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Phase One P25

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
Well i spent a lot of time shooting the P30 and not as much as the back I am buying but I did get plenty of quality time with the P25 and the Plus will have the extra benefits in it . But i thought it would be nice to show what this 22 mpx sensor can do. I did find the DR maybe slighter better than the P45 plus and P30 plus and jack and I spent some time together comparing this out processing some files and we came to the same conclusion the P25 maybe slightly better on the DR side . But hell there is so much range in these files anyway it really is pixel peeping. Now i know the Sinar , Leaf and other 22 mpx are most likely just as good in terms of resolving power including the ZD but of course like anything else the functions and such are different . But it is interesting to see how these 22 mpx wonders match up and believe me I am impressed by them. Now we should note Hassy uses the same Kodak sensors as the Phase pretty much and don't want to get into this brand versus that. Who really cares . I chose Phase because it just flat out works and works well and I like the speed , Iso and functions of it but that is me. Anyway let's just see what this puppy can produce with some Mamiya glass that is by all intensive purposes not regarded very higher against some others, which frankly not sure i agree with that becuase these lenses produce very well and there not even the D lenses YET:D. You know i will get every one of those . LOL

This was shot with the 55mm 2.8 at F5.
 

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
Speaking of DR the first one as shot the second just playing with highlight , shadows in C1 . I am blown in the first image in the sky in area's in the second look how it all comes back. BTW this is how I test , I put things through the torture images and se if it can save itself. This is my way and maybe not how someone else does things but i love the Ugly tests . It tells me a great deal
 

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
Doug I am going with the P25 Plus . To me it seemed to be the best value versus performance out of the three Phase backs. i can use it with the Horseman SWDII and also on any View camera body without worry of color shift. I can also get a great higher ISO 400 from it . So it seems to be a great value. Sure love to get the P45 plus no doubt there is some detail to be gained . But this gets me way over the 35mm DSLR world in a big way so it will handle almost any job and if i need to get to NY block size than I can always call in a bigger back of the P45 plus on a rental or from the folks at CI or something. All of the dealers here from Phase , Sinar and Leaf are all nice folks to deal with so whatever path you take these folks will help you. I know working with Lance over the last week he is really there to help support you and i am sure others are in the same category.

The other issue is Mamiya and Phase have teamed up and that is a great plus . We will see leaf shutters and already new body and lenses hitting the streets. To me I see this as a planning for the future with my gear that new things will come to support my purchase. Worst case i can always switch the mount> I think folks need to look down the path a little when making these kinds of purchases
 

LJL

New member
Guy,
It is nice to see the extended information that the files contain so that should you miss the exposure, you have some latitude to recover things. Like you, this is one of my "torture tests" also, as there are times when shooting quickly, that the meter can be pointed slightly at the wrong spot while you are trying to compose the shot on the fly.

In that street scene where you did pull back the exposure to get the clouds, it looks like you lost some contrast, as the street, the car, and palm plants seemed to go a bit flat. Not sure if that was your intention, or if there was something else going on. I have noticed that many of the "highlight recovery" tools tend to drop the contrast a fair bit as a way to get a bit more DR, but they also tend to take a lot of the zip out of things also.

Not picking nits here, as the demonstrated feature works. Just a personal observation and why I usually have to go back to make added adjustments after doing a highlight recovery in order to keep things looking the way I prefer them.

Lots of nice detail and good color in the shots from the back.

LJ
 

Jack

Sr. Administrator
Staff member
LJL, I think the point was he did BOTH highlight recovery AND fill pump on that file to show just how far he could push it.
 

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
This was a noise test at ISO 400 which looks pretty clean and i am expecting better with the Plus back but this is very acceptable . Sorry but I am just sharing my purchase decision in public looking at images
 

LJL

New member
LJL, I think the point was he did BOTH highlight recovery AND fill pump on that file to show just how far he could push it.
Thanks, Jack. I understood that Guy did play with things a bit and the clouds/sky did come back quite a bit. I was just commenting on how some of the tools treat things, and that other corrections need to be pumped back in to preserve stuff. Now, if Guy was intentionally trying to pull the sky down and push the shadows up.....that was accomplished, but the flatness does not do the test image justice, IMHO. These backs are delivering some very nice images to start, which is really nice to see. Like everything else we shoot and process, it takes time and experimentation to find the balance we want. (I could actually live with the blown sky to see the sharper bricks and better looking plants....that looks more attractive in that particular shot.)

LJ
 

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
LJL, I think the point was he did BOTH highlight recovery AND fill pump on that file to show just how far he could push it.
Exactly the image is not really correct , i am just showing how far you can stretch it. I would add more black to the scene to be correct but trying to see how much detail you can squeeze out of these shots that are not ideal exposures. There is a ton of elbow room here and that is very important
 

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
Thanks, Jack. I understood that Guy did play with things a bit and the clouds/sky did come back quite a bit. I was just commenting on how some of the tools treat things, and that other corrections need to be pumped back in to preserve stuff. Now, if Guy was intentionally trying to pull the sky down and push the shadows up.....that was accomplished, but the flatness does not do the test image justice, IMHO. These backs are delivering some very nice images to start, which is really nice to see. Like everything else we shoot and process, it takes time and experimentation to find the balance we want. (I could actually live with the blown sky to see the sharper bricks and better looking plants....that looks more attractive in that particular shot.)

LJ
Here just adding the black back in makes it look more correct. Lot's of tools to play with. But the cool part is you can fix the bad spots like the blown skies
 

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
Just a nice tonal range here, again the 55mm 2.8 lens which is really sharp. Just pulled the highlights down a touch on the left wall
 

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
This is the 150mm lens 3.5 maybe not considered the sharpest lens in the tool shed. Hmmm not a bad tool shed. Shot at F7
 

LJL

New member
Guy,
These are nice looking shots with tons of detail, and a real dimensionality to them. What I find the most interesting is that they at first they do not look all that different than anything else shot with a DSLR, for example, until you spend just a bit more time looking at them. Then the DR starts to really kick in, as does the ability to just keep zooming in and seeing more and more. It starts to really hit home when you look at the crops. They tend to look like normal DLSR shots done with a long, sharp telephoto, rather then blow-ups from a normal lens shot. This is great stuff.

LJ
 

Chuck Jones

Subscriber Member
LJ, in my opinion, the main reason to shoot MF digital is so you, or some idiot AD can crop into the frame to your heart's content, and not have to worry about having enough left to still retain a beautiful image & dynamic range. Hard to argue with 12 real stops of DR.....
 

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
Agree Chuck and what I run into all the time is you think it is just a small ad they are going to use it for than bam you walk in and there is a banner of your shot on the wall. This happens all the time with corporate clients. I want to deliver a better file that has plenty of growing space
 

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
This is the famed 28mm 2.8D lens. I shot this at F8 which maybe F11 would be a better F stop for it but for a focal length like this it is really nice . The far corners are a touch soft but stopping down even more would help it . But I want one. Looking at the crops you will see why. But also look at the distortion , there is none. This is a 20 mm on a P25
 

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
Okay watch this one . Shot with the 28 into the sun . I am trying to blow it here . The sky is toast but able to bring some back. Now here is where C1 really shines with the Phase backs it will correct for purple fringing and CA. I will post the two FF first Non corrected than corrected than the crops in the same order so you can see it better . Look at the trees on the left the leaves and the car highlights and the iron railing. This is something else
 

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
Jack shot a P45 plus with a 150mm lens and we processed it together with the corrections and were pretty impressed by this feature in C1
 

LJL

New member
LJ, in my opinion, the main reason to shoot MF digital is so you, or some idiot AD can crop into the frame to your heart's content, and not have to worry about having enough left to still retain a beautiful image & dynamic range. Hard to argue with 12 real stops of DR.....
Chuck,
I agree, and this is exactly the sort of issue I have to deal with now. I am seeing clients wanting a full page ad, and then as an after thought, start thinking poster and small billboard size. I normally shoot a lot of my polo action with a 1DMkII for speed, but have resorted to now shooting more with my 1DsMkII to permit that enlargement. Not planning to use MF for that task, but on product and some commercial stuff, the trend is to want to use the images for larger and larger display, or as you point out, to crop the daylights out of things for multiple uses. No matter how careful the exposure and file treatment, the 35mm size is not able to deliver things to such highly variable uses without suffering. For most magazine spot placements and even to full page or double page, there is less issue. The problem comes in when clients want to repurpose images to much larger size, or to crop heavily and then use that for a full page ad.

LJ
 
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