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Thread: Article on Phase IQ 180 on german Photoscala.de

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    Senior Member Stefan Steib's Avatar
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    Article on Phase IQ 180 on german Photoscala.de

    Quite interesting review of the IQ180 written by Anders Uschold - who is a Optics and Digitalphoto testengineer/specialist here in Germany:

    http://photoscala.de/Artikel/TestPra...-von-Phase-One

    for those who need this in English - try the google translate-it´s sometimes funny reading but you will get the point.

    http://translate.google.de/translate...-von-Phase-One

    Interesting are his findings about dynamics.....

    Greetings from Munich

    Stefan
    because photography is more than technology - and " as we have done this all the time "
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    Re: Article on Phase IQ 180 on german Photoscala.de

    Sorry, but this alonw kills the whole test "Hinweis: Die folgenden Aussagen und Auswertungen beziehen sich auf mit den Standardeinstellungen in Capture One 6 entwickelte JPEG-Fotos. Mit einer anderen Abstimmung in Capture One oder einem anderer RAW-Konverter können die Entwicklungs-Ergebnisse auch anders gewichtet ausfallen. Etwa: Weniger Rauschen, dafür aber auch weniger Auflösung."

    I says so much as the test was done by converting the files to JPG without any editing. Or one could say it is like throwing aways most of the data.

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    Senior Member Stefan Steib's Avatar
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    Re: Article on Phase IQ 180 on german Photoscala.de

    Hi Christopher

    right, but he also writes that using these differing settings the resolution will go down - the standard settings are optimized for a maximum resolution.
    It´s a bit like a table cloth that does not completely cover the table, if you pull one corner to cover, the other one will get uncovered.

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    Stefan
    because photography is more than technology - and " as we have done this all the time "
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    Re: Article on Phase IQ 180 on german Photoscala.de

    He is wrong. Resolution has very little to do with dynamic range. I can certainly keep the same Resolution in my IQ180 shots and optimize the DR a lot. I don't think the standard settings are optimized very well. Way to much sharpening lot's of DR wasted.

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    Senior Member Stefan Steib's Avatar
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    Re: Article on Phase IQ 180 on german Photoscala.de

    Hi Christopher

    Sorry here you err completely. see wikipedias definition of optical resolution

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Optical_resolution

    which per se is also valid for a digital recording system of that information:

    >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
    Measuring optical resolution

    A variety of measurement systems are available, and use may depend upon the system being tested.
    Typical test charts for Contrast Transfer Function (CTF) consist of repeated bar patterns (see Discussion below). The limiting resolution is measured by determining the smallest group of bars, both vertically and horizontally, for which the correct number of bars can be seen. By calculating the contrast between the black and white areas at several different frequencies, however, points of the CTF can be determined with the contrast equation.

    where
    Cmax is the normalized value of the maximum (for example, the voltage or grey value of the white area)Cmin is the normalized value of the minimum (for example, the voltage or grey value of the black area) When the system can no longer resolve the bars, the black and white areas have the same value, so Contrast = 0. At very low spatial frequencies, Cmax = 1 and Cmin = 0 so Modulation = 1. Some modulation may be seen above the limiting resolution; these may be aliased and phase-reversed.
    When using other methods, including the interferogram, sinusoid, and the edge in the ISO 12233 target, it is possible to compute the entire MTF curve. The response to the edge is similar to a step response, and the Fourier Transform of the first difference of the step response yields the MTF.
    >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

    So contrast (which is another word for dynamic range if you want to call it like this) is used to measure resolution !


    What you mean is visual improvement of dynamic range , but this ALWAYS lowers resolution by using Imaging algorythms that take information from one part of the resolved data set to compute it into another visible information (which as 80MPix do have plenty of reserve - used with the right lenses - may not be visible at first).
    these transformations are also lossy - so there is no such thing as a free improvement in one area, most of the time you even cut off information
    (see Histogramm after applying Photoshop Gradation). This does not change if you do it in 16 Bit raw processing (C1), it´s only less obvious.



    Regards
    Stefan
    Last edited by Stefan Steib; 22nd August 2011 at 04:36. Reason: Grammar ;-)
    because photography is more than technology - and " as we have done this all the time "
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    Subscriber Member jotloob's Avatar
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    Re: Article on Phase IQ 180 on german Photoscala.de

    Quote Originally Posted by Christopher View Post
    . . . .
    Die folgenden Aussagen und Auswertungen beziehen sich auf mit den Standardeinstellungen in Capture One 6 entwickelte JPEG-Fotos. Mit einer anderen Abstimmung in Capture One oder einem anderer RAW-Konverter können die Entwicklungs-Ergebnisse auch anders gewichtet ausfallen. . . .

    Or you could also say :
    Wenn der Hahn kräht auf dem Mist , ändert sich das Wetter , oder es bleibt wie es ist .
    I do love such statements .
    Regards . Jürgen .
    -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

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    Subscriber Member jotloob's Avatar
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    Re: Article on Phase IQ 180 on german Photoscala.de

    Sorry for the german words , but I just could not resist .
    Regards . Jürgen .
    -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

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    Senior Member Thierry's Avatar
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    Re: Article on Phase IQ 180 on german Photoscala.de

    At least there are a few here understanding it!



    Thierry

    Quote Originally Posted by jotloob View Post
    Sorry for the german words , but I just could not resist .
    Thierry Hagenauer
    [email protected]

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    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: Article on Phase IQ 180 on german Photoscala.de

    I think it reads Guys gets a free Alpa STC.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

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    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: Article on Phase IQ 180 on german Photoscala.de

    OT but I'll ask anyway Thierry does Alpa still make the SWA
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

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    Senior Member Stefan Steib's Avatar
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    Re: Article on Phase IQ 180 on german Photoscala.de

    Hallo Jürgen

    Passt schon......... - Stimmt aber nicht.
    It´s OK - but it doesn´t fit.

    To save a file in JPG does not mean you are losing any visible information against a Tiff especially if you take into account that in reality digital camera chips are only taking/processing/reaching about 6 bit of data for distinguishable steps of signal processing.It is lossy but JPEG is by far good enough to represent this on a monitor or a print.
    So what would have been different if Anders Uschold would have saved the files to Tif ? Nothing. His statements will nevertheless stay valid.

    Grüße aus München
    Stefan
    because photography is more than technology - and " as we have done this all the time "
    facebook:hcam.de - www.hcam.de - www.hartblei.de

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    Senior Member Thierry's Avatar
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    Re: Article on Phase IQ 180 on german Photoscala.de

    Guy, as soon as it is about new gear, you could understand any language!



    Yes, the SWA is still produced:

    Alpa 12 SWA

    Best
    Thierry

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Mancuso View Post
    I think it reads Guys gets a free Alpa STC.
    Thierry Hagenauer
    [email protected]

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    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: Article on Phase IQ 180 on german Photoscala.de

    LOL. You got that right. Thanks was not sure if the STC actually replaced it or just a addition to the line.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

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