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Thread: Hasselblad HC 28 vs CZ 40

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    Workshop Member Woody Campbell's Avatar
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    Hasselblad HC 28 vs CZ 40

    I finally got a Hasselbad CZ Distagon 40 and a CF lens adapter. The lens fits onto the H3D via the adapter with no problem. There is a somewhat stiff lever on the adapter to cock the shutter - the camera reminds you to cock the shutter if you haven't. Autofocus indicators appear to work accurately as you move the focus ring. You can compose and meter wide open - the camera knows what f-stop you've set, but you have to transfer the shutter speed from the camera to the lens. Altogether the ergonomics aren't bad, especially on a tripod.

    I ran comparison tests with the HC 28 out my dining room window - this is a brick wall torture test. All exposures on a tripod, ISO 50, f11 at 1/60, daylight WB. I processed normally in Phocus (which means a sharpening setting of 350). I've composed to put the microwave dishes in the upper right of both images.

    Here are the full images.

    28mm
    Attachment 3675

    40mm
    Attachment 3676

    Center crops

    28mm
    Attachment 3677

    40mm
    Attachment 3678

    [Continued on the next post]

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    Workshop Member Woody Campbell's Avatar
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    Re: Hasselblad HC 28 vs CZ 40

    Here are the corner crops:

    28mm:
    Attachment 3679

    40mm:
    Attachment 3680

    40mm with -8 red cyan CA correction in Lightroom
    Attachment 3681

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    Senior Member Graham Mitchell's Avatar
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    Re: Hasselblad HC 28 vs CZ 40

    I must say I prefer the Zeiss, especially in the centre.

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    Workshop Member Woody Campbell's Avatar
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    Re: Hasselblad HC 28 vs CZ 40

    A few observations: both lenses are sensational performers. The 40 has a slight edge in accutance and contrast at f11 - but this may be merely as a result of the fact the Fuji faced a larger challenge with the 28mm focal length. The minor CA exhibited by the 40 is "tame" - it can be corrected without causing other artifacts in the image. So too with linear distortion - it's easily corrected in Photoshop. The 28 has neither CA nor linear distortion straight out of Phocus, probably because of the corrections applied by the software.

    On all three corner crops note the color moire in the railing - I had moire correction turned off in Phocus.

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    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: Hasselblad HC 28 vs CZ 40

    The 40mm looks to have more bite to the images
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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    Subscriber gogopix's Avatar
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    Re: Hasselblad HC 28 vs CZ 40

    Very nice and surpring comparison. Thought the 28 was more detailed than showing.

    well another test may be to get the scene in the same FOV. Here, from same POV the 40 has almost 50% more pixels of information; for every 7 PX of 28 there are 10 PX of 40

    that said the difference is a lot more than I thought. ALthough 28mm (18mm 135 equivalent) is an intriguing FOV the 25mm equiv of the 40mm is pretty wide.

    Also, Woody, do you work in the theater?

    'right'??

    as in "stage right" correct

    regards
    Victor

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    Re: Hasselblad HC 28 vs CZ 40

    Thank you, Woody.
    Informative.
    Any chance you can post a 28mm file without DAC to see before & after?
    Billy

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    Re: Hasselblad HC 28 vs CZ 40

    Quote Originally Posted by Woody Campbell View Post
    On all three corner crops note the color moire in the railing - I had moire correction turned off in Phocus.
    Does turning moiré correction on fix it?
    If not, then would a multi-shot back handle it?

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    Workshop Member Woody Campbell's Avatar
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    Re: Hasselblad HC 28 vs CZ 40

    Quote Originally Posted by gogopix View Post
    Very nice and surpring comparison. Thought the 28 w

    Also, Woody, do you work in the theater?

    'right'??

    as in "stage right" correct

    regards
    Victor
    I was surprised as well - I'll run the 28 again. I've had trouble with right and left all of my life!

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    Workshop Member Woody Campbell's Avatar
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    Re: Hasselblad HC 28 vs CZ 40

    Here are corner crops with and without CA correction in DAC for the 28. This is very interesting: uncorrected the CA is very, very slight. But the uncorrected image doesn't exhibit the color "moire". The corrected image does. So the "moire" appears actually to be an artifact of the DAC CA correction. The moire slider in Phocus does nothing to it. Conclusion - turn off the CA correction in Phocus, at least for the 28. The HC 28 is amazingly well corrected before the software reaches it. By the way these are screen shots from Phocus - I've done nothing to optimize their appearance.

    Crop without CA correction (note very slight red fringing):

    Attachment 3683

    Crop with CA correction turned on:

    Attachment 3684

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    Re: Hasselblad HC 28 vs CZ 40

    Woody with Way too much gear,
    Do you have a Digitar 35mm to throw in the comparison mix?
    Billy

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    Re: Hasselblad HC 28 vs CZ 40

    Hi Woody,

    Which version of the 40 is this? IF or FLE?

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    Re: Hasselblad HC 28 vs CZ 40

    This is what I was going to ask for. I tried a 40mm on my old H2 with leaf back and thought it did not do as well as my 35mm HC. Now i have the 28mm HC. I am using an H3DII-31 now and slightly cropped sensor.

    OOPS i see you posted this now

    Quote Originally Posted by BJNY View Post
    Thank you, Woody.
    Informative.
    Any chance you can post a 28mm file without DAC to see before & after?
    Billy

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    Sr. Administrator Jack's Avatar
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    Re: Hasselblad HC 28 vs CZ 40

    Amazing difference Woody, thanks for posting these. That 40 looks like a winner
    Jack
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    "Perfection is not attainable. But if we chase perfection, we can catch excellence."

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    Workshop Member Woody Campbell's Avatar
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    Re: Hasselblad HC 28 vs CZ 40

    Quote Originally Posted by BJNY View Post
    Woody with Way too much gear,
    Do you have a Digitar 35mm to throw in the comparison mix?
    Billy
    I wish - don't nudge me that direction!

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    Workshop Member Woody Campbell's Avatar
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    Re: Hasselblad HC 28 vs CZ 40

    Quote Originally Posted by David Klepacki View Post
    Hi Woody,

    Which version of the 40 is this? IF or FLE?
    The IF.

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    Subscriber gogopix's Avatar
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    Re: Hasselblad HC 28 vs CZ 40

    i have the 40mm IF as well as the digitar, but for alpa.

    is there a mount for hassey glass on the alpa?

    Victor

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    Re: Hasselblad HC 28 vs CZ 40

    Quote Originally Posted by BJNY View Post
    Thank you, Woody.
    Informative.
    Any chance you can post a 28mm file without DAC to see before & after?
    Billy
    I'm more curious to see with the distortion correction turned off and on for comparison.

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    Re: Hasselblad HC 28 vs CZ 40

    OK if this is the IF lens... I understand the differences. THe comparison I made was with the version before that one---- and a lot less money. Son and a few others have always been a big fan of that lens.. but boy is it pricey...

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    Re: Hasselblad HC 28 vs CZ 40

    Shouldn't the test be done between a HC/35 and the V40?

    A MF28 is a heck of a lot harder to correct than a 35 or 40.

    In my controlled studio bench tests, the HC35 is the equal to my V40CFE @ f/8 ... so, I'm sure the 40IF would beat it ... and hopefully would at that price.

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    Workshop Member Woody Campbell's Avatar
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    Re: Hasselblad HC 28 vs CZ 40

    Quote Originally Posted by fotografz View Post
    Shouldn't the test be done between a HC/35 and the V40?

    A MF28 is a heck of a lot harder to correct than a 35 or 40.

    In my controlled studio bench tests, the HC35 is the equal to my V40CFE @ f/8 ... so, I'm sure the 40IF would beat it ... and hopefully would at that price.
    The HC 28 is very, very wide (the equivalent of a 20mm in 35mm terms) - it's a real engineering achievement at a reasonable price, all things considered. I consider the near absence of CA to be remarkable. For me the idea of the comparison was to have something to benchmark the 40 IF against.

    The HC 28 was one of the reasons why I bought the H3 kit: the 28mm angle of view on a 36x48 sensor is roughly the same as the Hasselblad SWC on 60x60. The SWC was a favorite of mine from film days. I can't prove it with the gear I own but I suspect that the HC 28 + H3 combination outperforms the SWC on film. With a digital back the SWC would be substantially less wide than the 28 so the comparison wouldn't be fair.
    Last edited by Woody Campbell; 2nd May 2008 at 15:21.

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    Re: Hasselblad HC 28 vs CZ 40

    I just received my V 40 IF and am anxious to do some testing. If desired I can post results. Since the V lenses are adaptable to all the new Hassy's and many people have them it could be interesting. Although the 40 IF is an expensive lens I got a mint copy for $1K more than the non IF version was going for from the same retailer. Given long lasting investment I opted for the more expensive (and I hope superior) lens given that difference. I may get new bodies or backs into the future but I plan to shoot my own funeral with the V lenses! LOL

    Woody

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    Workshop Member Woody Campbell's Avatar
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    Re: Hasselblad HC 28 vs CZ 40

    Quote Originally Posted by woodyspedden View Post
    I just received my V 40 IF and am anxious to do some testing. If desired I can post results. Since the V lenses are adaptable to all the new Hassy's and many people have them it could be interesting. Although the 40 IF is an expensive lens I got a mint copy for $1K more than the non IF version was going for from the same retailer. Given long lasting investment I opted for the more expensive (and I hope superior) lens given that difference. I may get new bodies or backs into the future but I plan to shoot my own funeral with the V lenses! LOL

    Woody
    That's terrific - you can never have too many Woodys working on issues like these.

    If you have other V lenses it would be great if you could post center and corner crops comparing with the 40 IF as a benchmark.

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    Re: Hasselblad HC 28 vs CZ 40

    Just in case anyone was wondering if the V40 IF was worth the money, here's a bench test of the HC/35 verses the V 40/CFE.

    f/8, tripod, mirror up, cable release, steady lights, no subject movement. Everything exactly the same except just swapping lenses on a H3D-II/39.

    Center: the resolving power is very close, but the V40CFE handled the extremely fine dot pattern in "Bal", where the HC/35 produced color Moiré.

    Edge: no contest, the HC/35 kills the Zeiss.

    Now, if I an get my hands on the 40IF version ... I'd like to test that against the HC/35 in this type of controlled conditions.
    Last edited by fotografz; 17th August 2008 at 15:34.

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    Subscriber gogopix's Avatar
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    Re: Hasselblad HC 28 vs CZ 40

    But the "V" still came out nice and sharp

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    Re: Hasselblad HC 28 vs CZ 40

    Quote Originally Posted by gogopix View Post
    is there a mount for hassey glass on the alpa?
    Silvestri Actuator for Hasselblad V lenses

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    Re: Hasselblad HC 28 vs CZ 40

    Quote Originally Posted by gogopix View Post
    But the "V" still came out nice and sharp
    Yeah, after being added in PS post. Too bad the rest of it isn't as sharp.

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    Re: Hasselblad HC 28 vs CZ 40

    why do you think the moire only shows up in the center crop?

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    Re: Hasselblad HC 28 vs CZ 40

    Quote Originally Posted by jlm View Post
    why do you think the moire only shows up in the center crop?
    Actually, it does show up in the smaller WhlBal card to the side ... it's just to small to see it ... and I didn't enlarge that part as huge.

    Also, remember that the HC/35 has to be enlarged more to make it the same size as the V40 for comparison.

    The center portion of both the lenses produces some Moire', but the HC/35 is more pronounced in the big enlargement.

    Phocus has a powerful new anti Moire' correction tool ... which I applied to the HC/35 center image to demonstrate how well it works.

    Attachment Image: Top is the Hasselblad/Zeiss V center blown up even more ... showing that there was some slight Moire' ... then the same HC/35 center that had more visable moire' ... but this time I applied the Phocus Moire' filter. Big difference.
    Last edited by fotografz; 30th July 2008 at 05:15.

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    Re: Hasselblad HC 28 vs CZ 40

    Is Phocus' Moiré filter creating the jaggies in the type?

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    Re: Hasselblad HC 28 vs CZ 40

    Quote Originally Posted by BJNY View Post
    Is Phocus' Moiré filter creating the jaggies in the type?
    Nope. Remember, I didn't move the tripod or the subject. That H35 file is enlarged more that the V40 to make them the same posting size ... because the H35 center image is smaller than the 40 to start with.

    There is a limit on how far you can take even a 39 meg file : -)

    This is about a 600% enlargement of the original 24"X18" 300dpi native file from the H3D-II/39 ... or the equivalent of a 288" X 216" image @ 150 dpi.
    which is a 24 foot X 15.6 foot print.

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