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A 39MP walk through town ...

KurtKamka

Subscriber Member
Lance at Capture Integration has been very kind in allowing to try out the P45+ and Mamiya combination over the holiday weekend. A major concern that I had with looking into MF was how well it would work as an all-around hand-holdable solution (I've never shot MF previously). I tend to be less of a studio person and more of a go out and find it shooter. I wanted to get a feel for higher ISO values, the size of the system for an afternoon of carry-around shooting and the general look of the files.

Anyway, here are a few of the results.

Kurt
 

mwalker

Subscriber Member
Beautiful hi rez pics. I really like the first two.... the second one especially but I'm a tree and woods guy.
 

Mitchell

New member
It looks like pretty amazing DR in the fourth one.

Thanks for posting. Look forward to your thoughts and decision.

Best,

Mitchell
 

Dale Allyn

New member
Kurt,

Thanks for posting these as they're right on track with my thoughts and process of consideration of MF. But since you're demoing the P45+ here I'm none too happy with you, cuz I plan on starting with some broken-down 3 MP back with peanut and butter spilled all over it before I spring for the P45+ (or similar). :D

So you've done me no favors here! :ROTFL:

Nice images you captured on your brief demo. It seems the combo is agreeable to you and your style.
 

cmb_

Subscriber & Workshop Member
I wanted to get a feel for . . . the size of the system for an afternoon of carry-around shooting and the general look of the files.
Kurt - interested in your impressions on using a MF system for the style you talk about and from what I know of your work.
 

harmsr

Workshop Member
Kurt,

I'm glad that I'm not the only one also falling the MF slope. This thing does have a learning curve though. Handholding needs to be alot more stable with faster shutter speeds. I also really need to stop down much more to get the depth of field that I have in my mind.

I did find that the 39MP backs really do show any camera movement, but depending on the size of the final image, however alot of it never shows in the print or screen image.

The good thing is when you nail, you really nail it.

The DR and color, in these backs is amazing (let alone the resolution).

I took a shot of some Coast Guard ships across the bay in Puerto Rico with the Mamiya 150 and Phase P45+. It was amazing to be able to see the detail in the VERY small wooden plate of the ships name which was miniscule in the overall shot. The plate detail is on the ship which is to the far left, under the bridge windows.

Best,

Ray
 

KurtKamka

Subscriber Member
I'll post a few thoughts a little later today. It is interesting to see so many people at the same point with regard to MFDB. First, just a couple of quick shots from today. The one thing about MF that I really like is the 3D look you can generate as separation between a subject and the background. Not a big revelation to those who have shot MF before. But when you see the big file you definitely see more of a 3D look.

Kurt
 

KurtKamka

Subscriber Member
One of the major reasons that I've been thinking about transitioning to a MFDB is to gain the 3D separation in pulling certain subjects out of scenes that I find interesting as I run across them. I want to explore still scenes that have a certain amount of action in them ... and I want to explore them at larger sizes to watch for unintended similarities and themes.

With that being said, here are a couple of examples that I was very pleased with during my short time with the camera. I felt fairly inconspicuous with the camera as I walked about town.

Kurt
 

irakly

New member
again, this time rules the second shot with a cyclist between two trees. absolutely paranoid picture! lovely!
 

TRSmith

Subscriber Member
I am reluctant to say this but feel I need to. And please, I have tremendous respect for the skills and artistic abilities of everyone involved with the MF revolution. So I don't mean this to be a comment about your talent in that regard.

What I'm leading up to is simply this. I just don't see it. I regularly follow the threads here that involve discussion of MF and with a very few exceptions, I do not see an advantage that's worth the price.

The exceptions are almost exclusively those captures (shown elsewhere in this forum) made with artificial lighting. Studio shots, fashion, product photography, etc. Aside from those examples (that are breathtaking in every way), the samples where someone carries an MF camera around and shoots similar subjects that one might shoot with a DSLR, are not really convincing me of the merits of a MF system for that kind of shooting.

I'm sure that MF could yield some excellent results on a tripod in a landscape setting. In fact I have seen some amazing examples of just that out there floating around. But for walking around and casual "observational shooting" (don't wanna get into the whole "Street Photography" debate) I'm guessing that the camera system is working against a fluid and natural style.

30 years ago I used Hassies and they had a special and important role. As did a view camera and an SLR. There was no one system that met every requirement in a professional environment. I can certainly see how a pro would require everything a larger sensor can provide. But as a replacement for a fine DSLR or M8 for out-and-about shooting? I just don't see it.

Just my opinion of course. And as I finish this final sentence, I fully anticipate that someone will have posted a few samples that completely prove me wrong. :eek:
 

Graham Mitchell

New member
I do not see an advantage that's worth the price.
Ah... the law of diminishing returns. The potential image quality is certainly higher but only you can decide if the extra performance is worth the price.

I should probably point out that the web-sized JPEGs are woefully inadequate when it comes to demonstrating file quality. I have been dropping a few hints to people to post full-resolution images and raw files but not much luck so far :)

the samples where someone carries an MF camera around and shoots similar subjects that one might shoot with a DSLR, are not really convincing me of the merits of a MF system for that kind of shooting.
I would agree that these cameras are not perfect for street photography but I doubt many people here are buying them with just that one purpose in mind. Imo, medium format is poor for sports, so so for street photography, and excellent for portrait, product, fashion, landscapes, architecture or any outdoor with controlled lighting.

Are you interested in medium format digital? What do you shoot?
 

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
Good point Tim and your right in a way. But like Kurt when I was in Puerto Rico i was basically getting to know the camera and how it works and Kurt is doing the same thing here also. This is his first time shooting MF so it is a lot different to shoot and such but he is just walking you through his demo with new gear. It really is not a street camera per say as we describe street. But it can be used outdoors for many things and what your not seeing is a 100 percent blowups on a 30 inch monitor that will honestly just scare you with detail. Not that we all have to have that but many times for me clients take things way past what my M8 can do and trust me i have been embarrassed walking in and seeing full wall size banners hanging up. As my client said the other day when I walked in with the P25 and described what it can do she said, so i can actually walk up to the banner and see detail. Right there i knew i made the right decision going MF . So it has some limitations on certain usage or types of shooting it certainly has the big advantages also. So as many of us are getting new systems and testing these things out we are all still getting a feel for them. But this is good to bounce stuff off folks and see what they think. This is a large investment and a BIG decision but at the end of the day it will be worth it.

Actually i was telling Jack this on the phone today. i worked for a big avionics corporation for 15 years as the chief photog. and traveled the world for them. But when 9/11 hit I got laid off along with about 900 other folks. they let me buy my gear for 500 dollars and it was a full Hassy V system and i mean full but my issue was at the time I could not afford 40 k for a back which in the beginning they were very expensive so I had to resort to DSLR's and had to sell all that to get the DSLR's it was a sacrifice i needed to make but now it is time to get back to what i really liked to shoot and MF shooting is fun for me and the results are far above 35mm. End of the day bigger is better be it film or digital. No matter how many mpx they stuff into a 35mm frame it still will come up short but the M8 and DMR did come very close even a 24mpx Nikon is still not going to be a MF back in quality. But they will get fairly close. Next time we look there will be a 60 mpx back so it will grow just like the 35mm world will.
 

David K

Workshop Member
I've seen a lot of Kurt's posts over the years and he shoots a variety of subjects besides what he's posted in this thread. I'm guessing that he already knows what MF can do in the other arenas and wants to see if it's good for this kind of work too. Irakly seems to think so, as do many other accomplished photographers. For me, shooting MF is mostly a tripod based experience...YMMV
 

Graham Mitchell

New member
even a 24mpx Nikon is still not going to be a MF back in quality.
Yes, and there are reasons other than megapixel count to consider the MF route:

- faster flash sync speeds (up to 1/1000)
- more dynamic range (several stops)
- ability to push and pull an image more than DSLR files can stand
- more resolution possible than the top DSLRs
- option of working with waist-level or 45 degree or 90 degree finders
- works with view cameras
- better lenses for some things
- better colour
- with some MF cameras, no need to rotate the whole camera when shooting in portrait mode
- and believe it or not there are features which some MF cameras have which Canon et al do not, afaik, such as focus bracketing, focus trap or colour temp sensor

Every time someone just compares the MP count it makes me want to hit my head against a wall :LOL:
 
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