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Thread: Rollei Hy6 available again

  1. #1
    Photon
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    Rollei Hy6 available again

    Apparantly the Franke & Heidecke company seems to survive sofar (computer translation) : http://translate.google.com/translat...y6&sl=de&tl=en

    It will be interesting to see how the new batch of the Hy6 will stand up to the other brands, both pricewise and qualitywise.

    Saw a photographer shooting with the Hy6, the other day. Didn't get an opportunity to check on the images... but loved the sound of the apparatus!

    Warmest,

    Ton

    http://www.tonvanmourik.com/

  2. #2
    Senior Member Graham Mitchell's Avatar
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    Re: Rollei Hy6 available again

    Good news!

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    Re: Rollei Hy6 available again

    Very good news! If I ever buy an entirely new MFDB system, this would be at the top of my list. Especially if they ever release the 6x6 film back
    Carsten - Website

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    Re: Rollei Hy6 available again

    Who would buy a system when it could go belly up - again - with nothing you could do about it? I'd wait a bit longer, like a couple of years..
    I am not a painter, nor an artist. Therefore I can see straight, and that may be my undoing. - Alfred Stieglitz

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  5. #5
    Senior Member Graham Mitchell's Avatar
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    Re: Rollei Hy6 available again

    Quote Originally Posted by Ben Rubinstein View Post
    Who would buy a system when it could go belly up - again - with nothing you could do about it? I'd wait a bit longer, like a couple of years..
    People have been buying Contax 645 for years after that system was put to rest. I'd buy a Hy6 because none of the competition interests me very much. Just my $0.02.

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    Re: Rollei Hy6 available again

    Same here. I am a Contax 645 owner, by the way. I would of course much prefer a living, breathing system rather than one on artificial life support (third-party repair centres), but this preference is not so strong that I would buy either a Hasselblad H or a Phase body The Hy6 is very neat though, and the 6008AF is a gorgeous camera.
    Carsten - Website

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    Re: Rollei Hy6 available again

    Some notes from a German guy: Franke & Heidecke is gone, no second chance. There is a new company, DHW Photo GmbH. They sit in the same rooms, CEO is Hans Hartje, who also was CEO at Franke & Heidecke. So it's something like a successor, but legally it's simply a new company.

    This new company is up with some 30 people now, they provide service for Rollei products, also Hy6 bodies and lenses. They also produce some Rollei 35, twin-eyed Rollei cams and slide projectors.
    Additional they sell again Hy6-bodies and Tele-Apogon 4/150 mm AFD, both obviously taken from the remains of Franke & Heidecke (so up to now there is no new production). Body and lens are updated to the last and newest hard- and software. So far I understand, there is no chance for them to build the body again, because the rights belong to Leaf Imaging now (part of Phase One -> partly owner of Mamiya). I fear that Phase One won't have interest in an additional system on a small market...
    Also you only get the body - no digital backs. There were statements that allow to hope that the 6x6 film-back will be available in future.

    There is no homepage up to now, I only could find an Ebay-shop...

    Andreas

    PS: I rented a Hy6 with Sinar 75 - a dream. If I "find" some money then that's my system But with Leaf back only - Sinar needs Mac (no way for me because of software and costs).

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    Re: Rollei Hy6 available again

    Quote Originally Posted by Ben Rubinstein View Post
    Who would buy a system when it could go belly up - again - with nothing you could do about it? I'd wait a bit longer, like a couple of years..
    I would buy it (if I did not allready own it) because I like rotating back, exchangable viewfinders and Schneider glass.
    And I bought a Sinar back because I liked the idea of a sensor with good high ISO but still without micro lenses and in the larger size.
    Maybe its only because I am a german guy and like german craftmanship

  9. #9
    Photon
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    Re: Rollei Hy6 available again

    Boy, imagine adding the Schneider 90 4.5 apo...

    Warmest,

    Ton

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    Re: Rollei Hy6 available again

    When did they sell the rights to Leaf? I wasn't aware of that. If true, the rights belong now to P1. What can we expect from that?
    Excellent news anyways!
    Eduardo


    Quote Originally Posted by Schmiddi View Post
    Some notes from a German guy: Franke & Heidecke is gone, no second chance. There is a new company, DHW Photo GmbH. They sit in the same rooms, CEO is Hans Hartje, who also was CEO at Franke & Heidecke. So it's something like a successor, but legally it's simply a new company.

    This new company is up with some 30 people now, they provide service for Rollei products, also Hy6 bodies and lenses. They also produce some Rollei 35, twin-eyed Rollei cams and slide projectors.
    Additional they sell again Hy6-bodies and Tele-Apogon 4/150 mm AFD, both obviously taken from the remains of Franke & Heidecke (so up to now there is no new production). Body and lens are updated to the last and newest hard- and software. So far I understand, there is no chance for them to build the body again, because the rights belong to Leaf Imaging now (part of Phase One -> partly owner of Mamiya). I fear that Phase One won't have interest in an additional system on a small market...
    Also you only get the body - no digital backs. There were statements that allow to hope that the 6x6 film-back will be available in future.

    There is no homepage up to now, I only could find an Ebay-shop...

    Andreas

    PS: I rented a Hy6 with Sinar 75 - a dream. If I "find" some money then that's my system But with Leaf back only - Sinar needs Mac (no way for me because of software and costs).

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    Re: Rollei Hy6 available again

    Jenoptik apparently owned the rights, and licensed the body to Francke&Heidecke, who manufactured the body for Sinar and Leaf, as well as under their more traditional Rolleiflex name (without digital back in the latter case). When Jenoptik sold off the various bits and pieces, Sinar went without the Hy6 rights (other than the right to market, sell, support and maintain the bodies they already had on their shelf; apparently enough for several years), but somehow Phase bought the rights with Leaf.

    If Phase never does anything with the Hy6, I will never forgive them. At least they should open up the possibility of further marketing and development, this time with an optional Phase/Mamiya mount.

    All this is as far as I understand it. Parts may be wrong.
    Carsten - Website

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    Senior Member Graham Mitchell's Avatar
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    Re: Rollei Hy6 available again

    I was mislead by the title of this thread. The Hy6 never stopped being 'available to purchase', while existing stocks last. I am still hoping for continued production of the camera and accessories. Phase One is crazy to sit on it like this.

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    Re: Rollei Hy6 available again

    Quote Originally Posted by carstenw View Post
    If Phase never does anything with the Hy6, I will never forgive them. At least they should open up the possibility of further marketing and development, this time with an optional Phase/Mamiya mount.
    Well, from what I have read here in Germany Leaf/Phase bought the rights on the body just to have the technics inside. They consider to use technical solutions inside - but I doubt they will restart production of the body.

    As I understood, when Franke & Heidecke was closed the available things were divided: Sinar wanted to continue selling the body and the backs, so they got obviously most of the bodys (and maybe lenses) already produced, Sinar still offers the system as new. Leaf was taken by Phase, stopped AFI immediately, so no interest in hardware - but the knowledge was interesting. There are only a few demo AFI and AFI-II available on the market.
    Second problem: all machinery needed to build body and lenses are gone. Franke & Heidecke, as far as I know, did not own those, they were rented. So they are away. Also the people qualified to build the things are gone - they all were fired when F&H closed. I hope for them, that they have new jobs now... So bringing the system back to life will be really expensive - and with economy as it is and banks doing decisions...

    So for all those reasons I really don't have much hope for the system to come back to life. Very sad, as in my opinion it was the best designed one on the market... As I wrote: I used it one weekend, and I was really happy with it And with the money available I would not hesitate a second to step in!

    Andreas - now going to bed, may not miss my flight to Tallinn tomorrow...

    PS: at least Leaf has some AFI-II 10 backs left, they offer a trade-in for the backs (only back to back, no body!) - so if someone is interested, take a look at Leaf-Germany website

  14. #14
    Photon
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    Re: Rollei Hy6 available again

    @ Carsten and Schmiddi: Thanks for better detailed info.

    @ Graham & others: Sorry for causing false expectations.

    Warmest,

    Ton

    http://www.tonvanmourik.com/

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    Re: Rollei Hy6 available again

    Sinar have been repairing and optimising Hy6 bodies for quite a few months now. It is good news for those who wish to purchase a Rollie TLR model. the pity for the Hy6 platform is that ( as of now) there are no new higher megapixel backs on the horison.

    Still I expect to get many years good use out of the 75LV and my Hy6. the old Schneider manual focuses lenses have a certain way of drawing not better but different to the V lens line from Zeiss both these lens types shine in natural light situations.

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    Re: Rollei Hy6 available again

    From what I can gather from the posts I've read, those of us who own the Sinar/Hy6 are quite satisfied with it... I know that I am. It's got it's quirks and may not be as up to date as some of the newer systems but it's got some great features that are still not available on many of the later offerings. I think the release of this system was unfortunate from an economic timing standpoint. That, coupled with less than stellar marketing are, IMHO, the reasons this system never gained traction.

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    Re: Rollei Hy6 available again

    The Hy6/Afi debacle is everybody's lost. This was a camera that was "needed", but came at a very difficult moment. Back in the 80's I bought my first (and only ever) MF system. A Hasselblad 500CM, 2 backs and 3 lenses. It was painful back then to spend $6kusd for the set. But I was mesmerized by it. It helped catapult my career to a higher level too. In my opinion no current DMF camera/system is worth this kind of "sacrifice"
    I think the Hy6/Afi was, briefly. :-(
    Eduardo
    Last edited by Uaiomex; 9th March 2010 at 10:15. Reason: finger error

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    Sr. Administrator Jack's Avatar
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    Re: Rollei Hy6 available again

    I agree, great camera, great concept. But... The mistake Rollei made was not allowing Phase to build a back for it. IMO that's what sealed it's fate, and suspect that by now it's too little too late...
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    Re: Rollei Hy6 available again

    I believe that the Hy6 marketing was overhyped in the beginning and bad at the end.
    Also customer relationship/service/sales seemed to make a bad job in some countries (like the US).
    How can it happen that potential customers did not get answers to e-mails? Thats silly. The response I received in Germany was much better.

    Anyways, I think Rollei/Sinar/Leaf was not able to really "sell" their system, they were not able to explain people the positive sides, flexibility and quality of glass. It is also a typical example how german tradional companies rely too much on their technology and quality and underrate customer relationship (all this is just my opinion and theory)

    Ahh-and I am mad too when I see how much money Leica wastes with the S2 just to proove that they can do something innovative instead of offering a R10 or producing enough M9s for their customers (and to make money)

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    Senior Member Graham Mitchell's Avatar
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    Re: Rollei Hy6 available again

    Quote Originally Posted by t_streng View Post
    It is also a typical example how german tradional companies rely too much on their technology and quality and underrate customer relationship (all this is just my opinion and theory)
    Absolutely true. On the other hand, I could say too many photographers are swayed by marketing hype rather than finding out which system works best for themselves!

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    Re: Rollei Hy6 available again

    Quote Originally Posted by Graham Mitchell View Post
    Absolutely true. On the other hand, I could say too many photographers are swayed by marketing hype rather than finding out which system works best for themselves!
    True, and then some of us maybe had bad samples to demo. My first go with the Hy6 was in a normally lit room, with the 80 mounted, and the camera could not lock focus on anything. If I went outside into bright light, it AF'd fine. Back in the well lit store, AF could not lock, would hunt for a few cycles, then stop with the image totally oof. This was in lighting that an 8 year old Contax 645 or original Mamiya AFD would AF fine in. So that led me to believe either the camera had a huge AF deficiency or my dealer's sample was bad --- either way, it was the second reason I never bought into Rollei...
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    Re: Rollei Hy6 available again

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Flesher View Post
    True, and then some of us maybe had bad samples to demo. ...the camera had a huge AF deficiency or my dealer's sample was bad --- either way, it was the second reason I never bought into Rollei...
    I think Jack hsa hi the nail on the head regarding the launch of teh Hy6 - it had deficiencies in autofocus that have since been adressed- still not a confidence booster for those who were seriously looking at the camera. Truth be told - the autofocus capability of teh Schneiders themselves hsa to be considered - that being said - it is hardly a camera to be used hand held in low light - given teh large size of its lenses - if you want to ewxercise your wrists put a Zeiss 110/2 on it.

    All that being said - it is a joy to use with its large viewfinder - I wish Mamiya RZ had higher than 400 shutter speed it too has a beautiful viewfinder and very under rated glass - matched to a Phase One back it sings.

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    Re: Rollei Hy6 available again

    Quote Originally Posted by PeterA View Post
    I think Jack hsa hi the nail on the head regarding the launch of teh Hy6 - it had deficiencies in autofocus that have since been adressed- still not a confidence booster for those who were seriously looking at the camera. Truth be told - the autofocus capability of teh Schneiders themselves hsa to be considered - that being said - it is hardly a camera to be used hand held in low light - given teh large size of its lenses - if you want to ewxercise your wrists put a Zeiss 110/2 on it.

    All that being said - it is a joy to use with its large viewfinder - I wish Mamiya RZ had higher than 400 shutter speed it too has a beautiful viewfinder and very under rated glass - matched to a Phase One back it sings.
    My own Hy6-body is at Sinar right now for AF-update and I can tell afterwards how good or bad it works. I dont expect super dooper AF performance but at least some improvement.
    With the 75LV (which offers pretty good high ISO performance for MF) and fast lenses including the 110 there is more one can do handhold than some might consider.
    Still I guess AF is not the strongest point of the Hy6.

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    Re: Rollei Hy6 available again

    My feeling is that one of the strengths of the Hy6 is the rotating adapter. As soon as you have to flip a 645 camera into portrait position, there goes any ergonomic advantage you may have had. I am also very fond of the fact that should anyone ever release a large square sensor, the Hy6 is ready.
    Carsten - Website

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    Re: Rollei Hy6 available again

    Carsten, I really wouldn't pin your hopes on a square sensor in our lifetime, or the next.

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