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Thread: Newest MFD member....

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    Newest MFD member....

    Hey guys-

    I just bit the bullet and now have an IQ160 for all of my landscape and African wildlife work. Just posting to say hello, and it's been a pleasure searching through some really old and not so old threads to help me determine which lenses to buy, as well as to get up to speed on other misc accessories.

    Just posting to say hello.

    Andy

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    Re: Newest MFD member....

    Congratulations! Looking forward seeing some images.

    Don
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    Re: Newest MFD member....

    Thanks, Don. I have a bunch more safaris in Africa slated for the rest of the year, and my new system will be at my side. I can't guarantee that all of my images will be captured with it, but my goal is to be able to produce the largest B&W prints that I possibly can, so hopefully it will work out. I have 6 more weeks of safaris this year, split between wildlife in Botswana and landscapes in Namibia (I am leading a PODAS event in September to Namibia). Then Iceland for 3 weeks in March and then more wildlife for the rest of the year.

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    Re: Newest MFD member....

    Sounds busy Andy. I've had a couple months off during the summer but jump back into it the end of Aug. I'll be in Montana and Wyoming until November attempting to get at least one really great fall image there.

    Looking forward to seeing the B&W.

    Don
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    Senior Member kdphotography's Avatar
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    Re: Newest MFD member....

    Congratulations, Andy!

    Aside from teasing us with great images from your photo safaris (that's one item on my bucket list) I'm sure you're going to enjoy your new MFDB!

    ken

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    Re: Newest MFD member....

    Andy,

    Congratulations for your IQ160. Would love to hear about your MF lens selections for wildlife. Hope you will share your field experience here too!

    Subrata

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    Re: Newest MFD member....

    Thanks, guys. Here is what I have so far:

    IQ160 / DF body
    28mm
    45mm
    75-150mm
    80mm

    I plan on picking up the Mamiya 300mm f/4.5, and I am also trying to get my hands on the 500mm APO (manual focus, of course). I keep hearing that the Schneider 240mm will be out 'soon', and that may change my mind on the 300mm. Who knows. My goal is to capture images that are more animalscapes, similar to a few of these images here:

    Elephants and Clouds : Timeless Africa : Andy Biggs Photo Safaris

    Giraffe Under an Acacia Tree : Timeless Africa : Andy Biggs Photo Safaris

    Elephant Reflection : Timeless Africa : Andy Biggs Photo Safaris

    Lioness Yawning : Timeless Africa : Andy Biggs Photo Safaris

    Most of these images were taken with either a 24-105mm or 70-200mm lens on 35mm camera bodies. I regularly sell 40x60" canvases, as well as 30x45" cotton rag prints, so you can see why MFD made it into my camera bag.
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    Re: Newest MFD member....

    Quote Originally Posted by Andy Biggs View Post
    Thanks, guys. Here is what I have so far:

    IQ160 / DF body
    28mm
    45mm
    75-150mm
    80mm

    I plan on picking up the Mamiya 300mm f/4.5, and I am also trying to get my hands on the 500mm APO (manual focus, of course). I keep hearing that the Schneider 240mm will be out 'soon', and that may change my mind on the 300mm. Who knows. My goal is to capture images that are more animalscapes, similar to a few of these images here:

    Elephants and Clouds : Timeless Africa : Andy Biggs Photo Safaris

    Giraffe Under an Acacia Tree : Timeless Africa : Andy Biggs Photo Safaris

    Elephant Reflection : Timeless Africa : Andy Biggs Photo Safaris

    Lioness Yawning : Timeless Africa : Andy Biggs Photo Safaris

    Most of these images were taken with either a 24-105mm or 70-200mm lens on 35mm camera bodies. I regularly sell 40x60" canvases, as well as 30x45" cotton rag prints, so you can see why MFD made it into my camera bag.
    One word of caution is that there is a significant problem using longer Mamiya lenses with a high res back like the IQ160 because of vibration issues with the mirror on the DF. I have never seen what I consider to be a sharp image made with the 300mm Mamiya, even where the camera was mounted on a tripod with MLU. It is one of the reasons I use a Hasselblad H2. The Hasselblad HC 300mm lens, like all of the HC lenses, is a leaf shutter lens and the images from it are exceptionally sharp, particularly if you can use MLU.
    Enjoy your shooting. I went to Tanzania last year and was lazy. I brought a new Panasonic GH2 and regret it.

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    Re: Newest MFD member....

    Quote Originally Posted by hcubell View Post
    One word of caution is that there is a significant problem using longer Mamiya lenses with a high res back like the IQ160 because of vibration issues with the mirror on the DF. I have never seen what I consider to be a sharp image made with the 300mm Mamiya, even where the camera was mounted on a tripod with MLU. It is one of the reasons I use a Hasselblad H2. The Hasselblad HC 300mm lens, like all of the HC lenses, is a leaf shutter lens and the images from it are exceptionally sharp, particularly if you can use MLU.
    Enjoy your shooting. I went to Tanzania last year and was lazy. I brought a new Panasonic GH2 and regret it.
    If the mirror is locked up, how can it be causing vibration issues?

    Do you mean vibration issues with the shutter on the DF?

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    Re: Newest MFD member....

    Quote Originally Posted by gerald.d View Post
    If the mirror is locked up, how can it be causing vibration issues?

    Do you mean vibration issues with the shutter on the DF?
    With the 300 it's more a case of making sure that even with MLUP that you allow vibrations to settle before firing the shutter. I find that 4+ seconds is required for super sharp landscapes. Also don't bother with the lens tripod mount unless you damp it with good long lens technique.

    For environmental animal portraits in bright african light I'm sure that someone as skilled as Andy will have no problems.
    Remember: adventure before dementia!

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    Re: Newest MFD member....

    Andy,

    Congrats on a stellar new system and welcome to "the pit."

    Jack
    home: www.getdpi.com

    "Perfection is not attainable. But if we chase perfection, we can catch excellence."

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    Re: Newest MFD member....

    Quote Originally Posted by gerald.d View Post
    If the mirror is locked up, how can it be causing vibration issues?

    Do you mean vibration issues with the shutter on the DF?
    Here's an interesting article where the consequences of large focal plane shutters are described and documented. It's an even larger format, but the principles are the same:

    Pentax67ii

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    Re: Newest MFD member....

    Quote Originally Posted by Andy Biggs View Post
    I plan on picking up the Mamiya 300mm f/4.5, and I am also trying to get my hands on the 500mm APO (manual focus, of course). I keep hearing that the Schneider 240mm will be out 'soon', and that may change my mind on the 300mm. Who knows. My goal is to capture images that are more animalscapes, similar to a few of these images here:

    Elephants and Clouds : Timeless Africa : Andy Biggs Photo Safaris

    Giraffe Under an Acacia Tree : Timeless Africa : Andy Biggs Photo Safaris

    Elephant Reflection : Timeless Africa : Andy Biggs Photo Safaris

    Lioness Yawning : Timeless Africa : Andy Biggs Photo Safaris

    Most of these images were taken with either a 24-105mm or 70-200mm lens on 35mm camera bodies. I regularly sell 40x60" canvases, as well as 30x45" cotton rag prints, so you can see why MFD made it into my camera bag.
    Those are some exceptional safari images, Andy
    Things I sell: https://www.shutterstock.com/g/epixx?language=en
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    Re: Newest MFD member....

    Quote Originally Posted by GrahamWelland View Post
    With the 300 it's more a case of making sure that even with MLUP that you allow vibrations to settle before firing the shutter. I find that 4+ seconds is required for super sharp landscapes. Also don't bother with the lens tripod mount unless you damp it with good long lens technique.

    For environmental animal portraits in bright african light I'm sure that someone as skilled as Andy will have no problems.
    From all of the images I have seen posted here, including from people who used a Cube with a heavy tripod and waited after the MLU and before releasing the shutter, nothing helps to produce critically sharp images with the 300mm. Not sure about something in the 200mm range.

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    Re: Newest MFD member....

    what about the 210mm as my longest landscape lens? Any of the same issues apply?

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    Re: Newest MFD member....

    Quote Originally Posted by Jorgen Udvang View Post
    Here's an interesting article where the consequences of large focal plane shutters are described and documented. It's an even larger format, but the principles are the same:

    Pentax67ii
    Thanks - that is interesting, but it is dealing with very slow shutter speeds indeed, and seemed to imply that shutter vibrations come in at under 1/30th of a second, and mirror ones at under 1/125th.

    Not that I'm challenging Graham's experience, but 4 seconds to allow for damping following a mirror lock-up is surprising to me.

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    Re: Newest MFD member....

    Just as an FYI, I am more likely to use the 300mm on a bean bag for wildlife with shutter speeds that will hopefully be faster than 1/125.

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    Re: Newest MFD member....

    I had the pleasure of testing a Mamiya 300 late last year while in Jackson Hole and afterwards decided to go back 100% medium format. The images here are all from the backside of the National Elk Refuge from distances of several 100 yards to as close to just several. I offer the full image then a 100% crop. These were all quick handheld no tripod shots with the ISO set at 100 and the f/stop either 8 or 11 and shutter speeds as low as 400 and high as 800.

    Recognizing the fact they were all shot handheld I can only image how much better they'd be with some sort of support. Also forgot to add these were taken with the P65+ which is basically the same as the IQ160; actually I consider the !Q160 just a supped up version of the P65+.













    With the understanding that I'm a landscape photographer first and nature/wildlife way down the list; I am nevertheless quite please with the 300 and 60 megapixels.

    Don

    No processing was done with any of the files other than to open duplice, crop at 100% then save the files.
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    Re: Newest MFD member....

    Quote Originally Posted by hcubell View Post
    From all of the images I have seen posted here, including from people who used a Cube with a heavy tripod and waited after the MLU and before releasing the shutter, nothing helps to produce critically sharp images with the 300mm. Not sure about something in the 200mm range.
    Here's the 300mm*** wide open on an AF with an IQ180. MLU was used, but take into account this was on a robotic pano head that was panning between shots.

    Pano head moves, stops, MLU half a second later, shot taken 3 seconds after that, then onto the next one (total of around 120 shots in this).

    Obviously ignore the background, and just check out the bits of the tree that are in focus to judge sharpness!

    Virtual Tour generated by Panotour

    /edit

    Alternatively, just ignore my post and check out Don's

    *** - this is the manual focus 300/2.8 I should add.

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    Re: Newest MFD member....

    Quote Originally Posted by Andy Biggs View Post
    Just as an FYI, I am more likely to use the 300mm on a bean bag for wildlife with shutter speeds that will hopefully be faster than 1/125.
    Based on limited experience from last year you should have no problems.
    Don Libby
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    Re: Newest MFD member....

    Quote Originally Posted by Andy Biggs View Post
    Just as an FYI, I am more likely to use the 300mm on a bean bag for wildlife with shutter speeds that will hopefully be faster than 1/125.
    I think that with your long lens experience you'll be fine. The bean bag will dampen any resonance/ringing which I feel affects quality.
    Remember: adventure before dementia!

    As Oscar Wilde said, "my tastes are simple, I only like the best"

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    Re: Newest MFD member....

    Quote Originally Posted by Don Libby View Post
    I had the pleasure of testing a Mamiya 300 late last year while in Jackson Hole and afterwards decided to go back 100% medium format. The images here are all from the backside of the National Elk Refuge from distances of several 100 yards to as close to just several. I offer the full image then a 100% crop. These were all quick handheld no tripod shots with the ISO set at 100 and the f/stop either 8 or 11 and shutter speeds as low as 400 and high as 800.

    Recognizing the fact they were all shot handheld I can only image how much better they'd be with some sort of support. Also forgot to add these were taken with the P65+ which is basically the same as the IQ160; actually I consider the !Q160 just a supped up version of the P65+.

    No processing was done with any of the files other than to open duplice, crop at 100% then save the files.
    Each to his own, but I do not consider these examples "sharp". I think they are very soft, even by web standards. In the top photo and the crop from it, nothing appears to be in critical focus.
    I don't ascribe this to technique. I think it is a function of the physics of the equipment. The DF, the IQ 160 and the shorter Mamiya/Phase lenses can provide extraordinary image quality, but IMO it falls very short in performance with longer lenses.

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    Re: Newest MFD member....

    Quote Originally Posted by Andy Biggs View Post
    Just as an FYI, I am more likely to use the 300mm on a bean bag for wildlife with shutter speeds that will hopefully be faster than 1/125.
    Andy, the best thing to do is to borrow a Mamiya 210mm and a 300mm and test them alongside your regular 35mm DSLR 135mm and 200mm lenses using the same shutter speeds and support system(i.e., a bean bag or the special RRS safari setup that you configured with RRS). Obviously, you are very experienced, and the best judge of what works for you and whether these Mamiya lenses with the DF are a stepup from from what you have been using. OTOH, the DF/IQ160with the Mamiya 150D and the shorter lenses will produce amazing results (if you can get close enough!).

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    Re: Newest MFD member....

    Have to admit I'm struggling with this a bit. Maybe I need new eyes, or a new brain.

    What exactly is the critical difference between shooting with a 150 and a 300 that makes it impossible to get a sharp image with the 300, whilst the 150 will produce amazing results?

    Howard, you're not saying there's a subtle or gradual change here. You are claiming that "amazing results" are possible with a 150mm lens, and "nothing helps to produce critically sharp images with the 300mm".

    Is it the quality of the lens itself (and are you referring to the /4.5, /2.8 or both?), or a fundamental limit based on some function of its focal length, the camera, and digital back?

    I can't see how it can be anything to do with the focal length. Assuming a subject lit in direct sunlight, you'd be looking at, what, about a 1/1000th or 1/1500th of a second shutter speed at f/2.8. And that's at ISO35? That's plenty fast enough to freeze your subject hand-held without worrying about mirror slap or shutter bounce, surely?

    Conversely, the Hassy HC300 is f/4.5, so you're already over a stop slower with that, not to mention limited to 1/800th shutter speed anyway.

    Is your point regarding technical challenges around the focal plane shutter and mirror of the DF, or simply that the HC300 is a far superior piece of glass?

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    Re: Newest MFD member....

    Quote Originally Posted by gerald.d View Post
    Have to admit I'm struggling with this a bit. Maybe I need new eyes, or a new brain.

    What exactly is the critical difference between shooting with a 150 and a 300 that makes it impossible to get a sharp image with the 300, whilst the 150 will produce amazing results?

    Howard, you're not saying there's a subtle or gradual change here. You are claiming that "amazing results" are possible with a 150mm lens, and "nothing helps to produce critically sharp images with the 300mm".

    Is it the quality of the lens itself (and are you referring to the /4.5, /2.8 or both?), or a fundamental limit based on some function of its focal length, the camera, and digital back?

    I can't see how it can be anything to do with the focal length. Assuming a subject lit in direct sunlight, you'd be looking at, what, about a 1/1000th or 1/1500th of a second shutter speed at f/2.8. And that's at ISO35? That's plenty fast enough to freeze your subject hand-held without worrying about mirror slap or shutter bounce, surely?

    Conversely, the Hassy HC300 is f/4.5, so you're already over a stop slower with that, not to mention limited to 1/800th shutter speed anyway.

    Is your point regarding technical challenges around the focal plane shutter and mirror of the DF, or simply that the HC300 is a far superior piece of glass?
    I think the Hassy 300mm lens produces much better results because it's a leaf shutter lens. The vibration from the focal plane shutter of the DF, particularly at slower shutter speeds, is probably a good part of the problem. I have no idea as to the inherent optical quality of the Mamiya 300mm lens. I just look at results. I tested the DF/P65 with the Mamiya 150mm D lens, and the results were VERY sharp. Long telephoto lenses are just more susceptible to a drop in image quality from the slightest form of vibration. You don't have to be an engineer to feel and hear the difference between using an H2 and and a DF. The former makes a barely audible click in the leaf shutter when you do MLU and release the shutter with a remote cable. The latter, even with MLU, still makes a lot of noise and you can feel the shutter release. I would assume that the faster the shutter speed, the less of a problem this would be, but I would still want to test it out if a 300mm lens were a key part of my kit. I use my 300mm lens a lot. My 35mm lens sits in my bag.
    BTW, if the issue is with the DF's focal plane shutter, I assume the issue would still be there even with Phase's new 240mm leaf shutter lens.

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    Re: Newest MFD member....

    The comments on the leaf shutter are right on the mark. The 300 is one of the most demanding lenses on MFDB. I find that its a kind of "smack you in the head" lens - capable of rewarding exacting technique with great results, and also making a fool if anything less than really careful. It needs slow steady work, solid tripod, MLU and fast shutter speeds if possible.

    The shot below is taken with a Schneider 300 (leaf shutter) on a Leaf back, with MLU and a very gentle hand. The crop on the right gives a sense of the resolution (see spider webs) on this limb some 30 yds away. Note the shallow DOF.

    For action shots, the 300 is pretty unusable. Rather the 150 mm with 1/1000 shutter (as opposed to the 1/500 max on the 300) is much easier. Surprisingly, the 300 (with only MF) is better with landscape than action, at least in this setup.
    Last edited by Geoff; 2nd January 2013 at 19:12.

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    Re: Newest MFD member....

    The Pentax 300mm f/5.6 is not the greatest lens (optically, the f/4 is far better), but there is no reason you can't handhold it--and I am not even trying. 1/250, f/8, Pentax 645D, and chasing a hummingbird around my garden. I see no motion blur and no more than the bird or bush would introduce.

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    Re: Newest MFD member....

    Here is a JPEG of a recent photo taken with the Hassy HC 300mm lens at sunrise in Tuscany. On a tripod f/16 at .3 seconds. There are also two crops of small details, one taken from the first file focused on the hay bale and the second from a second file that was focused on the farmhouse. These would be blended together in Helicon Focus. I hope this works.
    Oh, IQ 180 on the H2.
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    Re: Newest MFD member....

    Really lovely images Andy.

    Like Shashin, I find the 645D hand-holdable - not ideal but acceptable.

    Handheld 400mm f/5.6 and actual pixel crop:


    1_IGP7118 by tsjanik47, on Flickr


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    Re: Newest MFD member....

    Quote Originally Posted by hcubell View Post
    I think the Hassy 300mm lens produces much better results because it's a leaf shutter lens. The vibration from the focal plane shutter of the DF, particularly at slower shutter speeds, is probably a good part of the problem. I have no idea as to the inherent optical quality of the Mamiya 300mm lens. I just look at results. I tested the DF/P65 with the Mamiya 150mm D lens, and the results were VERY sharp. Long telephoto lenses are just more susceptible to a drop in image quality from the slightest form of vibration. You don't have to be an engineer to feel and hear the difference between using an H2 and and a DF. The former makes a barely audible click in the leaf shutter when you do MLU and release the shutter with a remote cable. The latter, even with MLU, still makes a lot of noise and you can feel the shutter release. I would assume that the faster the shutter speed, the less of a problem this would be, but I would still want to test it out if a 300mm lens were a key part of my kit. I use my 300mm lens a lot. My 35mm lens sits in my bag.
    BTW, if the issue is with the DF's focal plane shutter, I assume the issue would still be there even with Phase's new 240mm leaf shutter lens.
    Thanks.

    Clearly a leaf shutter is preferable given the same shutter speed - I don't think anyone would challenge that.

    However, given that with the DF option, you can go with an f/2.8 lens, and up to 1/4000th shutter speed, I don't believe the situation is as cut and dried as you were claiming in your earlier post.

    It would be a shame if someone clearly as accomplished with long lenses as Andy were put off from including a 300mm lens in his new kit based on your comments.

    Kind regards,

    Gerald.

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    Re: Newest MFD member....

    Thought I'd have a look at how the 300/2.8 is on a slow shutter speed.

    1/15th, ISO100, f/8.

    Phase One AF, MLU, Arca Cube and Gitzo 2540 LLVL.

    Focused at around 10 feet, so very close to the limit of the lens.

    Full frame:



    100% crop:



    Considering that at this shutter speed supposedly the shutter vibration can mess things up, that's not too bad, is it?

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    Re: Newest MFD member....

    Read this thread especially posts from me on the 300mm which I have tested and used a lot. I even posted a test but can't seem to find it . Post 20


    http://forum.getdpi.com/forum/medium...0-4-5-apo.html
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    Re: Newest MFD member....

    Congrats Andy, you'll enjoy working with the IQ160.

    I wouldn't worry about the 300mm unless your exposures are less than 1/100. In all of the images you linked I can't imagine the shutter speed is slow enough to cause problems. You would have more problems with blurry subjects before the vibration becomes a problem.

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    Re: Newest MFD member....

    At this moment I am more likely to get the older 300mm f/2.8 APO, primarily because of the faster aperture and hefty mass. I might also be able to use their old 2x teleconverter as well.

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    Re: Newest MFD member....

    Andy !.

    Welcome to the world of MF, you won't be dissapointed !.


    Quote Originally Posted by Andy Biggs View Post
    At this moment I am more likely to get the older 300mm f/2.8 APO, primarily because of the faster aperture and hefty mass. I might also be able to use their old 2x teleconverter as well.
    I'd agree with that also.

    I took the 300mm f4.5 on the 645D III to Homer recently to shoot Eagles, and frankly hated it. (both handheld, and tripod with all the normal long lens techniques). It was very hard to get a critically sharp frame.

    I found I had to shoot > 1/1000s to even come close.

    Also, even assuming 'sharp', I found the overall quality wasn't up to expectations of the IQ. Certainly looked nothing like the images from even the 80mm (never mind the stuff of the tech camera). The shots were 'mushy', feather detail was lost, etc etc.

    Andy's ability far far exceeds mine, but I would not recommend that lens (300mm 4.5) for wildlife.

    Regards

    Mark Farnan

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    Workshop Member Wayne Fox's Avatar
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    Re: Newest MFD member....

    Welcome Andy! Always good to hear more from you ...

    I have the 300 4.5 and and the shutter bounce can definitely be problematic ... may even be worse on a tripod. I think part of the problem is just the balance of the lens ... the 75- 150 doesn't seem to be an issue at all. You may want to experiment with mounting ... I think I get better shots with the camera still mounted to the tripod, so the weight of the lens is pulling down. The 2.8 makes a lot of sense in your case to get some faster shutter speeds, as does sand bags - haven't tried that. I am considering ordering this long lens support from RRS to see if it can help. I always take several images and the sharpness varies from shot to shot.

    The best answer might be the 240mm LS lens if it has enough reach for you. That should be much easier to get sharp images with. I don't do much telephoto, the 75-150 I have is a very sharp copy, and 150 seems to be enough for most of what I do. Hopefully someday I will get a chance to go to Africa where I would definitely want some good telephoto options.
    wayne
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    Re: Newest MFD member....

    I am wondering why you don't use Nikon D800 or Canon 5D MIII for wildlife photography. There are many more lens choices to choose from.
    High ISO, VR/IS, continuous shooting mode etc. are clearly more advantageous.

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    Re: Newest MFD member....

    Although not specifically related to the Mamiya 300mm, as some have illustrated in this thread, the Pentax 645D MFD camera along with various Pentax telephoto 645 lenses such as the FA 300mm and FA 400mm, aquaints itself to long lens use quite nicely.

    I just took the attached shot with the 645D and Pentax 600 f5.6 A* 645 Manual focus lens in part for continued testing of this lens. Tripod mounted of course but image would have greatly benefited from using additional long lens techniques.

    (OK, so it's the obligitory cat picture )

    Dave (D&A)
    Last edited by D&A; 27th July 2012 at 05:15.
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    Subscriber & Workshop Member GrahamWelland's Avatar
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    Re: Newest MFD member....

    Quote Originally Posted by Wayne Fox View Post
    I am considering ordering this long lens support from RRS to see if it can help. I always take several images and the sharpness varies from shot to shot.
    Wayne,

    I'll be interested to hear of your experiences with the RRS mount. I bought one and tried it for a while but ended up reverting to using MUP and extended delay as I wasn't seeing the expected image quality improvements with the support as I also was still getting variable results.

    That said that was with my first copy of this lens so maybe I'll give it another try ...
    Remember: adventure before dementia!

    As Oscar Wilde said, "my tastes are simple, I only like the best"

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    Re: Newest MFD member....

    Quote Originally Posted by Landscapelover View Post
    I am wondering why you don't use Nikon D800 or Canon 5D MIII for wildlife photography. There are many more lens choices to choose from.
    High ISO, VR/IS, continuous shooting mode etc. are clearly more advantageous.
    I am, actually. I would like for my IQ160 to be used as much as possible, and the longer I can get 'out there' with a long lens, to a point, the better. 200mm equivalent in 35mm terms would be nice, but not necessary. It all comes down to making better images where wildlife is only part of the frame, and this doesn't require a huge/long lens.

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    Re: Newest MFD member....

    Quote Originally Posted by Wayne Fox View Post
    The best answer might be the 240mm LS lens if it has enough reach for you. That should be much easier to get sharp images with.
    Perhaps, but I doubt 240mm will be enough focal length for me. I thought long and hard about getting into the Contax system so I could use their 350mm lens.

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    Re: Newest MFD member....

    Quote Originally Posted by D&A View Post
    Although not specifically related to the Mamiya 300mm, as some have illustrated in this thread, the Pentax 645D MFD camera along with various Pentax telephoto 645 lenses such as the FA 300mm and FA 400mm, aquaints itself to long lens use quite nicely.

    I just took the attached shot with the 645D and Pentax 600 f5.6 A* 645 Manual focus lens in part for continued testing of this lens. Tripod mounted of course but image would have greatly benefited from using additional long lens techniques.

    (OK, so it's the obligitory cat picture )

    Dave (D&A)
    Hi Dave:

    Nice to see you posting here; I thought you went over to the D800

    What are your impressions of the 600mm? It's a lens I'm very interested in trying.

    Tom

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    Re: Newest MFD member....

    Hi Tom,

    I don't want to take up too much space here with my response, as the thread is mostly about long lens options with the IQ/Mamiya system. I hope though it does provide some info that long lens options are avaialble in medium format and in some cases can hold their own (with of course limitations) against 35mm systems.

    In response to your question, nope, haven't gone to the "dark side"...LOL, although I am using both the D800E and 645D currently for different purposes. The 100% crop I attached to this response is only partially indicative of what the Pentax 600mm 645 lens is capable of. The reason I say partially, is that the shot was taken at ISO 1000 due to low light conditions, which in itself is good on the 645D, but will indroduce some noise and loss of detail. Addtionally the reason I haven't completed and posted my evaluation of this lens's performance, is I'm finding that slight changes in how both the 645D as well as the lens is handled during shooting as related to techinique, can often yield widely variable results. This posted shot, which was solely taken as part of a test was where the lens was simply mounted on a Wimberbley side arm and it was in free rotation mode on both axis, not an ideal set-up for extracting maxium sharpness nor performance. A two point support where both the lens and 645D are independently supported (seperately) yields considerably greater sharpness...yet of course is impractical for moving subjects. So in essence, I purposely took this shot knowing that a number of important variables were not optimumly set (free floating axis while shooting, ISO 1000, subject slighting moving, no cable release, single support for lens only etc.). Of course the lens is manual focus.

    So the short/brief answer to your question is the lens is capable of excellent, sharp professional results at f8 and beyond for use in very sizeable large format prints and when used at f5.6, is eminantly useful for decent-good sharpness and output with a fairly noticable but not tremendously significant drop in performance. Some limitations may be present when shooting at f5.6, depending what ones desired output and use of the files are going to be. At f8 and especially beyond, the resolving power and capability of the lens went well beyond expectations. Again this is from use of the lens on a cropped 645 body (the 645D). One though should not expect the extreme acuity of lenses such as the current Nikon Supertelephotos, but the pentax 600mm does hold it's own in a great many situations.

    I'm also testing this lens with Pentax's 1.4x teleconverter under various conditions and when optimal, it's quite promising (for fairly critical use).
    Results with proper lens/camera support along with impecable technique and shooting at low ISO is of course superior...but that would not have been real world shooting in this particular situation. These particular "Little ones" are constantly moving/heavily breathing and rarely sit still...LOL!

    Dave (D&A)

    (100% Crop of the full frame image that was posted in a previous post, with light to moderate non-optimal sharpening applied)
    Last edited by D&A; 29th July 2012 at 05:55.
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    Re: Newest MFD member....

    Quote Originally Posted by GrahamWelland View Post
    Wayne,

    I'll be interested to hear of your experiences with the RRS mount. I bought one and tried it for a while but ended up reverting to using MUP and extended delay as I wasn't seeing the expected image quality improvements with the support as I also was still getting variable results.

    That said that was with my first copy of this lens so maybe I'll give it another try ...
    I cheated and made one of these with a six inch mounting rail. Mounted the lens to one end and nylon screws with rubber bumpers on the other end. Made a huge difference.

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    Re: Newest MFD member....

    Hasselblad 300mm on a tripod with a remote (Wireless) shutter release about ten feet from the Goldfinch. This lens continues to astonish me regarding its resolution

    Stanley
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    Re: Newest MFD member....

    Quote Originally Posted by hcubell View Post
    I use a Hasselblad H2. The Hasselblad HC 300mm lens, like all of the HC lenses, is a leaf shutter lens and the images from it are exceptionally sharp, particularly if you can use MLU.
    Enjoy your shooting. I went to Tanzania last year and was lazy. I brought a new Panasonic GH2 and regret it.
    I have H4D-60/HC300mm and a GH2/14-140mm.

    The H4D is about four times as many pixels, but you do not need much vibration to get a worse picture with the bigger camera... and the GH2 works well at high ISO for high shutter speeds.

    The format is, I think 24mm as opposed to 53.7mm, so the angular field of view with the 14-140 at the top end would be similar.

    For narrow angles of view I have a Novoflex with 400mm and 640mm lens heads, which I can use on the GH2...

    As the Novoflex lenses have no glass behind the aperture (making it easy to add a copal shutter), I am thinking about using these lens heads on my Sinar P3 with my 60Mpx?
    Last edited by dick; 30th July 2012 at 11:16.

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    Subscriber & Workshop Member GrahamWelland's Avatar
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    Re: Newest MFD member....

    Quote Originally Posted by Wayne Fox View Post
    I am considering ordering this long lens support from RRS to see if it can help. I always take several images and the sharpness varies from shot to shot.
    I decided to give my RRS bracket another try with my newer 300/4.5 APO & DF/IQ160. I also tested with/without MUP and MUP & delay. As would be expected shooting without MUP at less than 1/500 was soft - even on the tripod. Due to light conditions I was shooting 1/40 - 1/3rd second here at f/8 /f7.1 which typically is a nightmare for shutter/MUP bounce or any other type of possible ringing vibration.

    Anyway, with the new copy of the lens and the RRS bracket I was getting very acceptable results. All MUP & 4 sec delay on release.:







    1/40 @ f/8 ISO50:




    1/3 @ f/7.1 ISO50:


    100% crop - LR std output no sharpening. With deconvolution sharpening this renders extremely sharply and remember this is 100% pixel peep unsharpened:
    Remember: adventure before dementia!

    As Oscar Wilde said, "my tastes are simple, I only like the best"
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  48. #48
    Senior Member etrump's Avatar
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    Re: Newest MFD member....

    Quote Originally Posted by GrahamWelland View Post

    100% crop - LR std output no sharpening. With deconvolution sharpening this renders extremely sharply and remember this is 100% pixel peep unsharpened:
    What are you using for deconvolution sharpening?

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    Workshop Member Wayne Fox's Avatar
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    Re: Newest MFD member....

    did you try it with the camera mounted to the tripod instead of the lens? That's what I'm thinking of trying. I think I get better results most of the time now without the lens support using my 300 and the DF mounted to the tripod.
    wayne
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    Subscriber & Workshop Member GrahamWelland's Avatar
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    Re: Newest MFD member....

    Ed,

    I've just been using ACR/LR 4.1 which brings on deconvolution sharpening with higher levels of the detail setting. It seems a lot gentler and cleaner than C1 Pro sharpening IMHO which seems to add artifacts quickly. That said, I haven't compared these images in print with those processed in C1.

    These were all done using just the default sharpen settings in ACR with nothing extra added other than down sampling for the web.

    I know that Topaz and Focus Magic have deconvolution too but I dare say there are others too.
    Remember: adventure before dementia!

    As Oscar Wilde said, "my tastes are simple, I only like the best"

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