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why did i choose the Arca RM3D over the others technical cameras... a friend asks...

Don Libby

Well-known member
Guy - or anyone else for that matter.

I've read this before and so far I just can't understand it. I've been using a WRS since it was first introduced and I've found the build quality to be very good. I'll admit I haven't been around Arca or Alpa much however from what I have seen I don't recall one having a particularly better build quality than another. In the end a tech body is just a piece of metal that's used to connect a lens to a back; of course it's not that simple when you include the ability to add movements. And speaking of movements, my WRS is as tight and precise today as it was when I first tried it out October 2008.

So based on 33 months of use having it never let me down I just wonder when I read
The Cambo does it all but the build and precision is not Arca or Alpa.
Don

The above in no way should be considered as any attempt in taking away from archive's original pointing out his reason for choosing and enjoying the RM3D. Bottom line it fits him which in the end is what its all about.
 

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
Don the Cambo is very good and why I will probably buy it. We have to remember it's much cheaper to buy the Cambo too. With that the build is very good but if you want a milling engineers dream than Arca and Alpa have that but they do cost more. In the end I would say Arca gets the tilt since it's on the body and ALL lenses. Alpa gets the size and nice feel ( I want small too). The Cambo rides the middle it can functionally do what both can at a better body price. I like all three to be honest and I also have not bought anything yet and I'm going though my general points of my homework for myself. I want to buy a body not extra options also. BTW I like shooting the Cambo but I have no allegiance to any of them. I'm just looking for a functional tool I can work with and the cost is low. Someone wants me to be there poster child than send me one. Its just that simple. There all over hyped in marketing so what else is new. People love there Alpa's and Arca's great, I just want something that works functionally for me and gives me what I need at a good cost. Put any name on it, it certainly won't matter to me at all. I don't buy names I buy working gear that I hope is bullet proof.

I should add for clarity on which models I am comparing against for myself the Arca RM3D the Alpa STC and the WRS. I know some models can do more things like the Alpa Max and some less like the RM2D which is another one I like for the size but no Tilt.
 

Jack

Sr. Administrator
Staff member
Folks, I do not know why a "war" of sorts seems to have started around tech camera body choices. I have said virtually every time I write about them, that it is a selection of trade-offs -- and most importantly ALL are capable of creating outstanding IMAGES!

Bottom line is we have price v operational convenience v absolute precision v movement choices v set-up choices v accessory availability v size and weight v a dozen other criteria.

I think it is certainly fair for anybody to claim they chose brand X for reasons A, B and C, and I think it is equally fair for others to say, I chose brand Y because I didn't like D, E and F about brand X. It is that type of dialog that will help others make informed about what features are best for THEM going forward. We should be grateful we have more than a few choices, should we not?

IMHO what counts is the resultant image -- and if your system helps you get to one in an efficient way for you, you've clearly made the right choice for YOU.

Cheers,
 

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
I have to agree with Jack. I have clearly stayed out of these discussions since I have not bought one yet but used all three numerous times. I posted here and its painfully obvious to me that I can't talk openly about any of them on what decisions i need to make for myself. Folks this brand war **** needs to end and end today. This does NO one any good as we ALL have different needs and wants not to mention different budgets. Also i am just going to say this because that is who i am is a very honest blunt person. If i can't talk openly on my own forum than we have a very serious problem because I could not be any more neutral on this particular subject but i certainly want to hear of each system so I can make my own choices , now just think of the guy that is just starting out in my same shoes. He's dead before he even starts to read these threads. We need the push for one brand over the other to stop and also our commercial venders to stay within the context of the specs. of each brand. I say this because lately I have been cringing here reading some of the posts. Not sure this is the GetDPI way in my heart.

Also GetDPI is a completely different forum than many out there, keep reminding yourself of that PLEASE
 

Jack

Sr. Administrator
Staff member
To Guy's last point, what we really want is to be a credible resource on ALL gear choices for our readers, not an arena of debate.
 

kdphotography

Well-known member
....Also GetDPI is a completely different forum than many out there, keep reminding yourself of that PLEASE
Don't need to remind me, Guy. Any self-respecting enabler knows that it's all about that warm feeling inside from the new acquisition of any/all medium format digital platforms and/or mfdb and related accessories.... and sharing those experiences...

:D

ken
 

jlm

Workshop Member
i hadn't seen it as a brand war. quite a bit of brand specific info has been presented
 

Don Libby

Well-known member
i hadn't seen it as a brand war. quite a bit of brand specific info has been presented

I'm in agreement.

Unless I missed something I fail to see where this has turned into a war of who has the best. What I have seen is a discussion clarifying the various merits of the systems. I feel most will agree that there is simply not one size fits all system of any type.

This thread was started by an individual stating the reasons why his system works best for him. The follow-up has been for the most a civil discussion of the original thoughts as well as additional clarification of the many ideas shared.

I feel that should this same thread have been on any other forum the result would have been much different. Kudos to the great family and friends here at GetDpi.
 

Don Libby

Well-known member
Don the Cambo is very good and why I will probably buy it. We have to remember it's much cheaper to buy the Cambo too. With that the build is very good but if you want a milling engineers dream than Arca and Alpa have that but they do cost more. In the end I would say Arca gets the tilt since it's on the body and ALL lenses. Alpa gets the size and nice feel ( I want small too). The Cambo rides the middle it can functionally do what both can at a better body price. I like all three to be honest and I also have not bought anything yet and I'm going though my general points of my homework for myself. I want to buy a body not extra options also. BTW I like shooting the Cambo but I have no allegiance to any of them. I'm just looking for a functional tool I can work with and the cost is low. Someone wants me to be there poster child than send me one. Its just that simple. There all over hyped in marketing so what else is new. People love there Alpa's and Arca's great, I just want something that works functionally for me and gives me what I need at a good cost. Put any name on it, it certainly won't matter to me at all. I don't buy names I buy working gear that I hope is bullet proof.

I should add for clarity on which models I am comparing against for myself the Arca RM3D the Alpa STC and the WRS. I know some models can do more things like the Alpa Max and some less like the RM2D which is another one I like for the size but no Tilt.
Guy - thanks for the clarification in your response. I've heard similar and felt that it needed to be clarified.

When I researched going to a tech camera it was down to Cambo and another company with Cambo winning out for several points. I've found that while Cambo is less expensive it nevertheless offers (me) system that is well manufactured, precise and durable for what I need it to do.

I like the looks of the Arca as well as the Alpa and Linhof systems. I'm a huge gear slut and proud of it. As soon as the WRS stops working for me I'll jump ship to something that will sooner than a rat jumping off a burning ship.

Take a good look around - who else has been discussing the pros and cons of using a tech camera like we here have? I feel we offer much more information in one place than any other forum.

Off the soapbox and back to work...


Don
 

cs750

Member
I agree with Don I have not felt this thread as being too much in the direction of a brand war. I am currently contemplating the purchase of a techical camera system, and have found these threads quite helpful. I do think it is good to be cautious about not letting "my brand is better than yours creep it", and to stress the great strengths technical cameras have to offer to some who are inclined in that direction. Hopefully, the cautionary concerns will be taken in that light, but not be repressive on constructive comment. This thread has helped me remain open minded as I continue my pursuit of this topic, and yet placed emphasis on the best traditions of GetDpi. Charles
 

PeterA

Well-known member
We all have a responsibility to maintain the cutlure of the forum as it was originally established. Both Jack and Guy have worked hard to foster a good culture in here and have many good people interested in participating in the forums.

I am sure we are all better off being able to access and tap into a broad range of experience in the forum - I know I am!

There are differences however in the ability of people to access and choose depending on where in the world they live and which companies/dealers represent particular products in those countries.

Something that is often overlooked in these discussions.

Personally I find it interesting to note that products from Sinar do not feature highly in the forum - but I suspect that Sinar is not well represenrted in the US.

Other forums with a more European participant bias show Sinar much more prominently than in GetDpi for example.

Only a few years ago - very ( very) few in here had heard of Alpa or understood the advantages of using a MFD back on one of these cameras matched to Schneider or Rodenstock - today there are a lot more users and a lot more knowledge.

People should take into account local differences in terms of availability and service and price in the total value equaiton. What is a no brainer in the US may be the direct opposite in Australia - because of local pricing servicing differences.

I can understand the strong Phase One brand in the US amongst hobby or serious amatuer users - you are fortunate to be able to access a number of high quality high service capability dealers over there - however in many other countries the same does not apply. So other choices have to be made and are made.

IF we are talking a level playing field with currency adjusted same pricing and availability for all products - ie a true global market many discussions would be different - I am sure.

Regarding this discussion - my view is that the Sinar artec is easilly the best system for me ( which means you guys are silly considering anythign eklse!!! :poke:) Since I just ordered one and it is on its way into my hot little sweaty hands - I would say that wouldnt I?:D:ROTFL:

It isnt about the photograph by teh way - it is about the FUN!
 

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
Peter well said actually and very correct as well. The US and Europe and such have very different service , support and sales not to mention product preferences. For example Hassy and Phase are a big part of the US market, Sinar is not but a very favorite brand in Europe for example. So yes even though this forum is pretty diverse in where folks are from it does have a slight slant more to US market. Also I should have brought up the marketing plays a big role. We just don't hear about every product. Lets say lighting for example. Profoto is obviously the biggest brand but there is Broncolor, Balcar etc as well. Although they all sell in the US , Profoto seems to have the biggest share here.

Great observations.

BTW I WANT full review posted within 1 week on the on your Artec. ROTFLMAO

Good luck my friend
 

Christopher

Active member
The Sinar arctec is really nice and I considered buying it for a long time. It's just not the best tool for me. ( limited lens choice and more important if it hasn't changed, the tripod mount is not centered.)
 

PeterA

Well-known member
Guy - totally agree on marketing of ALL sorts of products. Dont get me started on the prices we have to pay down here for profoto or bronocolor!! and I PROMISE I will do a full review of teh artec for the forum.

Christopher - totally agree on the issue of uncentered tripod positioning - it was anegative factor I thought lond hard on - because the work around for panned nodal type panorams will require teh use of additonal slides from RRS or someone to get nodal point swivel..

However my main interest is in rectlinear stitched panorams anyway - I am no big fan of the curved look of typical panorams.
 
However my main interest is in rectlinear stitched panorams anyway - I am no big fan of the curved look of typical panorams.
Peter, you should also try autopano, planar mode is quite remarkable. I can't wait to try stiching a few recliner panos with no quality loss and then run those through auto pano!!

Paul
 

lance_schad

Workshop Member
While we are on the Arca-Swiss subject, Rod Klukas will be visiting us here at Digital Transitions in NYC this Friday, July 15.

We are planning to go out and do some shooting around the city, possibly at The Highline .

If any members would like to come along we will have a R3Mdi/IQ180 and variety of lenses.

Woody is planning on coming along too and I am sure he will have his ALPA with hims as well.

Please let me know if your in the area and I can share the details with you.

Would be great to get to meet more NY members and allow you to handle the gear we are discussing.

Looking forward to it.

Lance
email me
 

David Klepacki

New member
Hi Lance,

Are you saying that you will actually have RM3di units for sale there, on the spot? Or will you and Rod just take orders for the camera for people to wait? BTW, Rod took my order for an Rm3di 8 weeks ago, and I am still waiting for it.

David
 

lance_schad

Workshop Member
Hi Lance,

Are you saying that you will actually have RM3di units for sale there, on the spot? Or will you and Rod just take orders for the camera for people to wait? BTW, Rod took my order for an Rm3di 8 weeks ago, and I am still waiting for it.

David
It is ONE of our demo units that we ordered a while ago that is being delivered this week. Even though Arca-Swiss has better representation now here in the US they need to start working on their delivery times. I am hoping that we get our additional Arca-Swiss gear prior to them taking vacation next month (similar to other European suppliers!).

Lance
 

vjbelle

Well-known member
The fact that the Arca-Swiss has a built in Helical could be a tipping factor for me. I have seen evidence of too many lenses from both Alpa and Cambo that show misalignment - enough so that at f11 the sharpness from left to right does not match. A contributor to this could be the helical and if Arca manufactures the built in helical to very tight tolerances that potential misalignment would/could be eliminated. I have not seen any images from an Arca so all of this is conjecture at this point. My interest, though, is piqued.

Victor
 
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