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Thread: Aptus 17/22 on RZ67?

  1. #1
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    Aptus 17/22 on RZ67?

    Anyone here use this combination? I'm curious about how it works. I'm considering this as my upgrade path from my H10, but figured I'd do my research before dropping the $$$.

    Thanks.
    Greg

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    Senior Member yaya's Avatar
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    Re: Aptus 17/22 on RZ67?

    Quote Originally Posted by gsking View Post
    Anyone here use this combination? I'm curious about how it works. I'm considering this as my upgrade path from my H10, but figured I'd do my research before dropping the $$$.

    Thanks.
    Greg
    Greg hi,

    There are many who use an Aptus on an RZ and that are quite happy with this combo (I can forward you some URLs if you want). If you can stretch for the 22 you'll enjoy the larger sensor but the 17 works fine as well (and is still bigger than the 36X24 sensor you use now)

    You basically need to buy an adapter, which comes with a sync cable, a camera control cable and a focusing screen.
    We make these adapters for V-fit backs as well as M (Mamiya/ Phase One) and H backs. All adapters allow for rotating the back from vertical to horizontal positions

    See the attached pages, extracted from the Aptus installation guide, the images show the M and V fit adapters.

    Live View also works on the RZ, providing that you have a dongle for the back.

    Hope this helps

    Yair
    Yair Shahar | Product Manager | Phase One | Mamiya Leaf
    e: [email protected] | m: +44(0)77 8992 8199 | yaya's blog

  3. #3
    Optechs Digital
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    Re: Aptus 17/22 on RZ67?

    Hi Greg,

    I think the Aptus 22 on the RZ is a great match and we still have a few guys in the NW still using them. There is something really pleasing about the sharpness of the Leaf 22 backs combined with the sharpness of the RZ lenses. It has a distinct edge sharpness. The ability to revolve the back on the camera is very handy also. The only complaints we hear are it is a bit cable intensive and if you use live view mode a lot, keep a bunch of the 6 volt batteries for the body on hand because you will go through plenty.

    Also some some users have commented on increased bicep size after handling this setup for a while

    as Yair suggests, get the 22 if it fits your budget. The 17 will work perfectly fine as well but the larger physical chip size of the 22 is especially nice on larger cameras like the RZ.

    Good luck and have with your search.

    Best,
    Paul

    Quote Originally Posted by gsking View Post
    Anyone here use this combination? I'm curious about how it works. I'm considering this as my upgrade path from my H10, but figured I'd do my research before dropping the $$$.

    Thanks.
    Greg

  4. #4
    Shelby Lewis
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    Re: Aptus 17/22 on RZ67?

    Hey Paul and Yair,

    I'm looking at a 22mp MF solution presently with the thoughts of eventually shooting a RZ/DF combo with an m-mount back.

    I love the aptus-22 files, but one thing gives me pause...

    There apparently was a firmware prob between the a22 and the proiiD that gave a single blank frame every time you changed shutter speeds. I talked to john schweikert about it and he also mentioned it here:

    [URL="http://luminous-landscape.com/forum/index.php?s=&showtopic=34969&view=findpost&p=28639 9"]

    Apparently you could even tape over the contacts and shoot the back with the lens-to-back cable (as in the "non-D" RZ) if you wanted.

    It's not a deal-breaker at all, as I don't foresee using an rz in a situation where you need to change shutter speeds continuously, but has this ever been addressed? Does the Aptus ii-5 share this glitch?

    Lastly... can you indeed confirm that the back rotates on the RZ IID body? Does it need to be unmounted or anything similar?

  5. #5
    Shelby Lewis
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    Re: Aptus 17/22 on RZ67?

    oops... I obviously missed the manual Yair posted outlining the rotating back. Thanks!

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    Senior Member yaya's Avatar
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    Re: Aptus 17/22 on RZ67?

    Shelby, a new RZd with a new Aptus-II (or Mamiya DM), when used with the Mamiya HX701 plate won't have that glitch as it has been addressed in both body and back.

    The Leaf adapter is mechanical and requires a sync cable, it works on all RZ models and you can get a longer sync cable (which we make for large format cameras) so it doesn't get stretched when you rotate the back, it just hangs on the side.

    Yair
    Yair Shahar | Product Manager | Phase One | Mamiya Leaf
    e: [email protected] | m: +44(0)77 8992 8199 | yaya's blog

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    Re: Aptus 17/22 on RZ67?

    Thanks Yair, the manual is so clear and helpful, i am still happy with my h Hasselblad system, but i still keep thinking that i may use a DB for either my RZII or 501CM, but i think i will keep that 501CM for film and Mamiya maybe will be a better solution for DB over 501CM, but i am going betwen P1 and Leaf, P1 getting my attention stronger than LEAF.
    Tareq

  8. #8
    Optechs Digital
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    Re: Aptus 17/22 on RZ67?

    Hi Shelby,

    Sorry, I can't speak to this issue as all of my experience has been with the RZ and the RZ Pro II ( not D) These earlier cameras worked flawlessly.

    Hopefully Yair or Leon Goldsmith can give you an official answer regarding the firmware.

    And yes, the backs do revolve as opposed to mount and re-mount on all the RZ models.

    Best,
    Paul

    Quote Originally Posted by Shelby Lewis View Post
    Hey Paul and Yair,

    I'm looking at a 22mp MF solution presently with the thoughts of eventually shooting a RZ/DF combo with an m-mount back.

    I love the aptus-22 files, but one thing gives me pause...

    There apparently was a firmware prob between the a22 and the proiiD that gave a single blank frame every time you changed shutter speeds. I talked to john schweikert about it and he also mentioned it here:

    [URL="http://luminous-landscape.com/forum/index.php?s=&showtopic=34969&view=findpost&p=28639 9"]

    Apparently you could even tape over the contacts and shoot the back with the lens-to-back cable (as in the "non-D" RZ) if you wanted.

    It's not a deal-breaker at all, as I don't foresee using an rz in a situation where you need to change shutter speeds continuously, but has this ever been addressed? Does the Aptus ii-5 share this glitch?

    Lastly... can you indeed confirm that the back rotates on the RZ IID body? Does it need to be unmounted or anything similar?

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    Re: Aptus 17/22 on RZ67?

    Quote Originally Posted by yaya View Post
    Greg hi,

    There are many who use an Aptus on an RZ and that are quite happy with this combo (I can forward you some URLs if you want). If you can stretch for the 22 you'll enjoy the larger sensor but the 17 works fine as well (and is still bigger than the 36X24 sensor you use now)

    You basically need to buy an adapter, which comes with a sync cable, a camera control cable and a focusing screen.
    We make these adapters for V-fit backs as well as M (Mamiya/ Phase One) and H backs. All adapters allow for rotating the back from vertical to horizontal positions

    See the attached pages, extracted from the Aptus installation guide, the images show the M and V fit adapters.

    Live View also works on the RZ, providing that you have a dongle for the back.

    Hope this helps

    Yair
    Yair,

    Good info, thanks.

    I already have the 17 Wi adapter...will it work with the 22? Or is the cutout not big enough?

    I see now what the camera control cable is for...tethered shooting from the computer. So there is no wake up cable (like the Phase backs). Does this affect battery life appreciably?

    Alas, I rarely see either the 17 or the 22 available here in the States. The 17 is rare enough, the 22 seems extinct.

    But yeah, for the RZ, I figured the 22 would be the better solution, and it seems more "dual compatible" than the ZDb. I recall the ZDb not having a wake-up port, and therefore is only Pro IID compatible?

  10. #10
    Senior Member KETCH ROSSI's Avatar
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    Re: Aptus 17/22 on RZ67?

    I actually have gained some interest in finding out more o the Afi II camera and look forward to see what is up with this system.

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    Senior Member yaya's Avatar
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    Re: Aptus 17/22 on RZ67?

    Quote Originally Posted by gsking View Post
    Yair,

    Good info, thanks.

    I already have the 17 Wi adapter...will it work with the 22? Or is the cutout not big enough?

    I see now what the camera control cable is for...tethered shooting from the computer. So there is no wake up cable (like the Phase backs). Does this affect battery life appreciably?

    Alas, I rarely see either the 17 or the 22 available here in the States. The 17 is rare enough, the 22 seems extinct.

    But yeah, for the RZ, I figured the 22 would be the better solution, and it seems more "dual compatible" than the ZDb. I recall the ZDb not having a wake-up port, and therefore is only Pro IID compatible?
    The actual adapter is the same, the only different bit is the focusing screen as they come with different size markings on them

    None of the Leaf backs need a wake-up cable as the Dalsa sensor uses a different architecture to the Kodak one. This has no connection to battery life.

    yair
    Yair Shahar | Product Manager | Phase One | Mamiya Leaf
    e: [email protected] | m: +44(0)77 8992 8199 | yaya's blog

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    Member Jeff Turner's Avatar
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    Re: Aptus 17/22 on RZ67?

    Quote Originally Posted by yaya View Post
    The actual adapter is the same, the only different bit is the focusing screen as they come with different size markings on them

    None of the Leaf backs need a wake-up cable as the Dalsa sensor uses a different architecture to the Kodak one. This has no connection to battery life.

    yair
    To add to Yair's always thorough information, when shooting tethered with the Aptus back, the DB battery is removed to expose the firewire port. With this setup, the firewire provides power to the DB, assuming you are tethered to a MAC. PCs, as I understand, do not supply power via firewire and shooting tethered to a PC requires a split firewire device that connects to computer and to a rigged up external power supply.

    Since there are no electrical connections between DB and RZ using the leaf adapter, there is no drain on the camera battery.

    Regards, Jeff
    Jeff T.
    Jeff Turner's Emerging Light Photography
    http://www.EmergingLightPhotography.com

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    Re: Aptus 17/22 on RZ67?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Turner View Post
    To add to Yair's always thorough information, when shooting tethered with the Aptus back, the DB battery is removed to expose the firewire port. With this setup, the firewire provides power to the DB, assuming you are tethered to a MAC. PCs, as I understand, do not supply power via firewire and shooting tethered to a PC requires a split firewire device that connects to computer and to a rigged up external power supply.

    Since there are no electrical connections between DB and RZ using the leaf adapter, there is no drain on the camera battery.

    Regards, Jeff
    Yes, I use 12V CCTV batteries to power my back via firewire.

    But I wasn't talking about draining the camera battery. I was talking about the DB battery. I recall reading that since the sensor never "sleeps", the battery life is shorter. This is also why they use active cooling (fans).

    Now I just have to find a back? Anyone in the Bay Area that wants to rent one to me?

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    Re: Aptus 17/22 on RZ67?

    Quote Originally Posted by gsking View Post
    Yes, I use 12V CCTV batteries to power my back via firewire.
    You can do the same with a Leaf back, we supply a (12V) DC-FW adapter

    But I wasn't talking about draining the camera battery. I was talking about the DB battery. I recall reading that since the sensor never "sleeps", the battery life is shorter. This is also why they use active cooling (fans).
    The fan does help in regulating the internal temperature, especially in warm conditions or when Live View is in use. It is not true that the sensor never sleeps. it's just that it can "be ready" very very quickly and thus not requiring a wake-up call.

    Yair
    Yair Shahar | Product Manager | Phase One | Mamiya Leaf
    e: [email protected] | m: +44(0)77 8992 8199 | yaya's blog

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    Re: Aptus 17/22 on RZ67?

    Yair,

    Thanks for your input. I almost bought the recent 17 that was with a 645AFD on Ebay, but it was just outside my price range...even though at $2650, it was a great price.

    Any idea where to find someone that rents them in the States? I can't find anyone. I have a fundraiser to shoot in September and having the bigger sensor and untethered back would make my job a heck of a lot easier.

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    Re: Aptus 17/22 on RZ67?

    At the risk of plugging a friend, I'd recommend talking to Erik @ Running Pixels in LA as they have kit but they also use other rental houses' equipment.

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    Re: Aptus 17/22 on RZ67?

    i would skip the 17 for the 22 without hesitation !

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    Re: Aptus 17/22 on RZ67?

    Quote Originally Posted by yaya View Post
    At the risk of plugging a friend, I'd recommend talking to Erik @ Running Pixels in LA as they have kit but they also use other rental houses' equipment.
    +1 Erik.

    Great guy. Very honest. Very knowledgeable.

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    Re: Aptus 17/22 on RZ67?

    Thanks, everyone!

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