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Thread: Pentax countdown..........

  1. #251
    Senior Member Lars's Avatar
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    Re: Pentax countdown..........

    Yeah the key for C/N is to keep their glass compatible. Moving up to a bigger sensor means a whole new market for them.

    Pentax is experimenting with this release. the 645D has been on and off as a project within Pentax several times over the last few years. Finally they decided to take it all the way to a product, launch it in Japan to test the waters. My guess is that international distribution is by no means a given.

    There is some marketing logic to this though - strengthen the brand for a future fullframe 24x36 DSLR. The Pentax lens family for FF is quite interesting even today, but the body is missing.
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    Re: Pentax countdown..........

    Quote Originally Posted by roanjoh View Post
    I have serious doubt that C/N will get into the MF market. They might focus their R&D on mirrorless, smaller DSLR (aka - m4/3, Samsung NX10) as the majority of the market is heading towards that direction to compliment their current gears. Ideally for me, Canon/Nikon will introduce a direct competition to the M9 - a small, mirrorless camera with a full frame sensor :-)

    But then again, you never know...........Pentax pretty much jumped the ship on full-frame DSLR and went straight to MF territory.

    What is stopping Pentax from coming up with a FF mirrorless cam?!

    I can understand the rationale for 10+frames/s and fast AF but there are plenty of users who do not need that but still would like to have FF (35mm speak) sensored bodies that aren't truck sized.

    I am looking forward to the Samsung NX10 showing up for sale.

  3. #253
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    Re: Pentax countdown..........

    Pentax currently doesn't have the resources to compete on all fronts. They're barely hanging on in the photographic market. Hoya could pull the plug at any moment.

    Bringing the 645D to market, at long last, leverages the existing platform of compatible lenses and satisfied owners of the film models. From the perspective of a business desperately in need of a reason for continued existence, and of critical mass to justify and sustain future development efforts, it represents a rational attempt to find a niche at least somewhat sheltered from direct attack by Nikon/Canon, where Pentax has some distinctive value to offer.

    The markets for both FF and mirrorless interchangeable lens are, by comparison, brutally competitive already. Pentax may have to enter the latter as a defensive move, but they will not be playing a strong hand.

    Remember that Mamiya used to sell 35mm cameras too. They've continued to take their lumps and bumps, but their decision to withdraw from that larger market to take shelter in the niche of medium format is probably one important reason why they're still around today.

  4. #254
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    Re: Pentax countdown..........

    Bringing the 645D to market, at long last, leverages the existing platform of compatible lenses and satisfied owners of the film models. From the perspective of a business desperately in need of a reason for continued existence, and of critical mass to justify and sustain future development efforts, it represents a rational attempt to find a niche at least somewhat sheltered from direct attack by Nikon/Canon, where Pentax has some distinctive value to offer.
    *********
    I am surprised that Hoya has made this move. The speculation was, at the time of the take-over/merger, that the camera division would be sold off. My guess would be that most of the R & D and "getting ready for production" money had been spent and the additional capital needed for a test marketing in Japan wasn't that much.

    The "price" point for this camera is at/slightly below my psychological threshold for a MFD upgrade. The HD4-40 isn't even close. I suspect that there are enough people in this small market, with a similar threshold, to make the Pentax a success if it performs up to it advertised specs.

    Steve

  5. #255
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    Re: Pentax countdown..........

    Quote Originally Posted by Vivek View Post
    What is stopping Pentax from coming up with a FF mirrorless cam?!
    Maybe a FF mirrored cam??

    How do you think the purist and traditional users will react if Pentax introduces a mirrorless full frame camera before the more traditional/clunky mirrored one? Yeah - pissed!!

  6. #256
    Senior Member bensonga's Avatar
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    Re: Pentax countdown..........

    Quote Originally Posted by Oren Grad View Post
    Bringing the 645D to market, at long last, leverages the existing platform of compatible lenses and satisfied owners of the film models.
    Exactly! This also why I think it is very unlikely that Canon or Nikon will enter the medium format digital market. They never entered the medium format film market and don't have an established base of dedicated owners (like myself) who already own a few useable lenses (hence reducing that initial entry price) which could have given them an immediate "in" to this market.

    Also, why would Canon or Nikon basically cannibalize sales from their $6-$8k pro DSLRs and spend the money to develop a whole new line of lenses for MFD? I don't see a real advantage for them in a move to MFD....unless of course, the Pentax 645D makes a very, very BIG dent in the sales of Canon/Nikon pro DSLRs.

    I'm just glad that Pentax finally came thru with the 645D....and with a product that is very attractively priced vs the existing MFD players.

    Gary
    Last edited by bensonga; 17th March 2010 at 14:01.

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    Re: Pentax countdown..........

    I hope this camera is a huge success as it will pressure not only MF makers in Hasselblad and Phase, but high DSLR's from Canon and Nikon.
    On paper the 40MP cameras from Phase and Hassy look pretty overpriced right now.

  8. #258
    Senior Member bensonga's Avatar
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    Re: Pentax countdown..........

    Many more photos of the 645D here:

    http://dc.watch.impress.co.jp/docs/r...15_353742.html

    Including some with a P67 105mm f2.4 lens attached. There will be a digital future for my P67 lenses after all.

    I've found that I actually prefer using my P67 lenses mounted on the 645NII I bought recently....the camera feels well balanced with those bigger lenses. I'm going to send the manual focus 645 lenses I purchased with the camera back to KEH and perhaps pick up some of the 645 FA (autofocus) lenses in the future.

    Gary




  9. #259
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    Re: Pentax countdown..........





    Compared to a regular SLR - not bad :-)

    This camera will be wildly popular if it can deliver on IQ.

    Roan

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    Re: Pentax countdown..........

    I like the way the screen on the top deck is angled. I barely use my top screens because they don't seem to be in a good viewing position.

    The 645 AF lenses are scarce!

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    Senior Member bensonga's Avatar
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    Re: Pentax countdown..........

    Quote Originally Posted by TEBnewyork View Post
    The 645 AF lenses are scarce!
    Yeah, those folks over on the Pentax Forum are snapping them up left and right. The only FA series (autofocus) lenses I've found in the past few days are in Hong Kong and Germany. I'm sure that if/when the 645D is available here in the US, we'll get the full complement of FA lenses too.

    Gary
    Last edited by bensonga; 28th March 2010 at 18:49.

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    Re: Pentax countdown..........

    can someone tell me how noisy the prototypes were on shutter release?

    Phamiya loud or Canon acceptable or Leica quiet?

  13. #263
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    Re: Pentax countdown..........

    Quote Originally Posted by bensonga View Post
    Yeah, those folks over on the Pentax Forum are snapping them up left and right. The only FA series (autofocus) lenses I've found in the past few days are in Hong Kong and Germany. I'm sure that if/when the 645D is available here in the US, we'll get the full complement of FA lenses too.

    Gary
    Which Pentax forum have you been reading?
    Waiting for it to hit the US? I'm thinking this might entail a roadtrip to Toky!

  14. #264
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    Re: Pentax countdown..........

    Quote Originally Posted by narikin View Post
    can someone tell me how noisy the prototypes were on shutter release?

    Phamiya loud or Canon acceptable or Leica quiet?
    Check the dcwatch link posted up top - they have a video with shutter sound.

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    Re: Pentax countdown..........

    Quote Originally Posted by thomas View Post
    .... Why I have been shipped a P45 with a tilted, swinged an rotated sonsor first? Why I have been shipped 3 (new!) P21+ just to get one that works flawlessly (and that, btw, already needs recalibration again! And so my P45 does!). Is there any quality control at Phase One? Why did J. Holmes write an extensive report on "medium format precission"? Why can't I check focus reliably (and be it based on an in-camera JPG) on the LCD of a Phase One back? Why is a refurbished black metal box without any camera at all so much pricier than the 645D? Is it so much better and so much more accurate that the price is justified in any way?
    I don't care what I've payed once for my DBs. I've decided to pay and I don't think back about that. However the 645D raises some serious questions when it comes to the prices of MFD.

    The next year or two will show what Phase and Hasselblad can *really* do to calculate competetively. I hope they stay in business, but work a little harder.

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    Senior Member bensonga's Avatar
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    Re: Pentax countdown..........

    Quote Originally Posted by TEBnewyork View Post
    Which Pentax forum have you been reading?
    Waiting for it to hit the US? I'm thinking this might entail a roadtrip to Toky!
    Hi Terry. Here's a link to the MF section of the Pentax Forum I mentioned:

    http://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/p...-645-6x7-645d/

    Maybe with a trip to Tokyo you'll be the first one in the States with a 645D and can do an exclusive review for us here at GetDPI.

    Gary

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    Re: Pentax countdown..........

    Quote Originally Posted by roanjoh View Post
    Check the dcwatch link posted up top - they have a video with shutter sound.
    It sounds quieter than my 503CWD and alot quieter than the motorized 645NII when it advances that 120 film.

    Gary

  18. #268
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    Re: Pentax countdown..........

    Quote Originally Posted by TEBnewyork View Post
    Which Pentax forum have you been reading?
    Waiting for it to hit the US? I'm thinking this might entail a roadtrip to Toky!
    http://www.japantrendshop.com/pentax-645d-p-833.html

    .........just saved you a plane tx Terry :-) Do it and give us a review!!!

  19. #269
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    Re: Pentax countdown..........

    Thanks! The link to this was broken yesterday.
    Now one just needs to find some lenses.

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    Re: Pentax countdown..........

    A good source of new Pentax lenses, both 645 and 67, is Tin Cheung Camera in Hong Kong. I have purchased from them and they are first rate. They often have lenses, like the elusive 35/3.5 FA, that are impossible to find new in the USA.

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    Re: Pentax countdown..........

    http://www.japanexposures.com/shop/p...roducts_id=381

    If you're adventurous enough to want to import one into the US before it's officially supported here, talk to Dirk Rosler. Unlike the Trend Shop, which is about selling gadgets, Dirk specializes in sourcing photographic equipment that's hard to find outside of Japan, and also can serve as an intermediary agent dealing with repair centers in Japan when they don't want to deal directly with an overseas customer and/or won't communicate in English.

    Context/disclaimer: I don't have any financial interest or other stake in Japan Exposures, but I am a very satisfied repeat customer.

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    Re: Pentax countdown..........

    Some fullres pictures from the 645D...

    http://www.pentax.jp/japan/imaging/d...m/645d/ex.html

    http://ganref.jp/magazines/index/1/0/366

    but no as sharp as a Leica S2...
    Last edited by xpixel; 19th May 2010 at 12:23.

  23. #273
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    Re: Pentax countdown..........

    Xpixel
    yes, I think there will be characteristics of the S2 and the Pentax that will join those of Phase Leaf and Hasselblad. In the early days Phase was 'analytical' and leaf 'warmer'

    Sharpness may be just a PP issue. I think many like their Pentax glass and will be pleased to have a MF option. Of course, S2 and Pentax are cameras whereas the others are backs, so a lot will depend on the other characteristics, like mirror slap, AF etc.

    But it does show "Rumours of the death of Medium Format were premature"

    (Remmebr when some said that Canon would have 35mm cameras to swamp backs etc etc

    anyway, good to see heady competition.

    regards
    Victor

    PS Keep those great S2 shots coming!

  24. #274
    Senior Member Lars's Avatar
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    Re: Pentax countdown..........

    Apparently Pentax has delayed the launch by a few weeks due to surprisingly high demand. Not sure if that's good or bad hehe.

    http://www.amateurphotographer.co.uk...ws_298306.html
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  25. #275
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    Re: Pentax countdown..........

    Hmmm. Why delay a launch just because -- or even if -- you have extraordinarily high demand???
    Jack
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    Re: Pentax countdown..........

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Flesher View Post
    Hmmm. Why delay a launch just because -- or even if -- you have extraordinarily high demand???
    Dunno about Hassey, but Phase certainly has no problems with releasing cameras and then make-you-wait-syndrome because of high demand... oh wait, that's just if you're a current Phase-user and they're filling orders for buyers new to Phase....


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