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The S2
- Thread starter PeterA
- Start date
ptomsu
Workshop Member
Hey folks,
overall the S2 is great news. For Leica of course, for those who want to get into a high quality MF system and for the whole MF market, because it looks like it already started to shake this high expensive market a bit and brought Hasselblöd to reuce their prices
This is a great new system and from what I hear it works remarkably well and feels much higher quality than most of the other MF Pro systems around. And it has completely been designed and developed by Leica, which makes me confident that they will bring this to a highly stable and reliable system once it is available for sale. Bad news of course for those who already have heavily invested in one of these systems, which I luckily have NOT.
For me timing is just right of the S System and Leica shows strong signs that they are also on the right path for the R and M system (FF).
Big Kudos to Leica!
overall the S2 is great news. For Leica of course, for those who want to get into a high quality MF system and for the whole MF market, because it looks like it already started to shake this high expensive market a bit and brought Hasselblöd to reuce their prices
This is a great new system and from what I hear it works remarkably well and feels much higher quality than most of the other MF Pro systems around. And it has completely been designed and developed by Leica, which makes me confident that they will bring this to a highly stable and reliable system once it is available for sale. Bad news of course for those who already have heavily invested in one of these systems, which I luckily have NOT.
For me timing is just right of the S System and Leica shows strong signs that they are also on the right path for the R and M system (FF).
Big Kudos to Leica!
Guy Mancuso
Administrator, Instructor
I just sent a very long note to my friends at Leica and wished them well on this project . I also gave them a list of things that i thought may work and suggestions on the service and support side of this that will be critical entering this market. I think some good positive feedback from the Pro shooters is a welcome addition to a new program. I will certainly be watching what the S systems becomes and how they work out all the details
Guy Mancuso
Administrator, Instructor
Essential exactly what i said Peter. They have to look at this product differently than anything else they sell, the target is Pro level by a large margin and it needs a lot of hand holding.
Re: The S2.... big mistake ?
From what I read here and there, the photographers who could be interested in this camera are already geared with MF and ... Canon.
All what I read is that the new 5DII is already sold into minds of most, evidence having one isn't even questionable.
In return, it seems very few will jump on the S2, I am afraid this won't be enough to save Leica, + crisis coming, many will cut off cost and investments.
Instead if they came out with a simple 3k$ FF.R10, Leica lenses owners would have grabbed it, they wouldn't compare with Can/Nik because they don't expect the same from leica, here then evidence of having one wouldn't be even questionable.
But when you see the M8 at 6k+.... definitely an R10 at this price won't sell.
In other words if you guys don't rush for this S2 who will ? Leica missed the bet and I am afraid they bite the bullet.
From what I read here and there, the photographers who could be interested in this camera are already geared with MF and ... Canon.
All what I read is that the new 5DII is already sold into minds of most, evidence having one isn't even questionable.
In return, it seems very few will jump on the S2, I am afraid this won't be enough to save Leica, + crisis coming, many will cut off cost and investments.
Instead if they came out with a simple 3k$ FF.R10, Leica lenses owners would have grabbed it, they wouldn't compare with Can/Nik because they don't expect the same from leica, here then evidence of having one wouldn't be even questionable.
But when you see the M8 at 6k+.... definitely an R10 at this price won't sell.
In other words if you guys don't rush for this S2 who will ? Leica missed the bet and I am afraid they bite the bullet.
Re: The S2.... big mistake ?
if they keep the rolex/gucci/ferrari mentality it has no chance of being anything more than a luxury toy. . .
i pretty much agree. if they price it low and go for hasselblad h3d II 31 market share they may survive - if the thing works right.
if they keep the rolex/gucci/ferrari mentality it has no chance of being anything more than a luxury toy. . .
ptomsu
Workshop Member
Well, if you compare the build quality and materials of Leica and Hassi then clearly Leica S2 wins. This is a totally different beast in the MF arena and hrd to come close to by any other vendor in build quality.
And I also am sure IQ is a level for itself.
So if one says this will not be appreciated by Pro's, that means also it is not appreciated by clients. Which I do not belief. Because all these clients always ask for top IQ and I am sure Leica can top IQ of several MF systems on the market, even with a slightly smaller sensor.
And I also am sure IQ is a level for itself.
So if one says this will not be appreciated by Pro's, that means also it is not appreciated by clients. Which I do not belief. Because all these clients always ask for top IQ and I am sure Leica can top IQ of several MF systems on the market, even with a slightly smaller sensor.
Guy Mancuso
Administrator, Instructor
My reasons are pretty simple . It could most likely beat my 22mpx back today and also offer something that i do struggle with and that is speed. For me that maybe enough. Let's not forget the speed issue here. MF shooters would kill for 1.5 FPS and less shutter lag and high ISO's. Coming from MF a Canon 5DII or actually anything else in 35mm i would not consider my top performer camera , it would fill a certain need when it comes up but most all MF shooters would lean on there MF camera's until they hit the soup with mostly speed issues than grab the Canon or Nikon. This certainly helps in that crossover between the two systems.
gogopix
Subscriber
Well, contrary to some perceptions of why I boost the Contax 645, I have decided it is just fine (maybe more than fine . I decided against a switch to H3D, or Hy6.
SO, I oredred the M8.2 and have put myself on the list for the S2 (and glass) and R10. Looks like "R" glass will get some legs after all.
My reckonning, I should come out ahead, maybe something left for a few good bottles of Burgundy.
best regards
Victor
. I decided against a switch to H3D, or Hy6.SO, I oredred the M8.2 and have put myself on the list for the S2 (and glass) and R10. Looks like "R" glass will get some legs after all.
My reckonning, I should come out ahead, maybe something left for a few good bottles of Burgundy.
best regards
Victor
Guy Mancuso
Administrator, Instructor
Well the S system is certainly appealing Victor no question about that. Nice to see you back in the saddle here. Hope all your vacations where fun.
woodyspedden
New member
victorWell, contrary to some perceptions of why I boost the Contax 645, I have decided it is just fine (maybe more than fine
SO, I oredred the M8.2 and have put myself on the list for the S2 (and glass) and R10. Looks like "R" glass will get some legs after all.
My reckonning, I should come out ahead, maybe something left for a few good bottles of Burgundy.
best regards
Victor
So great to have you back! I would love to share a bottle of Burgundy with you as I know your taste is impeccable! LOL Seriously, there is a lot of stuff here to be absorbed in the MFDB world. I think that you, Son and some others (David K) have got it right. The Contax stuff is and was great and time has not changed that. I hope that all who want to experiment with MFDB work with the Contax system because it is so good and you hardly stand to lose any money if you decide to sell and go with a more modern solution (Just MHO>>>>>>>LOL)
Woody
When you see clean Contax kits going for $1200 (two sold on FM in last week), a nice clean Contax kit and (ever-cheaper) moderately-MP'd USED Phase back just keeps looking better and better.
The MF and the high-end DSLR/'tweener market is going to undergo some very serious turmoil over the next year or so and while some prices may make our eyes go wide, there is always that old 'Street' adage about trying to catch a falling knife...
The MF and the high-end DSLR/'tweener market is going to undergo some very serious turmoil over the next year or so and while some prices may make our eyes go wide, there is always that old 'Street' adage about trying to catch a falling knife...
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PSon
Active member
Did someone say Contax 645 lover? Well you cannot be much more of a Contax 645 hardcore than Victor. Glad to see the missing Contax 645 son is back (well in this case more like a father).
Woody, hope your surgery is all done and on your recovery path. Yes the Contax 645 is a great system. The system is not a fancy name but it will not cut your pocket for having a full line of Zeiss medium format auto focus lens. For example, the 35mm lens can be had under $1700 with lens shade. Seriously, the whole medium format system can really eat up your saving. Thus I prefer to use what I know is still one of the best medium format system and yet for such little money to get. In turn, I would feed the part where it really count, the digital back such as the new PhaseOne P65+.
BTW don't let these two paragraphs think I stop here. I also have more friends with Sinar and Rollei too. At time I do not know who is a harder core, Victor or them?
Best Regards,
-Son
Woody, hope your surgery is all done and on your recovery path. Yes the Contax 645 is a great system. The system is not a fancy name but it will not cut your pocket for having a full line of Zeiss medium format auto focus lens. For example, the 35mm lens can be had under $1700 with lens shade. Seriously, the whole medium format system can really eat up your saving. Thus I prefer to use what I know is still one of the best medium format system and yet for such little money to get. In turn, I would feed the part where it really count, the digital back such as the new PhaseOne P65+.
BTW don't let these two paragraphs think I stop here. I also have more friends with Sinar and Rollei too. At time I do not know who is a harder core, Victor or them?
Best Regards,
-Son
gogopix
Subscriber
Actually, busy summer-trekking Wales and north england, then a 2000 km trip across France from Biarritz to Alsace, back thru Verdun and out from Paris.
Swamped with my company (investors, private equity, lots of people looking at us)
Also need to process about 3000 images. (I am likely 3000 posts behind too!)
Sounds like the troup has had fun in spite of market (Peter-hedge-time the best? ) I just sat it out. Keep cash. (euros)
Really, on top of it all, we are enjoying three grandkids; I can almost tolerate "T" ball and "swarm soccer"
LOL
Victor
Swamped with my company (investors, private equity, lots of people looking at us)
Also need to process about 3000 images. (I am likely 3000 posts behind too!)
Sounds like the troup has had fun in spite of market (Peter-hedge-time the best? ) I just sat it out. Keep cash. (euros)
Really, on top of it all, we are enjoying three grandkids; I can almost tolerate "T" ball and "swarm soccer"
LOL
Victor
:ROTFL: Now THAT is a good grandfather!
very interesting read on the s2 for those that weren't able to make it to photokina
http://dfarkas.blogspot.com/
(you have to scroll down a bit...)
http://dfarkas.blogspot.com/
(you have to scroll down a bit...)