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Thread: About Phase One dealers...

  1. #1
    Samuel Axelsson
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    About Phase One dealers...

    Hi all,
    I needed to post this as I'm feeling very frustrated with my PO dealer here in Sweden. Currently I'm using a P20 (V mount) that I lease (full paid in one year) as a refit since March. The current price from them for this refit non plus back is $9,850 (plus 25% taxes).
    I contacted my dealer showing my intention to upgrade my back and change the mount to a PhaseOne camera. My options were to change to a phase/mamiya camera with a P21+ or to a bigger sensor like a p25. And I also explained the I don't really need more than a 18-22 Mpx.
    Their response was that I can change my P20 to P30+ or a higer plus back. This upgrade would cost me $16,299 for the back and $3,300 for the PO camera with 80mm lens everything plus 25% taxes.
    This only tell my that my investment in the P20 was a BIG ERROR, what I never thought It could happen with phase one.

    Now I'm wondering what to do?
    Take a plane to the states? :-) Any ideas?

    Thanks
    /Samuel

  2. #2
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: About Phase One dealers...

    Sam give Lance a call at CI he may have some ideas for you.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

  3. #3
    Workshop Member lance_schad's Avatar
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    Re: About Phase One dealers...

    Sam,
    There have been some changes with official upgrade policies on the P20/P21 since they had the latest price drop when the PhaseOne 645AFD was announced.
    The classic upgrade price from a Non-Plus P-series back is $7990 which gets you a new digital back and warranty. The new list price for a P20+ is $9990 so I assume they figured and have experienced that the majority of P20 users were not going to want to pay for this upgrade so they took it off the price list.
    They are still giving you a trade in value for that back to larger sensor systems. For example you get a trade in value of $9000 towards a P45+/p25+, and $8000 value towards the upgrade to a P30+. Very good value.
    A straight platform swap is $2500 to the 645afd mount (if not covered under VA warranty)
    I know this does not fit your needs as per your post since you really would like to stay with the 16mp square sensor. I cannot speak for your local PhaseOne dealer, but if you were in our area we would attempt to assist you by tailoring a custom trade-in/upgrade program together for you, since we deal in used Phase One backs as well.
    Do they deal in used digital backs? If so they should be able creative to take care of your needs.
    Please let me know if you have any additional questions.
    L
    Lance Schad
    Capture Integration - Miami/Atlanta
    305-394-3196 cell | 305-534-5702 office
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  4. #4
    Natasa Stojsic
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    Re: About Phase One dealers...

    Quote Originally Posted by Samuel Axelsson View Post
    Hi all,
    I needed to post this as I'm feeling very frustrated with my PO dealer here in Sweden. Currently I'm using a P20 (V mount) that I lease (full paid in one year) as a refit since March. The current price from them for this refit non plus back is $9,850 (plus 25% taxes).
    I contacted my dealer showing my intention to upgrade my back and change the mount to a PhaseOne camera. My options were to change to a phase/mamiya camera with a P21+ or to a bigger sensor like a p25. And I also explained the I don't really need more than a 18-22 Mpx.
    Their response was that I can change my P20 to P30+ or a higer plus back. This upgrade would cost me $16,299 for the back and $3,300 for the PO camera with 80mm lens everything plus 25% taxes.
    This only tell my that my investment in the P20 was a BIG ERROR, what I never thought It could happen with phase one.

    Now I'm wondering what to do?
    Take a plane to the states? :-) Any ideas?

    Thanks
    /Samuel
    Samuel, funny you asked.... but I actually did just that/negotiated a little better deal and now I am happy with what I got

    Perhaps, they wanted you to protect your investment this time by going for something that will hold the price better and sell faster.... Actually, they probably know if you purchase P30+ and you decide to upgrade again, they will sell P30+ instantly therefore give you a better price

    I would go for it if you can, just negotiate the best possible price

  5. #5
    Samuel Axelsson
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    Re: About Phase One dealers...

    Hi,
    Thank you all for your resplies.
    My dealer called today. I think we are getting closer to a good deal. The thing is, even if a P30+ has a longer "life", it still feels much more than what I need. We'll talk tomorrow about P21+ or P30+. But I think the PhaseOne camera with a P21+ will be more than gorgeous. We'll see...

    Thank you!

    P.S. I promise a PhaseOne 645 Camera review if I end up getting it.

  6. #6
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: About Phase One dealers...

    Nothing wrong with getting a little more than you need. Makes growing a little easier
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

  7. #7
    Samuel Axelsson
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    Re: About Phase One dealers...

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Mancuso View Post
    Nothing wrong with getting a little more than you need. Makes growing a little easier
    I know, but I'm not sure the difference is worth almost $10,000. A non plus P30 cost about the same as the P21+ with a PhasOne kit, but dealers don't seem to like swapping refits in and out.

  8. #8
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: About Phase One dealers...

    I would simply go with a PLus no matter which one you get. Just for the resale value alone would make it worth it , not to mention some of the benefits of the PLUS. The LCD is better plus a whole list of other things. Having shot the P25 in San Juan and now owning the PLus. I could say it is better but hard to prove that really, It feels better to me if you know what I mean. Check out on the Phase site the benefits of the Plus most dealers i bet are not evening mentioning all of the benefits to you. I learned some extra stuff just from the website
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

  9. #9
    Natasa Stojsic
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    Re: About Phase One dealers...

    Quote Originally Posted by Samuel Axelsson View Post
    I know, but I'm not sure the difference is worth almost $10,000. A non plus P30 cost about the same as the P21+ with a PhasOne kit, but dealers don't seem to like swapping refits in and out.

    If you can negotiate for the best possible deal, I would still go for P30+

    On the other hand I started with P20 than P21+ than I was thinking about
    P45+ and the sweet spot was P30+, at least that is the way it worked for me

    Now, knowing more than I knew before, I could probably go P21+ but only if I knew I am getting P45+ down the road

    I was going to suggest to Guy to go straight after the P45+ because I know he appreciates the quality and who needs more than that anyway... later for some of his additional work with new 150mm D version/etc. to get P30+ and so on... but I'm sure he will get there, sooner or later

    Bottom line, I am working on similar best possible solution for me.. and that would be: to add P45+ and keep existing P30+

    Hopefully after Photokina

    I usually like to buy more expensive one first, that way it's much easier than going with the load up the hill!!!

    Anyway, I'm sure whatever you decide will work fine, so don't worry much because you will have the product that is reliable/works/easy/no nonsense/etc. and that is truly the most important and rare asset as far as DB is concerned

  10. #10
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: About Phase One dealers...

    Completely agree . The damn thing just works with no arguments at all and there is something to be said for that. Make the best deal you can and go for it. I will move up someday myself but maybe a few baby steps first but I am thrilled so far with the P25 Plus.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

  11. #11
    Samuel Axelsson
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    Re: About Phase One dealers...

    Guy, thanks for the good advice, the P30 non p has been also in my mind but I understand is not a good investment.

    Natasa, Of course I'd go for the P30+ but I have to consider other factors. For exemple: If I get the P21+ it will be paid about 9 months from now, so I'll probably be able to keep it in case I need to invest in more resolution, depending on upgrade prices etc... So I can use this one for more fast shooting and high ISO and the maybe go for a full frame if I need it, when we see what happens at photokina 2008 etc...

  12. #12
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: About Phase One dealers...

    The P30 just will not draw much attention on the used market as well as the Plus and that is what maybe something to consider. Even as i was deciding to buy i was looking at the same thing and i just did not want to buy yesterday tech. with the non Plus.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

  13. #13
    Samuel Axelsson
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    Re: About Phase One dealers...

    Today, and after a good conversation with my dealer, I decided no to upgrade and wait a bit. It seems that photokina could bring some new toys... I feel is a good idea not to rush into it right now...

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