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Once again I've fallen at the last hurdle - no MF for me!

D&A

Well-known member
I have to hand it to Jono. Here I am, going back and forth on this S2 thing (just as Jono and I'm sure others are doing) and then clear out of the blue he steps up to the plate (do they even have those kind of plates in Cricket?) and mans up and decides to go with both his gut feelings and a well throught our rationalized approach in deciding the S2 at least at this time, is not the right choice for his photography. (phew, yes I know, a run-on sentence!)

Jono, now that you've gotten to this point and most certainly have others possibly leaning in the same direction, don't go all wimp on us and do an about face....LOL! I don't know why, but something tells me we haven't heard the last of this :)

Either way, your mastering of composition and light among the other great things we see in your images, aren't going anywheres, regardless of what system you pick up, now or in the future.

Dave (D&A)
 

Godfrey

Well-known member
I think it is safe to say the Jono gets deep satisfaction from his photography. I find his understanding of light in landscapes and still lifes to be exquisite. I can fully understand his angst about balancing technical image quality vs. having gear that will change the way he shoots or his ability to simply capture what he sees. So, yes I can see that it is a hard decision and yes I am interested in his decision making process even if it takes two pages to articulate.....and yes I do think your answer falls into the category of bah, humbug....didn't you just post a fair amount on how you decided to buy the E5?
I posted that I had decided to purchase the E-5, yes.

I needed it, it was available, I'd planned to buy something else and changed my mind due to the additional advantages of the new model. I articulated them. It happened that I chose this camera, I decided to buy it for a couple of reasons, and I did. Done. On a scale of emotional severity running from 0 (I'm asleep) to 10 (my best friend just died a horrible death), I'd say it rated a 2.

I certainly didn't go on for a page about why I DIDNT buy it. I didn't say anything about "anguish" ... there was no anguish, no 'running to the brink and being held back at the last moment' drama. I haven't told you about all the other wonderful cameras I've thought would be nice to own and didn't buy either. It's a camera, not a life requirement for my sanity and health. I get a bigger kick and more drama out of seeing a wonderful photo made with a 7 year old E-1 and a $30 lens.

Bah, humbug. ;-)

BTW, I get deep satisfaction from my photography too. Cameras are not Photography.
 
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jonoslack

Active member
Phew
so many responses. I can see:
Agreement
Amusement
Questions about my manhood
Whimsy
Downright rudeness

This evening I have to get something finished. I'll answer properly later on, but I am reading every reply!

all the best
 

Godfrey

Well-known member
Jono feels offended that I made a tongue-in-cheek comment regarding his "anguish" over whether to buy a hyper-expensive camera.

I'd have thought that the line "Bah, humbug!" followed by a devilish smiley ...
]'-) ... would indicate that I was kidding him a bit. But Terry seems to be offended as well.

Well, on that basis I offer an apology ... there was no intent to offend.

I do feel rather strongly that all this drama over the notion of buying or not buying a camera is just malarky and totally irrelevant with respect to a pursuit of and love for Photography. I mean, I felt the same way when I finally obtained the Hasselblad super wide I'd wanted for 35 years as it had been a fantasy for most of my life ... But once I had it, I went to work with it, learned it, enjoyed it ... and sold it when it was no longer relevant to my Photography.

To each their own. I've unsubscribed from the thread now.
 

Terry

New member
Jono feels offended that I made a tongue-in-cheek comment regarding his "anguish" over whether to buy a hyper-expensive camera.

I'd have thought that the line "Bah, humbug!" followed by a devilish smiley ...
]'-) ... would indicate that I was kidding him a bit. But Terry seems to be offended as well.

Well, on that basis I offer an apology ... there was no intent to offend.

I do feel rather strongly that all this drama over the notion of buying or not buying a camera is just malarky and totally irrelevant with respect to a pursuit of and love for Photography. I mean, I felt the same way when I finally obtained the Hasselblad super wide I'd wanted for 35 years as it had been a fantasy for most of my life ... But once I had it, I went to work with it, learned it, enjoyed it ... and sold it when it was no longer relevant to my Photography.

To each their own. I've unsubscribed from the thread now.
No, it was not clear that it was tongue and cheek. However, I do find it odd that you offer an apology and then reitterate the same position over again.
 

MGrayson

Subscriber and Workshop Member
Need a sense of humor around here people. LOL
But Guy, don't you see how dangerous, how subversive Jono's position is? Without the certainty that a new more expensive camera will improve our photography, that leaves only hard work, practice, evaluation and criticism by our colleagues, experimentation, and struggle.

This could ruin everything!

(I don't need a smiley here, do I?)

Matt
 

stephengilbert

Active member
In addition to a sense of humor, people sometimes need to let things go. It isn't necessary to respond to every little thing.
 

jonoslack

Active member
But Guy, don't you see how dangerous, how subversive Jono's position is? Without the certainty that a new more expensive camera will improve our photography, that leaves only hard work, practice, evaluation and criticism by our colleagues, experimentation, and struggle.

This could ruin everything!

(I don't need a smiley here, do I?)

Matt
No indeed! (you don't need a smiley)
I realise that my decision is extremely odd . . . it's also extremely out of character (my wife is whirling in confusion, having blessed the idea to find that it doesn't seem to be happening!).
 

Terry

New member
No indeed! (you don't need a smiley)
I realise that my decision is extremely odd . . . it's also extremely out of character (my wife is whirling in confusion, having blessed the idea to find that it doesn't seem to be happening!).
She is whining because it just cost her a horse. :deadhorse:
 

jonoslack

Active member
Jono feels offended that I made a tongue-in-cheek comment regarding his "anguish" over whether to buy a hyper-expensive camera.

I'd have thought that the line "Bah, humbug!" followed by a devilish smiley ...
]'-) ... would indicate that I was kidding him a bit. But Terry seems to be offended as well.

Well, on that basis I offer an apology ... there was no intent to offend.

Fine - just like to emphasise that I wasn't remotely offended by questions about my manhood (justified) and everything else that everyone else said!
 

dick

New member
No indeed! (you don't need a smiley)
I realise that my decision is extremely odd . . . it's also extremely out of character (my wife is whirling in confusion, having blessed the idea to find that it doesn't seem to be happening!).
Just be diplomatic and buy one for your wife for Christmas! ( or buy each other one as a joint present).
 

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
But Guy, don't you see how dangerous, how subversive Jono's position is? Without the certainty that a new more expensive camera will improve our photography, that leaves only hard work, practice, evaluation and criticism by our colleagues, experimentation, and struggle.

This could ruin everything!

(I don't need a smiley here, do I?)

Matt
That is just to ( blank) funny. :ROTFL:


I need to get back to my web site rebuild ( what a freaking nightmare this is). Go Guy Go. I need a lot of encouragement here this is NOT fun.
 

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
Alright let me be serious for a brief moment here and offer some real thoughts up. Jono and I have been friends for awhile and i know we both respect each others opinion a great deal. I usually stay out of these unless directly asked but I am going to break my rule here.

Just looking at Jono as a shooter for a second . First i would not sell , take away or put your M9 on the block PERIOD. Your too good with it and it serves a purpose no Sony or S2 could ever do given your shooting style and subjects. However given that you did get a hall pass that one is hard for me to ignore. If my wife gave me a hall pass i would probably go for it, I'm not asking her because frankly she is really a doll and would say yes even though I joke about that all the time and lately she has been through health hell for the last year so I am not asking. Anyway here is what I see with the Sony since i have one also and I know the S2 well than the Sony could actually be replaced by the S2 . In all seriousness they are about the same weight and bulk wise and shooting one is not that much different than shooting the other. The other thing is noise floor wise they are about the same ISO 640 , 800 to 1200 max. Not really a big difference here except IQ which the S2 will surely smoke the Sony. I have one i can say that since my P40+ smokes the Sony but it has it's place( and i do like my Sony) . Also as far as file the M9 and Sony are pretty close so if you took a jump it would have to be up and the S2 would do that. Personally if it was me in this situation as Jono's and not a working Pro than a S2 /M9 sell everything else off except maybe one P&S than it would be a good combo. You have the file when you need it in the S2 and the agility in the M9. Also your files workflow wise would be pretty dang close since you are using the Kodak sensors. Now having said all that and it does make sense here is where the devil comes in a screws with your head and i can play that part well too. Do you need the file is the question and how MUCH will the S2 buy you over the M9 image wise. That is really the question you should be rolling in your head as far as camera and your abilities you have more than enough experience to get around any mental, physical road block that comes along as i talked about earlier in this same thread. Jono here is the real question for you is How much does this buy me money aside. If you can truthfully answer that to yourself than case closed either way. From a Pro seat I envy the hobbyist choices. I don't get these options.

For me it is different as a Pro I need the SLR since I already have the MF in a different style. Even if i had the S2 i would still need the DSLR Sony as back up and other reasons
 

fotografz

Well-known member
I have what could be a game changing thought or two as I explore this camera. It involves more of a question to myself than it does convincing any one else of anything.

When I consider something new, I don't necessarily approach it with the worry that it will change what I do, or how I see things, or anything current. That is because I want it to be part of change, not part of improving the status quo. Less like ... "will I stay the same?", but more like ... "Will this be part of (not the reason for) movement into new explorations?"

This happened to me when I first got a M so many years ago, it happened again when I first got involved with medium format (flim, then again with digital). And as I explore this camera I can see what a part of growth it can be as I expand my desire to be more, to be better. Often this can be done with what one has, and just as often it can be part of a whole new thing ... just like the M was all those years ago.

As I process the initial images from the S2, I am starting to feel a sense of unification from the camera ... it may be all that I need other than a big monster studio camera for my other world. The Sony and all but the most exotic parts of the M kit are now in the cross hairs. The S2 files are that good and easy to make. If proved true, the expense of this kit becomes less of an issue as it replaces others.

More to come, I have to run to a Holiday gathering.

-Marc
 

jonoslack

Active member
As I process the initial images from the S2, I am starting to feel a sense of unification from the camera ... it may be all that I need other than a big monster studio camera for my other world. The Sony and all but the most exotic parts of the M kit are now in the cross hairs. The S2 files are that good and easy to make. If proved true, the expense of this kit becomes less of an issue as it replaces others.

More to come, I have to run to a Holiday gathering.

-Marc
Enjoy the holiday gathering . . . .
 

jonoslack

Active member
Not really a big difference here except IQ which the S2 will surely smoke the Sony. I have one i can say that since my P40+ smokes the Sony but it has it's place( and i do like my Sony) . Also as far as file the M9 and Sony are pretty close so if you took a jump it would have to be up and the S2 would do that. Personally if it was me in this situation as Jono's and not a working Pro than a S2 /M9 sell everything else off except maybe one P&S than it would be a good combo. You have the file when you need it in the S2 and the agility in the M9. Also your files workflow wise would be pretty dang close since you are using the Kodak sensors. Now having said all that and it does make sense here is where the devil comes in a screws with your head and i can play that part well too. Do you need the file is the question and how MUCH will the S2 buy you over the M9 image wise. That is really the question you should be rolling in your head as far as camera and your abilities you have more than enough experience to get around any mental, physical road block that comes along as i talked about earlier in this same thread. Jono here is the real question for you is How much does this buy me money aside. If you can truthfully answer that to yourself than case closed either way. From a Pro seat I envy the hobbyist choices. I don't get these options.

For me it is different as a Pro I need the SLR since I already have the MF in a different style. Even if i had the S2 i would still need the DSLR Sony as back up and other reasons
I've solved the point and shoot problem . . . It's a pentax K5.
I can understand that you envy the hobbyist choices, and of course, the obvious answer is to get an S2, keep the M9 kit and ditch the A900 . . . .but I do weddings, not lots of weddings, but some, and they get paid for . . . .so the dSLR needs to stay, although, the DR and high ISO on the Pentax tempts one to think that could do away with the Sony, and of course the S2 would be wonderful for the times when one used the A900 with the 135 f1.8. . . . and lots is done with the M9 anyway. . . . .

I wasn't really expecting this thread to re-open the can of worms, but perhaps it does.

At any rate, I hope the discussion is helpful for others going through the same kind of thought processes.
 
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