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Phase P30 Plus in San Juan

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
Well got back late last night and processed these on the plane, yes i had a crowd of folks over my shoulder watching me process and of course it was like being at a workshop teaching folks how to do this stuff. Loved it. LOL

Anyway I actually did pretty good on the laptop so some details these are all shot with the P30 plus Phase back. Shot at ISO 400 no flash at all , all natural light but I was on a on a tripod for everyone of these. These shots are the result of Jack and i hiring 2 models for the workshop for the attendees to shoot . What you don't see is obviously 10 folks blasting away shooting along with me. From M8, D300 , D3, Mamiya ZD all capturing this teaching event we put on. I gave a lighting seminar before we started and just imagine teaching lighting without lights. LOL It actually went extremely well with regards to fill and main and such . But obviously a lighting workshop needs to be done. Anyway let's chat about the P30 plus. This bad boy is something else . Later on i will show you at ISO 1600 there is not a damn thing to sneeze at with regards to noise. If processed in the newer C1 version 4 the images are as clean as any D3 or 1dsMKII or III version at ISO 1600 . Yes folks this one took me for a surprise and as you see ISO 400 is just outstanding. I really like this back and been actually torn on it between the P25 plus but i am going with the P25 plus for the simple tilt/shift issue with backs and micro prism. Besides i am buying a Horseman SWD II with 35mm digitar also in my package with Capture Intergration. I only shot the P25 non plus but even ISO 400 looked good i AM expecting a ISO 400 to look like these with the Plus series. So my guess is I should be just fine. Also the P30 plus is a crop sensor which honestly even without the mask in camera i did not even notice it.

Anyway let me post a few images from it and later when i wake up i will get into some noise stuff with this back.I should mention in LR the noise was really good but C1 is really fine tuned to these backs and the files looked much better in regard to noise without smearing at the default levels. Again very impressed here. One other thing that COMPLETELY impressed me with the Phase backs is they just freaking work. There simple to use and not one glitch I ran into all week and this was with all three different backs. I even used the same card at one point and no issues. I can't talk about this enough because the last thing I needed when shooting this series was a screw up and screwing around with the camera back deal. I am a shooter not a engineer and I just want to shoot.
 

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
I just love this shot with the folks in the background walking up the street. It was getting late and the light was falling pretty fast , I missed focus a touch but image is first. One thing about MF is it needs LIGHT. LOL

This is the main reason I want a great ISO 400 because you really lose 2 stops over 35mm in DOF. This was the 150 3.4 lens at 5.6 but I may get the new 150mm 2.8 later on after I recover from this LARGE check I have to write. But I am serious I always loved MF and it is nice to get back to my roots
 

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
These street scenes are in between traffic. So this was a very fast shoot for everyone which is excellent training for them.
 

Terry

New member
Guy when we were looking through these in SJ. The one with the workers coming up the street was my favorite.
 

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
I have to find that one Terry. Did anyone take a shot of the whole street scene I wonder . Love to show that to the forum it would be a pretty fun shot to see.
 

Terry

New member
I have to find that one Terry. Did anyone take a shot of the whole street scene I wonder . Love to show that to the forum it would be a pretty fun shot to see.
I'm talking about the one you just posted with the models in the street and the women in uniform looking at what is going on.
 

KurtKamka

Subscriber Member
Guy, on your deliberations between the P25+ and P30+ backs, do you have any thoughts about the size of the sensor? I can see where it'd be an interesting decision. The P25+ has the bigger pixels ... but, if the noise works out to be almost as good as the P30+, the P25+ might be the better choice.

Also, were these hand-held?

Kurt
 

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
Kurt I was on a tripod. You make a excellent point and my thoughts are the P25 plus has better DR than both the P45 and P30 it is slight but it holds the highlights better. Now the P25 Plus was not with us so hard to truly say but I hope to get it late this week. But my thinking is if I can squeeze a great ISO 400 than I am really happy and ISO 800 even comes close to the P30 Plus at 1600 than i scored big. The P30 plus has a 1 stop advantage so if it is great at 1600 for the P30 plus than my thinking is the P25 plus at the top end should match it at it's highest ISO
 

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
Kurt my other thoughts are this, a P25 plus and a D3 maybe the winning combo. That damn D3 at the real high ISO is something else and a great way to maximize almost any shoot. I am heading down this road myself. I do lot's of events so the D3 would be perfect and the MF will do everything else. It's a tough call between these two backs but I don't always know were life leads so having that Horseman to use as a stitch camera and shift camera is very appealing to me and main reason to go P25 plus. Now it is a 22 mpx back so you have to be happy with the resolution but these files have a load of uprezing in them so i am not worried for a second it can do BIG. But seriously if anyone wants a Phase back you better like C1 because you will get the most out of it using C1 with the lens corrections and the way Phase tunes there software for there backs.
 

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
Here Terry I think you meant this one. I need to get offline too and see my family and unpack . Check in later folks. Need to make up for missing my wife's 50th BD. BTW this is straight from the camera in ACR. NO WB
 

KurtKamka

Subscriber Member
Guy, besides the strong C1 tie-in with the phase back, what difference are you seeing in files between the P25 and P30+ and those you've taken previously with the ZD back?
 

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
There all very similar. The ZD I found the details in the highlights were not as good as the Phase and maybe a touch more detail in the Phase but speed and functionality go to Phase although the Zd is nothing to sneeze at the higher ISO is just not there like the Phase but for the money a damn good back and that made this upgrade path tougher . I am really buying higher ISO and functionality and a more complete systems setup. I can't emphasize the relationship between camera, back and software enough. You need a working system in total.
 

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
Guy, on your deliberations between the P25+ and P30+ backs, do you have any thoughts about the size of the sensor? I can see where it'd be an interesting decision. The P25+ has the bigger pixels ... but, if the noise works out to be almost as good as the P30+, the P25+ might be the better choice.

Also, were these hand-held?

Kurt

Go to the Phase site and look at the crop factors and aspect ratios on the backs . i like the FF more on the P25 compared to the aspect ration of the P30 but this is presonal choice
 

Dale Allyn

New member
Guy et al,

Do you feel that the ZD is still a good point of entry (to MF digital) if one is weighing a Canon 1Ds3 purchase? Prior to a few months ago I was just planning to get the 1Ds3, but after having shot it I find the image upgrade to be insufficient. In my case, I expect that I'll end up with something like the P45+ because I like large prints – and I do zero commercial, fashion, or event work.

So now that you've compared the various backs, and if one was prepared to spend just 10K or so for now (excluding additional lenses), how do you feel about the ZD back on, say, the new 645 AFD III? Or do you recommend skipping the ZD back going with a used back of another breed for the use I've described?

(Sorry if this is sort off topic. I thought it sort of fit in, but I'd be happy to post the question elsewhere if you'd prefer.)

Thanks, Dale
 

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
Honestly just going to MF will beat any DSLR out there and the ZD certainly will do that no question. The old saying bigger is better still holds true. The ZD is slow though and have to deal with that but it is a good back. i would expect to see more of the ZD in the future as a upgraded unit too. There certainly is a place in the market for it but if you want large than the 39 mpx backs are something else. The P45 plus did have more micro detail than the 25 and 30 it was there for sure. But it's beyond entry point as far as money. Big expense but I think 22mpx are really nice from all the players and I know I can get nice big prints from them. After awhile you start choking your machine too, 16 bit P45 file is 228 mgs. LOL

P30 is about 180
P25 is 128

So your already in big. I see the 1DSMKIII not much better than what it replaced , it's there but you start adding it all up with Canon than think MF and the Mamiya with lenses it is pretty darn close.
 

David K

Workshop Member
I'd like to underscore the importance of higher ISO shooting that Guy mentioned above. At the risk of repeating what's already been said, the DOF on MF is really shallow... even at f/5.6 it's pretty easy to miss the point of focus. I've found that f/11 is where I like to shoot and at ISO 100 you can forget hand-held shots (at least I can forget them). The rule of thumb that many of us use when shooting 35mm, i.e. shooting at 1/focal length of the lens does not apply to MF. You can double that (at least) so if you're shooting a 110 mm lens you're going to want that shutter speed at 1/250th for hand-held. A good, clean ISO 400 file makes a world of difference in what and how you can shoot.
 

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
I agree David i would not be buying anything unless ISO 400 was very clean, sometimes you just need it and rather no be caught with my pants down as they say. For studio work a different story altogether or if you have a lot a light which these backs scream feed me. For a shooter like me that does a lot of different work I find this real important. Landscape shooters most likely will never get the ISO off of 50 so depends on what you do.
 
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