, mainly here in GetDPI I must give this compliment - to go for Hasselblad. It could have been Phase if they did not screw up the final pricing, but from the product both vendors were finally equally appealing and also readiness and openness (even if only internal) of their systems in terms of upgradability.

    Deciding for Hasselblad allows me an upgrade early next year to H4D60, I will add 1 or 2 more lenses to my lineup - 28, 35-90, 100, 150 or 210 - and be a happy shooter. And if I desire so I can expand with any tech camera and their legendary glass, which I still have to prove if it delivers better results for me than the system I have by then.

    And in 2 years - who knows, upgrade to the H5D80 ???
    Yep, I am seeking H4D pricing now. What I was missing was more complete information on the new H4D/60, some of which is now available on the Hasselblad site.

    In addition to the new focusing system, they have doubled the resolution of the TFT type 3" 24 bit LCD from 230,400 pixels to 460,320 pixels; have increased the read-write performance to 90/MB with Sandisk Extreme Pro CFs; and have improved the AF assist illumination for lower available light ... all of which are meaningful to me and my shooting demands. Also looking forward to the new version of Phocus.

    Again, thanks to all for all of the input pro and con ... as "spirited" as it got, much of it was still valuable in making such a difficult decision with so much money involved.

    Thanks,

    -Marc

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    Re: S2 in the "Real World"

    Hasselblad and Phase One....it's all good. Just comes down to what's the best deal for any one person, given their prior investement in lenses, upgrade options, service availability etc etc.

    I wish Leica well in this very competitive market and economy.

    Gary

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