Site Sponsors
Results 1 to 19 of 19

Thread: Sinar eMotion 54LV - 30 second exposure

  1. #1
    Senior Member Graham Mitchell's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    London/Kiev
    Posts
    1,079
    Post Thanks / Like

    Sinar eMotion 54LV - 30 second exposure

    Someone was asking for long exposure samples, so here are some from my back, the e54LV. This back's noise performance isn't as good as Thierry's recent e75LV - that is something else - but still highly usable. I don't normally shoot long exposures so I went out tonight and put it to the test.

    Thanks to the sodium lighting, I had to do a pretty large white balance shift, which actually increases noise so this is a real torture test.

    ISO 50, 30 seconds

    Scene:



    100% crop, no processing other than white balance:


  2. #2
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Sydney
    Posts
    251
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Sinar eMotion 54LV - 30 second exposure

    Graham,
    can you do one @800 ASA and 30 seconds?
    Cheers,
    Willem.

  3. #3
    Sr. Administrator Jack's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Los Altos, CA
    Posts
    10,486
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    1031

    Re: Sinar eMotion 54LV - 30 second exposure

    Pretty impressive if you ask me
    Jack
    home: www.getdpi.com

    "Perfection is not attainable. But if we chase perfection, we can catch excellence."

  4. #4
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    23,623
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    2555

    Re: Sinar eMotion 54LV - 30 second exposure

    Running to bank with ski mask now.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

  5. #5
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    1,513
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Sinar eMotion 54LV - 30 second exposure

    Graham,
    That is not bad at all. Thanks for sharing it.

    This raises a question in my mind at this point. Is there a crossover point between a longer exposure at lowest ISO and a shorter exposure at a higher ISO? In other words, would your 30 sec ISO 50 shot, have less noise than a 15 sec ISO 100 shot, or some other proper exposure?

    This is probably very closely tied to the base sensitivity of the sensor to some degree, so it may not be a general application, and ambient temps will come into play at some point. (I shoot a lot in South Texas, where it gets pretty warm/hot most of the year, and I can even see changes due to heat on the CMOS sensors in my Canon, so the CCDs in the MFDBs have to suffer some trade-offs also.)

    So when does a long exposure become a bigger problem than a shorter exposure at slightly higher ISO for some of these backs?

    LJ

  6. #6
    Senior Member Graham Mitchell's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    London/Kiev
    Posts
    1,079
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Sinar eMotion 54LV - 30 second exposure

    Another 30 s exposure. Now you can see why I don't bother shooting streets here at night. Man, those lights are ORANGE!


  7. #7
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    23,623
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    2555

    Re: Sinar eMotion 54LV - 30 second exposure

    Just as a example from the ZD back at ISO 50 and 20 seconds . I see no issues at all. I am basically working before sunrise. No noise at all.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

  8. #8
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Posts
    314
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Sinar eMotion 54LV - 30 second exposure

    Somehow, Phase One digital backs are able to capture upwards of 30 minutes:
    http://luminous-landscape.com/forum/...e=post&id=3217

  9. #9
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Posts
    314
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Sinar eMotion 54LV - 30 second exposure

    Graham, I posted this question in Thierry's ISO 800 thread:

    Quote Originally Posted by BJNY View Post
    Also would be curious to know
    how soon after the 30 second exposure is the digital back ready to make another capture.
    (Is there a wait for some sort of automatic black reference exposure to be made immediately afterwards?)

  10. #10
    Sr. Administrator Jack's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Los Altos, CA
    Posts
    10,486
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    1031

    Re: Sinar eMotion 54LV - 30 second exposure

    Quote Originally Posted by foto-z View Post
    Another 30 s exposure. Now you can see why I don't bother shooting streets here at night. Man, those lights are ORANGE!
    True, but they can make such cool B&W conversions

    (PS: Hope you don't mind my re-processing your image, and if you do let me know and I'll delete it ASAP)
    Jack
    home: www.getdpi.com

    "Perfection is not attainable. But if we chase perfection, we can catch excellence."

  11. #11
    Senior Member Graham Mitchell's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    London/Kiev
    Posts
    1,079
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Sinar eMotion 54LV - 30 second exposure

    BJNY, yes there is a 30 second wait while the black reference is captured, if your exposure was also 30 s.

  12. #12
    Senior Member Graham Mitchell's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    London/Kiev
    Posts
    1,079
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Sinar eMotion 54LV - 30 second exposure

    Guy, we need 100% unprocessed crops to see noise

  13. #13
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Posts
    314
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Sinar eMotion 54LV - 30 second exposure

    Quote Originally Posted by foto-z View Post
    BJNY, yes there is a 30 second wait while the black reference is captured, if your exposure was also 30 s.
    As I suspected.
    Thanks, Graham.

    BTW, a friend reported the Canon 5D is able to make the next captures immediately,
    while the 1Ds2 has to wait.

  14. #14
    Senior Member Graham Mitchell's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    London/Kiev
    Posts
    1,079
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Sinar eMotion 54LV - 30 second exposure

    No problem, Jack. I was planning to do the same. Still processing some shots to show you all.

  15. #15
    thsinar
    Guest

    Re: Sinar eMotion 54LV - 30 second exposure

    LJ, see my answer/remark to the same question in the other thread (e75 ISO 800 Sample):

    yes, there is a difference in noise when shooting either with high iISO and short time as to low ISO and long time: but as you said, the ambient temperature DOES play here a lot.

    If pretty cool, then I would probably go for the lowest possible ISO. At which temperature to "switch" to higher ISO and shorter times, well, that has to be tested.

    Thierry

    Quote Originally Posted by LJL View Post
    Graham,
    That is not bad at all. Thanks for sharing it.

    This raises a question in my mind at this point. Is there a crossover point between a longer exposure at lowest ISO and a shorter exposure at a higher ISO? In other words, would your 30 sec ISO 50 shot, have less noise than a 15 sec ISO 100 shot, or some other proper exposure?

    This is probably very closely tied to the base sensitivity of the sensor to some degree, so it may not be a general application, and ambient temps will come into play at some point. (I shoot a lot in South Texas, where it gets pretty warm/hot most of the year, and I can even see changes due to heat on the CMOS sensors in my Canon, so the CCDs in the MFDBs have to suffer some trade-offs also.)

    So when does a long exposure become a bigger problem than a shorter exposure at slightly higher ISO for some of these backs?

    LJ

  16. #16
    thsinar
    Guest

    Re: Sinar eMotion 54LV - 30 second exposure

    and 30 minutes waiting time in addition, for the black reference!

    Thierry

    Quote Originally Posted by BJNY View Post
    Somehow, Phase One digital backs are able to capture upwards of 30 minutes:
    http://luminous-landscape.com/forum/...e=post&id=3217

  17. #17
    thsinar
    Guest

    Re: Sinar eMotion 54LV - 30 second exposure

    Thanks too, Graham, those are pretty impressive as well!

    Thierry

    Quote Originally Posted by foto-z View Post
    Someone was asking for long exposure samples, so here are some from my back, the e54LV. This back's noise performance isn't as good as Thierry's recent e75LV - that is something else - but still highly usable. I don't normally shoot long exposures so I went out tonight and put it to the test.

  18. #18
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    1,513
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Sinar eMotion 54LV - 30 second exposure

    Quote Originally Posted by thsinar View Post
    LJ, see my answer/remark to the same question in the other thread (e75 ISO 800 Sample):

    yes, there is a difference in noise when shooting either with high iISO and short time as to low ISO and long time: but as you said, the ambient temperature DOES play here a lot.

    If pretty cool, then I would probably go for the lowest possible ISO. At which temperature to "switch" to higher ISO and shorter times, well, that has to be tested.

    Thierry
    Thanks, Thierry. I did see your comments. My question was more around where things may transition. A good example is the overall color, saturation, etc., that comes from longer exposures at base ISO, and that may be preferable to building noise. I think Graham has a good illustration of this.

    The other part of things is related to ambient temp effects. I agree, shoot at base ISO whenever possible, but sometimes that may not give best results. On really warm shooting days, I actually push the ISO a stop and then underexpose a stop or so, as I found that to deliver better color and lower noise with my Canons. Seems counter-intuitive, but it seems to provide good images for me when I need to shoot at higher shutter speeds under difficult light. (Besides polo, I shoot a lot of equestrian events that are held in large, poorly lit, hot arenas, and I need to stop action with a higher shutter speed. So I force things to manual, and purposefully underexpose a bit to get a denser file that actually holds up to pushing when processed, much as your shot from the garden.)

    LJ

  19. #19
    thsinar
    Guest

    Re: Sinar eMotion 54LV - 30 second exposure

    LJ,

    I fully agree with you, and your findings are also what I have experienced.

    Thierry

    Quote Originally Posted by LJL View Post
    Thanks, Thierry. I did see your comments. My question was more around where things may transition. A good example is the overall color, saturation, etc., that comes from longer exposures at base ISO, and that may be preferable to building noise. I think Graham has a good illustration of this.

    The other part of things is related to ambient temp effects. I agree, shoot at base ISO whenever possible, but sometimes that may not give best results. On really warm shooting days, I actually push the ISO a stop and then underexpose a stop or so, as I found that to deliver better color and lower noise with my Canons. Seems counter-intuitive, but it seems to provide good images for me when I need to shoot at higher shutter speeds under difficult light. (Besides polo, I shoot a lot of equestrian events that are held in large, poorly lit, hot arenas, and I need to stop action with a higher shutter speed. So I force things to manual, and purposefully underexpose a bit to get a denser file that actually holds up to pushing when processed, much as your shot from the garden.)

    LJ

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •