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Thread: Bargain MFDB deals at dealers!

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    Bargain MFDB deals at dealers!

    Bargain ... MFDB ... hmm, they don't often go together ... but has anyone noticed the recent trend of used MFDBs being cheaper from dealer's than privately? Ok, trend is maybe not the right word, but there are certainly some deals to be had. Not sure why this is - the large number of trade-ins for IQ backs, or the advent of 36MP Nikon's ... whatever, the end result seems to be the same - you can enter the MFD world today for a lot less than even just a couple of years ago.

    As an example, here's a P45+ for 7495 = $12k (US) from a UK dealer. Most that I see privately for sale start at $12k. All things being equal, if a dealer is selling one for $12k, a private sale should be significantly less, otherwise why bother? Taking my general rule-of-thumb that a private sale should be at most 80% of what a dealer is asking, for gear in the same condition, this means that mint P45+s should be going for around $9.5k privately.

    Another one: Optechs digital had an Aptus II 12 for sale a few weeks back for $20k - cheapest I've seen privately is $25k - another great deal. Surely these should be going privately for around $16k? Optechs just had an IQ180 for $33k - which should mean privately they're going for a lot less...$26k...but they're not. Here's a UK dealer with an IQ180 for $29.8k...so privately this should be $23.8k. Cheapest on eBay that I've seen is $32k (didn't make its reserve however). Why would anyone bid $32k if for $2k less (in the UK) or $1k more (in the US) you could buy from a reputable dealer like dtek/optechs (respectively)? P25+s seem to sell privately for $7k+ well here's one with only 3500 actuations for $6.8k - from a dealer. DTEK just sold one with only 460 exposures for the same price. Both with 1 year's support. Again, as a private sale - with no support - they should be going for significantly less ... I'd say around about the $5.5k mark.

    So, it seems to me now that now, more than ever before, it's worth checking with a dealer if you're interested in a MFDB, rather than just assume a private seller is going to be a more economical proposition. If the private seller is wanting nearly as much as the dealer (or more), then it's gotta be the dealer every time - for the added support they bring to the table.

    Jim

    P.S. I realise that different warranties can add value to used sales - be they a dealer or private seller - but private sales of used P/P+/Aptus backs rarely seem to come with any of the 'added value loaner back' type warranties, so the warranty you get from the dealer - usually 30 days -> 1 year makes a dealer an even more attractive proposition.

    P.P.S. I also realise that private sales may allow for tax avoidance, which makes them more attractve to non-professionals - who are generally registered for sales tax (VAT in the UK, HST in Canada etc.) and can claim it back. However, even taking that into account, I still feel a lot of private sales are pitched too high, and that dealer's shouldn't be dismissed out of hand.

    P.P.P.S. If anyone spots any great deals to be had at (reputable!) dealers, why not post them here and let everyone know? It'll sure it'll be more tempting than the usual 'phone for price' ( la buying a used car) scenario.

    P.P.P.P.S. I'm not a dealer.

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    Re: Bargain MFDB deals at dealers!

    It is true the private sales are not that cheap. Some can be. I have not long found out craigs list is in the UK now. A few months ago, one person was selling a 9 month old DF plus a p45+ and 80mm lens for 4000

    Also the first one you linked to needs to have VAT added to it if your in the UK. So that adds another 20% to it, which takes it up to 9000.

    But bargains are still out there, via gumtree/ craigslist here in the UK at least.

    Even now there is a DF/ Aptus 11 8/ 55-110mm/ 80mm Schneider LS lens/ 10 CF/ RRS L bracket. All less than 3 months old, the price?

    4100

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    Re: Bargain MFDB deals at dealers!

    Quote Originally Posted by carl-b View Post

    Even now there is a DF/ Aptus 11 8/ 55-110mm/ 80mm Schneider LS lens/ 10 CF/ RRS L bracket. All less than 3 months old, the price?

    4100
    Quick! Send me the link to the last one!!!

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    Re: Bargain MFDB deals at dealers!

    Phase One 645 DF Leaf Aptus II 8 40 Megapixel Kit + EXT

    Is that really a genuine sale? Seems extremely cheap to me!

    Mat

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    Re: Bargain MFDB deals at dealers!

    Quote Originally Posted by carl-b View Post
    Also the first one you linked to needs to have VAT added to it if your in the UK. So that adds another 20% to it, which takes it up to 9000.
    Yes, you're right - but as noted in my 'P.P.S.' this isn't an issue if you're VAT registered.

    Craigslist? You're kidding right? I've seen the ads on there, and they're simply unbelievable. Why would anyone sell a DB that way rather than via a reputable forum, eBay, or a dealer on commission? 99% of these adverts are scams, plain and simple. The remaining 1% are probably selling stolen goods. I would run a mile.

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    Re: Bargain MFDB deals at dealers!

    You can contact the seller and ask for the name of their "local US" dealer and the serial numbers/s of the items. Then you can easily check if these are recorded anywhere as stolen kit or not.

    If they don't answer or don't provide the info then....well...you run!
    Yair Shahar | Product Manager | Phase One | Mamiya Leaf
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    Re: Bargain MFDB deals at dealers!

    There are many good ways to buy a digital back for less than the cost of a new unit. A dealer demo unit, a dealer trade-in, a forum member of long standing and good reputation, a member of a local photo organization which has a track record and references etc.

    I don't include Craiglist in that list. Not because every sale there would be a fraud of some sort, but because the risk is intuitively much higher than one of the good ways to buy.
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    Re: Bargain MFDB deals at dealers!

    EBay in my experience is the best source of used equipment.

    Best thing about ebay is the rating system. With a dealer you cannot look up how happy clients really are. There no easy 3rd party mediator between a dealer and client.

    Dealers have a lot of overhead so their costs are higher.

    Just deal with people with a good ebay feedback record and things go smoothly.

    I have never had a problem returning and item bought off ebay.

    I also prefer companies that deal directly with customers rather than those that insist on you going through a dealer even for a simple repair.

    For example with one company I am trying to obtain a part. Simple external stand alone part. Spoken to both divisions, two dealers and two weeks later NO ANSWER YET.

    On the other hand I needed a repair of a lens that incidentally has been out of production for about 8/10 years. Called the company directly. Went through things with them over the phone. I sent it in and they ordered the part. lens and part arrived together. Three days later the repaired lens is on it's way back. Total time 8 days.

    I know where I'm getting my next camera from.

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    Re: Bargain MFDB deals at dealers!

    Quote Originally Posted by f8orbust View Post
    ...had an IQ180 for $33k - which should mean privately they're going for a lot less...$26k...but they're not...
    Or maybe they are! The free market has spoken, and an IQ180, bought from CI and sold by a reputable eBay seller, still under warranty with only 891 actuations, is worth...*drum roll*...$24,877.33

    So these things do depreciate faster than last year's laptop - ouch

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    Re: Bargain MFDB deals at dealers!

    Quote Originally Posted by f8orbust View Post
    Or maybe they are! The free market has spoken, and an IQ180, bought from CI and sold by a reputable eBay seller, still under warranty with only 891 actuations, is worth...*drum roll*...$24,877.33

    So these things do depreciate faster than last year's laptop - ouch
    Well, it somewhat depends on the motivation of the seller. If it were a financial emergency then you can understand taking the hit. If it's just someone deciding that they want to spend their money on something else then I would say it's a classic case of a fool and their money being easily parted.
    Remember: adventure before dementia!

    As Oscar Wilde said, "my tastes are simple, I only like the best"

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    Re: Bargain MFDB deals at dealers!

    If you are using this for a business and you listen to your accountant, leasing would most likely be the purchase method. Any computer which includes digital backs are virtually worthless after newer technologies supersede it. So if you are a business you would have leased it through one of the dealers that advertise here and forget about the resale value. Your digital processing fees will pay in part for the back every month and after the lease is up, you can just get a new one. After all, if you bought it and took the depreciation on the back and sold it at a profit, you would have to pay capital gains tax - again this is if you listen to your accountant.

    So if this individual was a business, the sale price may reflect the depreciated price. If not a business but an individual, if they had the $$$ to buy one in the first place, losing the $9000 is not a big deal for the bragging rights they had.
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    Re: Bargain MFDB deals at dealers!

    Quote Originally Posted by GrahamWelland View Post
    Well, it somewhat depends on the motivation of the seller. If it were a financial emergency then you can understand taking the hit. If it's just someone deciding that they want to spend their money on something else then I would say it's a classic case of a fool and their money being easily parted.
    Or this person could end up looking like a market genius getting out when they did if prices fall even further. Personally I can see it going either way. And if I had to bet, I'd bet it will get worse. I think the marketing and pricing paradigms for MF DB manufacturers is about to change drastically...
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    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: Bargain MFDB deals at dealers!

    Nice thread your all trying to kill me. My back is for sale folks.

    Seriously some if these sales you have to be careful as some are really bankrupt issues or going out of business sales. Optechs is like a clear case of that trying to clear inventory before closing his doors. On ebay stuff so much could wrong with people paying not following through on sales . Contacting PayPal after payment and shipping than calling foul. Than they pull your money. Seriously be really carefully here.

    One thing for sure I'm not going to rip you off nor is a dealer.
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    Subscriber & Workshop Member GrahamWelland's Avatar
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    Re: Bargain MFDB deals at dealers!

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack View Post
    Or this person could end up looking like a market genius getting out when they did if prices fall even further. Personally I can see it going either way. And if I had to bet, I'd bet it will get worse. I think the marketing and pricing paradigms for MF DB manufacturers is about to change drastically...
    Well if it's a case of 'getting out' then I might suggest that the motivation for 'getting in' at this nose bleed price level was perhaps not fully thought through. If you need to sell it, fine. However, if the motivation is to move on to the next new new thing, well, the market will take it's toll on you. That's life - heck it burns me too.
    Remember: adventure before dementia!

    As Oscar Wilde said, "my tastes are simple, I only like the best"

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    Re: Bargain MFDB deals at dealers!

    No doubt. We buy a new car and don't care much that we loose 15% - 20% of it's value the second we drive it off the lot. Computers are worse, and I think what's newish is now cameras are more emulating the computer model; like 50% residuals after 18 months of use where it used to be more like 67%.

    Older MF film cameras are starting to sound attractive to me again
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    Re: Bargain MFDB deals at dealers!

    On a related note, I want a P45+ for my Alpa so I'm actually almost pleased that the MFDB market prices are falling. The only problem is that they seem to be falling for every back OTHER than the P45+!
    Remember: adventure before dementia!

    As Oscar Wilde said, "my tastes are simple, I only like the best"
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    Re: Bargain MFDB deals at dealers!

    It's because TWO of us want one -- and excessive demand keeps prices high!
    Jack
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    Re: Bargain MFDB deals at dealers!

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack View Post
    It's because TWO of us want one -- and excessive demand keeps prices high!
    Econ 101 - Supply and demand
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    Re: Bargain MFDB deals at dealers!

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Mancuso View Post
    Nice thread your all trying to kill me. My back is for sale folks.

    Seriously some if these sales you have to be careful as some are really bankrupt issues or going out of business sales. Optechs is like a clear case of that trying to clear inventory before closing his doors. On ebay stuff so much could wrong with people paying not following through on sales . Contacting PayPal after payment and shipping than calling foul. Than they pull your money. Seriously be really carefully here.

    One thing for sure I'm not going to rip you off nor is a dealer.
    Flea Bay has gotten a lot more dangerous lately for both buyers and sellers. I spotted a Leica S2 being sold at a bargain price - contacted the seller who normally sells appliance parts and turns out his account had been hijacked. Buying from someone you know or know of via the board is great at least you know they really exist (at least in cyber space).

    Buy Guys' back, his wife will be much happier!
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    Re: Bargain MFDB deals at dealers!

    Believe me I exist. I will even deliver the damn thing with a full day of training. Hows that for customer service. LOL
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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    Re: Bargain MFDB deals at dealers!

    It feels weird that our two illustrious forum leaders are downshifting their DB's.

    Damn, this D800 must be good.....

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    Re: Bargain MFDB deals at dealers!

    Its okay and that is not my reason at all. Just bad timing on my end to downsize.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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    Re: Bargain MFDB deals at dealers!

    Quote Originally Posted by gazwas View Post
    It feels weird that our two illustrious forum leaders are downshifting their DB's.

    Damn, this D800 must be good.....
    They drank the Kool Aid - must resist! For me when Nikon comes out with AF lenses that have the same character as the Leica and Zeiss adopted lenses I will then consider switching but not till that happens.
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    Re: Bargain MFDB deals at dealers!

    The D800 is not worthy of Koolaid nor is anything else for me this is just business matters on my end. The rest is private and not happy i actually had to list my back for sale . People are running like scared rabbits for no reason. The D800 is not the MF killer. Far from it but it is very good that I will give it. Sorry i don't share in the hype of it, end of day it still is a nikon not a phase back.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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    Re: Bargain MFDB deals at dealers!

    Bottom line is, it is hard to find a photographer (whom I know personally) who owns either P65+, IQ160 or IQ180 didn't order Nikon D800 yet!

    Subrata

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    Re: Bargain MFDB deals at dealers!

    Most Pros run two systems anyway some 3 so no real surprise there but if your talking 35mm than sure the D800 is the best there is and that makes perfect sense to have a D800 and folks will sell off there Canons and older Nikons to get one or the D4 as well. Lets face it and I have said this all along its a great cheat system. You get some horsepower that is pretty obvious. But its not a replacement and I think there lies the confusion. I can't shoot great wide angle tech cam kind of movements with a Nikon, there is nothing that will match that. So yea great system but like every other system it has its limitations as well. Now if your a wildlife shooter than hell Nikon smokes a MF anyway. It all depends on your photography and what you do.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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    Re: Bargain MFDB deals at dealers!

    Quote Originally Posted by subrata1965 View Post
    Bottom line is, it is hard to find a photographer (whom I know personally) who owns either P65+, IQ160 or IQ180 didn't order Nikon D800 yet!

    Subrata
    And they probably own iPhones as well.

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    Re: Bargain MFDB deals at dealers!

    We need to remember as well the economy still sucks and many Pros are struggling to keep the doors open. Honestly we are the worst gage of the market since things are bad or our clients have sliced our pricing to ****. My 30 times a year client is down to 6 if that tells you anything and i have nothing to do with that reduction they still love me to death but there just is no budget for them. Its a pinch and a lot of guys have gone down the tubes , its sad to watch it happen. The best gage is really the hobbyist as they spend more than we do but Im seeing a lot of them bailing for no damn good reason as well . Maybe they feel the Pros pain and following suit not sure but whatever you bought last year in MF is no dinosaur either it still is the best image quality you can get your hands on. A lot of pros have had to readjust to the market and Im sorry you would be a idiot if your not making changes to that slide. Thats us we have no choices the hobbyist has all the choices in the world to make. Some folks are willing to take a bath on this stuff and thats there choice and it does not always look good in the market and a lot of going out of business stuff that follows it. Its hard to judge this and i think a lot of mistakes are being made. It's sad to watch as i care very much about the industry that supported me for many many years.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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    Re: Bargain MFDB deals at dealers!

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Mancuso View Post
    ... whatever you bought last year in MF is no dinosaur either it still is the best image quality you can get your hands on.
    Exactly.
    Remember: adventure before dementia!

    As Oscar Wilde said, "my tastes are simple, I only like the best"

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    Re: Bargain MFDB deals at dealers!

    Quote Originally Posted by subrata1965 View Post
    Bottom line is, it is hard to find a photographer (whom I know personally) who owns either P65+, IQ160 or IQ180 didn't order Nikon D800 yet!

    Subrata
    Quote Originally Posted by stephengilbert View Post
    And they probably own iPhones as well.
    Now I feel paranoid as I qualify in that group but have no interest in ordering a D800 but I do own an iPhone....?

    My 1Ds3 still takes fab pictures and the release of the new Nikon hasn't changed this so I'm keeping a firm grip of my Canon gear.

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    Re: Bargain MFDB deals at dealers!

    See thats the problem people feel paranoid because Nikon upped the game . Frankly we should be happy and the MF market will adjust accordingly but taking 20k baths on a sale is bad for the market in a couple weeks. A market that is already very thin on users. I refuse to take a bath , I will give someone a great deal but I need to walk away with a smile too and feel good about it, luckily I made money on it so that pain is far less than the hobbyist. Really they should not be giving this away unless they have some financial trouble which I totally understand that end. I don't know Im pretty stubborn about this industry on this level so maybe I'm not the one to speak out but I don't like what I am seeing. I am happy for Nikon and the D800 certainly helps me cheat a little better but I still love and want my tech cam and a back to go with it. Nothing can touch that, its so much fun to shoot.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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    Re: Bargain MFDB deals at dealers!

    Guy,

    I agree with you. What I forgot to mention you is they all are Landscape Photographers. I'm not talking about Wildlife / Sports / Wedding photographers.

    I have even seen one of them who never used 35mm system before in his 35 yrs. of Professional Fine Art Landscape Photography career and sells his print through Ansel Adam Gallery and many others. However, at the same time he is NOT replacing his IQ180, but wants to do what IQ180 can't do as it can't do long exposure and poor high ISO performance.

    Subrata

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Mancuso View Post
    Most Pros run two systems anyway some 3 so no real surprise there but if your talking 35mm than sure the D800 is the best there is and that makes perfect sense to have a D800 and folks will sell off there Canons and older Nikons to get one or the D4 as well. Lets face it and I have said this all along its a great cheat system. You get some horsepower that is pretty obvious. But its not a replacement and I think there lies the confusion. I can't shoot great wide angle tech cam kind of movements with a Nikon, there is nothing that will match that. So yea great system but like every other system it has its limitations as well. Now if your a wildlife shooter than hell Nikon smokes a MF anyway. It all depends on your photography and what you do.

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    Re: Bargain MFDB deals at dealers!

    I have a 5Diii, 800E and Aptus II 12 (soon to be IQ180)...so there are my biases. I got the 800E so I could have something I could use out of a Kayak, easier to swallow dropping a 5K kit in Lake Superior vs. a 50K one. Having said this, I think the two serve very different purposes.

    Also, I knew when I went ownt he MFDB route, especially at the top end, that this was not for any kind of monetary gains or investment dreams, this was going to be a quickly depreciating proposition, but that is life in the fast lane.

    Coincidentally, last night, I looked at the "fun with D800" and "fun with MFDB" threads. To me, it could be some kind of placebo effect, the MFDB images look very different -- mostly in tonality and smoothness. Also, every other image on that thread is stunning. The images in the "fun with tech cam" takes this even a step further. It could be that images in the MFDB thread were taken with more care and patience, or by more experienced users, regardless, they are different.

    For me, solid ground -- MFDB, water underneath -- D800E, kids and stuff around the house -- 5DIII.

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    Re: Bargain MFDB deals at dealers!

    >Older MF film cameras are starting to sound attractive to me again

    And Leica lenses going up :-)
    Uwe Steinmueller
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    Editor&Owner of Digital Outback Photo
    http://www.outbackphoto.com

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    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: Bargain MFDB deals at dealers!

    Yes the D800 will add some functionality for folks . Just the AF alone has me excited for certain things. Long exposures absolutely and why a lots guys have a P45+ but its also a one horse pony in a way . It can't do ISO 200 for anything without bad noise.

    Damn problem is its all about compromise
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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    Re: Bargain MFDB deals at dealers!

    Quote Originally Posted by ustein View Post

    And Leica lenses going up :-)
    I am thinking bigger formats
    Jack
    home: www.getdpi.com

    "Perfection is not attainable. But if we chase perfection, we can catch excellence."

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    Senior Member bab's Avatar
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    Re: Bargain MFDB deals at dealers!

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Mancuso View Post
    We need to remember as well the economy still sucks and many Pros are struggling to keep the doors open. Honestly we are the worst gage of the market since things are bad or our clients have sliced our pricing to ****. My 30 times a year client is down to 6 if that tells you anything and i have nothing to do with that reduction they still love me to death but there just is no budget for them. Its a pinch and a lot of guys have gone down the tubes , its sad to watch it happen. The best gage is really the hobbyist as they spend more than we do but Im seeing a lot of them bailing for no damn good reason as well . Maybe they feel the Pros pain and following suit not sure but whatever you bought last year in MF is no dinosaur either it still is the best image quality you can get your hands on. A lot of pros have had to readjust to the market and Im sorry you would be a idiot if your not making changes to that slide. Thats us we have no choices the hobbyist has all the choices in the world to make. Some folks are willing to take a bath on this stuff and thats there choice and it does not always look good in the market and a lot of going out of business stuff that follows it. Its hard to judge this and i think a lot of mistakes are being made. It's sad to watch as i care very much about the industry that supported me for many many years.
    Bad economy didn't you watch CNN or MSNBC or listen to that guy on TV once and awhile...everything is going to be fine were doing good now its been tough but it takes time and things are much better now than three years ago!

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    Re: Bargain MFDB deals at dealers!

    Yea someone needs to let them know about the real world out here. Lol
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

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    Re: Bargain MFDB deals at dealers!

    Quote Originally Posted by jagsiva View Post
    I have a 5Diii, 800E and Aptus II 12 (soon to be IQ180)....
    Yeah, but what kind of phone do you have?


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    Re: Bargain MFDB deals at dealers!

    Quote Originally Posted by kdphotography View Post
    Yeah, but what kind of phone do you have?

    You KNOW the answer
    Remember: adventure before dementia!

    As Oscar Wilde said, "my tastes are simple, I only like the best"

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    Re: Bargain MFDB deals at dealers!

    MFD might be suffering some fallout from release of D800, I see that some people on the Forum have bought the 5D3 from Canon but how many Canon users are considering the shift to Nikon?

    I wonder how the marketing chaps and ladies at Canon are appraising the impact of the D800?


    Mal

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    Re: Bargain MFDB deals at dealers!

    Quote Originally Posted by jagsiva View Post
    I have a 5Diii, 800E and Aptus II 12 (soon to be IQ180)...so there are my biases. I got the 800E so I could have something I could use out of a Kayak, easier to swallow dropping a 5K kit in Lake Superior vs. a 50K one. Having said this, I think the two serve very different purposes.

    Also, I knew when I went ownt he MFDB route, especially at the top end, that this was not for any kind of monetary gains or investment dreams, this was going to be a quickly depreciating proposition, but that is life in the fast lane.
    Ditto. I had a P25+ for similar reasons that complemented my IQ160 and that was so that I wasn't so paranoid about $60k of gear being chained up in my hotel room when I travelled for work with the opportunity to shoot somewhere at the weekend. I sold it to pay for a big trip but now I want another (or P45+) to replace it for long exposure work.

    Maybe I'm just getting old and boring but I find less "need" to change "stuff" these days and would rather just get the very best and stick with it or if I do change, change up to something better each time. Not sideways, not backwards, just forwards and up. I bought the IQ as a long term imaging investment as I'll never truly be limited by it's capabilities as an imaging platform. For my Alpa it is a great system.

    I also ordered the D800E as my more general travel and universal camera system. No doubt I'll end up using it more than my DF system as it does just about everything well and there are many more glass options plus I still have a shed load of Nikon gear to go with it.
    Remember: adventure before dementia!

    As Oscar Wilde said, "my tastes are simple, I only like the best"

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    Subscriber & Workshop Member GrahamWelland's Avatar
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    Re: Bargain MFDB deals at dealers!

    Quote Originally Posted by malmac View Post
    MFD might be suffering some fallout from release of D800, I see that some people on the Forum have bought the 5D3 from Canon but how many Canon users are considering the shift to Nikon?

    I wonder how the marketing chaps and ladies at Canon are appraising the impact of the D800?


    Mal
    You know that the 5D II killed Nikon for so long. The smart Canon guys won't swap but will just wait until the next iteration. That's what the smart Nikon folks did.

    The other flippers just stimulated the economy! (if you're a pro, I respect that different rules apply)
    Last edited by GrahamWelland; 15th May 2012 at 00:10.
    Remember: adventure before dementia!

    As Oscar Wilde said, "my tastes are simple, I only like the best"

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    Re: Bargain MFDB deals at dealers!

    Quote Originally Posted by GrahamWelland View Post
    You know that the 5D II killed Nikon for so long.
    I had chance to test preproduction 5DII and D700 and pick one.

    Still have D700 for "quick and dirty" stuff, or when i need to shoot something super fast, so i don't think it "killed" anything, really. Not to start brand war, just fact of life.

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    Re: Bargain MFDB deals at dealers!

    Quote Originally Posted by malmac View Post
    MFD might be suffering some fallout from release of D800, I see that some people on the Forum have bought the 5D3 from Canon but how many Canon users are considering the shift to Nikon?

    I wonder how the marketing chaps and ladies at Canon are appraising the impact of the D800?


    Mal
    Count me as the opposite, since I've gotten my 5D3, I have sold the last of my main Nikon lenses. While I don't think of myself as loyal to one particular brand, from what I've seen with the D800, is the resolution gain. Its what I shoot most and I still prefer the look from the Canon glass, subjective of course.

    However, "Fun with MF images" thread proves it cannot be touched for all the expected gain MF actually provides, objectively of course.

    The in between is the world of creativity. However, no one denies the impact of the D800. In fact, when Canon does eventually bring out their high res 35mm, I'll probably be buying. No doubt Nikon got there first, despite Canon showed off their 100MP camera at an expo once!

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    Re: Bargain MFDB deals at dealers!

    Quote Originally Posted by stephengilbert View Post
    And they probably own iPhones as well.
    Yes, but they all are planning for Nokia 808 PureView upgrade.

    "The 8-megapixel iPhone 4S, for example, has a 1/3.2-inch type sensor. The 808's in comparison is a 1/1.2-inch type, which is quite a large sensor for a mobile device. (Do the division and you get the approximate diagonal measurement of the sensor.) That's 2.5 times larger than the one Nokia used in its 12-megapixel N8.

    Speaking of optics, Nokia's lens choice makes things even more interesting. The Carl Zeiss 5-element lens has one high-index, low-dispersion glass lens instead of being all plastic like other smartphones. It has a large f2.4 aperture with a 26mm focal length for 16:9 and 28mm for 4:3. Nokia claims the combination along with the large sensor size will give you some nice background blur for close-ups; the 808 can focus as close as 6 inches from a subject. (Add in the lossless zoom and you can get very close to what you're shooting and presumably still get great fine detail.)"

    And this could be D800 killer!!!
    Last edited by subrata1965; 14th May 2012 at 23:32.

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    Re: Bargain MFDB deals at dealers!

    Quote Originally Posted by GrahamWelland View Post
    Well, it somewhat depends on the motivation of the seller. If it were a financial emergency then you can understand taking the hit. If it's just someone deciding that they want to spend their money on something else then I would say it's a classic case of a fool and their money being easily parted.
    My personal experience is used MFDBs are good for upgrades only. No one wants to make you a decent offer, irrespective of your motivation. If you are a well known photographer / instructor, then you have better chance, otherwise forget it.

    Just check LL forum and see how many IQ160s are waiting and since how long they are trying to sell.

    And isn't we are supposed to buy from the dealers only, as we need to have the "relationship" to get the support?

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    Re: Bargain MFDB deals at dealers!

    Quote Originally Posted by malmac View Post
    MFD might be suffering some fallout from release of D800, I see that some people on the Forum have bought the 5D3 from Canon but how many Canon users are considering the shift to Nikon?

    I wonder how the marketing chaps and ladies at Canon are appraising the impact of the D800?


    Mal
    Marketing chaps @ Canon has offered up to $550 Rebate when you buy 5D MK III with additional lens and/or speed light.

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    Subscriber & Workshop Member GrahamWelland's Avatar
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    Re: Bargain MFDB deals at dealers!

    The 'value' of your digital back varies significantly depending upon whether you are upgrading to a new back vs any other sale. That's true and certainly a different model than you'll see with pretty much any other type of camera system. Try getting an attractive trade at a dealer for anything else.

    If you want a cross-grade or change down then basically you will be offered a lot lower price for your back compared to the attractive trade-ins available to move up to a brand new higher resolution back.

    The prices for private sales are entirely market driven which is basically now softer given that I suspect the enthusiast buyers are now attracted more by other very able, but cheaper offerings. I'm sure that there's a segment of buyers who previously would have considered purchasing a MFDB that are no longer going to make that step any longer. I know at least of one of my DLSR shooting friends who was teetering on the edge of getting a MFDB system but now definitely won't. Also supply isn't an issue any more so I would wager that is another factor too.

    The bottom line though is that if you want to sell quickly today on the private market then you're probably not going to get top dollar.
    Remember: adventure before dementia!

    As Oscar Wilde said, "my tastes are simple, I only like the best"

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    Re: Bargain MFDB deals at dealers!

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Mancuso View Post

    One thing for sure I'm not going to rip you off nor is a dealer.
    Guy, I have mixed experience with Phase One dealers. Some of them has bad attitude, and unless you are famous, they don't care much.

    That's the reason, I don't deal with my local dealers any longer. They try to rip you off, only offer you discount provided you get an official quote from another dealer. Then complaint to Phase One saying why other dealer is offering discount. They don't believe in free market philosophy.

    I know another Phase One dealer who had threatened one of the photographer saying that if the photographer discloses any of his personal dissatisfaction in the forum, then he will be hearing from the dealer's lawyer.

    Not necessarily everyone will get the same support from the dealers the way you used to get. It depends on overall how much business you are giving it to them. This is true for every business and fact of life.

    I hope the arrival of D800 will increase competition and will bring down the "ego factor" of some of these Phase One dealers.

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