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Thread: New Sinar Hy6-65 Camera System (31 MPx) Announced

  1. #1
    thsinar
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    New Sinar Hy6-65 Camera System (31 MPx) Announced

    For your information:

    Sinar has announced today a new integrated MF digital camera system, the Sinar Hy6-65 (31 MPx) and a new camera + digital back, the Sinar Hy6 - s65r.

    The main characteristics:

    1. Sinar Hy6-65

    - Fully Integrated MF camera system: with optimized communication between lens, camera body, digital engine, and software.

    - On-Board image processing with internal "QuadCore Image Processing" (QCIP technology): First digital medium format cameras with completely integrated digital image processing on board.

    - Future-oriented data storage: The high-speed data transfer of the Sinar Hy6 65 and Sinar Hy6-s65r allows for capturing images at fast capturing rates and storing them to CF card in RAW, DNG, and JPEG format or a combination of them .

    JPEG images can be stored in four different file sizes and two compression rates. Thus, one is able to send low-resolution JPEGs to the art director or agency immediately after the shooting and process the selected high-resolution images later on.

    - 3" bright display with 640 x 480 pixels (280 ppi), with automatic menu orientation, Images, histogram, sensitivity, on-board exposure warning, memory status, white balance.

    - File size: 60 MB (DNG and Sinar RAW 16 bit), 181/90 MB (TIFF 48/24 bit)

    - Capture rate: 1 image / sec.

    - White Balance: Automatic, presets, manual.

    - Data storage: High-Speed CF Card (4 GB UDMA CF card included),
    alternatively also directly on hard disk via Firewire.

    - Active cooling: ventilator.

    - Power supply: one (two also possible) rechargeable lithium-ion battery 7.2 V, 2200 mAh.

    - Operating time with battery: up to approx. 2000 exposures.

    - Firewire interface: IEEE 1394b (800 Mbps, compatible with IEEE 1394a 400 Mbps).

    - Capturing software: Sinar eXposure™ 6.1 or later.

    - Operating systems: Mac OS X as of 10.4.11, Windows XP as of Service Pack 2, Windows Vista as of Service Pack 1.

    - Availability/Delivery: as per September 23rd 2008

    2. Sinar Hy6-s65r

    - Same as above, but the camera digital back can be used on any other common MF camera with the corresponding adapter interface (Sinar m, Hasselblad V 500 series, Hasselblad H1/H2, Mamiya 645 AFD/AFD II).

    - Revolving Digital Back on the Sinar Hy6.

    - Power supply: Two rechargeable lithium-ion batteries 7.2 V, 2200 mAh, for long-lasting operation.

    - Live Video

    - - Availability/Delivery: as per September 23rd 2008

    3. Sinarback eSprit 65

    - Single MF digital back, 31 MPx.

    - Technical features: same as described above.

    - Availability/Delivery: as per September 23rd 2008

    Remarks:

    - I have purposely not mentioned the ISO range of the above mentioned digital camera system and digital back, since I have no definitive information about it yet. I shall inform as soon I have it.

    - Prices available at Photokina.

    Here however some first images of these new products:
    Last edited by thsinar; 29th August 2008 at 01:27.

  2. #2
    Super Duper
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    Re: New Sinar Hy6-65 Camera System (31 MPx) Announced

    WOW!

    Now Sinar is talkin' my language

    BEAUTIFUL !

    Lots of questions, but we'll wait to see what questions others ask

  3. #3
    Senior Member Graham Mitchell's Avatar
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    Re: New Sinar Hy6-65 Camera System (31 MPx) Announced

    Hi Thierry, it looks as if the back colour scheme matches the camera now. Is that right?

    There are some welcome new features here - will there be a similar Hy6-s54r and Hy6-s75r in time? Is there still built-in memory as with past backs? What does the image processor do exactly - just handling the JPEG conversions?

  4. #4
    thsinar
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    Re: New Sinar Hy6-65 Camera System (31 MPx) Announced

    hi Graham,

    yes, we have "got" it (with your help and the poll on another forum)!

    It seems that I have succeeded to convince that a camera is black, and even that accessories (back) are black, and that they should match.



    Best regards,
    Thierry


    Quote Originally Posted by foto-z View Post
    Hi Thierry, it looks as if the back colour scheme matches the camera now. Is that right?

    There are some welcome new features here - will there be a similar Hy6-s54r and Hy6-s75r in time? Is there still built-in memory as with past backs? What does the image processor do exactly - just handling the JPEG conversions?

  5. #5
    thsinar
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    Re: New Sinar Hy6-65 Camera System (31 MPx) Announced

    Graham,

    - there is no longer an internal hard-state memory: it is all shooting on high-speed CF cards (or tethered with FW).

    - The eMotion 54 LV and 75 LV will not be available with this new 3" display, there are no talks about it: the eMotion 54 LV has probably reached the end of its life cycle, and the eMotion 75 LV has already got an improved display with higher resolution recently (though not 3").

    However, both backs, the eMotion 54 LV and the eMotion 75 LV are available as Sinar Hy6 "r" version (with revolving adapter).

    - The image processor does on one hand handle the file format written internally (DNG or JPG), but it is my knowledge that it is also used to apply other parameters to the file: more when I have the information in detail.

    Best regards,
    Thierry

    Quote Originally Posted by foto-z View Post
    There are some welcome new features here - will there be a similar Hy6-s54r and Hy6-s75r in time? Is there still built-in memory as with past backs? What does the image processor do exactly - just handling the JPEG conversions?

  6. #6
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: New Sinar Hy6-65 Camera System (31 MPx) Announced

    I'm a little confused sorry but I have to ask. So the HY6-65 is a completely new body with a dedicated 65 back that is a all in one setup. Like a Hassy H31

    Than a separate s65r back only that say i could use on my Mamiya . Same back different mounts

    Than here is my real confusion espirit 65 single. Is this a single shot back that can use different mounts and the 65 back is a multi shot back. Could you explain that a little better in less technical terms. Sounds very interesting
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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  7. #7
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: New Sinar Hy6-65 Camera System (31 MPx) Announced

    Next question would be are these crop sensors like the P30 Plus and H 31 with no micro lenses or with micro lenses. Dalsa or Kodak.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

  8. #8
    thsinar
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    Re: New Sinar Hy6-65 Camera System (31 MPx) Announced

    Morning Guy,

    You are not as much confused as I am!


    Seriously, to answer:

    - the Sinar Hy6 body is EXACTLY the same. Only the interface (which is fix and cannot accept adapters) and the communication (FW) of this "Sinar Hy6 - 65" are different.

    - Yes, a separate eSprit 65 back, single shot, with this time possibility to adapt it to either the Sinar Hy6, called then Hy6 - s65r ("r" means with revolving adapter, the "s" stands for eSprit), or to the other branded platforms indicated in my post. This back is single shot only.

    I hope I could clarify?

    Thanks and best regards,
    Thierry

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Mancuso View Post
    I'm a little confused sorry but I have to ask. So the HY6-65 is a completely new body with a dedicated 65 back that is a all in one setup. Like a Hassy H31

    Than a separate s65r back only that say i could use on my Mamiya . Same back different mounts

    Than here is my real confusion espirit 65 single. Is this a single shot back that can use different mounts and the 65 back is a multi shot back. Could you explain that a little better in less technical terms. Sounds very interesting

  9. #9
    thsinar
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    Re: New Sinar Hy6-65 Camera System (31 MPx) Announced

    same sensor as the one used by others:

    - Kodak KAF31600CE CCD with full-frame technology and microlenses
    - 44x33mm


    Best regards,
    Thierry

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Mancuso View Post
    Next question would be are these crop sensors like the P30 Plus and H 31 with no micro lenses or with micro lenses. Dalsa or Kodak.

  10. #10
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: New Sinar Hy6-65 Camera System (31 MPx) Announced

    Thanks Thierry that helped so same framing let's call it to simplify as the P30 and H31 framing and basically the same sensor but with added features and such. Sounds very promising. This is a hot area it seems the 31mpx sensor, glad to see Sinar jump in this area also, gives us yet another great option in the market. For the end user a pretty big battleground on the 31mpx area with hopefully great pricing to boot. Look forward to it
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

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    Re: New Sinar Hy6-65 Camera System (31 MPx) Announced

    Quote Originally Posted by thsinar View Post
    .....the communication (FW) of this "Sinar Hy6 - 65" are different......
    How is it different, Thierry?

  12. #12
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: New Sinar Hy6-65 Camera System (31 MPx) Announced

    Thierry when Press releases and such are available could you please post links to them. Thanks . Photokinia is looking pretty good this year
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

  13. #13
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: New Sinar Hy6-65 Camera System (31 MPx) Announced

    Quote Originally Posted by BJNY View Post
    How is it different, Thierry?
    Sounds like lens data will be feed into the software for corrections and such. But i will let Theirry explain this one
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

  14. #14
    Senior Member Graham Mitchell's Avatar
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    Re: New Sinar Hy6-65 Camera System (31 MPx) Announced

    Quote Originally Posted by thsinar View Post
    - The image processor does on one hand handle the file format written internally (DNG or JPG),
    So DNG now replaces IA and BR files straight from the camera?

  15. #15
    thsinar
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    Re: New Sinar Hy6-65 Camera System (31 MPx) Announced

    you kill me, Billy!


    seriously: I have no precise details yet, but I assume that it is somehow controlled by the internal FW.

    Best regards,
    Thierry


    Quote Originally Posted by BJNY View Post
    How is it different, Thierry?

  16. #16
    thsinar
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    Re: New Sinar Hy6-65 Camera System (31 MPx) Announced

    I will.

    Thierry

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Mancuso View Post
    Thierry when Press releases and such are available could you please post links to them. Thanks . Photokinia is looking pretty good this year

  17. #17
    thsinar
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    Re: New Sinar Hy6-65 Camera System (31 MPx) Announced

    Yes, partly correct, Graham:

    I have actually posted a little mistake in my post, but cannot edit to correct it anymore.

    - The Sinar Hy6 - 65 writes either DNGs, JPGs or the 2 together, with 4 different sizes for the JPGs and 2 different compressions for the DNGs

    - There is the option to have the Sinar RAWs (the .IA and .BR files) out of the eSprit 65 back, and thus out of the Sinar Hy6 - s65r system

    Sorry if there is any confusion.

    Best regards,
    Thierry



    Quote Originally Posted by foto-z View Post
    So DNG now replaces IA and BR files straight from the camera?

  18. #18
    Senior Member Graham Mitchell's Avatar
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    Re: New Sinar Hy6-65 Camera System (31 MPx) Announced

    No confusion any more

  19. #19
    Senior Member Graham Mitchell's Avatar
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    Re: New Sinar Hy6-65 Camera System (31 MPx) Announced

    Quote Originally Posted by thsinar View Post
    hi Graham,

    yes, we have "got" it (with your help and the poll on another forum)!

    It seems that I have succeeded to convince that a camera is black, and even that accessories (back) are black, and that they should match.
    That's excellent news!

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    Re: New Sinar Hy6-65 Camera System (31 MPx) Announced

    I'm confused
    FW=FireWire or FW=Firmware ?

  21. #21
    thsinar
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    Re: New Sinar Hy6-65 Camera System (31 MPx) Announced

    Sorry, FW = Firmware

    Thierry

    Quote Originally Posted by BJNY View Post
    I'm confused
    FW=FireWire or FW=Firmware ?

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    Re: New Sinar Hy6-65 Camera System (31 MPx) Announced

    Quote Originally Posted by thsinar View Post
    you kill me, Billy!
    What?! No wireless to iPhone...pfft!

  23. #23
    thsinar
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    Re: New Sinar Hy6-65 Camera System (31 MPx) Announced

    http://luminous-landscape.com/forum/...howtopic=27547




    Quote Originally Posted by BJNY View Post
    What?! No wireless to iPhone...pfft!

  24. #24
    thsinar
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    Re: New Sinar Hy6-65 Camera System (31 MPx) Announced

    Just as a side-note:

    I might be cut-off, with the current (political) events going on in Bangkok: the situation is worsening hour by hour and they speak about cutting electricity.

    So if you don't "hear" from me anymore, you know that I am sitting in the dark. And then any "wireless communication to iPhone" will be of no help at all.



    FYI:

    http://www.nationmultimedia.com/

    and

    http://www.bangkokpost.com/pad_mass_...ss_protest.php

    Best regards,
    Thierry

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    Re: New Sinar Hy6-65 Camera System (31 MPx) Announced

    Thierry I have not read the news yet but road trip sounds like something you may want to consider like right now.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

  26. #26
    Senior Member Graham Mitchell's Avatar
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    Re: New Sinar Hy6-65 Camera System (31 MPx) Announced

    I hope you and the family stay safe, Thierry. You all have a place to stay in Estonia any time if things get really bad. I have to warn you though, the fridge is empty

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    Re: New Sinar Hy6-65 Camera System (31 MPx) Announced

    Okay read the news , GET THE HELL OUT OF THERE
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

  28. #28
    Super Duper
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    Re: New Sinar Hy6-65 Camera System (31 MPx) Announced

    So it's a Kodak sensor like that of the H3D-II/31 and Phase One P30+.

    That is very exciting news IMHO. I'll be very interested in the ISO info when available ... but it should be decent.

    Sounds like a very fast camera to use with the Schneider AF glass.

    Congrats to Sinar.

    (Gee, the design looks exactly like the one I did in that previous thread ... including the extended bright metal strip across to the back itself

  29. #29
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: New Sinar Hy6-65 Camera System (31 MPx) Announced

    I think a free back is in order Marc, don't you. LOL
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

  30. #30
    thsinar
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    Re: New Sinar Hy6-65 Camera System (31 MPx) Announced

    well, speaking about road trips: it reminds me 2 years ago, when I had to take my flight to Photokina. The airport was temporarily closed at the time I wanted to take my plane, due to the army's "coup d'état" taking place.

    Did you say there is Photokina in a couple of weeks?!



    Thierry


    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Mancuso View Post
    Thierry I have not read the news yet but road trip sounds like something you may want to consider like right now.

  31. #31
    thsinar
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    Re: New Sinar Hy6-65 Camera System (31 MPx) Announced

    Thanks Graham, much appreciated!

    I will try to bring out whatever I can from the country, to fill your fridge.


    Thierry

    Quote Originally Posted by foto-z View Post
    I hope you and the family stay safe, Thierry. You all have a place to stay in Estonia any time if things get really bad. I have to warn you though, the fridge is empty

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    Re: New Sinar Hy6-65 Camera System (31 MPx) Announced

    Here's a copy of the press release that I was sent...

  33. #33
    thsinar
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    Re: New Sinar Hy6-65 Camera System (31 MPx) Announced

    Thanks Marc.

    I said it, that I forward all suggestions, included your design!


    Best regards,
    Thierry

    Quote Originally Posted by fotografz View Post
    So it's a Kodak sensor like that of the H3D-II/31 and Phase One P30+.

    That is very exciting news IMHO. I'll be very interested in the ISO info when available ... but it should be decent.

    Sounds like a very fast camera to use with the Schneider AF glass.

    Congrats to Sinar.

    (Gee, the design looks exactly like the one I did in that previous thread ... including the extended bright metal strip across to the back itself

  34. #34
    thsinar
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    Re: New Sinar Hy6-65 Camera System (31 MPx) Announced

    Thanks David!

    I was just about to post it: it seems that Thailand is a bit slower!

    Cheers,
    Thierry

    Quote Originally Posted by David K View Post
    Here's a copy of the press release that I was sent...

  35. #35
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    Re: New Sinar Hy6-65 Camera System (31 MPx) Announced

    Thierry,
    The image used in the press release still shows blue in the waist level finder and battery grip.

  36. #36
    thsinar
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    Re: New Sinar Hy6-65 Camera System (31 MPx) Announced

    I saw it, but not mine.

    Let's see when we have it in front of the eyes: all I can say is that the back I saw 2 months ago was matching.

    Thierry

    Quote Originally Posted by BJNY View Post
    Thierry,
    The image used in the press release still shows blue in the waist level finder and battery grip.

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    Re: New Sinar Hy6-65 Camera System (31 MPx) Announced

    Thierry,

    My personal feeling is that Sinar has gone in precisely the right direction with the introduction of this camera. A fast shooting, lower price point solution with high ISO performance competitive with the best backs on the market. All this with the added advantage of being able to bypass proprietary software and the in camera jpgs should produce the best on screen image of any digital back out there. If this is priced right it should be a real winner for Sinar. I'm guessing the fashion shooters will be all over this puppy.

  38. #38
    thsinar
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    Re: New Sinar Hy6-65 Camera System (31 MPx) Announced

    Thanks David,

    yes, that was one of the ideas behind our decision to come with a 31 MPx camera.

    Best regards,
    Thierry

    Quote Originally Posted by David K View Post
    Thierry,

    My personal feeling is that Sinar has gone in precisely the right direction with the introduction of this camera. A fast shooting, lower price point solution with high ISO performance competitive with the best backs on the market. All this with the added advantage of being able to bypass proprietary software and the in camera jpgs should produce the best on screen image of any digital back out there. If this is priced right it should be a real winner for Sinar. I'm guessing the fashion shooters will be all over this puppy.

  39. #39
    Senior Member PSon's Avatar
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    Re: New Sinar Hy6-65 Camera System (31 MPx) Announced

    Thierry,
    You mentioned other medium format cameras compatibility with the new back but will it also work with the Contax 645? I bet it would work since it is from Sinar.

    Best Regards,
    -Son
    ALPA (MAX, STC, TC) | CAMBO (Actus DB2, WRS-AE) | CONTAX | HASSELBLAD | LEICA | DB (CFV-16, CFV-39, IQ180, IQ360, IQ3100, P45+) | Lens (Canon, Fujinon, Leica, Nikon, Pentax, Rodenstock, Schneider, Zeiss)

  40. #40
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    Re: New Sinar Hy6-65 Camera System (31 MPx) Announced

    Can't wait to see the price point.

    But if one has a lot of Rollei glass ... well ...

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    Re: New Sinar Hy6-65 Camera System (31 MPx) Announced

    I'm told that the adapter plates are the same as those for the eMotion series... another bit of good news. The only downside I can see is for folks like me who have the e75LV, adapter plate, Rollei glass, and are thinking this could be a nice thing to own I could keep the e75LV on my Hy6, and my Contax 645 could live on this new back... or the other way round. The words Customer Loyalty Discount spring to mind

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    Re: New Sinar Hy6-65 Camera System (31 MPx) Announced

    Maybe Steve Hendrix wants to change his mind (Sorry Steve, just couldn't resist).

  43. #43
    thsinar
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    Re: New Sinar Hy6-65 Camera System (31 MPx) Announced

    hi Son,

    No, we do not support the Contax 645 anymore: I know, it is a pity for some, but it is commercially not viable anymore.

    Best regards,
    Thierry

    Quote Originally Posted by Pham Minh Son View Post
    Thierry,
    You mentioned other medium format cameras compatibility with the new back but will it also work with the Contax 645? I bet it would work since it is from Sinar.

    Best Regards,
    -Son

  44. #44
    thsinar
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    Re: New Sinar Hy6-65 Camera System (31 MPx) Announced

    David,

    yes, the adapters are mechanically the same as the eMotion ones. But the software/firmware does not support anymore Contax 645 bodies (see my previous post).

    In this case you would have to use your eMotion 75 on the Contax.

    Best regards,
    Thierry

    Quote Originally Posted by David K View Post
    I'm told that the adapter plates are the same as those for the eMotion series... another bit of good news. The only downside I can see is for folks like me who have the e75LV, adapter plate, Rollei glass, and are thinking this could be a nice thing to own I could keep the e75LV on my Hy6, and my Contax 645 could live on this new back... or the other way round. The words Customer Loyalty Discount spring to mind

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    Re: New Sinar Hy6-65 Camera System (31 MPx) Announced

    Thanks for posting this Thierry. It is great to see that Sinar listened to the constant criticisms about their screens. When you say 640x480, 280ppi what kind of visibility are we talking about? Is that like the D3, or is it better or worse? I am curious...also curious to see how this transitions into your other upcoming backs....
    My photos are here: http://www.stuartrichardson.com and more recent work here: http://stuartrichardson.tumblr.com/ Please have a look at my book!
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  46. #46
    thsinar
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    Re: New Sinar Hy6-65 Camera System (31 MPx) Announced

    Stuart,

    I am kind of embarrassed to say it: I did not yet see a D3!


    But I have seen the Sinar eSprit display, and it is big, nice, sharp and contrasty: definitively a huge step forward.

    Best regards,
    Thierry


    Quote Originally Posted by Stuart Richardson View Post
    Thanks for posting this Thierry. It is great to see that Sinar listened to the constant criticisms about their screens. When you say 640x480, 280ppi what kind of visibility are we talking about? Is that like the D3, or is it better or worse? I am curious...also curious to see how this transitions into your other upcoming backs....

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    Re: New Sinar Hy6-65 Camera System (31 MPx) Announced

    Thanks Thierry, these are the D3 screen's specs:
    3.0 " TFT LCD
    • 922,000 pixels (VGA; 640 x 480 x 3 colors)
    • 170° viewing angle
    • Brightness adjustment

    So I assume that they are similar if they are both VGA and 3 inches.
    My photos are here: http://www.stuartrichardson.com and more recent work here: http://stuartrichardson.tumblr.com/ Please have a look at my book!
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  48. #48
    thsinar
    Guest

    Re: New Sinar Hy6-65 Camera System (31 MPx) Announced

    Yes, it seems that they are similar.

    Best regards,
    Thierry

    Quote Originally Posted by Stuart Richardson View Post
    Thanks Thierry, these are the D3 screen's specs:
    3.0 " TFT LCD
    • 922,000 pixels (VGA; 640 x 480 x 3 colors)
    • 170° viewing angle
    • Brightness adjustment

    So I assume that they are similar if they are both VGA and 3 inches.

  49. #49
    Senior Member
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    Apr 2008
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    Seattle, USA
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    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: New Sinar Hy6-65 Camera System (31 MPx) Announced

    Thierry & Sinar -

    Great job on this!! I love the fact that the color scheme is 'calmer'... Thanks for listening, and thanks Graham!

    I really, really love that I can get standard, self-contained raw files out of the back now--frankly, this is my #1 issue with the e75LV.

    Lots of goodness here. I'm a little confused about the models--since I already have a Hy6, what difference would I notice with a "self-contained" s65 vs. owning an s65r on my current Hy6? (I understand the firmware is different--I am curious what the difference is to the photographer).

    Again, nice job, and thank you for listening to your customers--I'm really impressed!
    -Brad

  50. #50
    thsinar
    Guest

    Re: New Sinar Hy6-65 Camera System (31 MPx) Announced

    Hi Brad,

    Thanks for the compliment.

    I'll try to explain it:

    1.Unless you need/want a second Hy6 body, in your case you would simply take a eSprit 65 with its adapter (revolving or not).

    2.This would give you in addition to the integrated "Hy6-65" model:

    - the Sinar RAWs (.IA & .BR)
    - the revolving possibility (not possible with integrated Hy6-65
    - the possibility to adapt/mount the back on another camera (H1/H2, V, Mamiya 645 AFD & 645 AFD II, Sinar m)
    - the live video (n.a. with the Hy6-65)

    Best regards,
    Thierry

    Quote Originally Posted by BradleyGibson View Post
    Thierry & Sinar -

    Great job on this!! I love the fact that the color scheme is 'calmer'... Thanks for listening, and thanks Graham!

    I really, really love that I can get standard, self-contained raw files out of the back now--frankly, this is my #1 issue with the e75LV.

    Lots of goodness here. I'm a little confused about the models--since I already have a Hy6, what difference would I notice with a "self-contained" s65 vs. owning an s65r on my current Hy6? (I understand the firmware is different--I am curious what the difference is to the photographer).

    Again, nice job, and thank you for listening to your customers--I'm really impressed!
    -Brad

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