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Thread: Trouble With Alpa MAX, T/S & New WA Rodies

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    Trouble With Alpa MAX, T/S & New WA Rodies

    I bought the new Alpa 50mm SB Rodenstock HR. I really wanted to get wider than the 80 with the 34mm SB 12deg Tilt/Swing (T/S) adapter. As known, the 34mm T/S cannot mount on the front of the MAX with the Lens Stitch adapter, which, as noted in a previous thread, allows the back to move keeping the lens in a fixed position for stitching. Especially important when using T/S.

    The 50mm back lens element hits the inside of the MAX when shifting; the lens must be mounted directly to the MAX's front standard and the rear element is long. It can only be shifted 10mm left or right. With a full size sensor oriented in landscape mode, this pretty much reaches the limits of the 90mm image circle (IC) of the 50mm. HOWEVER, when mounted in portrait orientation, the back can still only be shifted 10mm which is far short of the edge of the IC.

    The response from Alpa was that to get full movement with the 50, you had to use the new 17mm 7deg T/S adapter plus the new 17mm extension. Fortunately I have an amazing Alpa dealer (Fotocare) who will work with me on this for the 50. However a major question that I asked to Alpa directly this past Thursday (10/5) is whether the new 17mm SB wide angle lenses (that won't utilize the 17mm extension tube) will also be limited in their shift movement with the MAX because of the rear lens element butting up against the back frame as it shifts.

    No answer yet but has anyone had any experience?
    Thanks in advance,
    Bob

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    Re: Trouble With Alpa MAX, T/S & New WA Rodies

    Quote Originally Posted by rga View Post
    ..... However a major question that I asked to Alpa directly this past Thursday (10/5) is whether the new 17mm SB wide angle lenses (that won't utilize the 17mm extension tube) will also be limited in their shift movement with the MAX because of the rear lens element butting up against the back frame as it shifts.

    No answer yet but has anyone had any experience?
    Thanks in advance,
    Bob
    Bob,

    Will the new 17mm TS adapter not prevent the rear element of wide angle SB lenses from reaching into the MAX? Presumably the new 17mm TS adapter CAN be mounted on the front of the MAX, which would solve the problem. After all it just makes the SB lens into a LB one, which clearly should work. Seems to me the problem is the old (12 degree) 34mm TS adapter not working on the front of the MAX. Or maybe I don't understand at all - which is entirely possible....

    Cheers, -Peter

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    Re: Trouble With Alpa MAX, T/S & New WA Rodies

    Bob,

    Can we surmise that the problem is only when using the 17mm mount 50mm on the front and the t/s or spacer on the rear? If so, I would expect the same issue with any of the shiftable bodies correct?

    Any problems with mounting both the lens and adapter on the front as Peter suggested?

    Or did we misunderstand?
    Remember: adventure before dementia!

    As Oscar Wilde said, "my tastes are simple, I only like the best"

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    Re: Trouble With Alpa MAX, T/S & New WA Rodies

    Graham,
    The 50 Rodenstock is a 34mm SB lens, so Bob would need two 17mm adapters (presumably one TS and one plain). One can go on the back and the other one the front of the MAX, and I would assume this would solve the problem. Or both on the front. Or a *NEW* 34 TS on the front. As I understand it (at least) .....

    Cheers, -Peter

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    Re: Trouble With Alpa MAX, T/S & New WA Rodies

    Hi Peter & Graham,
    The problem is that I cannot mount the 12deg adapter (which is for 34mm SB lenses) on the front of the MAX. I don't know for sure but that T/S adapter is probably mountable on the front of all the other bodies (I know it is on the STC).

    The 50mm Rodenstock HR is a 34mm SB lens, not a 17mm SB lens.

    Peter I think you nailed it. If I put the plain 34mm extension on the front of the MAX and then mount the 50, there is no restriction. That essentially turns it into an LB lens.

    So the question remains can the new 17mm T/S mount on the front of the MAX? You say presumably it can: did you see this written anywhere or have some other source? I haven't seen this...
    Thanks,
    Bob

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    Re: Trouble With Alpa MAX, T/S & New WA Rodies

    Aha - got it. For some reason I thought that the 50mm was one of the new 17mm mount lens - doh.

    So much change at Alpa I'm having a hard time keeping up.

    Btw, what was the problem with the t/s on the front? Interference with the shift mount adapter bolt ? As you know, there are no such problems with the STC other than the optical viewfinder which needs a 10mm lift adapter. I had to do that myself actually.
    Remember: adventure before dementia!

    As Oscar Wilde said, "my tastes are simple, I only like the best"

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    Re: Trouble With Alpa MAX, T/S & New WA Rodies

    Quote Originally Posted by rga View Post
    Hi Peter & Graham,
    .......So the question remains can the new 17mm T/S mount on the front of the MAX? You say presumably it can: did you see this written anywhere or have some other source? I haven't seen this...
    Thanks,
    Bob
    No Bob, I have not seen it written, but judging from the pictures of the MAX with the stitch adapter, I can see why there is no room for the old 34mm TS adapter. The new 34 (and 17) TS seem a lot smaller in lateral extent, so I'm assuming (admittedly) they would work. If not - it seems like a major design flop by Alpa, making the MAX with Stitch adapter unusable with the new TS system...

    Cheers, -Peter

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    Re: Trouble With Alpa MAX, T/S & New WA Rodies

    Hi Graham,
    It's not the bolt, but the roundness of the adapter. The newer ones appear square much like the extensions, but I don't know for sure if the new 17 T/S (or for that matter the new 34 T/S), which appears to be square, will mount on the front of the MAX...
    Bob

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    Re: Trouble With Alpa MAX, T/S & New WA Rodies

    Thanks Peter.
    I think you're right from the images. Let me know if you hear anything definitive; I'll do the same.
    Bob

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    Re: Trouble With Alpa MAX, T/S & New WA Rodies

    Bob,

    I have the new 34mm T/S - let me know if you'd like to try it and I'd happily send it for you to test.

    Hmm, scratch that, I have the 12degree adapter which was the most recent. I now see that they have a square 5 degree version for 17 & 34mm which I assume is what you referred to.
    Remember: adventure before dementia!

    As Oscar Wilde said, "my tastes are simple, I only like the best"

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    Re: Trouble With Alpa MAX, T/S & New WA Rodies

    The new tilt adapters are the reason why the Rodenstock 50mm shortbarrel lens became possible.

    The new 34mm tilt adapter can be mounted in front of the MAX, or a 17 mm multi-use adapter in front and the 17mm tilt on the back. For the 50mm Rodenstock lens these are a must because of its very long back-element. I had the same issue on an XY.
    Last edited by smei_ch; 6th October 2012 at 18:49. Reason: clarification

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    Re: Trouble With Alpa MAX, T/S & New WA Rodies

    Thanks. Very good to know.

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    Re: Trouble With Alpa MAX, T/S & New WA Rodies

    Quote Originally Posted by rga View Post
    Thanks. Very good to know.
    I have sent you a PM . Please have a look .
    Regards . Jürgen .
    -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

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    Re: Trouble With Alpa MAX, T/S & New WA Rodies

    Quote Originally Posted by rga View Post
    Hi Graham,
    It's not the bolt, but the roundness of the adapter. The newer ones appear square much like the extensions, but I don't know for sure if the new 17 T/S (or for that matter the new 34 T/S), which appears to be square, will mount on the front of the MAX...
    Bob


    The new 17 T/S does mount on the front of the max with the stitch adapter. I have one currently on mine.

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    Re: Trouble With Alpa MAX, T/S & New WA Rodies

    You will probably get your answer faster from the good people on this forum than you will from the people at Fotocare. My experience with them has been terrible - post sales support has been non-existent. I gave up doing business with them for a number of years. I hope your experience is better. For a giggle around my studio we refer to them as FotoScare.

    Jack


    Quote Originally Posted by rga View Post
    I bought the new Alpa 50mm SB Rodenstock HR. I really wanted to get wider than the 80 with the 34mm SB 12deg Tilt/Swing (T/S) adapter. As known, the 34mm T/S cannot mount on the front of the MAX with the Lens Stitch adapter, which, as noted in a previous thread, allows the back to move keeping the lens in a fixed position for stitching. Especially important when using T/S.

    The 50mm back lens element hits the inside of the MAX when shifting; the lens must be mounted directly to the MAX's front standard and the rear element is long. It can only be shifted 10mm left or right. With a full size sensor oriented in landscape mode, this pretty much reaches the limits of the 90mm image circle (IC) of the 50mm. HOWEVER, when mounted in portrait orientation, the back can still only be shifted 10mm which is far short of the edge of the IC.

    The response from Alpa was that to get full movement with the 50, you had to use the new 17mm 7deg T/S adapter plus the new 17mm extension. Fortunately I have an amazing Alpa dealer (Fotocare) who will work with me on this for the 50. However a major question that I asked to Alpa directly this past Thursday (10/5) is whether the new 17mm SB wide angle lenses (that won't utilize the 17mm extension tube) will also be limited in their shift movement with the MAX because of the rear lens element butting up against the back frame as it shifts.

    No answer yet but has anyone had any experience?
    Thanks in advance,
    Bob

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    Re: Trouble With Alpa MAX, T/S & New WA Rodies

    Quote Originally Posted by fotoflood View Post
    You will probably get your answer faster from the good people on this forum than you will from the people at Fotocare. My experience with them has been terrible - post sales support has been non-existent. I gave up doing business with them for a number of years. I hope your experience is better. For a giggle around my studio we refer to them as FotoScare.

    Jack
    Thanks for the input Jack. My experience has been the exact opposite. Fotocare has stood by their word and delivered without exception over the past 3 years for me. Jeff Hirsch has stood by his word and more; my faith in real service from professionals has been restored and upheld both by Jeff at Fotocare and Lance and Doug at Digital Transitions.
    Glad I have a different experience than you had. You may want to give them another go.
    Best and thanks again,
    Bob
    (BTW, Fotocare took back my 34T/S they sold me 2 years ago, gave me full credit and I paid the difference for the 17T/S and 17Extension. Now my 50 has full shift and I can still use all of my other 34SB's with T/S. Pretty amazing and just one of the reasons for my above statement...
    www.rgaphoto.com
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    Re: Trouble With Alpa MAX, T/S & New WA Rodies

    Bob,
    I'm pleased to learn that your experience has been more positive than mine. As for me, Fotocare will never see a penny of business from me or anyone in my studio. After my purchase where the Hassy equipment clearly had problems, Fotocare thought that this is the way the equipment was suppose to work and that I was being picky. It was clearly defective. Eventually it got resolved - not by Fotocare - but by Hasselblad. I much rather do business with other companies which have consistently given me great support and who understand how equipment is suppose to work. You mentioned Digital Transitions and I totally agree, and now with Doug on board it's even better. One of the reasons I decided to go with the Arca aside from being a great camera was because of the wonderful support and friendly support of DT.

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    Re: Trouble With Alpa MAX, T/S & New WA Rodies

    Quote Originally Posted by fotoflood View Post
    Bob,
    I'm pleased to learn that your experience has been more positive than mine. As for me, Fotocare will never see a penny of business from me or anyone in my studio. After my purchase where the Hassy equipment clearly had problems, Fotocare thought that this is the way the equipment was suppose to work and that I was being picky. It was clearly defective. Eventually it got resolved - not by Fotocare - but by Hasselblad. I much rather do business with other companies which have consistently given me great support and who understand how equipment is suppose to work. You mentioned Digital Transitions and I totally agree, and now with Doug on board it's even better. One of the reasons I decided to go with the Arca aside from being a great camera was because of the wonderful support and friendly support of DT.
    I had the same experience with Fotocare. I could not get any correct information;as a result I bought Arca Swiss from CI and I am very happy with the camera and the service
    Stanley

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