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Why do you use MF? or: I am in the MF crisis...

carstenw

Active member
There is less difference in functionality, but of course adding the T/S Panel makes the WRS both more expensive and larger, and there is the question of the accuracy of the T/S functionality compared to the movements on the arTec.

Btw, I also find both arTec and WRS very attractive, and if I ever wanted this type of camera, one of these two is almost certainly what I would get.
 

Jack

Sr. Administrator
Staff member
If the WRS had a sliding back option, I'd be all over it in a nanosecond...
 

carstenw

Active member
I also use my prism more often with the Contax, but always carry the WLF as well. I don't like using a WLF on 645 as much as on 6x6, not least because of portrait mode.
 

carstenw

Active member
If the WRS had a sliding back option, I'd be all over it in a nanosecond...
You mean with or without the T/S panel? Wouldn't you need it to get front-to-back sharpness in the kinds of landscapes you do? At that point, the arTec is also a real choice (does it come with a Phase mount yet?).
 
T

tokengirl

Guest
In the color pair, the detail was again for all intents and purposes Identical. However, color tonality was a completely different story. The color shot was of a thick forest floor, with lots of various shades of green, from blue-green to yellow greens, along with some subtle tonal gradations in the browns. Bottom line here was that in the M9 print, most of the greens all looked the same color, while in the Hassy shot you could see a wide variety of subtle color gradation.
This is pretty much it for me. I struggle with thoughts of whether to pursue a journey into MFDB-Land or not, as I am extremely happy with my DSLR kit (Canon 5DMkII). I love the versatility, features and lens choices of my current setup. I am comfortable with my equipment. So sometimes, in more rational moments, I talk myself down from this ridiculous notion of spending more than my car cost for a fairly basic MFDB kit that will not be NEARLY as versatile as my Canon kit.

And then I think about the shades of green, because that's where I really see the biggest difference between DSLR and MFDB. Those delicate, subtle tonal differences in the greens are just lost in DSLR-land, comparatively speaking.

So I continue to dream.
 

thomas

New member
There is less difference in functionality, but of course adding the T/S Panel makes the WRS both more expensive and larger, and there is the question of the accuracy of the T/S functionality compared to the movements on the arTec.
The TS lens panel is not really larger than the regular panel. It's indeed a very slick solution!
They just should mount the lenses turned 45° - otherwise the Tilt-screw covers the distance indication on the lens :wtf:
At least me I am going to order my lenses turned 45° (even without the TS panel).

Btw, I also find both arTec and WRS very attractive, and if I ever wanted this type of camera, one of these two is almost certainly what I would get.
And I am very, very interessted in the Arca Swiss Rm3D :)
Hopefully I'll get one in my hands soon to test it.
 

Paratom

Well-known member
Thomas have you tried a finder instead of the WLF. Myself i focus better with a finder when I shot Hassy years ago I found using a WLF a much harder focusing tool without that little magnifier that popped up. I know the Hy6 does not have one , actually just played with Son's a couple weeks ago and it hunts in low light like anyone else's but I had a little bit of a struggle with WLF but I am so used to using a regular finder that it could be me. Just wondering if you tried a regular finder at all and maybe something you may want to look at.
Hi Guy,
The Hy6 WLF has the little pop up loupe and it works well.
I also have a 45 degree finder which is very nice - in the end both work fine.
AF is where I really have problems. I got in contact with Sinar today and probably I will send the camera in.
 

Jack

Sr. Administrator
Staff member
You mean with or without the T/S panel? Wouldn't you need it to get front-to-back sharpness in the kinds of landscapes you do? At that point, the arTec is also a real choice (does it come with a Phase mount yet?).
WITH the TS panel. And yes, the Artech or the M-2 are the only current solutions that offer rise/fall/shift plus tilt AND swing with a sliding back viewing option that can also accommodate a 35mm lens...
 

Jack

Sr. Administrator
Staff member
Arca Swiss Rm3d :)
Only offers tilt or turned 90 degrees sideways to get swing, not both together. In my review of the Cambo TS panel, I show a very clear example of why/when BOTH together are important.
 

thomas

New member
There is less difference in functionality, but of course adding the T/S Panel makes the WRS both more expensive and larger, and there is the question of the accuracy of the T/S functionality compared to the movements on the arTec.
Btw, I also find both arTec and WRS very attractive, and if I ever wanted this type of camera, one of these two is almost certainly what I would get.
as to the accuracy of the TS panel:
I do not doubt that it is very accurate; Cambo is working within tolerances of 1/100mm (at least that's what they say and I have no reason to doubt it).
But... and that's maybe a big but ... I am not sure how accurate it is over a long time. I think the mechanism is prone to go a bit baggy. Just speculation...

As to arTec vs. WRS: two different concepts. Both very strong. Actually the arTec would meet my needs better. However my "tuned" WRS meanwhile is nice to use. I've exchanged the regular GG with a fresnel GG and bought a bright and clear and perfectly to adjust 6x loupe for focussing.
And I LOVE that integrated leveling base. I can go shooting with a small backpack with the Cambo outfit and actually don't miss anything. It's really very, very lean.
 

Jack

Sr. Administrator
Staff member
Where can one actually purchase the Artech, and do they offer Mamiya plates yet?
 

carstenw

Active member
What loupe do you use, Thomas? I need a focusing loupe for my upcoming 4x5 Chamonix, and both the Schneider and the Rodenstock loupes are 200 Euro :bugeyes:
 

thomas

New member
Only offers tilt or turned 90 degrees sideways to get swing, not both together. In my review of the Cambo TS panel, I show a very clear example of why/when BOTH together are important.
I see!
It's really funny (or maybe not so funny): all these cameras provide certain features but lack of one or two features other cameras offer (due to their particular concept/design).
So a WRS with sliding back (impossible!) or a Arca withTilt&Swing (more likely) would be nice for you... and both do not exist right now.
The closest match seems to be the arTec. But no Mamiya Mount for you yet (AFAIK) and Rodenstock lenses only (which is - maybe - no drawback).
 

thomas

New member
What loupe do you use, Thomas? I need a focusing loupe for my upcoming 4x5 Chamonix, and both the Schneider and the Rodenstock loupes are 200 Euro :bugeyes:
It's a Rodenstock with aspherical glass. Yes, it's quite expensive (€260,- or so). I spent hours comparing... I don't know... 10? ... loupes and finally it was the Rodenstock due to the brightness, clearness, the magnification factor and the handling. Actually it was clearly the Rodenstock from the very beginning... I just thought it must be possible to get a good loupe for half the price or so. But I didn't want to make a compromise here.
 

Jack

Sr. Administrator
Staff member
I see!
It's really funny (or maybe not so funny): all these cameras provide certain features but lack of one or two features other cameras offer (due to their particular concept/design).
So a WRS with sliding back (impossible!) or a Arca withTilt&Swing (more likely) would be nice for you... and both do not exist right now.
The closest match seems to be the arTec. But no Mamiya Mount for you yet (AFAIK) and Rodenstock lenses only (which is - maybe - no drawback).
Exactly, though there is the Arca M-2 option. Sinar only offering Rodenstock is fine as I really like the HR Digirons.
 

Paratom

Well-known member
.... For portraits and people, the 110 or 180 are much better.

Tom, do you really find that you use all 5 lenses? Especially 150+180 sounds a little redundant..
Carsten,
I started with 80 of the kit, than bought the 40 and 150, 40 because its wide, 150 because it seemed like the best compromise between weight, focal length and price.
As soon as I had the 110 this became my most used lens, because it is fast, easier to focus than the slower lenses, very short minimum focus distance, and very flexible focal length. The only dowside besides price is the weight/bulk.
The 50 and 180 I got used later on.
Mostly I would carry the Hy6 with 110mm and either 40 or 50mm.
If I had to walk longer I might carry 40 and 80 because its lighter.
I really havent used the 150 much at all.

The 180 with its longer reach and speed is very nice too but its a monster lens and you dont wat to carry it long distances. However you can shoot really special portraits with it.

I might sell the 150 and maybe even the 180 - but then as long as I own ther Hy6 system I think it is great to have those lenses together-specially since they might not be manufactured in the future any more. Plus I dont think they will loose (any more) value right now- so no rush.

What I shall do is to use the 80 more often again.
 

carstenw

Active member
It's a Rodenstock with aspherical glass. Yes, it's quite expensive (€260,- or so). I spent hours comparing... I don't know... 10? ... loupes and finally it was the Rodenstock due to the brightness, clearness, the magnification factor and the handling. Actually it was clearly the Rodenstock from the very beginning... I just thought it must be possible to get a good loupe for half the price or so. But I didn't want to make a compromise here.
Wow, that really seems excessive. I only paid about 360 Euro for my Schneider APO-Symmar 210mm f/5.6 including shipping and import duties! I'll have to think about a compromise here, or really go for it.
 

thomas

New member
Exactly, though there is the Arca M-2 option.
It would drive me crazy as hell to focus for infinity all the time without helical focus mount! I've adjusted my Digitar very carefully to my DB and it's dead on at infinity. Infinity is safe ground - that's a very good feeling! :D
Of course you could engrave marks on the rail for the infinity setting of each lens. But is that really accurate enough with your P65+? I doubt so...

Sinar only offering Rodenstock is fine as I really like the HR Digirons.
on an arTec these lenses make perfectly sense. But the Digitars (beside the symetrical design) are light and small... if this is what you are up to.
 
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