The search for "accuracy"... fed up

[Shelby Lewis]

Mediumcool, your words about film are actually heavy on my mind. I've been seriously looking at 4x5 (for art/work) alongside a 35mm film camera (for my happy snaps) and just forsaking digital for a bit (iphone excepted). I have a slow final year coming up at school where I'll be working predominantly on private projects. Might be a good time to just try something different.

 

[Guy Mancuso]

Thanks Max. I tried a lot of those focusing solutions and got decent with them, including a loupe (6x) for off-center focusing.

I'll be honest and say I'm not sure why I sold it, artistically. I'll use Guy's words... Funk. I am, however, back in doctoral studies (at 40, with kids) and there was a lot of work I could shoot to pay the bills that the aptus/rz couldn't handle including weddings... the D800 has really helped put some $$$ on the table. There was a real hope that I'd be happy with the camera artistically... the word "synergy" comes to mind... but I'll be the first to go to bat for the d800 as a photographic tool. It's been a real winner. I just don't see any magic in my d800 files.

S2? I just can't afford it... maybe when I'm out of school, but right now I'm an MF bottom feeder, lol (which is cool with me).

This really might come down to better and / or artistic processing. Unfortunatly this is where digital leads you in better technique in post. You want more look like MF than some of this can be done with 2 very simple things first it is light obviously without it you have zilch but getting your head around post is very important which for many gets sidetracked a lot . Yea it's a PITA and a lot of folks hate it BUT it's also the answer sometimes in making it the game changer it's not all about bokeh and stuff like that it's more about what post can bring to the table. In general my advice to all is stop working 15 diffrent software processing programs find one and be a expert at it. That can make the difference. The D800 needs a little more work than MF that's a given so we need to accept that fate .

 

[johnnygoesdigital]

Shelby,

You're an artist! Cameras are tools that allow us to express in ways that are unique and personal. They should integrate in ways that expand your creative process.

It is absolutely essential that you have a camera that melds your artistic imagination into your creative expression-can there be any other way? Looking at other photographers portfolio's, it's obvious who creates, from those who just observe.

I've often been criticized for "leap frogging" because I could not find satisfaction,(or reliability). It's those comments that I don't adhere to or respect, but instead follow my passion. It's also the initial price of MFD that fuels this debate and emotions. I started with older Hasselblads, and then to the "H", with the H4D/40, Leica S2, Canon, Sony, Phase one DF, etc.. I sold them all... For me, I needed expression, lighting has greatly added to that as another variable in my art, and for me, the RZ has enhanced my creativity. I often just hold the camera and admire its simplicity, and revel in the fact, that its initial price is a fraction of MFD, but has achieved for me, the best photographs I've ever taken! Your photography will take a dramatic step towards satisfaction, when the right camera rests in your hands. Nothing is obsolete, unless you want it to be.

 

[Shashin]

I wonder what medium-format digital was like before the D800...

 

[MaxKißler]

Some interesting thoughts in this thread. I'm often thinking that I must be an idiot for attaching so much importance on the camera I'm using. I'm aiming on becoming a professional photographer, a problem solver. This is what the kind of photography I want to do is about: Solving problems. Therefore it's the ideas that should matter and less the camera being used.
However, it's a fact that I'm producing better images with the gear I love using.

BW film has really helped my photography develop. And I would definitely suggest to shoot more film now and then. Even if it's just for a short period of time, it helps to redefine ones pace with digital.


Shelby, if your blues is an artistic one maybe you should do something crazy and unpredictable like others have mentioned before me. Keep the D800 to pay the bills and shoot portraits with a large format camera. Use tilts and swings to lay the plane of focus exclusively on the eyes. See where that gets you.

I don't know, just a thought...

 

[richard.L]

It's not the wand, it is the wizard. So they say.

 

[Shashin]

Man is a rational animal and the camera does not matter.

After that bit of fantasy, lets talk about the reality.

Now, I also do work professionally. You could give me a Cheerios box and I can take images for you. But walking around with a Cheerios box around my neck does not blow my hair back. The camera does matter. It can help or hinder the process. I always have a little dating to do with a new camera to get to know it.

One other thing I find very important that really does not come up often in conversation is format. To me, this is the number one consideration. The square I just fell in love with. The 3:2 I could never come to terms with. I even bought some really great 3:2 cameras--the Konica Hexar AF was a beautiful little camera. It was just too hard to get that magic out of it--the frame is either too narrow for portrait or not wide enough for landscape. The Leica Ms and the X-Pro1 are really tempting cameras, but I know the format is just too much of a struggle for me.

I know I can crop and, on a professional level, I do what I need to get the result for the client. But the magic of photography for me is in that perfect image that comes straight out of the camera. Sure I tweak the color and contrast, but the essential image is there. As Adams said, it is like god needed someone there to press the shutter button.

 

[johnnygoesdigital]

Yes, format is a considerable part of the equation. The 6x7 format is my sweet spot because I can crop to square if desired, but not the other way around. The 645 was too small for me, but my H1 was easy to shoot and the most accurate light meter i've ever used. I agree with Max, that shooting film will greatly enhance the experience. The learning curve with digital is less, and most definitely has its advantages, but the character, dynamic range and tonality of film is unmatched, for me...as an artist.

 

[fotografz]

Just a little thinking out loud here as an ex-MFD shooter who's still struggling to find gear that satisfies. I understand this is a "personal problem"

I've really been struggling for a few years finding a home for my photography, gear-wise. Sony... to Canon... to Leaf (my fav, looking back)... to Nikon d800. As some of you have seen, I've been overall pretty unhappy with the d800.

But that's not what has become apparent in the last month, at least to me.
(And this post isn't about the D800)

What has become clear to me... in my case... is that the level of "polish" I've come to expect from my gear has really gone a long way towards frustrating my artistic self. I actually look back at my earlier work when we all shot a maximum 12mp and I felt as though that gear just worked due to the resolution not being able to expose the faults of the imaging systems (focus-wise, et al...). I've gotten great results out of gear since then, but I feel as though a majority of my efforts are spent keeping the gear reigned in in order to produce satisfactory images.

Where am I going with this? I'm not sure. I can say that the siren call to pick up a 35mm- and 4x5 film set-ups alongside my d800 just so I can shoot a film stock and actually get a consistent "look" is starting ring in my ears. MFD is calling hard again as well...

But in the end, I'd be interested in thoughts you all, as folks I know who have shot most of the systems out there, have had as to just getting fed up with the digital rat race... that's where I am right now. Fed up.

Is it a funk? Who knows. I think a creative funk is different than being constantly distracted from making images by whatever the distraction may be. As Gilda Radner quipped when told she had cancer ... "It's always something."

The difference is that some distractions are out of our control, and some can be eliminated. In this case, it is the struggle with gear. Generally, if you struggle with anything photographic, it can erode confidence and rob you of the attention that should be placed on the work itself, not the tools that help make it.

This isn't new, but I strongly suspect it is more intense with the ever changing digital landscape. Everyone is leaping from lilly pad to lilly pad.

While it is true that with talent you can do good work with anything, the truth is that a good piece of gear that matches your personal vision goes a long way in making that talent shine. The etherial images you made with your A900 simply are not going to happen with an iPhone, to quote an extreme.

Frankly, I was a bit saddened when you walked away from the RZ/Leaf kit. It seemed you were onto something but flew the coop to soon. I've worked with that kit now for over 15 years, the Hasselblad V series for 30 before moving to the H, and the Leica M for over 40. I'm on my 9th Hasselblad H camera and can play it like a concert pianist. After some costly distractions, my Sony is it ... which is less important because I do not like 35mm DSLRs all that much.

Given the time, you just master it. It has its short comings and you just find ways around them until it becomes second nature. Nothing comes instantly, and it takes time ... be it a musical instrument or a camera.

IMO, funk isn't it, the gear isn't it ... it is impatience.

If you find something that matches your vision, master the damned thing ... the next lilly pad won't be any different, and it actually may not be a fit for you, and then you start the whole silly thing all over again.

-Marc

 

[Stefan Steib]

Shelby -

don´t despair, this is normal! I would on your place be concerned if you wouldn´t have these waves of doubt once in a while ! No art without doubt, no beauty without struggle, you have to bleed and sweat and finally catch the moment of ease and certainty, to make your image.
The camera means nothing. It´s just a black hole with some kind of sensor and a lens in front. Forget about it, center on yourself.
The best camera is the one you don´t even know it´s there until you have finished your image.

This is what makes us all brothers, we are addicts of the image and we fight for it, and cry and rumble and search, .....man... what a lot of search.

It´s a long way, but it´s worth every second to go. I would not want to do anything else !

With sympathy
Stefan

 

[Jorgen Udvang]

There's no universal answer to this question as we all work differently, but I kind of recognise my own challenges in you post, Shelby. The LF road makes sense, although I'm to lazy to thread that path myself. I ended up buying into GX680 (film only, at least for now) at a cost that forced me to put the obvious plan, upgrading to D800 and OM-D, on hold until next year or whenever.

The latest, greatest often makes our lives as photographers less challenging, which makes sense. Much has been said about the differences between the D800 and MFD. I wouldn't know since I've used neither, but still it seems obvious that, as long as one can live with the inherent limitations of the somewhat smaller format, the D800 is much easier to live with and cheaper too. The question that arises for me is: Do I always want less challenges? Do I grow on that?

There's obviously more to photography than the technical side... fortunately much more. But giving oneself challenges on the technical as well as the creative side sometimes makes sense, and sometimes it makes us stronger and more creative. At least it does for me.

It's like not going across the road to have dinner at the cheap but excellent restaurant there every night, but now and then buy the ingredients and make something myself, even if it's more expensive, even if it takes more time and even if there's no guarantee that the results will be better. But it's home made, by me, and I learned something while cooking it. That has an immense value to some of us.

 

[Shelby Lewis]

I hear ya, Marc.

 

[Bob]

Shooting some velvia in a horseman back on my Rm3di using only a 70mm lens.
just the thing for the occasional techno-funk.
ok I could be shooting B&W but I have to use up the velvia first LOL
-bob

 

[MGrayson]

It doesn't count unless you develop it yourself, Bob. :ROTFL:

--Matt

 

[Bob]

It doesn't count unless you develop it yourself, Bob. :ROTFL:

--Matt

if it were B&W I would.
-bob

 

[SergeiR]

It doesn't count unless you develop it yourself, Bob. :ROTFL:

--Matt

I do all sheet film in all flavors in home. Only reason i do 120 at lab is bc i don't have 120 rails for jobo tank

May i have cookie now?

 

[Bill_Green]

Let's look at all this objectively. You sold the Leaf kit because you needed something that could handle wedding work. You bought the Leaf kit because despite the images you made with the Sony, you needed something to feed your soul. You see yourself as a professional, an artist, and a broke student.

Why not separate things out a bit? D800 (or a900 if you wish) as your professional tool. This camera makes money. When it is in your hand, you are a professional and you are at work. Then buy a RZ with a 110 and your favorite film. This camera is to make art, not money. When it is in your hand you are an artist creating your vision photographically.

Of course, since you are a broke student, I know where you can get a good deal on an a900. oke:

 

[Bob]

I do all sheet film in all flavors in home. Only reason i do 120 at lab is bc i don't have 120 rails for jobo tank

May i have cookie now?

No, but you may have a cheezburger
-bob

 

[docmoore]

Mediumcool, your words about film are actually heavy on my mind. I've been seriously looking at 4x5 (for art/work) alongside a 35mm film camera (for my happy snaps) and just forsaking digital for a bit (iphone excepted). I have a slow final year coming up at school where I'll be working predominantly on private projects. Might be a good time to just try something different.

I don't know Shelby....

I did the 35, 6x7, 4x5 film thing..with an Imacon scanner and full resources to make it happen.

Considering that you have two beautiful young children and a life outside of this passion....is it worth spotting a negative for dust at 1 to 2 hours in CS6 to get the same result or fairly similar result to adjusting contrast and curves with the Leaf? Kinda takes the fun out of it.....And the expense is not insignificant....

Once you have be exposed to MF digital it is very difficult to accept the compromises that are inherent in 35 digital irrespective of the Mpix count.

Loved everything you showed with the Leaf...and I can understand your angst.

Bob

 

[doug]

... I just want to open up a file and smile at the overall quality of it, regardless of subject...

I do that with nearly every DMR file. I wish it were bigger, but otherwise at lower ISOs the quality leaves nothing to be desired.