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Thread: Phase change the IQ package after you buy?

  1. #1
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    Phase change the IQ package after you buy?

    I got word that Phase have changed the Value added package from what was promised. It appears you now will only get a very basic 'Classic' configuration, plus the longer warranty.

    Did anyone ever get the full Value Added Kit, as listed below? I certainly didn't, not even close to it, despite paying fully. Really don't see how they can change the deal after we have ordered and paid. (and part received)

    Very bad of Phase to play the old bait n' switch game on loyal customers.

    Quote Originally Posted by lance_schad View Post

    Classic Configuration:
    IQ or P+ Digital Back w/ 1 year classic warranty
    Accessories:

    - Small Weatherproof case
    - Digital back Battery
    - Dual DB battery charger
    - 4.5m Firewire Cable
    - CCD Cleaning Kit
    - Capture One DB

    Value Added Configuration:
    IQ Digital Back w/ 5 Year Valued Added Warranty (loaner unit during repair)
    P+ Digital Back w/3 Year Value Added Warranty (loaner unit during repair)
    Accessories:
    - Waterproof stroller hard case with room for 17” laptop
    - 2 lens wraps
    - 2 digital back batteries
    - 4.5m Firewire Cable (800 to 800 w/ IQ)
    - Dual DB battery charger
    - DB Multi connector cable
    - LCC calibration plate
    - CF card (4gb or 8gb)
    - CF card reader
    - QP reference cards
    - Digiclean CCD cleaning kit
    - USB 3 cable
    - Capture One Pro license

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    Senior Member stephengilbert's Avatar
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    Re: Phase change the IQ package after you buy?

    What did you get (or not get)?

    Did you trade up, or buy outright?

    Did you ask your dealer what's up?

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    Re: Phase change the IQ package after you buy?

    I don't yet know what might be in the VA package, but the new standard package includes a very nice foam-filled cardboard box and not a "waterproof case"
    You can see the "unboxing" at the Capture Integration site http://www.captureintegration.com/?s=unboxing
    -bob

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    Senior Member etrump's Avatar
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    Re: Phase change the IQ package after you buy?

    Did you check with your dealer?

    Phase didn't have all the VA product so instead of making you wait they shipped the standard with the VA products to follow.

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    Workshop Member lance_schad's Avatar
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    Re: Phase change the IQ package after you buy?

    Hopefully this will clear up any confusion on Phase One's new packaging. They have changed how the Classic Digital Backs and Systems are delivered.


    Left Side - Value Added Weather Sealed Case
    Center - Classic Digital Back Box
    Right - Classic System Suitcase
    -----------------------

    The Value Added suitcase is a weather and waterproof suitcase with inline wheels and a telescoping handle.
    The case is made from a high performance material, and it has press & pull latches and automatic pressure release valve.
    It will meet most carry-on regulations on international airplanes.
    The case measures: 551 x 358 x 226mm
    ------------------------

    Value added system content:
    Phase One 645 DF camera with IQ or P+ Series digital back mounted and 8GB CF card installed
    Schneider Kreuznach 80mm, f2.8 LS lens
    Capture One Pro software CD ,
    Firewire 800 cable,USB3 Cable (IQ-series only),
    CCD Cleaning kit
    100x100mm Lens cast calibration plate
    Getting stated box with:
    645DF/ IQ or P+ Quick Guide
    USB key with documentation
    Gray Card and Warranty papers
    AA type batteries for 645DF
    2 Lens wrapping cloths with:
    CF-Cardreader and cable
    Hähnel Twin Pro charger with internatinal
    power supply and car charger.
    2 Digital Back Batteries and an extra
    battery casette with batteries for 645 DF
    Multiconnector sync cable for connection
    to technical camera
    CF-card storage box
    Accesory box with:
    HB Multimount lens adaptor
    Digital back cover
    645DF Back and lens cover
    Lens and LCD Microfiber cleaning cloth.

    Value added digital back content:
    IQ or P+ Series digital back and 8GB CF card
    Capture One Pro software CD
    Firewire 800 cable
    USB3 Cable (IQ-series only)
    CCD Cleaning kit
    100x100mm Lens cast calibration plate
    Getting stated box with:
    645DF/ IQ or P+ Quick Guide
    USB key with documentation
    Gray Card and Warranty papers
    2 Lens wrapping cloths with:
    CF-Cardreader and cable
    Hähnel Twin Pro charger with internatinal
    power supply and car charger.
    2 Digital Back Batteries
    Multiconnector sync cable for
    connection to technical camera
    Accesory box with:
    Digital back cover
    Lens and LCD Microfiber cleaning cloth.
    ----------------------------------------
    Classic System Suitcase

    Phase One 645 DF camera with IQ or P+ Series
    digital back mounted
    Schneider Kreuznach 80mm, f2.8 LS lens
    Hähnel Twin Pro charger with internatinal power
    supply and car charger.
    1 Digital Back Battery
    Capture One DB software CD
    Firewire 800 cable
    USB3 Cable (IQ-series only)
    CCD Cleaning kit
    Getting stated box with:
    645DF/ IQ or P+ Quick Guide
    USB key with documentation
    Gray Card and Warranty papers
    Lens and LCD Microfiber cleaning cloth

    Classic Digital Back Box Content

    Phase One IQ or P+ Series digital back
    Hähnel Twin Pro charger with internatinal power
    supply and car charger.
    1 Digital Back Battery
    Capture One DB software CD
    Firewire 800 cable
    USB3 Cable (IQ-series only)
    CCD Cleaning kit
    Getting stated box with:
    645DF/ IQ or P+ Quick Guide
    USB key with documentation
    Gray Card and Warranty papers
    Lens and LCD Microfiber cleaning cloth

    Upgrades
    Digital back upgrades will ship in the DB Box.
    The box will contain:
    IQ Digital Back
    FireWire 800 cable
    USB3 cable
    Startbox with warranty and documentation
    Plus relevant focusing screen (if required)

    Lance
    LANCE SCHAD - Digital Transitions - Phase One,Mamiya | Leaf,Arca-Swiss,Cambo, Profoto
    direct/cell:610-496-5586 office:877-367-8537x224
    http://www.digitaltransitions.com email:[email protected]

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    Re: Phase change the IQ package after you buy?

    cough cough, that sucks! over 20K on a back and they save a few buck on a box. what were the suits thinking!

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    Re: Phase change the IQ package after you buy?

    Quote Originally Posted by sendog View Post
    Very bad of Phase to play the old bait n' switch game on loyal customers.
    Double-check with your dealer, then if still unsatisfied with their response, contact P1. I received everything that was promised in my VA Package.

    It's a bit presumptive to blame P1 in a public forum when it seems you're not wholly sure of the situation yourself.

    Quote Originally Posted by djonesii View Post
    cough cough, that sucks! over 20K on a back and they save a few buck on a box. what were the suits thinking!
    Why shouldn't P1 differentiate between it's offerings? Your logic also runs both ways: If you can afford a $xK MFDB then you can afford – or most likely already own – your own case.

    Admittedly, the case is a nice touch. But I still think it's even nicer to limit it to the higher-end VA Packages.

    The angst surrounding the IQ backs is astounding.

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    Administrator Bob's Avatar
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    Re: Phase change the IQ package after you buy?

    And back when my cub was delivered it came with a leather cube case, which has been sitting on my shelf ever since it arrived.
    Actually, the only useful things are the functional bits, other than storage, most folks decide on their bags and gear separately.
    I would have no problem if phase offered the plastic case with custom cut foam as a separate item, but it might not attract enough volume to make it worthwhile.
    -bob

    p.s.
    I LOVE my IQ180!
    what a joy to use.

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    Workshop Member Woody Campbell's Avatar
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    Re: Phase change the IQ package after you buy?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bob View Post
    And back when my cub was delivered it came with a leather cube case, which has been sitting on my shelf ever since it arrived.
    Actually, the only useful things are the functional bits, other than storage, most folks decide on their bags and gear separately.
    I would have no problem if phase offered the plastic case with custom cut foam as a separate item, but it might not attract enough volume to make it worthwhile.
    -bob

    p.s.
    I LOVE my IQ180!
    what a joy to use.
    Amen on the bags and gear.

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    Re: Phase change the IQ package after you buy?

    Quote Originally Posted by lance_schad View Post
    Hopefully this will clear up any confusion on Phase One's new packaging. They have changed how the Classic Digital Backs and Systems are delivered.


    Left Side - Value Added Weather Sealed Case
    Center - Classic Digital Back Box
    Right - Classic System Suitcase
    -----------------------

    The Value Added suitcase is a weather and waterproof suitcase with inline wheels and a telescoping handle.
    The case is made from a high performance material, and it has press & pull latches and automatic pressure release valve.
    It will meet most carry-on regulations on international airplanes.
    The case measures: 551 x 358 x 226mm
    ------------------------

    Value added system content:
    Phase One 645 DF camera with IQ or P+ Series digital back mounted and 8GB CF card installed
    Schneider Kreuznach 80mm, f2.8 LS lens
    Capture One Pro software CD ,
    Firewire 800 cable,USB3 Cable (IQ-series only),
    CCD Cleaning kit
    100x100mm Lens cast calibration plate
    Getting stated box with:
    645DF/ IQ or P+ Quick Guide
    USB key with documentation
    Gray Card and Warranty papers
    AA type batteries for 645DF
    2 Lens wrapping cloths with:
    CF-Cardreader and cable
    Hähnel Twin Pro charger with internatinal
    power supply and car charger.
    2 Digital Back Batteries and an extra
    battery casette with batteries for 645 DF
    Multiconnector sync cable for connection
    to technical camera
    CF-card storage box
    Accesory box with:
    HB Multimount lens adaptor
    Digital back cover
    645DF Back and lens cover
    Lens and LCD Microfiber cleaning cloth.

    Value added digital back content:
    IQ or P+ Series digital back and 8GB CF card
    Capture One Pro software CD
    Firewire 800 cable
    USB3 Cable (IQ-series only)
    CCD Cleaning kit
    100x100mm Lens cast calibration plate
    Getting stated box with:
    645DF/ IQ or P+ Quick Guide
    USB key with documentation
    Gray Card and Warranty papers
    2 Lens wrapping cloths with:
    CF-Cardreader and cable
    Hähnel Twin Pro charger with internatinal
    power supply and car charger.
    2 Digital Back Batteries
    Multiconnector sync cable for
    connection to technical camera
    Accesory box with:
    Digital back cover
    Lens and LCD Microfiber cleaning cloth.
    ----------------------------------------
    Classic System Suitcase

    Phase One 645 DF camera with IQ or P+ Series
    digital back mounted
    Schneider Kreuznach 80mm, f2.8 LS lens
    Hähnel Twin Pro charger with internatinal power
    supply and car charger.
    1 Digital Back Battery
    Capture One DB software CD
    Firewire 800 cable
    USB3 Cable (IQ-series only)
    CCD Cleaning kit
    Getting stated box with:
    645DF/ IQ or P+ Quick Guide
    USB key with documentation
    Gray Card and Warranty papers
    Lens and LCD Microfiber cleaning cloth

    Classic Digital Back Box Content

    Phase One IQ or P+ Series digital back
    Hähnel Twin Pro charger with internatinal power
    supply and car charger.
    1 Digital Back Battery
    Capture One DB software CD
    Firewire 800 cable
    USB3 Cable (IQ-series only)
    CCD Cleaning kit
    Getting stated box with:
    645DF/ IQ or P+ Quick Guide
    USB key with documentation
    Gray Card and Warranty papers
    Lens and LCD Microfiber cleaning cloth

    Upgrades
    Digital back upgrades will ship in the DB Box.
    The box will contain:
    IQ Digital Back
    FireWire 800 cable
    USB3 cable
    Startbox with warranty and documentation
    Plus relevant focusing screen (if required)

    Lance

    This is a lot more explanation than before Lance! That final category is new on the list, and the one that applies to most of us here.

    Till now one would have believed that purchasing a Value Added Upgrade to new IQ180 back would be the same package as a 'Value Added Digital Back only' but... it seems not. It seems the upgrade is picked clean of everything but the back and leads. This is the first time I've seen this reduced specification, and am surprised by it.

    Some fresh batteries for a new back, a charger, and a copy of C1 Pro, and a new LCC card, for 'Value Added' upgraders should be the minimum, surely?

    As it is, buying a 'Value Added Upgrade', compared to 'Classic Upgrade', means what - a different piece of paper in the box, specifying a 1 year vs 5 year guarantee, and, err... that's it !

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    Re: Phase change the IQ package after you buy?

    It seems to me the difference between a 1 year vs. 5 year warranty is not to be minimized.

  12. #12
    Senior Member ddanois's Avatar
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    Re: Phase change the IQ package after you buy?

    I'm in the camp that upgraded and was surprised by the lack of box contents. I suppose that Phase was thinking that if you're upgrading then you already have all of the new kit items (minus the FW800 & USB 3 cables). Additionally, they probably feel that they already gave us a big discount on the new back so no other "goodies" are necessary. As previously mentioned in this thread, I'm not really interested in a new plastic case as I have several that I prefer for my gear.

    Of greater concern for me was the fact that my box paperwork was for a classic warranty when I paid for the VA warranty. I have a request out to CI to get the correct documentation as the new 5yr VAW is a real asset and I don't want to be 3 years out with an issue and having to argue over warranty.

    Derek

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    Re: Phase change the IQ package after you buy?

    I understand the warranty part for sure. Making sure that is correct but have to agree with Derek on the packing if you upgraded than you already have those boxes from your originally purchase and your just upgrading the back , not sure why you would think you would get all that stuff again. New purchase obviously different story first time buyer you should get all that stuff. Sure I would have liked to have seen a small pelican case for back only in the upgrade. That would be nice but honestly it would sit on a shelf for 95 percent of us.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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    Re: Phase change the IQ package after you buy?

    Quote Originally Posted by ddanois View Post
    Of greater concern for me was the fact that my box paperwork was for a classic warranty when I paid for the VA warranty. I have a request out to CI to get the correct documentation as the new 5yr VAW is a real asset and I don't want to be 3 years out with an issue and having to argue over warranty.
    It's a meaningful concern. I'm highly confident the error is just the paper in your box and that you are logged as a VA owner. However I'll gladly double check that Phase has in it's support system the warranty which you purchased, and then send you documentation accordingly.

    Doug Peterson (e-mail Me)
    __________________

    Head of Technical Services, Capture Integration
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    Last edited by dougpeterson; 5th June 2011 at 07:04.

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    Senior Member ddanois's Avatar
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    Re: Phase change the IQ package after you buy?

    Thanks Doug. I'm sure that you and the team at CI will resolve it completely.

    Derek

    Quote Originally Posted by dougpetersonci View Post
    It's a meaningful concern. I'm highly confident the error is just the paper in your box and that you are logged as a VA owner. However I'll gladly double check that Phase has in it's support system the warranty which you purchased, and then send you documentation accordingly.

    Doug Peterson (e-mail Me)
    __________________

    Head of Technical Services, Capture Integration
    Phase One Partner of the Year
    Leaf, Leica, Cambo, Arca Swiss, Canon, Apple, Profoto, Broncolor, Eizo & More

    National: 877.217.9870 *| *Cell: 740.707.2183
    Newsletter | RSS Feed
    Buy Capture One 6 at 10% off

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    This has nothing to do with the cases .....

    Dear all;

    A bit of background, I spend about 1/2 my time in my day job running a world wide marketing department in a small oilfield services company. In this business small means I look after Houston, London, Denver, Moscow, Cairo, Tripoli and Lagos. The other 1/2 my time I spend helping to make our data processing services run better, more or less internal sales, my products are mostly ideas and change.

    Phase set a client expectation a while back, their systems came with a blue box and a black box, even if the pros make a different choice for daily use, they still have these boxes sitting around. They changed that policy. In my marketing mind, that was a poor change.

    I have bought a ton of PC's, from many manufactures, my wife finally got an iMac for her birthday, I'm an engineer by training, DOS from the floppy disk days, Windows 3.1 etc ... From the instant I ordered that iMac, I knew it was going to be trouble for me. When it arrived double boxed, and in packaging that clearly was a cut above the rest, that packaging validated my decision. We got Apple care, when the airport didn't work quite right, the just took care of it. I never got that from any PC vendor. In short, Apple throughout the process justified the premium on a stack of industry standard parts with a better out of box experience. Although I have not installed C1 on that machine, my guess is it will run no better than on a similarly specified Dell.

    A little role playing game .... you're hunting for a wedding photographer, you go to a trendy part of town, up the elevator to a nice office, are met by a pretty receptionist set on some Italian leather couches, are then given an iPad each to review some images while you wait drinking your latte. ( I think you see where this is heading .... ) To some extent, a less marketing savvy guy with better images is going to loose this job.

    I just got my first Phase One back, little blue box, large black one, delivered by a dealer, had my hand held for a couple of hours while I asked some questions, and the system included a CF card that was actually of use to me. My decision was validated. Any thing less next time, and I will feel cheated. Nikon never did this for me!

    I'm not talking Leica blue ostrich skin strategy, but double boxed, presentation box, it says quality. Hasselblad actually sold some kits in a traveling case at one point, I've seen them on the big auction site. To some extent, we are in a luxury good market, not an industrial one. This type of change ( deleting something that they did before ) does not give the customer a warm fuzzy feeling. I'll close with something that sticks in my mind from a Bently car review, buy a set of matching carbon fiber umbrellas for GBP 160,000 and they will throw in a Bently for free!

    as I said, what were the suits ( i.e. corporate marketing ) thinking when the did this to the dealer network.

    Dave

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    Re: Phase change the IQ package after you buy?

    Quote Originally Posted by etrump View Post
    Did you check with your dealer?

    Phase didn't have all the VA product so instead of making you wait they shipped the standard with the VA products to follow.
    In my case, it was my dealer who told me that Phase have stepped down the package you get with an 'upgrade' !

    I think Phase didn't have their product lines thoroughly sorted out. The info Lance now gives is much more specific that before, which left people believing they were getting the 'Value Added Back Only' only package, when upgrading to VA specs. Not just customers, but the dealers thought so too (why else were they asking for your Pelican Case back, if they didn't assume you were about to get a new one?)

    Phase have changed the specification, months after we ordered. Fair enough for the future, but they should give a little compensation for pre-order customers, for their mis-step, at least.

  18. #18
    Workshop Member lance_schad's Avatar
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    Re: Phase change the IQ package after you buy?

    Narkin,

    Yes there was some confusion. There are a few different transactions that we are dealing with:

    1) Upgrades from previous generations of PhaseOne Digital Backs - existing users which are essentially just upgrading the "digital back" portion of their kit. So, this an easy one, just give them the new cables and swap backs.

    2) Users who purchased a new IQ systems and received a "Buy Now" loaner P+ series. Again this should be straight forward, because they received a new kit with a P+ series loaner.... The confusion that maybe happening is that some of these kits were shipped in the older weatherproof cases. Phase changed the packaging in the May timeframe.

    3) Competitive trade ins- People who purchased this way will receive a new kit (VA or Classic). It will be the new packaging most likely because of the shipping time frame - after May.

    4) New purchases made now, will all be in the new packaging.

    Do I like the new classic packaging? Well it's nice to look at, but it is not as practical as the older weatherproof case, but we have to live with it for now.

    I think they could have at least created a nice foam-cutout that could be transferred from the cardboard packaging to a specified model of a Pelican/Storm case that would fit everything snugly and neat. It would then serve as a dual purpose. People could proudly display their new Phase One Packaging on a shelf and then use the foam to protect their gear. (Phase are you listening?)

    I also feel that Phase One has lost out on a branding opportunity, because people did store and transport their systems in the smaller classic case and it had their logo on it.

    Anyway hope this clears it all up and sets expectations for what you may receive if you order or have a IQ on order.

    Lance
    LANCE SCHAD - Digital Transitions - Phase One,Mamiya | Leaf,Arca-Swiss,Cambo, Profoto
    direct/cell:610-496-5586 office:877-367-8537x224
    http://www.digitaltransitions.com email:[email protected]

  19. #19
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    Re: Phase change the IQ package after you buy?

    I may not yet have a dog in this fight but hope to.

    I recently upgraded from a P45+ to a refurbished P65+. The only thing I was interested in was changing the digital back; I could give two hoots about boxes or containers. My main interest was the back. Sorta of like when I go to a steakhouse and order a meal - I couldn't care less about the green garnish on the side of the plate. It came with the meal so therefore I paid for it. Will I use it? No.

    My P30+ and P45+ were both bought as a Value added package so I have the nice pelican case. That case has sat in my closet collecting dust for several years; and is still there. The P65 was shipped in a nice cardboard mailer which I used to return my P45+. Again the only thing I was and still interested in was the back itself. The back makes me money not the shipping container.

    I know I'm different (as anyone who has met me will tell you). I used the P30+ on first a Mamiya then Phase body. That kit was stored in a camera bag of my choice. When I made the move to a technical camera and the P45+ I decided to use a pelican case to hold all the gear. All this time the original Phase case was sitting where I left it.

    Phase recently sent us a backpack. That backpack has seen more use in the short period of time I've had it than the case ever will. I used it to pack my M9 as I hiked down into part of the Grand Canyon last week. I also used it to pack my WRS/P65 out to areas that I normally wouldn't have before.

    Have we become spoiled with the garnish? Yes. But what did you spend the money on in the first place? I hope it was the back.

    I partially agree with Lance, Phase may have lost out on branding of cases. However they did real good with the backpacks.

    Again I brought the back not the garnish.

    Just my 2¢


    Don
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  20. #20
    Senior Member KeithL's Avatar
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    Re: This has nothing to do with the cases .....

    Quote Originally Posted by djonesii View Post
    Dear all;
    I'm not talking Leica blue ostrich skin strategy, but double boxed, presentation box, it says quality. Hasselblad actually sold some kits in a traveling case at one point, I've seen them on the big auction site. To some extent, we are in a luxury good market, not an industrial one. This type of change ( deleting something that they did before ) does not give the customer a warm fuzzy feeling. I'll close with something that sticks in my mind from a Bently car review, buy a set of matching carbon fiber umbrellas for GBP 160,000 and they will throw in a Bently for free!
    You know, I wouldn't give a rat's arse if Phase supplied their latest and greatest in a brown paper bag. If it's bling you want then perhaps cameras aren't really your thing.

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    Re: This has nothing to do with the cases .....

    Please see my post in the Sunset Bar!

    http://forum.getdpi.com/forum/showth...164#post323164



    Dave

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