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Thread: Phase One Photokinia Press Release

  1. #101
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    Re: Phase One Photokinia Press Release

    Nenes if you are so hanged up on design maybe you should start looking at a Hello Kitty camera or something..

    Porsche have gotten away with this design thinking for over 40 years.. (must be fun to have a trained chimpanzee as head of design though..)

    I personally think that the afd/df body is a beautiful design that is much more ergonomical Than the H system and alot more better looking. That silverpaint on the H system might have been a cool thing to match your thinfoil space jacket in the 90's to, but its getting old real fast.. As long as the ergonomics works I think they should put their money on the inside instead..

  2. #102
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    Re: Phase One Photokinia Press Release

    Quote Originally Posted by nenes View Post
    HASSELBLAD AT LEAST CHANGE THE DESING OF THE CAMERA!!!!
    MAMIYA has never been a camera to follow,(not in desing ,not in technology,not in lenses) until phaseone backs came out and hasselblad closed their sistem...IF MAMIYA WILL HAVE A HASSELBLAD 503 cw DESING i will be happy to keep going with it (same desing)and better technology but it is not the case
    I buy these things for function, not design.
    The only quibble I have is the absence of a waist level finder option and more AF points.
    Mainly I want a stable reliable system that just keeps going and doesn't surprise me in the middle of a shoot.
    -bob
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  3. #103
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    Re: Phase One Photokinia Press Release

    Quote Originally Posted by Bob View Post
    I am very excited but I KNOW NOTHING
    That's ok. The only people who are excited about any of these announcements fall into one of three categories
    1. People who know nothing.
    2. People who do know everything and have to appear to be excited because they sell the equipment for a living.
    3. People who belong to the Hy6 Club.

    What a collection of underwhelming announcements. The good news is there is not anything here that will even tempt me to dig deep into my pockets. However, I really did expect Phase to announce a truly new from the ground up body that would surpass the Contax, the H series and the Hy6. The last thing I expected was a slight refresh of the AFD/DF.

  4. #104
    Administrator Bob's Avatar
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    Re: Phase One Photokinia Press Release

    Quote Originally Posted by hcubell View Post
    That's ok. The only people who are excited about any of these announcements fall into one of three categories
    1. People who know nothing.
    2. People who do know everything and have to appear to be excited because they sell the equipment for a living.
    3. People who belong to the Hy6 Club.

    What a collection of underwhelming announcements. The good news is there is not anything here that will even tempt me to dig deep into my pockets. However, I really did expect Phase to announce a truly new from the ground up body that would surpass the Contax, the H series and the Hy6. The last thing I expected was a slight refresh of the AFD/DF.
    I KNOW NOTHING about C1 v7 and don't sell it either

  5. #105
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    Re: Phase One Photokinia Press Release

    That's Category #1.

  6. #106
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    Re: Phase One Photokinia Press Release

    Quote Originally Posted by hcubell View Post
    That's Category #1.
    I KNOW NOTHING that I can tell you

  7. #107
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    Re: Phase One Photokinia Press Release

    "Assuming it performs as indicated the Phase One DF+ body is now more robust, reliable, and has a few nice features (e.g. AF fine tune), today as compared to yesterday and is the same price as the DF was. Not a revolution, but a solid improvement."

    i thought when i bought it that my DF was a pro camera... robust, reliable... i was wrong !

    For a body only that cost more than a D800 (including sensor), it's a bit disappointing...
    so, i'm not shure that i will upgrade it soon !
    Still my RM3D is working like a charm...

  8. #108
    Workshop Member Wayne Fox's Avatar
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    Re: Phase One Photokinia Press Release

    so anyone have any idea if the focal plane shutter opens with MLU so the leaf shutter can offer less vibration?
    wayne
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  9. #109
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    Re: Phase One Photokinia Press Release

    Keep hearing about how small HB/Phase/Leica are and how small a company/resources they have and best use of funds yadder yadder!

    How come then, companies that operate in the even smaller tech camera market can release multipul exciting new cameras at Photokina but the big three players dish up these luke warm upgrades and still dare to charge at these massivly elevated prices?

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    Re: Phase One Photokinia Press Release

    Quote Originally Posted by gazwas View Post
    Keep hearing about how small HB/Phase/Leica are and how small a company/resources they have and best use of funds yadder yadder!

    How come then, companies that operate in the even smaller tech camera market can release multipul exciting new cameras at Photokina but the big three players dish up these luke warm upgrades and still dare to charge at these massivly elevated prices?
    Tech cameras except the newly announced FPS are just CNC machined frames selling for way too much money. The complexity of building a medium format camera with AF, firmware upgradability, battery system that communicates with a digital back is way more complex.

    You need one engineer to develop a new alpa body, you probably need a couple for whole new camera system.

    You just can't compare both ...

  11. #111
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    Re: Phase One Photokinia Press Release

    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Spinnler View Post
    You just can't compare both ...
    Oh, I'm just grumpy because I wanted to spend some money!
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  12. #112
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    Re: Phase One Photokinia Press Release

    USB tethered?

  13. #113
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    Re: Phase One Photokinia Press Release

    Quote Originally Posted by Wayne Fox View Post
    so anyone have any idea if the focal plane shutter opens with MLU so the leaf shutter can offer less vibration?
    I meant to imply above that all other functions of the DF remain --- no way to get the mirror up and FP shutter primed ahead of leaf shutter. I even asked if that could be a firmware revision and was told no. I know, that sucks for us...
    Jack
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  14. #114
    Workshop Member Wayne Fox's Avatar
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    Re: Phase One Photokinia Press Release

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack View Post
    I meant to imply above that all other functions of the DF remain --- no way to get the mirror up and FP shutter primed ahead of leaf shutter. I even asked if that could be a firmware revision and was told no. I know, that sucks for us...
    Makes it easy for me, prob. no reason to buy the camera. (I manual focus and lately focus stack more and more).

    Maybe it will help a little, hopefully someone will test the new 240LS with and without the leaf shutter to see if helps at all with the FP shutter bounce.
    wayne
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  15. #115
    Workshop Member Wayne Fox's Avatar
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    Re: Phase One Photokinia Press Release

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack View Post
    I will add that I STRONGLY encouraged them to move that project to a top priority, as I had just cautioned them that the limited DF+ announcement would likely not be seen as a positive one for them...
    I guess we can hope this was sort of a no brainer upgrade, and the real purpose was to make the current camera a little better since it's been a while, and not really targeted as an upgrade path, more as something for new buyers or for those whose DF bodies are on their last leg.

    I hope they didn't blow a lot of R&D and other development resources on it ...
    Last edited by Wayne Fox; 18th September 2012 at 12:47.
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  16. #116
    Subscriber & Workshop Member GrahamWelland's Avatar
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    Re: Phase One Photokinia Press Release

    Quote Originally Posted by Bob View Post
    I buy these things for function, not design.
    The only quibble I have is the absence of a waist level finder option and more AF points.
    Mainly I want a stable reliable system that just keeps going and doesn't surprise me in the middle of a shoot.
    -bob
    Amen to that. Not much to ask is it?

    Btw, like Don/Ken I also use the EJII battery system in my DF and so far no unexpected lock ups.

    The 28LS could have been interesting to me if the optics were different but it doesn't seem so - looks like just the leaf shutter.

    Still no 240LS ...
    Remember: adventure before dementia!

    As Oscar Wilde said, "my tastes are simple, I only like the best"
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    Re: Phase One Photokinia Press Release

    240LS now slated for early this winter.
    Doug Peterson , Digital Transitions | Email
    Dealer for: Phase One, Mamiya Leaf, Arca-Swiss, Cambo, Eizo, Profoto
    Office: 877.367.8537. Cell: 740.707.2183

  18. #118
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    Re: Phase One Photokinia Press Release

    Quote Originally Posted by GrahamWelland View Post
    The 28LS could have been interesting to me if the optics were different but it doesn't seem so - looks like just the leaf shutter.
    So are you saying its the same design as the 28D but with LS and a Schneider badge?........ Surely not!

  19. #119
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: Phase One Photokinia Press Release

    This in from Phase One

    Phase One marketing --

    1) the 28mm Aspherical is in fact shipping now (the press release had indicated October)

    2) the 240 mm lens is shipping Q4
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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  20. #120
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    Re: Phase One Photokinia Press Release

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Mancuso View Post
    This in from Phase One

    Phase One marketing --

    1) the 28mm Aspherical is in fact shipping now (the press release had indicated October)

    2) the 240 mm lens is shipping Q4
    I can confirm it is shipping and we should have at least one in house here at Digital Transitions by next week .

    Lance
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    direct/cell:610-496-5586 office:877-367-8537x224
    http://www.digitaltransitions.com email:[email protected]

  21. #121
    Workshop Member Bryan Stephens's Avatar
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    Re: Phase One Photokinia Press Release

    Quote Originally Posted by dougpeterson View Post
    Pencil Sharpening has not been enabled in firmware yet.
    Future upgrade I presume?
    Bryan

    “You don’t take a photograph, you make it.” — Ansel Adams

  22. #122
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    Re: Phase One Photokinia Press Release

    Quote Originally Posted by Bob View Post
    OMG my old D100 and my D800 look about the same too.
    -bob
    Same goes for my F4 / F5 and D700 / D800 / D3s, and those cameras have about a 30 year lineage between the earliest and newest.

    (Okay, I admit it... I'm a Nikon junkie )
    Bryan

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  23. #123
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    Re: Phase One Photokinia Press Release

    Photokina 2030: "We are thrilled to announce a major upgrade to the most flexible medium format platform in the world, the Phase DF++++++++++."
    hcubell
    www.howardcubell.com
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  24. #124
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    Re: Phase One Photokinia Press Release

    From DF+ announcement to HB Lunar, what these companies are thinking!? No, seriously!? Still in love with RZ! I think I need to say goodbye to all these digital BS very soon when none of these companies listen to what their customers need, maybe except the new Hy6 Mod2!
    Aryan Aqajani - Photographer in Melbourne, Australia
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    Re: Phase One Photokinia Press Release

    Worth noting for anyone interested in high flash sync speeds with the LS lenses is I've just looked at the specs of the new 240LS on the Mamiya Leaf site and the top sync speed for this lens is 1/800 sec. A spec the Phase One website doesn't mention or has been highlighted in any info released by Phase.

  26. #126
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    Re: Phase One Photokinia Press Release

    Quote Originally Posted by gazwas View Post
    Worth noting for anyone interested in high flash sync speeds with the LS lenses is I've just looked at the specs of the new 240LS on the Mamiya Leaf site and the top sync speed for this lens is 1/800 sec. A spec the Phase One website doesn't mention or has been highlighted in any info released by Phase.
    It's actually an issue with any large leaf shutter, they simply cannot cycle as fast as a smaller leaf shutter. That particular lens has a very large leaf shutter, so it's max speed is 1/800th to begin with, not 1/1600th like it's smaller sisters. It's nothing Phase left out of the spec, it will be there when they go to market with it -- they were very up front about that when they showed us the lens in Denmark last month.

    I shot with the prototype while I was there BTW, and it is quite probably the single best optic of any brand I have ever used...
    Jack
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    "Perfection is not attainable. But if we chase perfection, we can catch excellence."
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  27. #127
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    Re: Phase One Photokinia Press Release

    Quote Originally Posted by gazwas View Post
    So are you saying its the same design as the 28D but with LS and a Schneider badge?........ Surely not!
    Same lens construction, same min focal distance. I guess so. That's what they did already with the 150mm also: better lens barrel, leaf shutter, but same glass and half a stop less fast.

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    Re: Phase One Photokinia Press Release

    Looks like something was lost in translation on the show floor. The calibration will in fact be one universal offset for the body.

    While that isn't a big deal for each lens (given that the autofocus drive and sensor are both in the body the chance of per-lens issues is quite small) it does disappoint me regarding backs. The majority of owners only have one back, but rental houses, and production facilities (and us as dealers) have many bodies and many backs. Since it's not per-back (e.g. tied to back's serial) this means you'll have to write down or remember the calibration for any given body and enter the calibration when you switch bodies.

    Of course it's still a major improvement from not being able to do it at all and for the vast majority of users these details won't matter - alas I will not be one of those users since I regularly use any one of a dozen bodies and backs :-(.

    Sorry for the misunderstanding - hope it's clear I was not trying to mislead. Sometimes in live reporting you just get things wrong, and with two languages and a lot of hubub Photokina is ripe for that sort of thing.

    Quote Originally Posted by dougpeterson View Post
    The user controllable focus calibration is
    - PER back
    - PER lens
    - PER body

    So if you have two backs, two bodies, and five lenses you can make sure that any combination is perfectly matched. No trip to the factory

    While in five years I've only had a handful of customers send their gear in for focus calibration issues I certainly welcome this as a great step forward. It gives all the promised benefits of a closed system where the body+back are locked together in firmware while keeping all the benefits of an open system where you can use any body (new/used/borrowed/rented) with any back (new/used/borrowed/rented).

    Now I just need confirmation which lenses and backs will support this feature. That's the sort of nitty gritty I'm not sure we'll get an answer to until closer to shipping date.
    Doug Peterson , Digital Transitions | Email
    Dealer for: Phase One, Mamiya Leaf, Arca-Swiss, Cambo, Eizo, Profoto
    Office: 877.367.8537. Cell: 740.707.2183

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    Re: Phase One Photokinia Press Release

    Quote Originally Posted by anGy View Post
    Same lens construction, same min focal distance. I guess so. That's what they did already with the 150mm also: better lens barrel, leaf shutter, but same glass and half a stop less fast.
    Got confirmation today: same elements, same grouping, same basic optical design.

    Lens design guys got back to me and said the air gaps were modified and the lens element centering techniques were improved. To be honest I don't know what that means beyond their textbook definitions. And to be honest I don't really care what they say so much as what our tests show.

    In that regard we received our first 28LS for demo and several for sale. Our initial test in the office today vs. the 28D showed much more improvement than I expected. To the point where I'm fairly certain the test was off in some way. We'll be retesting tomorrow.
    Doug Peterson , Digital Transitions | Email
    Dealer for: Phase One, Mamiya Leaf, Arca-Swiss, Cambo, Eizo, Profoto
    Office: 877.367.8537. Cell: 740.707.2183

  30. #130
    Senior Member Stefan Steib's Avatar
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    Re: Phase One Photokinia Press Release

    Maybe they bought a K8 made by Zeiss , probably the most sophisticated device on the market , that´s what´s used for montage of our lenses in Oberkochen.

    http://www.zeiss.de/C12567A8003B8B6F/EmbedTitelIntern/ProspektK8_d_PDF/$File/K8_d_Version_011207.pdf

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  31. #131
    Subscriber & Workshop Member GrahamWelland's Avatar
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    Re: Phase One Photokinia Press Release

    Quote Originally Posted by Stefan Steib View Post
    Maybe they bought a K8 made by Zeiss , probably the most sophisticated device on the market , that´s what´s used for montage of our lenses in Oberkochen.

    http://www.zeiss.de/C12567A8003B8B6F/EmbedTitelIntern/ProspektK8_d_PDF/$File/K8_d_Version_011207.pdf

    regards
    Stefan
    All well and good but at nearly $5k for the current 28 D lens it should ALREADY be mounted by vestal virgins with eagle eye sight and rock steady dexterity as it is ...
    Last edited by GrahamWelland; 24th September 2012 at 16:48.
    Remember: adventure before dementia!

    As Oscar Wilde said, "my tastes are simple, I only like the best"

  32. #132
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    Re: Phase One Photokinia Press Release

    What I don't understand is what the heck Schneider do in this "Design" collaboration with Mamiya?

    For the last few new LS lens releases they managed to design a new lens that's actually the same as the old one? Do they in fact only just supply the shutter and that is where the process ends?

    And of all the lenses needing re-designs and leaf shutters the 28mm would have been last on my list. Who on earth needs a LS in a 28mm (17mm as 35mm equivalent) lens?
    The 35D springs to mind for a complete re-think and while not essential a LS may come in useful.
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  33. #133
    Subscriber & Workshop Member GrahamWelland's Avatar
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    Re: Phase One Photokinia Press Release

    Gareth,

    All I know is that the Schneider versions do seem to render beautifully. I don't know why or how but there IS a difference. Now the D versus non- D seems much more suspect sometimes.
    Remember: adventure before dementia!

    As Oscar Wilde said, "my tastes are simple, I only like the best"

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