Mamiya Leaf introduces the new Leaf CREDO

[yaya]

Yair,

I got the upgrade prices for the Credo 80 from my dealer. The cost to upgrade from the Aptus II 12 is almost the same as the cost to upgrade from the Aptus II 10. What is the logic behind this? If feel like I'm being penalized for buying your flagship product.

Hi Jag, as mentioned above this sort of upgrades are dealt with on a case-by-case base through the dealer. We'll follow up and see that what you get it worth everybody's while

BR

Yair

 

[jagsiva]

Hi Jag, as mentioned above this sort of upgrades are dealt with on a case-by-case base through the dealer. We'll follow up and see that what you get it worth everybody's while

BR

Yair

Yair, I have been working through my dealer. As I said, the pricing to go to Credo 80 from Aptus 12 is the same (actually a $840 more!!) compared to the Aptus 10. Needless to say, I am scatching my head. I have sent you an email separately as to not confuse this thread

Jag

 

[gazwas]

Yair, considering you're based in the UK, why is GB such a difficult place to buy a Leaf product in? This is the main reason why I've never owned an Leaf back due to the difficulty is finding a dealer other than Calumet who I consider too big a company to give real dealer support like smaller Phase One dealers do.

A P65+ to Credo80 might be a nice upgrade in the near future if there is a good cross platform upgrade going. I don't need all the flashy focus features of the IQ180 but the better screen and 100% focus check might be tempting.

 

[hcubell]

The real underlining issue here is there is not a damn thing out there in 35mm that can even come close to what a tech cam can do. You want great wide angle ,rise/ fall shift and movements you need a back the Credo is a great option for existing Leaf users to upgrade too or folks to buy new and when is cheaper costs a problem. LOL

Guy, I have no doubt that, under perfect test conditions where the focus with the tech camera is nailed, it will "outperform" the D800, though by how much and in what ways remains to be seen. However, I am skeptical that, in real world situations in the field shooting landscapes where critical focus is critical, the proficient user of a tech camera will be able to nail it the way a D800 can nail it with Live View. The D800 also provides more depth of field compared to an IQ180.
I expect we will see some real world testing like this at some point. I know that a Mr. Ashley in your Nikon forum has been comparing a D800 with an IQ180 on a DF, and it took him four tries, I think, to nail the focus with the DF before he could even start the comparison.
Oh, and my point was not that the D800 is every bit as good as an IQ180, but it is nonetheless a game changer. A remarkable new camera. The Credo backs cannot remotely be considered game changers. A little bit less of what Phase One has already been offering for over a year. Perhaps this line of backs will take over the "low end" of Phase One's line and Phase has something really new and different to announce at Photokina, like a CMOS chipped back with 100mp that has "real" Live View and great high ISO performance.

 

[yaya]

Yair, considering you're based in the UK, why is GB such a difficult place to buy a Leaf product in? This is the main reason why I've never owned an Leaf back due to the difficulty is finding a dealer other than Calumet who I consider too big a company to give real dealer support like smaller Phase One dealers do.

A P65+ to Credo80 might be a nice upgrade in the near future if there is a good cross platform upgrade going. I don't need all the flashy focus features of the IQ180 but the better screen and 100% focus check might be tempting.

Hi Gareth, not sure I understand as there are 4 other dealers listed on our UK page in addition to Calumet. Peartree have been around for ages and all the others know the product well and promote it regularly on their sites/ newsletters etc. Hope this helps

Yair

 

[Guy Mancuso]

Guy, I have no doubt that, under perfect test conditions where the focus with the tech camera is nailed, it will "outperform" the D800, though by how much and in what ways remains to be seen. However, I am skeptical that, in real world situations in the field shooting landscapes where critical focus is critical, the proficient user of a tech camera will be able to nail it the way a D800 can nail it with Live View. The D800 also provides more depth of field compared to an IQ180.
I expect we will see some real world testing like this at some point. I know that a Mr. Ashley in your Nikon forum has been comparing a D800 with an IQ180 on a DF, and it took him four tries, I think, to nail the focus with the DF before he could even start the comparison.
Oh, and my point was not that the D800 is every bit as good as an IQ180, but it is nonetheless a game changer. A remarkable new camera. The Credo backs cannot remotely be considered game changers. A little bit less of what Phase One has already been offering for over a year. Perhaps this line of backs will take over the "low end" of Phase One's line and Phase has something really new and different to announce at Photokina, like a CMOS chipped back with 100mp that has "real" Live View and great high ISO performance.

I already ran tests against the 160 and tech cam which are posted and Raws provided. In Nikon forum first blush.

 

[gazwas]

Hi Gareth, not sure I understand as there are 4 other dealers listed on our UK page in addition to Calumet. Peartree have been around for ages and all the others know the product well and promote it regularly on their sites/ newsletters etc. Hope this helps

Yair

Thanks Yair

I thought Teamwork were just a Phase Dealer, Peartree rental and Cambo just sold........ err.... Cambo.

As for the others, you might as well have Jessops stock it!.

 

[JonMo]

Honestly; have we gotten so lazy and spoiled as photographers that we can no longer do without "Live View"?! :facesmack:

I know looking from the past and having to use Ground Glass, Loupes and Polaroids to assess composition and focus was a pain in the butt, but now with even the Credo and it's supposed "not even close to good enough" live view there are still complaints that it will not allow perfect live image focusing or "perfect auto focus"?

Good grief, I still use an aptus 65s hand held on my Cambo RS and manage to do street photography I am happy with.

I guess I look at the advances in the cameras and backs and am looking for things like what Phase / Leaf are coming out with; finer resolution, better ISO performance, more ruggedness and finally (hopefully soon, oh please be soon) the long promised USB 3.0 interface for tethering.

If it gets to the point where the camera perfectly captures everything in every situation with no more requirement than pointing it in the correct general direction; what would anyone need me for?

Oh well, on that day I guess I can become a coffee barrista or something.

 

[Shashin]

+1

I must just have special superhuman powers to focus my cameras.

 

[gazwas]

Saying we are spoiled and lazy photographers to want better live view is just plain wrong. Who in their right mind would not want a feature that allowed critical, precision focusing, LIVE off the film plane rather than a glass/fresnel screen?

I fully understand people WANTING a better live view experience but NOT wanting it leaves me totally baffled why anyone would not want to remove one of the most fundamental aspects of capture out of the "What could go wrong" equation.

 

[Egor]

Honestly; have we gotten so lazy and spoiled as photographers that we can no longer do without "Live View"?!

Yes

I know looking from the past and having to use Ground Glass, Loupes and Polaroids to assess composition and focus was a pain in the butt, but now with even the Credo and it's supposed "not even close to good enough" live view there are still complaints that it will not allow perfect live image focusing or "perfect auto focus"?

At least in my case for studio work, It's not about focus, or even the "pia" factor...it's about money/time/access. When your camera is 10ft in the air over a complex set, their is very little time to build a scaffold, climb up there, as well as your art director, stylists, and set designer, to then look thru the tiny viewfinder, see changes that need to be made, climb back down, make the changes, shoot the shot, evaluate it....god, I'm getting tired just writing all the steps!
In the old days, before LV, we could do about 2-3 set cover shots per day, now we can do 20-30...with client signoff!!!
And let's not even talk about remote access (client is in Seattle, art director in NYC, Photo Studio in Ca,...etc.)

If it gets to the point where the camera perfectly captures everything in every situation with no more requirement than pointing it in the correct general direction; what would anyone need me for?

Oh well, on that day I guess I can become a coffee barrista or something.

I used to run a coffee cart and let me tell ya, it's no picnic, either! You think it's just coffee, but somehow there are now 300 ways to prepare it and flavors like baskinrobbins and organic, free range, sustainable, free trade....ahhhhh! No thanks!

 

[Oren Grad]

Honestly; have we gotten so lazy and spoiled as photographers that we can no longer do without "Live View"?! :facesmack:

I spend plenty of time eyeballing ground glass screens and other old-fangled focus analogs on everything from half-frame 35 cameras to big view cameras. On the large format cameras, the view on the big GG is part of the entertainment value - it's glorious!

But when I'm doing repro work with my EOS 60D + macro lens + copy stand setup, the crisp, magnified live view on the 60D swivel-LCD is a lifesaver. I get better results than anything I can manage with a magnifier clipped on the viewfinder, and more quickly and with less hassle, too. My productivity, measured by number of high-quality captures per unit of time, is way higher with the LV.

If I were trying to shoot MF digital in the field with the intent of making wall-size prints, I'd want it there too. So yes, I want to hear about what the MF vendors are doing to make progress in this area.

 

[JonMo]

I have a difficult enough time just trying to figure out HOW to order the coffee let alone make it!

The point of my statements was that the amount of angst regarding the fact the medium format systems have not been able to instantly create a match for the tech ease of the new dslr systems.

I have always felt they fill different needs.
I use a 5d mk Ii for lowlight
A 1d mk IV for sports and long lenses
A digital back for architecture and landscapes
And my aformentioned Cambo for walk around

I understand the increase in out put for some pros, I would never shoot football with my tech cam as my focussing skills are not that good; but in repro work, architecture and landscape where critical focus is required, my goto tech is tethering.

Perhaps I need better glasses for staring at tiny screens.

I don't chide people for wanting a feature ( USB 3.0 tethering please ) just find that the level of disappointment and the projection of absolute need is a bit much.

If it is that important to you that's just fine.
But I believe my own view can be considered just as valid

 

[gazwas]

I don't chide people for wanting a feature ( USB 3.0 tethering please ) just find that the level of disappointment and the projection of absolute need is a bit much.

If it is that important to you that's just fine.
But I believe my own view can be considered just as valid

Forum talk is the new Nikon D800 being a game changer. The first MF back manufacturer to pull off 20-30fps live view will be a game changer IMO and is probably one of the MOST WANTED feature of all the photographers I know who run MFD gear.

Your view may be valid for a select few but the majority, especially in combination with the new generation IQ/Credo screens are crying out for this feature.

 

[JonMo]

Sigh,
labled as a minority again.

Oh well I bow to your obvious superior knowledge and accept that oposing views are simply the ramblings of the uninformed with no contact with others in the profession.



Have a good day Gareth

 

[JonMo]

Oh and I still want leaf to activate the usb 3.0 function as soon as possible please.

That port on the IQ series with no purpose is driving us PC Laptop owners crazy.:loco:

 

[Christopher]

I for one don't care about USB3 and find it laughable, that Phase still hasn't managed to deliver a feature announced from the beginning.

Well back to the point, for me the ONLY next step which will move me to upgrade or get a new back IS CMOS and LIVEVIEW and I mean real one...

 

[SergeiR]

Yair, thanks for samples.

(PS: i couldn't care less for live view, and even less so for CMOS, now lets get back to looking at them Credo backs?)

 

[DeckardTrinity]

How many MFDB users use Mac vs PC? Last I checked, no Mac comes with USB3 natively (maybe as an add-on card for a Mac Pro). So that just leaves mainly PC users, unless this new tethering capability will work over a USB2 connection as well?

 

[JonMo]

That may just be because at one point the only laptop available with full firewire 800 was made by Mac.

By the way, the new Macs no longer have Firewire ports.

And since the Phase and Leaf products both advertised that the products were going to work with USB and have the port already I guess I can be excused as an obviously lowly PC user to hopefully have them work.

Maybe some of us prefer a laptop with an exceptional screen like the Lenovo W Series with a sturdy shock resistant body to take into the woods because we LIKE to work off a giant screen instead of the equivalent of a glorified iPhone.

Since the tethering is supposed to work for BOTH USB 3.0 and back-wards to USB 2.0; maybe it may be usable for us non Mac people since no MF back has a THUNDER port.

How insulting is "How many MFDB user use Mac vs PC?"

Last I checked even Capture 1 software worked on my laptop.

As far as getting this thread off of my being an idiot for not wanting a better live view;

I am excited by the new Credo and am wondering when the item "I" need which is already built into the back will be activated.:thumbup: