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Thread: Decisions on very wide side

  1. #51
    Natasa Stojsic
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    Re: Decisions on very wide side

    Quote Originally Posted by carbonmetrictree View Post
    Guy,

    Let me know what you feel about the lenses. I decided on the 28HR because it was in the middle of the two, but I really wish I could have the 24XL. It's just that I want to start out with only one lens for now, it was a very tough decision, considering I shoot most of my personal work with super wide lenses and my architectural work with a little longer lenses.
    Andrew, even though I feel 24XL will become my favorite lens, I don't think you made a mistake
    28HR is very nice lens

  2. #52
    carbonmetrictree
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    Re: Decisions on very wide side

    The only issue I have with it is the weight compared to the 24XL or the 35XL, maybe I won't have to sign up for the gym after all!

    Quote Originally Posted by Natasa Stojsic View Post
    Andrew, even though I feel 24XL will become my favorite lens, I don't think you made a mistake
    28HR is very nice lens

  3. #53
    thsinar
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    Re: Decisions on very wide side

    The Rodenstock 28 HR has the advantage that it can be shot wide open at f4 without centerfilter and still sharp till the corners. The 24 XL has to be stopped down.
    The (official) shift given is pretty conservative and you can easily go a few mm more in shifts, without significant loss of sharpness.
    The imace circle is bigger than the 24 and does cover bigger 645 sensors with STILL some 3/4mm shift.

    Best regards,
    Thierry

    Quote Originally Posted by carbonmetrictree View Post
    Guy,

    Let me know what you feel about the lenses. I decided on the 28HR because it was in the middle of the two, but I really wish I could have the 24XL. It's just that I want to start out with only one lens for now, it was a very tough decision, considering I shoot most of my personal work with super wide lenses and my architectural work with a little longer lenses.

  4. #54
    Natasa Stojsic
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    Re: Decisions on very wide side

    Quote Originally Posted by carbonmetrictree View Post
    The only issue I have with it is the weight compared to the 24XL or the 35XL, maybe I won't have to sign up for the gym after all!
    To be honest, I thought mounting 28HR on on ALPA TC looked a little bulky and awkward.... but 24XL looked just right!!! Let's hope we'll make enough money so you can buy 24XL and I can add 28HR

    One more detail in addition to what Thierry said is... with ALPA TC+24XL setup is that it doesn't balance/feel naturally/safely when you mount it on a tripod or removing it... there's always this risk of slipping through your hands because 24XL is so tiny and on the other side of the camera you have DB weight to deal with....

    So I think 28HR being heavier will balance better, at least that is my experience

  5. #55
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: Decisions on very wide side

    Thanks Theirry I do like the 28mm focal length better myself which is about a 21mm in the FF DSLR arena. The center filter on the 24mm effectively does cut 2 stops which will be a issue with strobe and may have to do multiple pops. Great info folks. This obviously is a tough area in MF and also a very expensive one , so discussions about all the options are awesome. We have talked very little about these special lenses that are out there and this is something we should be engaged in. Obviously on our normal MF mirrored camera's we do hit some limitations in optical design and such when we get very wide and really only two 28mm lenses on the market from Mamiya and Hassy. With these lenses we have several bodies to attach them too. Alpa , Cambo, Horseman , Sinar, Arca Swiss and Silvestri. They are all not cheap so making a smart decision is very important at least to my wallet it is. LOL
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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  6. #56
    carbonmetrictree
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    Re: Decisions on very wide side

    Thierry and Natasa, I'm glad to see that I made the right decision. What is the maximum shift I could possibly do with the 28HR while keeping the image intact? I'd most definitely use the 24XL on the TC for my experimental work, I don't need shifts since most of my work relies on dramatic angles.

    Sorry for hijacking your thread, Guy. But I hope all of this is helping you get closer towards a decision!

  7. #57
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: Decisions on very wide side

    Andrew this is great info all of it. No such thing as hijacking a thread , Great info is great info.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

  8. #58
    thsinar
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    Re: Decisions on very wide side

    12/13 mm with the 28 HR at f4

    Thierry

    Quote Originally Posted by carbonmetrictree View Post
    What is the maximum shift I could possibly do with the 28HR while keeping the image intact?

  9. #59
    carbonmetrictree
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    Re: Decisions on very wide side

    Thanks Thierry!

    Guy - I've been on some incredibly sensitive forums before, didn't want to step on anyone's toes (or Alpa's for that matter)

  10. #60
    Workshop Member lance_schad's Avatar
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    Re: Decisions on very wide side

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Mancuso View Post
    Thanks Theirry I do like the 28mm focal length better myself which is about a 21mm in the FF DSLR arena. The center filter on the 24mm effectively does cut 2 stops which will be a issue with strobe and may have to do multiple pops. Great info folks. This obviously is a tough area in MF and also a very expensive one , so discussions about all the options are awesome. We have talked very little about these special lenses that are out there and this is something we should be engaged in. Obviously on our normal MF mirrored camera's we do hit some limitations in optical design and such when we get very wide and really only two 28mm lenses on the market from Mamiya and Hassy. With these lenses we have several bodies to attach them too. Alpa , Cambo, Horseman , Sinar, Arca Swiss and Silvestri. They are all not cheap so making a smart decision is very important at least to my wallet it is. LOL
    Guy,
    You may want to use the multi-pop exposure box to do multiple pops of your strobes to build up your exposure.
    Here is the description and article that Jeff Totaro wrote about it on our website:

    http://www.captureintegration.com/20...ple-exposures/

    Lance Schad
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  11. #61
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: Decisions on very wide side

    That sounds nice Lance, let me know what that would cost. I like the idea it does the wake up for you
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

  12. #62
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: Decisions on very wide side

    Hmmm my 35mm Mamiya lens looks pretty damn good as the focal length
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

  13. #63
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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  14. #64
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: Decisions on very wide side

    Maybe the Schnieder Apo digitar 5.6 XL. Says the highest resolution and best distortion.

    Rodenstock HR 35mm F4 looks nice also and no center filter.

    Do you need center filter on the Schnieder apo does not recommend it like the other 35mm lens

    Switar looks nice with 72mm filter built in. But it does recommend center filter.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

  15. #65
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    Re: Decisions on very wide side

    It seems like the key is if you intend to use it handheld, or if you will have it on a tripod all the time. If on a tripod, lack of distortion and sharpness are more important than lens speed and vignetting (you can use the center filter and the f/11 base aperture). If you need to use it handheld or don't have the ability to create a lot of light, then the faster lenses without the need for the center filter should be a better buy, as they give you 3 stops of real speed (1 stop faster and don't require the 2 stop filter), and I imagine they don't give up TOO much sharpness and distortion to get there.
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  16. #66
    carbonmetrictree
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    Re: Decisions on very wide side

    I'd go with the 35mm Apo Digitar XL, I've heard great things about that lens from a friend who has an extensive set of Alpa gear.

  17. #67
    Natasa Stojsic
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    Re: Decisions on very wide side

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Mancuso View Post
    Maybe the Schnieder Apo digitar 5.6 XL. Says the highest resolution and best distortion.

    Rodenstock HR 35mm F4 looks nice also and no center filter.

    Do you need center filter on the Schnieder apo does not recommend it like the other 35mm lens

    Switar looks nice with 72mm filter built in. But it does recommend center filter.
    Guy, I didn't need filter for Schneider Apo-Digitar 5.6/35 mm XL but 35HR is again very good lens too... faster but smaller circle though!!!

    Worst case scenario... I can see myself buying 28HR next to 24XL but not 35HR next to 35XL of course unless I win national lottery

  18. #68
    Sr. Administrator Jack's Avatar
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    Re: Decisions on very wide side

    If you want wide, go W I D E... You have the 35 for the Mamiya, so get the 24 for the Alpa and be done with it!

    Jack
    home: www.getdpi.com

    "Perfection is not attainable. But if we chase perfection, we can catch excellence."

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    Re: Decisions on very wide side

    I second Jack's motion. You have the 35 focal length covered with your Mamiya and from what you have shown it is a really good lens.

    You have stressed that you want the Alpa for WIDE. So go WIDE and get the 24 (or perhaps the 28, I don't know enough about Alpa to be sure although i believe Peter A mentioned that the image circle of the 24 was such that it was harder to do stitching.

    Woody

  20. #70
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: Decisions on very wide side

    Yea i know just exploring all these options.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

  21. #71
    Workshop Member lance_schad's Avatar
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    Re: Decisions on very wide side

    Go with the 24mm on the TC. You do not have the capabilities for movements on that system anyway. Like Jack said you have a 35 on your Mamiya.
    You definitely need the center filter with that lens.
    You can also always crop in.
    It is probably the sharpest lense I have ever shot with!
    The Multi-Pop box is $229 plus s&h.
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  22. #72
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: Decisions on very wide side

    Lance bring one to the lighting workshop for me . I want a Pop box. LOL
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

  23. #73
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    Re: Decisions on very wide side

    The 24 is one of those 'special' lenses - it is wide.

  24. #74
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: Decisions on very wide side

    Peter you need to fly into Florida and come to the workshop. We would love to have ya and besides i can play with your Alpa lenses.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

  25. #75
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    Re: Decisions on very wide side

    Couldnt think of anything nicer Guy - am taking 10 days off next week and going up to Far North = your South - for some much needed SUN. Sadly though I am up to my neck managing these melting markets and the real world...so no can do as much as I would love to meet up with all my pals...

  26. #76
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: Decisions on very wide side

    I understand totally .
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

  27. #77
    Senior Member JimCollum's Avatar
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    Re: Decisions on very wide side

    did some informal playing around at my uncle's house with the Horseman.

    This time was just with natural light (no strobes). some samples of how wide you can go.


    center 35mm Rodenstock shot




    color changes in the walls are due to reflection from artwork, rugs and windows. The next step is to take strobes and see how clean i can get them


    fully shifted in all directions







    i'll add more as i process them

    jim

  28. #78
    Senior Member JimCollum's Avatar
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    Re: Decisions on very wide side

    35mm lens, single frame





    shifted full in all directions...






    100% crop (didn't do any sharpening for this image... was taken at f16 for DOF)




    haven't done any curves processing on it either.. pretty much straight shots
    Last edited by JimCollum; 27th August 2008 at 01:26.

  29. #79
    Senior Member JimCollum's Avatar
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    Re: Decisions on very wide side

    nothing scientific (ie mathematical)... but i shot the 35mm shifted fully 17mm in each direction) today along side of a D3 and the 14-24 lens. I was getting almost exactly the same field of view as 14mm on the D3

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