Site Sponsors
Page 3 of 8 FirstFirst 1 2 3 4 5 ... LastLast
Results 101 to 150 of 381

Thread: Anyone excited about the Hasselblad rumor and Photokina this year?

  1. #101
    Senior Member MaxKißler's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Berlin
    Posts
    387
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Anyone excited about the Hasselblad rumor and Photokina this year?

    It will be interesting to read about all the frustration and disappointment built up by all that desire and high expectations when Hasselblad will release just something like a H4D-80 but nothing truely new...

  2. #102
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Posts
    528
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Anyone excited about the Hasselblad rumor and Photokina this year?

    Which is pretty much what I am expecting, maybe the really exciting part will be the battery solution for both the H4D60 and the H4D80.... (that would make some people really joyful)

  3. #103
    Senior Member KeithL's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    832
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Anyone excited about the Hasselblad rumor and Photokina this year?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dustbak View Post
    Which is pretty much what I am expecting, maybe the really exciting part will be the battery solution for both the H4D60 and the H4D80.... that would make some people really joyful)
    ...and others weep.

  4. #104
    Senior Member ondebanks's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Posts
    518
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Anyone excited about the Hasselblad rumor and Photokina this year?

    Quote Originally Posted by georgl View Post
    ...but in 2012, most medium format-lenses are still at the technical level of the 1970s...
    Ah, come now. No medium format lens in the 1970s had aspherical elements, vanishingly few had exotic low dispersion (ED or ULD) glass or could be truly called APOs, and multicoating was only a few layers thick. Leaf shutters were slower, and imprecisely timed by springs (except the Rollei SLX). There was no AF or IF.

    It's not that all those things are essential to create technically great images - some lenses of that generation can scarcely be bettered today, and I'm still happy to use them. But it's not accurate to say that MF lens designs have not moved on in the years since.

    I have noticed a strong correlation between lens design generation and performance, especially among the Japanese MF manufacturers. Mamiya, Bronica, Pentax and Fuji really upped their lens game from about the mid-1980s onwards. I find that those who are dismissive of say, M645 or RB67 or Pentax 67 glass, are typically talking about their experiences with some of the 1970s designs. Again, that is not to say that some of the older designs are not also stellar: the Mamiya 24mm ULD fisheye has never been surpassed in MF, to take one example, and used samples still command a 4-digit dollar price to this day, because it's just so damn good even on the 60 and 80 MP digital backs. But look at what Mamiya had in the 1970s (1st gen RB67 and M645 lenses; plus mainly-1960s-designed TLR and Press lenses) and compare it to what they designed in the 1990s: new APO telephotos for the M645, 645AF, RB and RZ; 120/4 macro; K/L lenses for the RB; L lenses and ULD wideangles for the RZ; the entire lens ranges of the Mamiya 6 and the Mamiya 7! And you're telling me they're not technically better?

    I'm not as familiar with the Hasselblad lenses, but when Marc says he sold all his V lenses when he tested them against his H lenses, I believe he knew exactly what he was doing.

    Ray

  5. #105
    Super Duper
    Senior Member

    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Royal Oak, MI and Palm Harbor, FL
    Posts
    8,498
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    44

    Re: Anyone excited about the Hasselblad rumor and Photokina this year?

    I think the excitement and speculative anticipation is driven by the wording of the press release.

    Using a historical reference to the launch of the H system seems to promise something quite new in MFD ... which I doubt would be the more specialized digital Xpan and more on the magnitude of the H system at the time of it's unveiling ... which was new from the ground up.

    Depends on the level of hype injected into the press release, but the way I read it the release seems to strongly hint that the H is being replaced, or augmented with a totally new camera.

    What it might be is anyone's guess ... but I will say there is nothing about it that I've been able to squeeze out of anyone. Not a peep, squeak, or vague hint what-so-ever.

    Yes, the H4D/60 battery would make me happy

    -Marc

  6. #106
    Member Miller's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Posts
    66
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Anyone excited about the Hasselblad rumor and Photokina this year?

    Marc,

    I think the ambition the new owners have worded when acquiring the company also may play a role.
    Anyhow, let's hope that the excitement of all the non-Hasselblad users does not take its toll...

    Frans Rutten

  7. #107
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Costa Rica, central america
    Posts
    319
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Anyone excited about the Hasselblad rumor and Photokina this year?

    Quote Originally Posted by MaxKißler View Post
    It will be interesting to read about all the frustration and disappointment built up by all that desire and high expectations when Hasselblad will release just something like a H4D-80 but nothing truely new...
    In my case before committing money for a MF system, I need MF manufacturers to show that they are committed first.

    In the case of Hasselblad the new group have had little time to build something fully new.

    If something truly new appears it's more likely the reason they buy, or if build on this short timeframe maybe a buggy implementation.

    If they introduce a H4D-80 or a H5D-80 and they announce at Photokina or soon later a H4D-320 I will be more than happy.

    MS camera with a Dalsa sensor will show the will to invest.

    Jut introducing a H4D-80 will not be enough.
    A supreme H5D system will do even without the MS Dalsa.

    In different words, at this moment for me, is show me that you are not taking the last revenue out of a dying product.

    Show me that you believe in your product.

    Best regards,
    James

  8. #108
    Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Karlsruhe, Germany
    Posts
    174
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Anyone excited about the Hasselblad rumor and Photokina this year?

    I'll second that as i received an invitation from Hasselblad yesterday
    for photokina 2012. With the invitation they did send a note that they
    are going to sell all of their CFV and H4D bodies demo gear now
    (including the H4D-60 and H4D-200MS).

    They did sell few pieces here and there in the past
    (my wife was lucky to grab the CFV-16 from them) but
    never sold the entire set of bodies they carry to
    shows and HB dealer events etc.

    Anyway, we all know more in less than three weeks from now.

    Quote Originally Posted by fotografz View Post
    I think the excitement and speculative anticipation is driven by the wording of the press release.

    Using a historical reference to the launch of the H system seems to promise something quite new in MFD ... which I doubt would be the more specialized digital Xpan and more on the magnitude of the H system at the time of it's unveiling ... which was new from the ground up.

    Depends on the level of hype injected into the press release, but the way I read it the release seems to strongly hint that the H is being replaced, or augmented with a totally new camera.

    What it might be is anyone's guess ... but I will say there is nothing about it that I've been able to squeeze out of anyone. Not a peep, squeak, or vague hint what-so-ever.

    Yes, the H4D/60 battery would make me happy

    -Marc

  9. #109
    Subscriber Member jotloob's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    KEMPTEN / GERMANY
    Posts
    1,513
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    116

    Re: Anyone excited about the Hasselblad rumor and Photokina this year?

    Ralf

    I got that invitation from Mr.Seidel yesterday as well and was wondering
    why they would sell Demo Gear before the photkina and not after .
    Do they want to get rid of all H4Dxx gear because a new system comes along ?
    Regards . Jürgen .
    -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

  10. #110
    Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Karlsruhe, Germany
    Posts
    174
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Anyone excited about the Hasselblad rumor and Photokina this year?

    Hi Jürgen (and sorry for not talking to you for quite some time but i was a little bit "under water" with some other stuff the last couple of months),

    from the list they send it appears to be the entire set of bodies they have
    as demo gear.

    So now draw your own conclusions

    Cheers,
    Ralf


    Quote Originally Posted by jotloob View Post
    Ralf

    I got that invitation from Mr.Seidel yesterday as well and was wondering
    why they would sell Demo Gear before the photkina and not after .
    Do they want to get rid of all H4Dxx gear because a new system comes along ?

  11. #111
    Senior Member KeithL's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    832
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Anyone excited about the Hasselblad rumor and Photokina this year?

    Quote Originally Posted by rmueller View Post
    from the list they send it appears to be the entire set of bodies they have
    as demo gear.
    This gets more and more interesting.

    In the UK the Procentre has massive discounts on most of their pre-owned H series stock but not on the V series.

    As you say "draw your own conclusions".

  12. #112
    Super Duper
    Senior Member

    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Royal Oak, MI and Palm Harbor, FL
    Posts
    8,498
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    44

    Re: Anyone excited about the Hasselblad rumor and Photokina this year?

    Quote Originally Posted by Miller View Post
    Marc,

    I think the ambition the new owners have worded when acquiring the company also may play a role.
    Anyhow, let's hope that the excitement of all the non-Hasselblad users does not take its toll...

    Frans Rutten
    Yes Frans, I am holding my enthusiasm in check for now.

    Another speculative point could be deduced from the nature of the new owners ... which are heavily vested in high-tech ventures, and seem to be European centric. Plus I believe all operations have been united back to Sweden ... and that move even affected service times, as it was/is being done in-mass and pretty quickly.

    Add these clues to others mentioned, and it does seem that something is definitely up.

    If it is a totally ground-up new system, it will be interesting how current Hasselblad users will be treated/supported. My H system investment is not insignificant.

    -Marc

  13. #113
    Member Douglas Fairbank's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    London
    Posts
    35
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Anyone excited about the Hasselblad rumor and Photokina this year?

    Quote Originally Posted by KeithL View Post
    Bengt, can you post a link to the announcement please?
    Quote Originally Posted by Bengt Nyman View Post
    Gary,
    About a month ago Hasselblad announced that on 18 September 2012 they will be introducing an "almost" medium format mirror-less camera. It was mentioned that the format would be 2xFF. Interpreted literally this could mean 36x48 mm. It was also mentioned that this new Hasselblad camera would have a sensor by Sony and other content by Fuji. Further details, including resolution, ISO and more were not specified leaving lots of room for speculation.
    Here is a copy of a press invitation from Hasselblad, no link available for this, sorry.

    "In 2002 at photokina Hasselblad launched the revolutionary H System that changed and shaped the medium format market of the new millennium. Embraced by professional and amateur photographers around the world, it is still the unsurpassed standard for craftsmanship and ultimate image quality.

    In 2012, 10 years later, our commitment to innovation, evolution and expanding to new horizons is as uncompromising as it has always been in the century-long history of Hasselblad.

    We are pleased to invite you to the Hasselblad Press Conference at photokina 2012, which will take place Tuesday, September 18th 2012, 14.00 - 15.00 at Koelnmesse, Kristallsaal Sektion 3, Entrance West."

  14. #114
    Senior Member KeithL's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    832
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Anyone excited about the Hasselblad rumor and Photokina this year?

    Thanks, Douglas, just as I remembered, no mention of any specific product.

  15. #115
    Senior Member KeithL's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    832
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Anyone excited about the Hasselblad rumor and Photokina this year?

    Interestingly enough, the Procentre is not discounting H series lenses.

  16. #116
    Subscriber Member jotloob's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    KEMPTEN / GERMANY
    Posts
    1,513
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    116

    Re: Anyone excited about the Hasselblad rumor and Photokina this year?

    Quote Originally Posted by KeithL View Post
    This gets more and more interesting.

    In the UK the Procentre has massive discounts on most of their pre-owned H series stock but not on the V series.

    As you say "draw your own conclusions".
    . . . . . but not the V-Series ! ! !

    ALPA friends , who also have V-System lenses , keep them ! ! !
    There is a strong rumor , that ALPA will present an attachment module , which is fully compatible with the ALPA System , where you can use existing HB V-System lenses .
    Does that sound weird ? ? ?
    Regards . Jürgen .
    -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

  17. #117
    Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Posts
    154
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Anyone excited about the Hasselblad rumor and Photokina this year?

    There are three possibilities:

    1. No EVIL, just a minor upgrade of the H-system (80MP-sensor...)
    2. EVIL but 80-90% sourced from Fuji
    3. EVIL actually designed and made by Hasselblad, maybe even with new Zeiss-lenses

    Sadly, 2. is less likely than 1. and 3. even less likely than 2. ...
    For me, it makes a difference if Hasselblad is willing to invest into it's Sweden-based R&D & production and a cooperation with Zeiss or if they continue to let Fuji do the vast majority of work. But I have to admit, I don't say that just as a photographer but also as an engineer, someone who is also worried about craftsmanship and technical standards.

    Zeiss for example has the skill and technology to give a hypothetical EVIL-system lenses that are fully usable at f2.8 even in demanding (WA) focal lengths. Or strong WA that make technical lenses superfluous - especially considering the possibility of Live-View.

    I tested various MF-systems and I had a quite simple requirement: a nice WA which offers excellent sharpness corner to corner and a not too-slow standard lens making sharp images at f2-f2.8 even off-centre.
    The 40 year old Planar 80mm didn't really convince me (no big surprise, but why they never re-designed it?) - well just an old design, but even the slow 4/80 for the Mamiya 7 is not performing too-well at f4 (just did some drum scans) and I was really shocked how unusable the Planar 2/80 for the Contax 645 is - how did they dare to put their name onto this lens? And Kyocera is one of the better manufacturers...

    @ondebanks
    The Distagon 60, Planar 100 or the 250 Suparchromat are still among the best lenses in medium-format and their production was started nearly 40 years ago! By now they could make them faster or even better-performing, just look at the progress they made in smaller formats. Or the mechanical quality, the patented internal focusing mechanism (used in the later Superachromats) derived from their experience in cinematography - you don't want to focus a Fuji/Mamiya-lens again... The Fuji 60-120 I tested got stuck after two weeks...

    I don't say that medium-format systems should only be equipped with Zeiss-lenses but right now it's quite the opposite: all similar equipped and performing lenses by Mamiya/Fuji - no exception without using a technical camera. Wouldn't it be great to have access to state-of-the-art optical technology?

    Here is the Velvia-sample I've talked about: beautiful landscape, not sufficient light to stop down and the result = mushy corners :-(

    IMHO the Mamiya 4/80 is one of the very best standard-lenses available in MF...

  18. #118
    Bengt Nyman
    Guest

    Re: Anyone excited about the Hasselblad rumor and Photokina this year?

    Here are two original quotes and calibration points for expectations about Hasselblad 2012:

    --- "We are proud to have such an iconic brand in our portfolio and are convinced that with solid financial support and a suitable growth strategy, Ventizz can further strengthen Hasselblad's position as the first-class producer of medium-format digital camera systems. Furthermore, we plan to develop Hasselblad cameras to appeal to a wider circle of ambitious photographers,"*said Helmut Vorndran, managing partner and CEO of Ventizz Capital Partners. ---

    --- Hasselblad CEO Larry Hansen said his company is looking forward to exploring "brand new markets". ---

  19. #119
    Senior Member ondebanks's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Posts
    518
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Anyone excited about the Hasselblad rumor and Photokina this year?

    Quote Originally Posted by georgl View Post
    There are three possibilities:

    1. No EVIL, just a minor upgrade of the H-system (80MP-sensor...)
    2. EVIL but 80-90% sourced from Fuji
    3. EVIL actually designed and made by Hasselblad, maybe even with new Zeiss-lenses
    So that's actually two possibilities, since who cares who designs/makes a camera or lens? All that matters is how it performs and integrates into your system and whether you like using it. Seriously, if you judge a product by the name-badge on it...or snobbish (I even sense xenophobic from some people) impressions of the pedigree and country of origin of the people behind it...well...

    So, your Mamiya 80/4 image illustrates that one of the best MF lenses is not perfect in the corners, wide open. Is that a surprise? Of course not. But to make your point, you would have to show us that an equivalent non-MF "state of the art" lens is perfect in the corners, wide open - and equally good in the centre too - on the same scene. Can you show us that?

    Ray

  20. #120
    Super Duper
    Senior Member

    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Royal Oak, MI and Palm Harbor, FL
    Posts
    8,498
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    44

    Re: Anyone excited about the Hasselblad rumor and Photokina this year?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bengt Nyman View Post
    Here are two original quotes and calibration points for expectations about Hasselblad 2012:

    --- "We are proud to have such an iconic brand in our portfolio and are convinced that with solid financial support and a suitable growth strategy, Ventizz can further strengthen Hasselblad's position as the first-class producer of medium-format digital camera systems. Furthermore, we plan to develop Hasselblad cameras to appeal to a wider circle of ambitious photographers,"*said Helmut Vorndran, managing partner and CEO of Ventizz Capital Partners. ---

    --- Hasselblad CEO Larry Hansen said his company is looking forward to exploring "brand new markets". ---
    So, that presents the possibility of an H5 evolution of the H series which is why the dump of current H4 demos and price reductions of current camera body retail stock, but not a rush to off-load the H lenses ... and something brand new to broaden the marketing scope of the Hasselblad brand, as in a CMOS based smaller non-modular camera with EVF or something on that order.

    Does "ambitious" mean "expensive"

    -Marc

  21. #121
    Super Duper
    Senior Member

    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Royal Oak, MI and Palm Harbor, FL
    Posts
    8,498
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    44

    Re: Anyone excited about the Hasselblad rumor and Photokina this year?

    Quote Originally Posted by georgl View Post
    There are three possibilities:

    1. No EVIL, just a minor upgrade of the H-system (80MP-sensor...)
    2. EVIL but 80-90% sourced from Fuji
    3. EVIL actually designed and made by Hasselblad, maybe even with new Zeiss-lenses

    Sadly, 2. is less likely than 1. and 3. even less likely than 2. ...
    For me, it makes a difference if Hasselblad is willing to invest into it's Sweden-based R&D & production and a cooperation with Zeiss or if they continue to let Fuji do the vast majority of work. But I have to admit, I don't say that just as a photographer but also as an engineer, someone who is also worried about craftsmanship and technical standards.

    Zeiss for example has the skill and technology to give a hypothetical EVIL-system lenses that are fully usable at f2.8 even in demanding (WA) focal lengths. Or strong WA that make technical lenses superfluous - especially considering the possibility of Live-View.

    I tested various MF-systems and I had a quite simple requirement: a nice WA which offers excellent sharpness corner to corner and a not too-slow standard lens making sharp images at f2-f2.8 even off-centre.
    The 40 year old Planar 80mm didn't really convince me (no big surprise, but why they never re-designed it?) - well just an old design, but even the slow 4/80 for the Mamiya 7 is not performing too-well at f4 (just did some drum scans) and I was really shocked how unusable the Planar 2/80 for the Contax 645 is - how did they dare to put their name onto this lens? And Kyocera is one of the better manufacturers...

    @ondebanks
    The Distagon 60, Planar 100 or the 250 Suparchromat are still among the best lenses in medium-format and their production was started nearly 40 years ago! By now they could make them faster or even better-performing, just look at the progress they made in smaller formats. Or the mechanical quality, the patented internal focusing mechanism (used in the later Superachromats) derived from their experience in cinematography - you don't want to focus a Fuji/Mamiya-lens again... The Fuji 60-120 I tested got stuck after two weeks...

    I don't say that medium-format systems should only be equipped with Zeiss-lenses but right now it's quite the opposite: all similar equipped and performing lenses by Mamiya/Fuji - no exception without using a technical camera. Wouldn't it be great to have access to state-of-the-art optical technology?

    Here is the Velvia-sample I've talked about: beautiful landscape, not sufficient light to stop down and the result = mushy corners :-(

    IMHO the Mamiya 4/80 is one of the very best standard-lenses available in MF...
    If you love Zeiss so much, just use them ... CF, CFi and CFE or any F/FE lens can be adapted to any focal plane MFD or film camera made (like 645 Mamiya, Leica S2, or Contax 645) ... and CF/CFi and CFEs can be use in leaf shutter mode on any H camera, film or digital made to date. Or just use a 503CW.

    Personally, I wouldn't judge Fuji lenses based on the old 60-120 for the F cameras ... even some of the all-mighty Zeiss lenses for that camera left something to be desired.

    BTW, the Leica S lenses are probably the best out there right now ... fast apertures and pretty sharp all the way out to the corners ... a lot sharper than what you consider to be one of the best lenses in MF. However, the cost of a little better is a LOT of money.

    Quoting the performance of Zeiss Cine lenses is a red herring ... yes they are state of the art, but at what cost? Who would pony up that kind of money for some IQ gain in MF lenses? I mean lets get real here.

    -Marc

  22. #122
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Posts
    1,587
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Anyone excited about the Hasselblad rumor and Photokina this year?

    Did anyone ever stop to think that Ventizz bought Hasselblad not to slice it up and sell it on (as the doomsday conspiracy theorists have it) but because Hasselblad actually had the smarts to design something amazing but didn't have the capital to invest in its production without serious backing?

    Also, I remember the former 'Blad CEO (Poulsen?) stating before it was finally released that the Leica S2 was the perfect MF product but (at that point) it was merely vaporware. I wouldn't be surprised to see a fully integrated digital MF product, compatible with H system lenses, a la the S2 but with a full 645 sensor.

    Either that or they're reinventing the V system with a full frame square sensor I can dream, can't I?

  23. #123
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    23,623
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    2555

    Re: Anyone excited about the Hasselblad rumor and Photokina this year?

    Here is something I heard but I know it will be more fuel for the rumors. The money pocket for Hassy backing is extremely deep far more than many of us realized in the buyout of it. Ventizzz has extremely deep pockets. What that means for products we just don't know. Personally I would not be surprised for one second we did not see a S2 style look alike in Hassy.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

  24. #124
    Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Posts
    191
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Anyone excited about the Hasselblad rumor and Photokina this year?

    Quote Originally Posted by KeithL View Post
    This gets more and more interesting.

    In the UK the Procentre has massive discounts on most of their pre-owned H series stock but not on the V series.

    As you say "draw your own conclusions".
    Also, wasn't the October number of Victor going to be dedicated to the V system?

    I believe I received an email along those lines... interesting...

  25. #125
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Posts
    110
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Anyone excited about the Hasselblad rumor and Photokina this year?

    This thread is getting comical.

  26. #126
    Super Duper
    Senior Member
    Shashin's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Florida, USA
    Posts
    4,499
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    141

    Re: Anyone excited about the Hasselblad rumor and Photokina this year?

    LOL. We take a sample of a lens wide open and expect that the corners that are not focused at the focal plane should be as sharp as the center where the camera was focused? And what Ray said...

    Personally, I hope Hasselblad release a digital version of the disc camera--remember those?

    I mean, if we are just fantasizing...

  27. #127
    Bengt Nyman
    Guest

    Re: Anyone excited about the Hasselblad rumor and Photokina this year?

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Mancuso View Post
    ... Ventizzz has extremely deep pockets ...
    Deep pockets require large returns on investments.
    This will be no free lunch for photo nostalgics. I do not think that Ventizz is the least interested in what Lieca or anybody else did in the past. If they read the market like I do they see the need for top quality digital images produced with a simple, electronic, high tech camera with a minimum of moving parts.
    Canon and Nikon are invested in making and selling mirror boxes. The medium format industry has an IQ advantage but are also stuck in old mechanical technologies. Nobody has yet taken the mirrorless technology to the top, on parity with MF IQ. It will happen. And hopefully Ventizz/Hasselblad are smart enough to be among the first to ride that wave.

  28. #128
    Senior Member stephengilbert's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Santa Monica, CA
    Posts
    2,274
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    2

    Re: Anyone excited about the Hasselblad rumor and Photokina this year?

    "This thread is getting comical."

    Getting?
    Likes 1 Member(s) liked this post

  29. #129
    Super Duper
    Senior Member
    Shashin's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Florida, USA
    Posts
    4,499
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    141

    Re: Anyone excited about the Hasselblad rumor and Photokina this year?

    When does it become tragical?

  30. #130
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    23,623
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    2555

    Re: Anyone excited about the Hasselblad rumor and Photokina this year?

    When nothing is released. Lol
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com
    Likes 3 Member(s) liked this post

  31. #131
    Super Duper
    Senior Member

    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    3,673
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Anyone excited about the Hasselblad rumor and Photokina this year?

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Mancuso View Post
    When nothing is released. Lol


    Yea, but that will save everyone a boatload of money won't it? Hmmm, yet on the other hand, we always find something else to spend it on...don't we? LOL!

    Reading this thread I get the sense that there is great turmoil in the MF market. On one hand I keep thinking the next evolution is going to be the fully intergrated high performance MFD camera ala S2 and 645D but with full frame sensors and lenses up to the task. ...or on the other hand, take it one step further and make it revolutionary with EVF/Live View and compensate for the increased size these things have grown and get rid of the mirror box altogether.

    I think even Nikon saw the writing on the wall and although they still manufacturer their Pro sized bodies for PJ work and ultra fast shooting (D4 etc.). they chose for now to make their flagship landscape/studio camera a more compact design and most have embraced this concept quite quickly, even those who only shot D3's sized bodies exclusively.

    So extrapolate what you will, I somehow think things even in the slower moving/changing MFD market is going to speed up..especially if they can cull a somewhat bigger share of the market and at the same time come up with the R&D funds to support such developments. Obviously not an easy thing to do.

    Dave (D&A)

  32. #132
    Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Posts
    154
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Anyone excited about the Hasselblad rumor and Photokina this year?

    @fotografz
    Fuji reached the quality of most Zeiss-designs of the 200/500-series - but these were old designs. But what if Zeiss would have gotten a chance to design entirely new lenses? In fact, I'm actually NOT happy with the performance of these older designs, people spending 40k$ on a 80MP-back should be that picky as well.
    The very few newer designs (350SA, 40IF...) give a hint of what would have been possible. The cinematography-department just represents the major improvement that Zeiss was capable of, the old Hasselblad-designs are closer to the standard of the "Superspeeds" (the Zeiss cinematography lenses from the 1960s/70s, also very expensive). Maybe these lenses would have been a bit more expensive than most Fuji or Mamiya-designs - but is there really no need for higher quality standards? Sharp corners? Open aperture performance? A "good enough" 645-AF-system? Get a Mamiya, perfectly fine. But making sacrifices by replacing the 500/200-series with the H-system, especially since all other choices are nearly gone by now, either? Hasselblad could have done better than this, with the possibility of an entirely new EVIL-system they have a (maybe the last) chance to proof that. Sorry, I don't want another Fujiblad - and it's not even cheap, either.

  33. #133
    Senior Member KeithL's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    832
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Anyone excited about the Hasselblad rumor and Photokina this year?

    Quote Originally Posted by georgl View Post
    @fotografz
    Sorry, I don't want another Fujiblad
    Then don't buy one.
    http://www.keithlaban.co.uk
    Likes 2 Member(s) liked this post

  34. #134
    Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    54
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Anyone excited about the Hasselblad rumor and Photokina this year?

    The rumor did say " is looking forward to exploring "brand new markets"". Maybe it is not a camera at all? Maybe it is a new kind of muffin or something?
    Likes 2 Member(s) liked this post

  35. #135
    Super Duper
    Senior Member

    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Royal Oak, MI and Palm Harbor, FL
    Posts
    8,498
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    44

    Re: Anyone excited about the Hasselblad rumor and Photokina this year?

    Coulda, shoulda, woulda.

    But they didn't and Zeiss didn't.

    What you do not grasp is that Hasselblad has some stellar H lenses like the 100/2.2, and the HCD35-90 is all new from the ground up and is a much better lens than the Zeiss 35-90 made for the Contax 645 (which wasn't 40 year old design BTW) ... and one-by-one they are improving the older H designs that were launched with the film based H1 camera .... The new HC/50-II is a quantum leap over the previous HC/50, and the new 150N and 210-II Macro are both improved to perform on higher meg backs.

    However, as Keith mentioned ... don't like it, don't buy it.

    -Marc
    Likes 2 Member(s) liked this post

  36. #136
    Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Posts
    154
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Anyone excited about the Hasselblad rumor and Photokina this year?

    "don't like it, don't buy it"

    That's the point, whatever your financial resources, need or preferences are, there is only Fuji/Mamiya - similar design approach and quality standard, a future Hasselblad-system (EVIL needs new lenses anyway) could be a vast improvement and Zeiss would be an ideal partner.

    The "Zeiss" 35-90 was made by Kyocera, the last designs for Hasselblad (300/350Sa, 40IF) did show what is possible with re-designs, but Hasselblad decided against it to cut costs, that's not what Hasselblad was about.

  37. #137
    Super Duper
    Senior Member
    Shashin's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Florida, USA
    Posts
    4,499
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    141

    Re: Anyone excited about the Hasselblad rumor and Photokina this year?

    A more interesting rumor is that Pentax/Ricoh may be updating the 645D.

    Pentax working on second generation of the 645D medium format camera | Photo Rumors

    The Pentax is really the only modern MFD camera out there...


  38. #138
    Senior Member RVB's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    Amsterdam
    Posts
    807
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Anyone excited about the Hasselblad rumor and Photokina this year?

    Quote Originally Posted by Shashin View Post
    A more interesting rumor is that Pentax/Ricoh may be updating the 645D.

    Pentax working on second generation of the 645D medium format camera | Photo Rumors

    The Pentax is really the only modern MFD camera out there...

    Leica S2? it's pretty modern.. and an S3 with live view will be modern...

  39. #139
    Super Duper
    Senior Member
    Shashin's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Florida, USA
    Posts
    4,499
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    141

    Re: Anyone excited about the Hasselblad rumor and Photokina this year?

    You probably did not see me type my post with a straight face...

    The S2 is a great modern camera. Pentax pushed that a little further down the technology road. It looks like the both Pentax and Leica are looking for new sources for sensors and will be sporting CMOS. I guess live view is coming to the MFD world. It will interesting to see what is revealed. If Hasselblad, Pentax, and Leica go with live view, I wonder what Phase and Leaf are going to do. They have tried to push CCD technology to have live view, but it is not really that great and the lack of an integrated body makes the cameras a bit of a compromise.

  40. #140
    Senior Member RVB's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    Amsterdam
    Posts
    807
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Anyone excited about the Hasselblad rumor and Photokina this year?

    Quote Originally Posted by Shashin View Post
    You probably did not see me type my post with a straight face...



    The S2 is a great modern camera. Pentax pushed that a little further down the technology road. It looks like the both Pentax and Leica are looking for new sources for sensors and will be sporting CMOS. I guess live view is coming to the MFD world. It will interesting to see what is revealed. If Hasselblad, Pentax, and Leica go with live view, I wonder what Phase and Leaf are going to do. They have tried to push CCD technology to have live view, but it is not really that great.
    Rumours say french electronic company STmicroelectronics will be supplying the sensor for the S3.. not too long now before we know the truth.. I just sold my S2 to get ready for the S3..

  41. #141
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Posts
    1,198
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Anyone excited about the Hasselblad rumor and Photokina this year?

    Quote Originally Posted by Shashin View Post
    You probably did not see me type my post with a straight face...

    The S2 is a great modern camera. Pentax pushed that a little further down the technology road. It looks like the both Pentax and Leica are looking for new sources for sensors and will be sporting CMOS. I guess live view is coming to the MFD world. It will interesting to see what is revealed. If Hasselblad, Pentax, and Leica go with live view, I wonder what Phase and Leaf are going to do. They have tried to push CCD technology to have live view, but it is not really that great and the lack of an integrated body makes the cameras a bit of a compromise.
    Conversely, you could claim that the lack of an integrated body makes the backs incredibly adaptable.

    I can mount my Phase One back on a Phase One AF, Fuji GX680, Hartblei HCam, or Alpa TC.

    Kind regards,

    Gerald.

  42. #142
    Super Duper
    Senior Member
    Shashin's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Florida, USA
    Posts
    4,499
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    141

    Re: Anyone excited about the Hasselblad rumor and Photokina this year?

    Gerald, it is simply part of the compromise. Phase/Leaf are a back system. And as that type of system, they work well. My point was more directed at the camera as a unit and the separate back limits what can be done. I think Hasselblad, Leica, and Pentax are looking at an integrated system. I am wondering how that will impact the Phase/Mamiya line. There are Phase/Mamiya shooters that don't mount their back on anything else. Will the technology benefits of CMOS and an integrated system affect Phase/Leaf? Certainly there is a class of customer that is very used to sophisticated technology in their cameras. Could the move of MFD to CMOS be a large driver in market share for some of these companies? I am just speculating.

    Predicting is hard to do, especially about the future.

  43. #143
    Senior Member RVB's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    Amsterdam
    Posts
    807
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Anyone excited about the Hasselblad rumor and Photokina this year?

    Quote Originally Posted by gerald.d View Post
    Conversely, you could claim that the lack of an integrated body makes the backs incredibly adaptable.

    I can mount my Phase One back on a Phase One AF, Fuji GX680, Hartblei HCam, or Alpa TC.

    Kind regards,

    Gerald.
    H4X with I.Q back is a very tempting combination..

  44. #144
    Workshop Member ptomsu's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Austria, close to Vienna
    Posts
    3,870
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Anyone excited about the Hasselblad rumor and Photokina this year?

    Must say I would love anything which comes from HB - yes I admit I am a big fanboy

    But honestly, the next big step could be a full frame 6x6 back / camera system based on CMOS and a high end mirror less (EVF).

    Maybe dreaming but I would be signed in for that

  45. #145
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Posts
    1,198
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Anyone excited about the Hasselblad rumor and Photokina this year?

    Quote Originally Posted by Shashin View Post
    Gerald, it is simply part of the compromise. Phase/Leaf are a back system. And as that type of system, they work well. My point was more directed at the camera as a unit and the separate back limits what can be done. I think Hasselblad, Leica, and Pentax are looking at an integrated system. I am wondering how that will impact the Phase/Mamiya line. There are Phase/Mamiya shooters that don't mount their back on anything else. Will the technology benefits of CMOS and an integrated system affect Phase/Leaf? Certainly there is a class of customer that is very used to sophisticated technology in their cameras. Could the move of MFD to CMOS be a large driver in market share for some of these companies? I am just speculating.

    Predicting is hard to do, especially about the future.
    There's no question that the Phase/Mamiya bodies are extremely basic when compared to almost anything else out there. Coming from a Canon 1D4, I found the auto-focus of the POAF to be so limiting, that the lens collection I've built up for it is almost entirely MF (that of course had an advantage that it kept the price of the collection down significantly).

    Personally, I don't really see the live-view benefits that CMOS would bring to be an advantage at all. People talk a lot of the time about wanting decent live-view to be able to confirm focus before shooting, but the reason they want to do that - in my mind - is that they don't trust the focussing of the camera in the first place.

    Don't treat the symptom. Cure the disease.

    Get something approaching the focussing of the 1D4 in a MF body, and who needs live-view for focus confirmation? I really don't think many professional sports/wildlife shooters using the 1D4 or 1Dx use live-view for focus confirmation. They don't need to. They know that - used properly - the camera will pretty much nail it every shot.

    What I'd like to know is what is stopping MF manufacturers from bringing out a body that auto-focuses well enough* that live-view becomes a non-issue?


    /edit
    * for clarification, I should probably have said "a body that has great AF functionality such that..."

  46. #146
    Super Duper
    Senior Member
    Shashin's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Florida, USA
    Posts
    4,499
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    141

    Re: Anyone excited about the Hasselblad rumor and Photokina this year?

    Quote Originally Posted by gerald.d View Post
    What I'd like to know is what is stopping MF manufacturers from bringing out a body that auto-focuses well enough* that live-view becomes a non-issue?
    Nothing. Pentax did.
    Likes 2 Member(s) liked this post

  47. #147
    Super Duper
    Senior Member

    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    3,673
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Anyone excited about the Hasselblad rumor and Photokina this year?

    Quote Originally Posted by Shashin View Post
    Nothing. Pentax did.
    I would agree with this! I wouldn't say the Pentax 645D is on par (AF wise) with say a D700, D3s nor D4....but in a number of ways is somewhat competitive with many mid level DSLR's and for a MFD body body, that's pretty good in my opinion.

    Dave (D&A)

  48. #148
    Super Duper
    Senior Member

    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Royal Oak, MI and Palm Harbor, FL
    Posts
    8,498
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    44

    Re: Anyone excited about the Hasselblad rumor and Photokina this year?

    Quote Originally Posted by georgl View Post
    "don't like it, don't buy it"

    That's the point, whatever your financial resources, need or preferences are, there is only Fuji/Mamiya - similar design approach and quality standard, a future Hasselblad-system (EVIL needs new lenses anyway) could be a vast improvement and Zeiss would be an ideal partner.

    The "Zeiss" 45-90 was made by Kyocera, the last designs for Hasselblad (300/350Sa, 40IF) did show what is possible with re-designs, but Hasselblad decided against it to cut costs, that's not what Hasselblad was about.


    Sorry, I have zero issues with the build quality and engineering of the H camera, and I used the V system for 40 years prior to that. The camera body is made by Hasselblad ...

    "The H-System is largely designed and manufactured by Hasselblad, with Fuji's involvement being limited to finalizing Hasselblad's lens designs and producing the glass for the lenses and viewfinders"

    Just to be clear, since your statement implies the relatively recent 45-90 zoom lens was a Kyocera lens and not a Zeiss ... The 645 Contax 45-90/4.5 was a Carl Zeiss designed lens and was manufactured by Kyocera under the watchful QC control of the Zeiss Institute in Japan ... like most of the Contax 645 and 35mm Contax N lenses were. The Hasselblad HC/35-90 is a much better lenses in almost every way.

    Kyocera Americas | About | 2002 » CONTAX Introduces New Carl Zeiss Zoom Lens For The 645 System

    Just keepin' it real

    -Marc

  49. #149
    Senior Member Stefan Steib's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Lindenberg im Allgäu
    Posts
    1,294
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    12

    Re: Anyone excited about the Hasselblad rumor and Photokina this year?

    Quote Originally Posted by Andy Biggs View Post
    This thread is getting comical.
    For me this thread is a relief - it shows that there is still life here and people still want MF - after the 35mm wave with the D800E lately I was already fearing, this is really the begin of the end now.

    Greetings from Lindenberg
    Stefan
    because photography is more than technology - and " as we have done this all the time "
    facebook:hcam.de - www.hcam.de - www.hartblei.de

  50. #150
    Senior Member Stefan Steib's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Lindenberg im Allgäu
    Posts
    1,294
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    12

    Re: Anyone excited about the Hasselblad rumor and Photokina this year?

    Quote Originally Posted by Shashin View Post
    A more interesting rumor is that Pentax/Ricoh may be updating the 645D.

    Pentax working on second generation of the 645D medium format camera | Photo Rumors

    The Pentax is really the only modern MFD camera out there...

    The pentax IS by far the most modern MF camera if you take a look at the PRICE TAG ! The market is somewhat loosing a significant slice of the highend segment and especially in "normal" production studios a 40-50k $ camera will not pay off, a 10k $ will !

    Greetings from Germany
    Stefan
    because photography is more than technology - and " as we have done this all the time "
    facebook:hcam.de - www.hcam.de - www.hartblei.de

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •