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Problem: IQ180 below -4 deg. Celsius

goesbang

Member
Any update?
Doug,

I shot extensively with my IQ180 in the Swiss Alps in Dec2010/Jan2011. Outdoor temps on most of my morning walks were typically -6 to -2degC, but on one particular morning it was -17C when I got off the gondola at the top of one mountain, and -12C when I took the ride down 3 hours later.
I usually work with my IQ180 on normal latency on the Alpa STC, but in these cold conditions, I chose to use it on zero latency. My thinking was that this would generate a little heat and thus avoid any issues with extreme cold. I also carry my spare batteries in the inside pocket of my jacket so they stay moderately warm.
The back was switched off when I was legging it between shooting locations, but I would turn it on as soon as I arrived at a place where I thought there might be a shot to be had. Thus, by the time I had set up my tripod and composed my image, the camera was cold but not freezing. This was a year ago and Liveview was not yet available. I'd imagine that simply using liveview would bring sensor temp up enough to avoid any issues.
On several occasions, I had the sensor exposed briefly whilst changing lenses. No problems here apart from bloody cold fingers!
I did note a drop in battery life, at a guess in the region of 20% down from my normal expectations, but I put this down to the batteries being below their best at these temps. I have 6 batteries but never got through more than 2 fully charged batteries, though I don't shoot a lot of frames when I'm shooting landscapes, perhaps 60 frames or so each walk.
My files themselves were just as accurate and clean as I would expect at normal temps, even when shooting 15-30sec exposures at low ISO with ND grads etc.
I would love to hear how others are going this winter with the updated firmware and liveview. Unfortunately I am in Dubai this winter where temps don't get very cold at all. I'd rather be with family in Switzerland and taking daily hikes in the snow, but clients are keeping me busy here.
As an aside, I took the IQ180 and Alpa to Afghanistan where is was cool and very, very dusty and as expected, all worked perfectly. It will be interesting to hear where members are travelling with their backs and what conditions they are shooting in. I will be shooting a lot in Malaysia and Indonesia in 2012, so I'll report on high-humidity usage as well.
Cheers,
 
G

Gerhard

Guest
That's great to hear as an additional data point. Though I was hoping specifically for an update from the OP.
Okay, here is my update:

I'm back from Iceland since one week. The problem persisted all the time. My first action here in Germany was to buy an upgrade for the backup DB which I took with me on that trip: P45+ => P65+. In my opinion the difference in image quality between the P45+ and the IQ180 was too big for a good backup. And then there is still the crop-factor…

(BTW: In the course of the last year I did not make a lot of very long exposures with the P45+. Therefore losing this P45+ advantage will not be a problem for me.)

Upon arrival of the P65+ I will send out my IQ180 for check&repair to PhaseOne Denmark. After getting it back I will make tests and give the forum an update.

The posting of Siebel sounds extremely promising.

My next trip to Iceland will be very soon: in February. In this season it can be quite cold in Iceland - colder than -10 centigrade. Another reason for taking a really good backup with me.

Gerhard
 

dougpeterson

Workshop Member
Upon arrival of the P65+ I will send out my IQ180 for check&repair to PhaseOne Denmark. After getting it back I will make tests and give the forum an update.
Please do! We're starting to get more field reports from our users on IQ use in extreme cold and yours is the only I've seen that was strongly negative. Most have been strongly positive (i.e. worked like a champ, no glitches at all, moderately lower battery life offset by simply keeping batteries warm in a pocket) and a few have been mostly positive (i.e. one or two lockups/glitches that may or may not have been weather related but otherwise worked great).

Logically this means one of four things:
- your specific equipment (back, batteries, lens, body) is in someway defective
- your specific workflow/usage is different (frequency of LCD use, use of specific features, shutter speeds used, ISOs used)
- your specific environment (humidity, altitude, cold, wind) is in someway more challenging
- the number of positive reports we've received is an insufficient sample size or issues from others have been under-reported

My bet is Door #1, but all three are possibilities and your report can help settle it for sure!

Please update the forum either way when you find out!

Doug Peterson (e-mail Me)
__________________

Head of Technical Services, Capture Integration
Phase One Partner of the Year
Leaf, Leica, Cambo, Arca Swiss, Canon, Apple, Profoto, Broncolor, Eizo & More

National: 877.217.9870 *| *Cell: 740.707.2183
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M

macz

Guest
Please do! We're starting to get more field reports from our users on IQ use in extreme cold and yours is the only I've seen that was strongly negative. Most have been strongly positive (i.e. worked like a champ, no glitches at all, moderately lower battery life offset by simply keeping batteries warm in a pocket) and a few have been mostly positive (i.e. one or two lockups/glitches that may or may not have been weather related but otherwise worked great).

Logically this means one of four things:
- your specific equipment (back, batteries, lens, body) is in someway defective
- your specific workflow/usage is different (frequency of LCD use, use of specific features, shutter speeds used, ISOs used)
- your specific environment (humidity, altitude, cold, wind) is in someway more challenging
- the number of positive reports we've received is an insufficient sample size or issues from others have been under-reported

My bet is Door #1, but all three are possibilities and your report can help settle it for sure!

Please update the forum either way when you find out!

Doug Peterson (e-mail Me)
__________________

Head of Technical Services, Capture Integration
Phase One Partner of the Year
Leaf, Leica, Cambo, Arca Swiss, Canon, Apple, Profoto, Broncolor, Eizo & More

National: 877.217.9870 *| *Cell: 740.707.2183
Newsletter | RSS Feed
Buy Capture One 6 at 10% off

Hi to all

I just came home from a trip in the Swiss Mountains capturing at -15 to -20 °C with the IQ180 on the Alpa. I had 10 batteries fully charged and was able to capture 70 images - then finished since all of the batteries were just blinking on the back (they have been kept warm in the meantime). Back home putting them into the charger they showed 80 % charge...

So Gerhard is not alone and I just got the identical information from a friend experiencing this today with his IQ180.

Always the same behavior: put a new battery in the (cold) back - first it shows something like 50 % battery, then you make one exposure: 20 %, second or even third exposure and the back keeps blinking...

I am glad I did not take et the IQ180 to Norway last February and used the P65+ instead for capturing Northern lights...

It would be great if the material would be defective - since in this case the solution would be close. If it is a problem of the system (IQ180) we may wait until next winter - or for better batteries!

Btw I am using firmware 2.01.

Look forward to better news.

Markus
 

Kirmo

New member
Now back home in Finland, from Kenya.

As we have now winter and usually around -10C to -30C I'll
do some shooting with my IQ180. We also have sometimes
more than -40C. For us this is NORMAL winter weather.

For P65+ I've had no problems. I'll report how the new back
works.

Kirmo
 

Bill Caulfeild-Browne

Well-known member
We have had virtually no cold weather in Ontario this winter - and no snow, so I haven't been shooting with the IQ180. But the forecast is for -15ºC by the end of this week and I'll go out for a full day in the cold and see what happens. Last time I had no problem in -12ºC but it was only for a few hours.

(Hope you had a good trip to Kenya, Kirmo!)

Bill
 

Kirmo

New member
Bill, yes, we had great time. Also got the LS 55 and 110 two days before we started our trip. The LS 110 was very handy when shooting at Maasai and Samburu villages. Also some wild life with IQ.

Some warmer weather, only -5C now. For week end back to normal.

I've charged the batteries and will try to do some kind of testing then.

Anyone seen LS 240 or the wide angle tilt-shift lenses?

Kirmo
 

dougpeterson

Workshop Member
Anyone seen LS 240 or the wide angle tilt-shift lenses?
Schneider has said privately they are going to make one and I'm the project is well under way (lens development takes a long time from first conception to final shipment), but the lens has not even been announced, let alone shown, let alone shipped, let alone tested.

Doug Peterson (e-mail Me)
__________________

Head of Technical Services, Capture Integration
Phase One Partner of the Year
Leaf, Leica, Cambo, Arca Swiss, Canon, Apple, Profoto, Broncolor, Eizo & More

National: 877.217.9870 *| *Cell: 740.707.2183
Newsletter | RSS Feed
Buy Capture One 6 at 10% off
 

Landscapelover

Senior Subscriber Member
I shot P1 DF with IQ 180 5 days ago when the temperature was 5 degrees F with wind chill. It was very cold.
The batteries were covered with wrapped cloth in the backpack.
Five out of 6 lithium batteries(for IQ back) which were fully charged were dead.
When I came home I checked and all batteries were fully charged again.
Just want to share this information.

Pramote
 

dougpeterson

Workshop Member
I have the 240 LS ordered - I was told February for delivery but I have my doubts!
Told by whom? When?

The last official word I have from Phase One places delivery in the June-ish time-frame.


Doug Peterson (e-mail Me)
__________________

Head of Technical Services, Capture Integration
Phase One Partner of the Year
Leaf, Leica, Cambo, Arca Swiss, Canon, Apple, Profoto, Broncolor, Eizo & More

National: 877.217.9870 *| *Cell: 740.707.2183
Newsletter | RSS Feed
Buy Capture One 6 at 10% off
 
G

Gerhard

Guest
That is exactly my observation: Under cold conditions the IQ180 is mis-interpreting the battery voltage. The battery voltage itself is absolutely fine. I confirmed this by inserting the same, cold battery into a P45+, a P65+ or a battery charger.

By the way: My IQ180 is for repair in the factory for nearly 4 weeks now and I hope to get it back soon.

... and I hope that it will be working in cold conditions after the repair.

Best,
Gerhard




I shot P1 DF with IQ 180 5 days ago when the temperature was 5 degrees F with wind chill. It was very cold.
The batteries were covered with wrapped cloth in the backpack.
Five out of 6 lithium batteries(for IQ back) which were fully charged were dead.
When I came home I checked and all batteries were fully charged again.
Just want to share this information.

Pramote
 

Landscapelover

Senior Subscriber Member
That is exactly my observation: Under cold conditions the IQ180 is mis-interpreting the battery voltage. The battery voltage itself is absolutely fine. I confirmed this by inserting the same, cold battery into a P45+, a P65+ or a battery charger.

By the way: My IQ180 is for repair in the factory for nearly 4 weeks now and I hope to get it back soon.

... and I hope that it will be working in cold conditions after the repair.

Best,
Gerhard
Hi Gerhard,

Please let me know how it turns out.

Regards,
Pramote
 

dchew

Well-known member
That is exactly my observation: Under cold conditions the IQ180 is mis-interpreting the battery voltage. The battery voltage itself is absolutely fine. I confirmed this by inserting the same, cold battery into a P45+, a P65+ or a battery charger.

By the way: My IQ180 is for repair in the factory for nearly 4 weeks now and I hope to get it back soon.

... and I hope that it will be working in cold conditions after the repair.

Best,
Gerhard
I thought all was fine with mine until last Friday I was out. It was a bit windy and cold. Same thing with mine. All the batteries that were fresh showed dead on the IQ180.

Time for a call to my dealer.

Dave
 

Kirmo

New member
Test results after very simple test.

DF + IQ180 + 55LS + V-grip + tripod.
Batteries 100% charged.

Temperature -27C, camera outside on tripod. The camera
stays on same place outside all the time.

9:20 Turned camera + back on
Took 3 pictures
Turned camera + back off

9:35 Turned camera + back on
Took 3 pictures
Turned camera + back off

9:50 Turned camera + back on
Took 3 pictures
Turned camera + back off

Back shows battery is almost dead.

I take the camera inside.
Check battery of V-grip in charger = 100%
Check battery of IQ180 back = 80%

So same behaviour as others have found out.

I've reported my dealer and he informs Phase One.


Kirmo

ps. Later today the weather will warm up again.
Yesterday was too warm to make the test, only -15C.
 

cng

New member
I'm finding something similar with my IQ180 and tech cam. In Japan at the moment, ambient temperature is about 0–7 degrees Celsius (so not as cold as what others are experiencing).

My four batteries all start out fully charged, and a few different scenarios consistently occur:

1. I get only a few shots before the low battery indicator starts blinking. Sometimes ejecting the battery and reinserting it seems to work. If not, the charger later shows the battery to be 75%–80% full.

2. The back tells me "insufficient storage", despite the CF card not being full. Rebooting the back or (most commonly) swapping the battery seems to solve the problem. Again, this issue seems linked to the battery because at the same time the battery indicator will drop suddenly from full/near full to half/quarter full. Battery charger will later show at least 50%–80% charge left in the battery.

3. Other times, no problems. I will get a good hour or two of shooting on a single battery, even with Live View. (NB. I am not very efficient with my battery use, I tend to leave the back turned on most of the time as I am constantly shooting or composing using Live View).

There doesn't seem to be any consistency between the (non-)performance of each battery. Any or all of them could be problematic on a given day.

Does this sound familiar to anyone?
 
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